Typhoon struck pineapple land for a reason

[Frodo]

bro, I am leaned towared you arguments. Crucifixion being cornerstone of Christianity and almost every evangelist uses it to tout their belief. Surprisingly, they are still unable to find the nails used.

The missing years between Jesus's childhood and the beginning of his ministry is another riddle still lacking convincing explanation. Jesus is supposingly not an ordinary man and is claimed by christians to be the son of god. Being such an important and special character, the missing account is really thought provocative when others key historical figures of his era in the vicinity region are better documented.


Global flood tribal story. If there is really such a flood that submerged the highest mountain on earth, there should be abundant traces left everywhere. Yet, they are unable to produce any evidence except faith-based assertion. We need to look at the similarities between biblical Noah flood and the Babylonian's Epic Of Gilgamesh. Both cases the flood was supposed to be global.Both arks landed on mountains in the middle east. The Babylonian ark landed on Mt. Nasir and the bible ark landed on Mt. Ararat which are no more than a few hundred miles apart. Read this wiki page for more bewildering similarities, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_of_Gilgamesh

Even if no trace of the execution tool remains after 2000 years it does not mean Jesus was not crucified as described in historical documents. And the so-called missing years? How would not knowing what happened during this time count against the historicity of the Gospel accounts or Jesus? Besides there are clues in the Gospels if you read the Bible carefully. Moreover, you cannot expect the Gospels to give a full account of Jesus' life unless you have good reasons to expect that from the Gospel writers. And how does other historical characters who have detailed year by year chronological details of their lives, count against Jesus? It doesn't at all. What matters is whether the accounts reported are true, not whether they are exhaustive enough to one's liking.

If there was a global flood, indeed there must be evidence of such. And there is evidence that is consistent with a global flood. The earth is mostly covered with water. The geological features of the earth is best explained by a global catastrophe and its aftermath, e.g. the Grand Canyon. And all over the world there are cultures that recount a global flood that bears many similarities attesting to a common memory of an event.

 

[Frodo]

Our species have not even agreed on what/who God is, or whether there is a (or several) God(s) even. There are only two (or three, or four) people (even if fictitious) who claimed to have communicated with God, Jesus, and Mohammed (and probably Moses, Noah, and some other biblical figures). And from these, I listen only to Jesus' teachings - to love, to forgive (if they know not what they do), as a mere mortal, don't think I can do more, will try though.

As for my kid, spend less time on that Nintendo DS will be a good start.

Cheers!

There is a common consensus that the God who made the universe e.g. time, space, matter must be outside of it i.e. God must be timeless, immaterial, all powerful. And it is reasonable to think that God would have wanted to make Himself known to us. Man can speculate all he wants, but only God's self-disclosure is accurate and true. Lastly, Jesus did not just claimed to communicate with God, He claimed to be God. Now that's a bold claim worth examining.

 

[Frodo]

If I were to pick one, I'd say it leans towards intelligent design. Who, or what is this intelligent being(s), it yet to be known.

Cheers!

Good choice! So you see, it is possible to see which explanation is better. We don't need to know a lot, but we do need to be able to evaluate what we do know at the moment and filter out the weaker explanations.

 

[Frodo]

I'm sorry. I have to say that we do not know. Some things, I can safely say I accept that I will not know in my life, and it won't bother me. Our human minds are too small to comprehend things beyond our three dimensional time/space coordinates. There are limitless possibilities that our mind/imagination cannot even conjure.

Cheers!

But how do you know that we do not know? I don't think we need to be omniscient to know things. We can know something truly even if we do not know it fully.

 

[Frodo]

We know crucifixion was a Roman practice to display to the public what happens to criminals and probably was used as a means of prevention of crimes against them. That Jesus was crucified served to fulfil the scriptures. The cross became a Christian symbol. The story is very powerful. The nails were probably recycled and reused despite the wealth of Rome.

