Which is the most significant dialect group in china and is there a ranking?

[Fook Seng]

Yes, tryto bea cunninglinguist.
The penis mightier than thesword.
Something iswrong withmy keyboard. :o

You mean the"Sword" is mightier than words?

 

[Ramseth]

Yes, tryto bea cunninglinguist.
The penis mightier than thesword.
Something iswrong withmy keyboard. :o

Language is the bridge across the world. The more you learn the merrier. I heard a theory that seven is the limit for the brain. I'll settle at five.

 

[jw5]

Walao eh u all.
Don't seem to appreciate my 2 favourite jokes that I always repeat in sam's alfresco heaven. :o

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Language is the bridge across the world. The more you learn the merrier. I heard a theory that seven is the limit for the brain. I'll settle at five.

ok you can speak mandarin,english, thai, jap and what's the 5th? I suppose you know 3 dialects. Teochew and hokkien which are similar and cantonese?

 

[sleaguepunter]

When you pick up a fight use Hokkien. When you get into a quarrel do it in Cantonese.

hokkien swearing is just plain vulgar but cantonese swearing has a poetic sound to it and it meant to curse the entire family and ancestors.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Actually, I feel no flattering when called ang moh kia too. But I understand that those Chinese aunties and uncles who call me that mean well without anything derogatory. However, if you look at how Windows call me chup cheng kia, if you don't understand the menace and insult, you need help in language and dialect.

Here's the thing: Context.

It's kind of the same thing with nigger. A black or his close fren calls him nigger it's like a term of endearment. A white person that he doesn't know calls him that it's meant as an insult.

However in this case nigger is still different from chup cheng. The word has already been established as a basis to insult and demean a person. I doubt ppl actually use chup cheng to insult a mixed person.

PS chup cheng just means mixed. Asian mix like vomit singh is also included. Here's the thing though. What sort of dialect term should we call you mix breeds then? I can only thing of ang moh specifically for your case.

 

[Ramseth]

ok you can speak mandarin,english, thai, jap and what's the 5th? I suppose you know 3 dialects. Teochew and hokkien which are similar and cantonese?

English, Chinese, Malay, Thai and Japanese. Teochew, Hokkien and Cantonese. Yes, I rank English as my first language, hope you don't mind. I think that your family generally speaks English as first language too. Teochew and Hokkien are close but Cantonese is vastly different. However, I'm also sure that my undertstanding of Chinese language and dialects thereof, history and culture are thousands of miles ahead of you.

 

[Narong Wongwan]

Language is the bridge across the world. The more you learn the merrier. I heard a theory that seven is the limit for the brain. I'll settle at five.

this guy would disagree with your theory

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[sleaguepunter]

chup cheng basically mean mix breed. hokkien not exactly a flowerly langague so if u percived chup cheng as an insult, tough luck mate.

 

[sleaguepunter]

English, Chinese, Malay, Thai and Japanese. Teochew, Hokkien and Cantonese. Yes, I rank English as my first language, hope you don't mind. I think that your family generally speaks English as first language too. Teochew and Hokkien are close but Cantonese is vastly different. However, I'm also sure that my undertstanding of Chinese language and dialects thereof, history and culture are thousands of miles ahead of you.

chinese is not a langague but a race. u dont speak chinese, u speak either chinese regional dialects or official govt langague aka putonghua aka mandarin.

 

[Ramseth]

this guy would disagree with your theory

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Whatever. Different strokes for different folks. What's learned cannot be unlearned. Like, once your know how to ride a bicycle or swim, you'd always be able to ride a bicycle or swim naturally.

 

[Ramseth]

chinese is not a langague but a race. u dont speak chinese, u speak either chinese regional dialects or official govt langague aka putonghua aka mandarin.

Technically, it's called Mandarin or Beijing Dialect or Hanyu as defined in standard dictionary. I don't give a damn as long as I'm undertstood.

 

[sleaguepunter]

u can dont give a damn but many teachers also make this mistake including Mother Tongue teachers. i went to my kid kindergarten to give the teacher what i thought of her langague standard. speak chinese my arse..

 

[Narong Wongwan]

chup cheng basically mean mix breed. hokkien not exactly a flowerly langague so if u percived chup cheng as an insult, tough luck mate.

chip cheng is 十种 meaning ten species.......slang for mixed breed. Some crudely translate as ten sperm.....so imho its an insult.

