Association of Muslim Professionals finally wake up and take their PAP partner.

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

The Singapore Malay Community's Dilemma...

gong xi gong xi roy n to one n all,

it is an academic book...found it quite a long read wif empirical qualitative analysis...but still worth a read for those truly interested in trying to make an objective informed view on the state of the singapore malay community in the context of singapore society n governance as a whole...as Dr Rahim posits an alternative view fm the kinda conventional thinking wif acadedmic rigour underpinning the same...in a nutshell Dr Rahim opines that...

it is generally due to purported institutional and structural obstacles that hold back the singapore malay community i.e. discrimination in employment, malay community started n continues to remain at a lower educational n economic level than the singapore chinese community, subtle discrimination in the NS SAF structure, the singapore malay community has internalised the cultural deficit theory (i.e. malay culture has great difficulty in successfully adapting to the modern globalised world) which appears to be based on conventional thinking...

ironically Dr Rahim's povs seem to contradict Dr Mahathir's own analysis which tie in wif the cultural deficit theory in his seminal piece of work contained in his book 'The Malay Dilemma', which 'helped' to explain the need for m'sia's bumi policy after the race riots in the late 60s...as an aside and interestingly enuff even after 30s of the bumi policy, the malays in m'sia do not seem to hv caught up wif the chinese save for the 'minority' bumi elite...

anyways Dr Rahim's book is both explosive n insightful even after a decade since it was first published(this does not necessarily mean that i agree wif her povs)...especially in light of harry's latest public observations on the singapore malay community...combine this wif the robust statement harry made in parliament last yr when nmp viswa tabled the motion on the present state of singapore society viewed in the context of the national pledge etc...

btw it may of interest to know that Dr Rahim is the niece of the late President Yusof Ishak n her late father was a senior minister of state in the pap government under harry...

Thanks, I will read it. A book or an article in the papers?

actually i am a life long reds fan(waiting for the big game at the bridge to start!) fm the days of watching the late brian moore(my all timer fav!) n jimmy hill on the telly...saints n greavsie(its a funny old game saint!), john motson(another fav), clive tyldesley, martin tyler(my current fav notewithstanding the sexists scandal) etc...also grew up on 'shoot' mag, use to hv great fun playing wif the yearly shoot cardboard league table freebie(perhaps a collector's item now!)...so also took an interest in the likes of derby,leeds,arsenal,spurs,everton,villa,newcastle, notts forest, man u etc...

actually tot QPR were in wif a shout when bernie ecclestone n mittal bought into loftus road...

Ah, the good old glory days at the Baseball Ground (for you younger guys, the predecessor of Pride Park, home ground of the "greatest football club in the world...Derby County Football Club" We're just waiting for any billionaire (pimp, drug lord, mafia don, maybe even an ex PM of an island state) to buy over the club and replace it with the entire Spanish national team! :-)

 

[kukubird58]

He's either stupidly honest or honestly stupid as a politician. Worse off then him are those who supports him. If I live in Tampines and GMS really come, I'll vote for PAP, not spoil my vote.

hahaha...ah Forv, don't lah....this is going to affect the Opp percentage.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

We singaporeans are all in the same boat

like i said before bro...i understand where u r coming fm n fully empathise wif u over the apparent sinicization of singapore society over the last 30 odd yrs...

however yr analogy is clearly flawed n erroneous...u appear to be moving in a dangerous irrational emotive way which sadly helps no one least of all yourself...

the 'singapore house' belongs to all singaporeans period...regardless of race,language or religion...we singaporeans all 'own' n r in this 'house' for better or for worse...

Since the Chinese started thinking that they are now owners of this land and treats the Republic of Singapore as an extended Mandarin speaking province of China.

Tell me honestly, if a tenant moves into a room in your house and over time, start imposing his values, language, customs and culture and start inviting his family, friends of his own race and start to treat your house as his and start insulting and treating the owner and landlord that is you as a nuisance tenant instead who must conform to his language, values and culture, what would you do?