I am sure there were many floods throughout history. The biblical flood is just one. And from it the ancients forged the story of Noah's Ark which tells of God's intentions and goodness. I like the story and am looking forward to watch the coming movie. The bible stories are good, for it describes the evilness of man, and that among these men, there are good ones. And this gives us hope.

Cheers!

Yes, there have been many floods, but yet many cultures tell of a worldwide flood that involves God/gods and humans with animals on huge vessels. There is a common thread, but I believe the Bible contains the true account preserved for us.

 

[Frodo]

bro,
I missed out the wiki link, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transitional_fossil


The undeniable evidence of human and chimp descending from a common ancestor(common ancestry), http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromosome_2_(human)

Calling it transitional begs the question. I would say that every fossil discovered was a fully functioning creature that once lived.

As for the chromosome part, the conclusion is inferred, not proven. The evidence is not undeniable.

 

[Agoraphobic]

Common consensus does not mean it is correct. Everyone thought the world was flat when Columbus said it was round, it just reflects the popular thought of the day, that's all. Jesus' claim has been examined many times, over and over again. Some believe, some don't. It's personal choice.

Cheers!

There is a common consensus that the God who made the universe e.g. time, space, matter must be outside of it i.e. God must be timeless, immaterial, all powerful. And it is reasonable to think that God would have wanted to make Himself known to us. Man can speculate all he wants, but only God's self-disclosure is accurate and true. Lastly, Jesus did not just claimed to communicate with God, He claimed to be God. Now that's a bold claim worth examining.

 

[Agoraphobic]

At university, my math professor walked into class and said, even if we can only comprehend things in three dimensions, it does not mean that more cannot exist. As mortals, at a point in time, we only know so much, and there is still more to know. Our minds and knowledge are finite at a point, but it can grow beyond that. That much I know.

Cheers!

But how do you know that we do not know? I don't think we need to be omniscient to know things. We can know something truly even if we do not know it fully.

 

[Frodo]

Common consensus does not mean it is correct. Everyone thought the world was flat when Columbus said it was round, it just reflects the popular thought of the day, that's all. Jesus' claim has been examined many times, over and over again. Some believe, some don't. It's personal choice.

Cheers!

It doesn't mean it is wrong either. Truth is always true. What people believed to be true at one time has no bearing on truth. The earth is round is a true fact, even if everyone else once believed it was flat. Of course, not everyone believed the earth was flat, that's a myth really. Yes, people have examined Jesus' claims, so either He was telling the truth or He was lying. He was either Lord or Liar or Lunatic. Where do you think the evidence point?

 

[Frodo]

At university, my math professor walked into class and said, even if we can only comprehend things in three dimensions, it does not mean that more cannot exist. As mortals, at a point in time, we only know so much, and there is still more to know. Our minds and knowledge are finite at a point, but it can grow beyond that. That much I know.

Cheers!

Here's the thing, you are right that there are many things we do not know. But it makes a difference to know someone who knows everything. And God has revealed to us many things that otherwise we cannot know.

 

[Agoraphobic]

Proof of the Ark is impossible. A family of woodworms that lived through the voyage multiplied and ate the entire vessel. They have consumed the evidence. All that is left is a story for us.

Cheers!

Yes, there have been many floods, but yet many cultures tell of a worldwide flood that involves God/gods and humans with animals on huge vessels. There is a common thread, but I believe the Bible contains the true account preserved for us.

 

[Agoraphobic]

He can be anything the believer wishes him to be. To me, he was a man, a teacher. Son of God, miracle-maker, healer of the sick, that's for others to believe.

Cheers!

It doesn't mean it is wrong either. Truth is always true. What people believed to be true at one time has no bearing on truth. The earth is round is a true fact, even if everyone else once believed it was flat. Of course, not everyone believed the earth was flat, that's a myth really. Yes, people have examined Jesus' claims, so either He was telling the truth or He was lying. He was either Lord or Liar or Lunatic. Where do you think the evidence point?