 

[Fook Seng]

An old learned history professor I met one day in Guangzhou during dinner explained to me that In the old days during the first emperor Qung Shi Huang as he conquered completely the northern part of the north he also wanted to take over the south so he sent thousands of soldiers to the south like Guangdong and Fujian areas. But during those days they could not travel directly down south so they have to take the SW route through Sichuan and then Guangxi area. This took years of travel and during the traveling some soldiers "awol" and mixed with the southern people. Now when they arrived in Guangdong and Fujian areas they also did not fight and could not go back also and at that time the emperor also mati liao. So they settled down with the local people instead of going home because it is almost impossible to reverse. The influence on the local dialects was great with many tones.

Somehow something seems to be missing in the preceding discussions on the evolution of dialects. Too much emphasis was placed on the demographics of the inhabitants and their mother tongues. Too little was placed on the evolution of the dialects themselves, the influence that new immigrants impact on the evolution of the language. Like today, Malay and Indonesian are significantly influenced by western technological (also cultural) terms which have become part of their language. Hokkien in Singapore too has many borrowed words from Malay and this is talking of just the last 50 to 100 years or so. Singlish is another good example of the interaction of several languages. But back to Chinese dialects.
My understanding is
, explained to me also by some Professor of Chinese Studies some 30 years ago, that Cantonese and Hokkien are very ancient dialects, truer to the ancient tongues of the Chinese than Mandarin which is a relatively new and simplified dialect developed from borrowing the most common characteristics of people living in the North. Once established, there was the reversed influence on these regional dialects resulting in several dialect groups having close association with Mandarin. About 40% of China today is a native speaker of a Mandarin-like tongue. Cantonese and Hokkien are not just the result of outside influence of a small of soldiers sent from the North on a long expedition but a large migration of people driven by war from nvading barbarians. They in turn drove south those people who originally occupied Southern China to today's Vietnam and Thailand. One reason why Cantonese speaks Mandarin with a funny accent is that there are too many similarly sounding words which are not exactly the same in the two dialects. Whether Cantonese and Hokkien are Han people originally occupying the North of China, I have no clue. I stand corrected on the above.

 

[Ramseth]

u can dont give a damn but many teachers also make this mistake including Mother Tongue teachers. i went to my kid kindergarten to give the teacher what i thought of her langague standard. speak chinese my arse..

Most of my English and Chinese teachers, their standards of the languages couldn't match mine. I just went through it as a matter of formality.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

English, Chinese, Malay, Thai and Japanese. Teochew, Hokkien and Cantonese. Yes, I rank English as my first language, hope you don't mind. I think that your family generally speaks English as first language too. Teochew and Hokkien are close but Cantonese is vastly different. However, I'm also sure that my undertstanding of Chinese language and dialects thereof, history and culture are thousands of miles ahead of you.

Wow arrogant indeed! You were born in some hokkien peng family and english actually is your first language? Hey there's something called learning and studying on a subject. If i wanted to i could read up more on the dynasties and history and get a clearer picture.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

chip cheng is 十种 meaning ten species.......slang for mixed breed. Some crudely translate as ten sperm.....so imho its an insult.

I didn't know about this thanks for enlightening me. The fact of the matter is in hokkien pray tell is there any polite form of calling a mixed breed person? Is there any pc term in hokkien to call someone that's mixed? I don't think so hence the use of chup cheng.

 

[Narong Wongwan]

I didn't know about this thanks for enlightening me. The fact of the matter is in hokkien pray tell is there any polite form of calling a mixed breed person? Is there any pc term in hokkien to call someone that's mixed? I don't think so hence the use of chup cheng.

Pa Cheng or cham cheng would be more 'polite'......Pa Cheng/cham cheng literally means mixed breed. But somehow i still feels its used to describe animals rather than persons.....any hokkien scholars here?

 

[Ramseth]

Wow arrogant indeed! You were born in some hokkien peng family and english actually is your first language? Hey there's something called learning and studying on a subject. If i wanted to i could read up more on the dynasties and history and get a clearer picture.

Yes, I was born into a hokkien/teochew beng gangster family. My maternal granduncle was tiger general of 24 at one time inmate of Pulau Senang and my paternal grandfather was white fan of 32. As a kid (eldest grandson in line), I've already got used to packing parangs in their funeral lorries just in case. You've got a problem with that? But there's no arrogance, just facts. There're more than ten forummers here who know me personally.

Any lie or exaggeration would be immediately exposed. I managed to talk my way into police, NTUC and all the way to USA and back. I do not lie or exaggerate. I only talk facts of life, whether in English, Chinese or other languages. Somehow, I happened to be the best English and Chinese speaker in the clan and gang circles. I'm ranking white fan too for that on top of tiger general for streetfighting. Police knows that too, but they're alright with it as long as I remain within legal bounds in the line of duty. Very few people carry both ranks. I'm one of the very few.