Would you not kick this ungrateful tenant out of your house?

And if the Chinese dishonestly say they will not and do nothing, my question to them is this? Why the current angst over the new crop of foreigners moving to live in Singapore?

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Not black n white

i think u r making broad general sweeping statements wifout much substance to back up such a narrow minded subjective n somewhat biased pov...

fm my own personal knowledge of singapore chinese relatives n friends who hv emigrated abroad (all come fm english educated backgrds)...none of them left becoz of the reason(s) alleged by u...their reasons mainly stemmed fm wanting more space to breath both physically n intellectually...more work family life balance...n not wanting to c their kids tear their hair out n get depressed over studying mandarinCL2 the s'pore way(now finally acknowledged n conceded by harry no less as flawed n unfeasible!!) n the local educational pressure cooker system in general...

saying that i do acknowledge that quite afew singapore middle class eurasians(others) n middle class singapore indians emigrated both when harry & pap first came to power in 59'(apparently out of fear of the chinese commies coming into power)...n later in the 80s' due to the apparent sinicization of singapore...

be that as it may...i think things hv now become more complex n nuanced because of the rise of globalisation n the individual wif the requisite set of knowledge based skills in demand the world over...

ironically i gather that there r even afew higly educated m'sian malays who hv emigrated to s'pore in recent yrs due to their apparent unhappiness over the bumi elites controlling the malaysian economy together wif the powerful chinese n indian minorities...

so it is not as black n white as u make it out to be bro...

There's a difference as to why the Indians and Eurasians had to leave and why the Chinese emigrated.

The Indians and Eurasians (and Malays) were marginalised when it came to looking for jobs ("Mandarin speaking only", "Chinese only" job ads).

The social environment where you had to live alongside chang huayi Chinese who no longer behave like Singaporeans but like Chinamen who now own our Malay soil and can do as they please, had become intolerable.

The decades old and ongoing chauvinistic "Huaren, Huayi" campaigns introduced by the old fool to "unite" the Chinese and led by SAP Chinese extremists were rudely and insensitively intruding into their personal, social and especially common space like that of the workplace and public space had become intolerable.

The Chinese reasons for moving out are different. As I had pointed out earlier, the Chinese will either move on to another host or attempt to take over the host after they have sucked the host. Those Chinese who left have sucked enough from the host.

That, unlike that of the Indians and Eurasians, is their reason for leaving. Same outcome. Fundamentally different reasons.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Emperor without clothes

Straits Times' amusing n disingenuous editorial "On race and religion - again" which was no surprise really...once again providing substance ammo to be ranked 147 or below...demonstrates the emperor wifout clothes syndrome rearing its ugly head once again...

why didn't the abv ST ed deal wif the other critical n oh so relevant issues raised in AMP's statement? i.e. why made public, what abt OB markers n what abt the apparent sinicization of singapore in the last 30 odd yrs????...

This can only happen if people around him are letting him hear what he wants to hear. I could not help notice that all his political life has fear effectively and he can't seem to get over it as a tool to manipulate the masses.

First it was communism, then it was Malaysia trying to undo us, then the marxist, then it was Malaysian again trying to start their own port to kill our trade, and now Islam. He never stops with his bogeyman politics.

He certainly divided the nation and he thinks that others are responsible.

the photo taken in hangzhou of harry wearing his fu man chu jacket juxtaposed wif his host jiang zimin wearing a lounge suit made me rotfl...

Notice his habit of wearing the Mao jacket in his foreign travels - your comment about tribal roots.

unfortunately for the malays n all other ethnic minorities for that matter...i presently think perhaps it is still better the 'devil' u know than the 'devil' u dont...

I hope the Malays have good think who they want to represent their interest. The PAP is certainly not doing it.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Who is left with the shit?!

yes harry does indeed know what he is doing...but at whoose expense???...n in this regard i am not alluding to his son n the pap govt...