 

[Frodo]

Proof of the Ark is impossible. A family of woodworms that lived through the voyage multiplied and ate the entire vessel. They have consumed the evidence. All that is left is a story for us.

Cheers!

Remember we were agreed that something can be true even if we can't show it to be true? Even if you believed woodworms ate it all, you must have some basis for saying that, or would you then say something else ate up the woodworms and left no trace at all? A lot of things cannot be proven i.e. we cannot show to be true, yet it does not mean they are not true. Unless you are saying we are dealing with something logically impossible.

 

[Agoraphobic]

I like your optimism. But this God did not teach humans how to split the atom, create jet propulsion. or even manufacture vaccines.

Cheers!

Here's the thing, you are right that there are many things we do not know. But it makes a difference to know someone who knows everything. And God has revealed to us many things that otherwise we cannot know.

 

[Frodo]

He can be anything the believer wishes him to be. To me, he was a man, a teacher. Son of God, miracle-maker, healer of the sick, that's for others to believe.

Cheers!

Did Jesus leave us with that option? No. He made explicit claims about His identity. Our wishes for Him can be wide off the mark. It is His claims that matter, not our opinions of Him.

 

[Agoraphobic]

The woodworms? I read it in a comic.

Cheers!

Remember we were agreed that something can be true even if we can't show it to be true? Even if you believed woodworms ate it all, you must have some basis for saying that, or would you then say something else ate up the woodworms and left no trace at all? A lot of things cannot be proven i.e. we cannot show to be true, yet it does not mean they are not true. Unless you are saying we are dealing with something logically impossible.

 

[Frodo]

I like your optimism. But this God did not teach humans how to split the atom, create jet propulsion. or even manufacture vaccines.

Cheers!

But how does this count against Him? The fathers of modern science were believers and none complained that God did not teach them what they discovered. Instead it is their belief that God has ordered the universe that led them to discover and formulate the laws of nature. If you never taught your kids how to make their beds (I'm sure you do!), does that justify them saying they have no father? Of course not. A complaint against God is not the same as denying God exists.

 

[Frodo]

The woodworms? I read it in a comic.

Cheers!

Then let's keep that theory in comic con land.

 

[gymkhana]

There is a common consensus that the God who made the universe e.g. time, space, matter must be outside of it i.e. God must be timeless, immaterial, all powerful. And it is reasonable to think that God would have wanted to make Himself known to us. Man can speculate all he wants, but only God's self-disclosure is accurate and true. Lastly, Jesus did not just claimed to communicate with God, He claimed to be God. Now that's a bold claim worth .

really???did jesus claim to be god?
Instead of "hear oh Israel , the Lord our God is but One God" did he say hear oh Israel, the Lord your god is me???
The closest statement allegedly alluded to jesus claiming to be God never really comes even close to him proclaiming such blasphemy is where statements like I and my father are one ..sure I agree I and my dad is one in purpose , one in ideology and one in mission .
Or where pls tell the good ppl here that jesus proclaimed that he is God .
unequivocally.

 

[Frodo]

There is a common consensus that the God who made the universe e.g. time, space, matter must be outside of it i.e. God must be timeless, immaterial, all powerful. And it is reasonable to think that God would have wanted to make Himself known to us. Man can speculate all he wants, but only God's self-disclosure is accurate and true. Lastly, Jesus did not just claimed to communicate with God, He claimed to be God. Now that's a bold claim worth .

really???did jesus claim to be god?
Instead of "hear oh Israel , the Lord our God is but One God" did he say hear oh Israel, the Lord your god is me???
The closest statement allegedly alluded to jesus claiming to be God never really comes even close to him proclaiming such blasphemy is where statements like I and my father are one ..sure I agree I and my dad is one in purpose , one in ideology and one in mission .
Or where pls tell the good ppl here that jesus proclaimed that he is God .
unequivocally.

If you read the Gospels you would not have failed to read that the Jews accused Him of claiming to be God.