[SIC] 楚汉传奇 lai liao

[sleaguepunter]

saw 2 espisodes, dont quite like.

 

[Alamaking]

saw 2 espisodes, dont quite like.

Not as exciting as Three Kingdoms lah, I mean the history....

 

[sleaguepunter]

Not as exciting as Three Kingdoms lah, I mean the history....

just saw episode 3, knn, the marry the Lu part never follow what was written in history.

i dont like not because it not exciting but the producers try to twist some parts not according to what were recorded in the books.

 

[Alamaking]

just saw episode 3, knn, the marry the Lu part never follow what was written in history.

i dont like not because it not exciting but the producers try to twist some parts not according to what were recorded in the books.

I'm not very familiar with this part of the history, still trying to learn more

 

[sleaguepunter]

I'm not very familiar with this part of the history, still trying to learn more

in the show, Lu marry Liu because she tired of running and consider Liu a hero.

but according to shiji, it old Lu after meeting Liu, believe Liu will be great man later in life so he gave his daughter hand to Liu Bang despite protest from his wife.

 

[Sideswipe]

just saw episode 3, knn, the marry the Lu part never follow what was written in history.

i dont like not because it not exciting but the producers try to twist some parts not according to what were recorded in the books.

the end of the war when Xiang Yu might have escaped back to Pengcheng, but he chose to kill himself in front of the Han soldiers. the books recorded it like that too ?

 

[Alamaking]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/uHasawULyks" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Episode 11

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ovDBH8hpLk4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Episode 12

 

[sleaguepunter]

the end of the war when Xiang Yu might have escaped back to Pengcheng, but he chose to kill himself in front of the Han soldiers. the books recorded it like that too ?

not pengcheng but jiangdong.

he was surrounded by ten of thousands of Han soldiers while he left with atmost a hundred men, after repeated charges into Han soldiers, he and his small band of men reach the riverbank. according to legend, his men beg him to cross the river on the small sampan they found. but he refused as he ashamed to go back to JiangDong where his original 8000men was raised from without them. so he mounted from his beloved warhorse and put it on the sampan and push off the sampan. upon seeing what he did, all his men dismounted from their mounts to give their horses a chance to live on while they follow xiangyu to battle on foot. soon all his men fell by Han weapons and left only Xiang Yu. So Xiang Yu slit his own throat and the Han soldiers rushed forward to chop his body into pieces to claim the 1000 pieces of gold reward as promise by Liu Bang.

 

[goldenmonkey]

the end of the war when Xiang Yu might have escaped back to Pengcheng, but he chose to kill himself in front of the Han soldiers. the books recorded it like that too ?

XiangYu did have a chance to escape via the boat offered by a boat rower to return to his hometown (Chu area), but his arrogance got in the way and thus the famous saying of "having no face t meet JiangDong fellows" as he had led most of his men to doom.
He was a valant warrior, overly straight in his own ways of managing people and a prideful man. Liu was in everyway an direct opposite - a shrewd and almost unscrupcous character, extremely good in human-relationship and a ill-principled man who can beg for mercy at any time. Liu Bang would still be considered as a great emperor despite his personal short coming.

It was the most facsinating part of Chinese history to me - and I would say the fabrication of ROTK on Liu Bei's part was to mimic this story of Liu Bang - retreating to BaShu, having a all-knowing advisor (Zhang Liang vs Zhuge Liang). Of course, Liu Bang rewrote history by claiming victory while Liu Bei didn't.

Another remarkable part of Han history is that of Liu Xiu, great grand-son of Liu Bang, who was not anything less earth-breaking than Liu Bang in establishing the second part of the glorious Han dynasty - which historians called Dong Han (eastern Han).
Liu Xiu is a much more honourable man with great visions and his love story to his wife is a classic.

 

[sleaguepunter]

liu bang had xiao he as prime minister, zhang liang & chen yu as strategists and han xin as commander in chief plus his sworn brothers as generals but liu bei had only only zhuge liang to do the jobs of xiaohe, zhang liang, chen yu and han xin.

if u ask me, the person in ROTK behave the same as liu bang was cao cao. liu bang subordinates consistly mainly of riff raffs and will accept anyone into his ranks as long the person is a talent without regards to the person past. chen yu was known to have affair with his older brother's wife so he had a bad reputation but liu bang accept his service after chen yu left xiang yu.

 

[goldenmonkey]

Bro, I believe you are talking about Chen Ping.

Chen Ping is an extreme political animal you can ever find. He served under Xiang (not an low-ranking official) but deflected as Xiang has higher "expectations" of his followers in terms of conduct and often disregard Chen's tactics.