I daresay an old soldier like him knows exactly what he was doing. I think it is more like the good cop bad cop routine. He says the unmentionable as bad cop, and let his son play the good cop. His hard truth gets said, never mind if his son has to fight the rearguard action. The GE are coming. If it doesnt get thrashed out now, he has to hold his peace forever. I diidnt think he can stand it.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Yes!

yes, yes, yes...i shall go further...why the sudden need for distinct n separate ethnic self help orgs?...why the sudden need for SAP schools?...

But I do agree with you that the PAP language policies are very racially divisive. The Speak Mandarin campaign to unite Chinese also means keeping non-Chinese minorities segregated from the Chinese majority.

Shouldn't it be something to unite Singaporeans instead of just an ethnic group?

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Only Orang Laut...

well if the Singapore Malay is of pure "Orang Laut" blood then perhaps i wld agree wif u...but i hardly think that wld be the case...

i think there is no requirement for malays to integrate with "others".
they did not migrate here. they are merely staying in their homeland, but unfortunately, overwhelmed by migrants from other places.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

I suspect this has been a false front endeavor all the while.

Your reason to support the PAP does not hold water. The PAP has consistently crafted the message that the Malays are a threat to Singapore and therefor cannot be in the SAF except in some sterile capacity. Every time the PAP or its leaders raise the issue about Malays, it something negative about the race and the Govt is stepping in to "help". The other opposition have been silent about other races for decades.

Your first few posts gave the impression that you could not craft a decent sentence and your argument is that Chinese are recent arrivals and should be kicked. out. And your moniker is not something someone would choose. Now you write fluently. You battled with the rastafarian because you needed to have a forum and he being a racist with borderline IQ on a good day was the perfect foil.

Roy and others seem to put up better arguments than you in support of non-chinese. Yours is straight forward - the Malays own the land and the Chinese get out and the Malays will vote PAP. And nothing else.

I am in two minds if your are indeed a Malay as as you are destroying the race by your approach. First the old man indicates that the Malays won't assimilate and you come in and do the same. What gives?

Oh please screwball enough of your idiotic conclusions. Seriously do you actually think you're intelligent?

If you can actually read MMVPAP had been cursing MM lee afterwards hence his moniker is actually a contridiction.

In any case let's see you call me a borderline retard.

I have managed to counter almost every point you have given. You have not responded because you have shot yourself in the foot each time. You are illogical and make no sense whatsoever.

It's really strange cos you try to appear like a gentleman, you don't respond directly to me not because you are a gentleman oh no please i didn't insult you at all but you cannot counter any of my points like i mentioned earlier but of course you talk about me behind my back. What a coward you are.

I have already given my explainations as to why chinese have sap schools while the other races don't have it. Nope no opposing view from you. This proves you don't have any intelligent way to prove what i have written to be incorrect. Of course with your big ego you had to find a way to get back at me so you used a cheap move by talking bad about me behind my back. :oIo:

This shows what sort of character you are.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

I don't see how Speak Mandarin Campaign made any difference to the minorities. Mandarin has always been used in Chinese schools, not the dialects, unlike in HK. Not really a mother tongue for most ethnic southern Chinese here notwithstanding, it's position as a common language across all dialect groups has been longstanding well before the campaign, even well before independence. The difference in the olden days were the majority of Chinese, whatever dialects, weren't schooled. Their children who went to Chinese schools were schooled in Mandarin and conversed with each other in Mandarin. But upon going home, they conversed with their parents in their dialects.

The Speak Mandarin Campaign came along with the dismantling of all traditional Chinese schools, preserving and converting a few more prestigious ones to SAP schools. It's a matter of direction of Chinese education. I can see how some Chinese dialect die-hards are against it. But what has it got to do with Malays? No Chinese is accusing Malays of speaking Malay to each other or forcing them to speak Mandarin.

What you have written is correct. The reason why these ppl that disagree with such a campaign is they just need to find something to complain against the chinese. Hence you have ppl that write examples which look riddiculously senseless. Chinese ppl speaking mandarin among themselves thus leaving out the non mandarin speaking ppl in the workplace cos of some so called racist policy known as the speak mandarin campaign. Oh please. I have hung out with malay and indian frens and they speak to each other in their own language and i cannot understand them but i don't kick up a fuss like them.

These group of ppl are just simply kicking up a fuss for no reason.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Yes Again!

yes, yes, yes....

let me give u an eg. in my office...i hv always encouraged my hr head to get ethnic minority singgies for admin work n reception...we hv hired a malay here and an indian there...but sadly n unfortunately they all seem to quit after a short period...i became curious after a recurrence pattern n made some inquries...to my surprise(guess i was blissfully naive at that time becoz management staff had quite a god mix including ang mohs n now also nris...still exists!) i found out that the malays n indians quit because they eventually felt uncomfortable being a v small minority where mandarin n dialects were the common langs of communication intra admin staff...the same thing seems to happen where the singapore malays n indians seem to be the majority n hv 'control'...can hardly blame them...this appears to be a real live issue...worrying,troubling n of concern...a real conundrum...

Of course the common language between the races is English. What other language would a Malay, Indian and Chinese converse to each other with?

I'm refering to the Speak Mandarin at work campaign which encourages Chinese Singaporeans to speak Mandarin to other Chinese Singaporeans. While this in theory should not affect the rest, it might, in reality cause problems when the conversation is work related and the minority worker is left out.

The other issue is when the non Chinese minority feel left out when everybody else in bantering in Mandarin. I've been working for the past 30 years and I've always worked in a majority Chinese workplace. (its hard not to in Singapore) For the first 15 years, everybody spoke English to each other. However in recent times, my educated Chinese colleagues speak Mandarin to each other, including work related discussions which is not an ideal situation.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Common language of communication

i think sld apply to all ethnic grps...when in a grp where there is more than one ethnic grp person...the polite n sensitive approach sld be to speak a common lang to all...

let me give a light hearted yet real eg...when gerard houllier first took over as a manger of the reds n attended his first training session at melwood, he said that english wld be the common lang of communication...however later on that v same day he suddenly spoke in french to one of the french players in front of phil thompson his assistant manager...thompson immediately but gently told houllier to pls speak in english n use english as a common lang since he was working in england for an english football club...houllier laughingly held up his hand to admit his mistake n never again spoke in french amongst a mixed grp while he was at anfield...

There were olden days when most of our Chinese grandparents could speak conversational Malay. Had the culture of Malay speaking continued, the Malays would be pleased and most local Indians and Chinese would have no problem with it, but the English-speaking immigrants or visitors would still feel the sensitivity of being excluded as outsider. I'm Chinese, but I agree English is not only the most profitable but also the most logical and functional choice for an unifying language in a multi-lingual society.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

......


Many, many years ago, I was asked to stay back after school to re-write my very first essay. This was because the racist Chinese teacher thought that I had asked someone (presumably a clever Chinese) to write as she could not believe that a Malay whose destiny, she believed, lay in being a peon or driver to a Chinese could actually write and think critically. A few racists insults came flying my way from her mouth.

What racist insults did she say to you?

So you were told to re-write your essay. Was the new rewritten essay as good as the first one? 2ndly are you sure the teacher was racist towards you? Sometimes it's not cos the teacher is racist, it's cos they think you as an individual is unable to produce a piece of work at a certain level. Let me ask you and answer me honestly. Throughout your schooling years what sort of student were you? How were your grades like? Please don't mistake every biasness exhibited by some chinese person as racism against your race. It might be your personality or how you present yourself.

We have done everything that we can to the point of feeling utter humiliation in having to grovel before the Chinese to seek acceptance and in order to prove our worth, loyalty, etc. What do we get back? We get a kick in our mouths. Need to speak Mandarin at the workplace? Okay we will try to assimilate and learn to speak Mandarin. And of course, our people still don't get the job because they are then asked whether they can write in Chinese, etc.