Chen rose through the ranks and became an important figure as he would sore discontent within Xiang's rank given his earlier postion in Xiang's camp.

In later years, when empress Lu was in overall control and Chen became her most trusted ally, he help rid of all possible threats coming from the very people responsible for Liu's success - Peng Yue, Ying Bu, no less Han Xin.
Xiao He was smart to "smear" his own name to escape jeolousy while Zhang Liang went to the taoist way.


Eventually when the fight between Lu's relative and Liu's decendants broke out (Lu was quite neutral and didn't really push for a change in dynasty), Chen turned coat again when it was obvious that Lu's clan would lose. Together with Zhou Bo, he upstaged and eliminated Lu's clan and instored a "unknown" child of Liu Bang from Boji to become emperor - Liu Che. That would only mean Chen continuous influence in court matters and save his decendants' career. He died bearing a high post by performing successful and shrewd political move all his life.

 

[Alamaking]

Liu Xiu is Liu Ce aka Han Wudi son?

 

[sleaguepunter]

Liu Xiu is Liu Ce aka Han Wudi son?

刘秀 is 武帝 greatX7 grandson.

 

[goldenmonkey]

Sorry, I would mean great great great grand son....of Liu Bang. Xiu was from the blood line of the brother of Han Wudi. He was a pauper before he staged the rebellion against Wang Meng (who was famous for being the first generation of Han's theif - which name was given to Cao Cao later for his role to steal Han's kingdom). I am surprised no movie or show was ever made on the life of Liu Xiu known to me. His life story was quite amazing to me.

 

[sleaguepunter]

Bro, I believe you are talking about Chen Ping.

yes, i got the name mix up. chen ping the correct name.

 

[sleaguepunter]

Together with Zhou Bo, he upstaged and eliminated Lu's clan and instored a "unknown" child of Liu Bang from Boji to become emperor - Liu Che. That would only mean Chen continuous influence in court matters and save his decendants' career. He died bearing a high post by performing successful and shrewd political move all his life.

呂后死後，呂后一族外戚欲作亂。大臣陳平、周勃和宗室劉章等人以計謀騙來兵權，消滅了掌握兵權的呂氏外戚，打算擁立新皇帝。因為劉恆是劉邦當時現存年紀最長之子，又寬厚孝順，而且劉恆之母薄氏的家族比較不強勢。[1]於是大臣們擁立代王劉恆即皇帝位，是為漢文帝；並且黜殺漢惠帝之子漢後少帝劉弘。
漢文帝即位後，勵精圖治，興修水利，衣著樸素，廢除肉刑，使漢朝進入強盛安定的時期。當時百姓富裕，天下小康。漢文帝與其子漢景帝統治時期被合稱為文景之治。

chen ping and zhuo bo install prince of dai liu heng as emperor who known as emperor wendi.

 

[Alamaking]

刘秀 is 武帝 greatX7 grandson.

Har? Liubang>Kangxi>Liuce father (dunno simi name)> Liuce right?

Kanina I need to read more...

 

[goldenmonkey]

呂后死後，呂后一族外戚欲作亂。大臣陳平、周勃和宗室劉章等人以計謀騙來兵權，消滅了掌握兵權的呂氏外戚，打算擁立新皇帝。因為劉恆是劉邦當時現存年紀最長之子，又寬厚孝順，而且劉恆之母薄氏的家族比較不強勢。[1]於是大臣們擁立代王劉恆即皇帝位，是為漢文帝；並且黜殺漢惠帝之子漢後少帝劉弘。
漢文帝即位後，勵精圖治，興修水利，衣著樸素，廢除肉刑，使漢朝進入強盛安定的時期。當時百姓富裕，天下小康。漢文帝與其子漢景帝統治時期被合稱為文景之治。

chen ping and zhuo bo install prince of dai liu heng as emperor who known as emperor wendi.

It is my turn to get the name wrong, Wen Di is Liu Heng. His son, Jing Di, is Liu Che.
It did little justice to attribute the protection of Liu's Han Dynasty without mentioning Guan Yin. He was the young general during Liu Bang's time and later did the event-turning move in securing the military rights to slaughter Lu's clan. Such was the margin of defeat - very narrow - you could be king or lose your life in a instant.

 

[goldenmonkey]

Bro, what is Kangxi doing in Han Dynasty LOL

 

[Alamaking]

Bro, what is Kangxi doing in Han Dynasty LOL

Ehh alamak... SALAH!!! Lol, I got mixed up, watching 美人无泪 concurrently, Hahaha