The Chinese have been inflicting, over a few decades, a severe psychological damage on the collective psyche of my people. They have done so by constantly belittling and humiliating us as useless, lazy, good for nothings, etc when in truth, we simply do not share and are not interested in the rapacious, materialistic values and acquisitive culture of the Chinese.

This is indeed a joke. It's like you're blaming your own failures unto others. If i do recall in school we had ah bengs and other assorted pupils that loved to have fun and laze around all day and were chinese. Nobody is preventing you from studying harder instead of lazing around not studying or working harder. I find that you have contridicted yourself. Firstly you mention the chinese have been belitting you as lazy, good for nothing and it has damaged your psyche. Ok, the next sentence you mention you're actually not interested in improving yourselves. Do you see how riddiculous this sounds? If you're not even interested in improving yourselves and want to take it easy in life, how in the hell can the chinese damage your psyche when that's how you all act? You shot yourself in the own foot. The chinese merely called a spade a spade. Please, you're just trying to find ways to blame chinese ppl again as usual. Who doesn't want to take life easy? The new china immigrants work harder than the local chinese and the local chinese get called lazy. It doesn't sound flattering at all but when we look at it, it's a fact. We know that's true. The local chinese don't go blaming others when they know that it's a fact they don't work as hard or want to succeed as much as the china ppl.

I'm sure you like nice stuff like new clothes, nice jewellery, cars and so on. The last time i checked malays do love those above items, your race is materialistic too so stop putting the blame unto others.

We have decided that enough is enough. There is a point where we stop rolling over and start hitting back. We have adopted a tit-for tat response.

Start your SAP schools and we will start our madrasahs. Speak you Mandarin and we will speak our Malay. Rekindle your ties with the Malaysian Chinese and we will rekindle our ties with the Malaysian Malays. Seek support and kinship with your one billion global Chinese kin and we will seek support and kinship with our one billion global Muslim ummah. Treat our land as though you are owners and can turn it into a Mandarin speaking province of China and we will respond by reasserting our claims over our land and telling you to pack up and leave. The tit-for tat list will go on.

I have already explained why it is not in our strategic interest to vote for another Chinese party. Unless you can show me a Chinese party who will defend our strategic interest, we will be happy to consider it. You and I know that there are none and that we will be worse off if we have to deal with more Chinese parties under various clans or political groupings. You and I know that the duplicitous Chinese "activists" and political opportunists have jumped onto our bandwagon trying to show their "care" and "concern" for our community with the hope of winning our votes and nothing else. That is also the reason why you had to coach that SAP-NSP guy about what to say about the Malays when he revealed his true colours.

The last part that i quoted is indeed a big joke. Firstly are madrasahs banned in sg? The last time i checked there are quite a significant percentage of malays that study in these religious schools. No chinese has complained about it. What's your grouse then? The students studying in sap schools don't go around creating trouble. Their parents chose for them to study in a sap school what business is it of yours? Just like if a malay wishes to get his child enrolled in a religious school go ahead, who's stopping him?

Who's stopping you ppl from speaking malay? The army commands, the national anthem are all in malay the chinese aren't complaining. Who's stopping you from speaking your malay language? Tell me who?

From this last paragraph i can see that you're insane. What's your nick again? The PAP is a chinese run party hence by posting under this nick what does it make you? Somebody that contridicts himself.

Lastly all politicians want voters to vote for them. I guess you want a politician with noble intentions which is indeed an oxymoron then create a new nick. Malays must vote for new malay party. Politicians of every race do things not because they are saints that expect nothing in return, they do it cos they want your vote. This applies to all politicians regardless of race.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Singapore is not a homogenuous state

perhaps u hv a pt...however i think u forget the region in which singapore is situated n the fact that singapore was n is not a homogenuous state...

if u read read harry's latest book u wld know that even harry acknowledges that singapore's future lies in this region n not north asia, in particular china...notwithstanding the rise of china as both an economic super power n probably a military super power in the future as well...

the local issues of race, language n religion remain v complex n sensitive issues...real hot potato conundrums wif no easy ans...these r not black n white issues...

Sure that there was a politcal agenda to speak mandarin campaign. But another angle could be that Deng took power in 1978 and opened up China to the world for business. Speak Mandarin campaign started in Singapore shortly after that.

Perhaps MM could see that the future was bright for Mandarin speakers and introduced the speak mandarin campaign. He put $ where his mouth and in 1992 invested billions in Suzhou.

Many Singaporeans are now able to benefit from this ability to converse and write in Mandarin. Many Singaporeans, because of their knowledge of English and Western business management practice (edu in the West) and their knowledge of Chinese language and culture are able to parlay that into lucrative jobs in China.

As for more use of Mandarin - well there is influx of PRC but there is also the cultural influence that China has in the region. Much was made about former Australian PM ability to speak mandarin.

If you look forward, Chinese base of 1.4B united by a common written languange, increasing dominance in this region I think mandarin will be used even more frequently.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Re: Common language of communication

i think sld apply to all ethnic grps...when in a grp where there is more than one ethnic grp person...the polite n sensitive approach sld be to speak a common lang to all...

let me give a light hearted yet real eg...when gerard houllier first took over as a manger of the reds n attended his first training session at melwood, he said that english wld be the common lang of communication...however later on that v same day he suddenly spoke in french to one of the french players in front of phil thompson his assistant manager...thompson immediately but gently told houllier to pls speak in english n use english as a common lang since he was working in england for an english football club...houllier laughingly held up his hand to admit his mistake n never again spoke in french amongst a mixed grp while he was at anfield...

Firstly why did gerard speakin french? He's a frenchman common sense a person would be more comfortable speaking in his mother tongue. There are many chinese in sg that are chinese educated and are more comfortable speaking in mandarin rather than english. Yet i am sure they would comply if someone that didn't understand mandarin ask them to speak in english instead.


Let me change the situation on the above example you have given. If phil thompson had the same behavior and demeanour as one of the minorities in singapore. He would have kept quiet instead of reminding gerard he would have kept quiet and then gone on to complain in a forum that the football club is racist and that the french are trying to impose their french culture unto an english club. This looks very likely correct?

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Archipelago not Peninsula

er sorry for being pedantic but since singapore is an island of itself wif afew other tiny specs now including pendra branca...then i dont think it can be part of the malay peninsula...archipelago perhaps but not peninsula...

I feel distasteful whenever I hear Singapore Chinese referring to Malaysia as mudland. Looking at the map, it's not hard for anyone with moderate intelligence and eyesight to see that Singapore is geographically part of the Malay peninsula.

 

[kingrant]

Yr pov seems rather naive. Political agenda and motives are seldom obvious. They will be sold in as transparent a manner as possible so even those who are targets will not know them. Examples of the political agenda are SAP schools, Speak mandarin campaign, and even the graduate mother scheme. One example of the target is pple like you. You also need innocent and guileless citizens to absorb the messages with religious zeal and without suspicion

Let me put it this way. LKY has always believed (I daresay it is in his blood) that only a Chinese-dominant Singapore can continue to keep Singapore going. A lot of pple ( such as the 66%) may think that as the 'modern father' of Singapore, the Great Helmsman of Singapore, his integrity and motives can't be selfish and therefore must be beyond question, and like gosh! what were we thinking?

Whether that is justified is irrelevant for now, because he has internalised his thinking into Singapore politics and govt. and that will not change until another party who thinks differently replaces the PAP. in power. E.g. LKY has cited examples over the past yrs why the Japs, and the 'tiger economies' of the Koreans, and Taiwanese and HKies have such hard driving economies because they are homogenous - no need to wait for slaggard minorities to catch up, all in one direction and high momentum etc. Ask LKY and he'll ask you to produce examples of Muslim countries (non-oil exporting) which ranked equal or better than them on the OECD.

So with the 66% like you, the PAP propaganda has worked well. LKY's Yellow Singapore policy is akin to the White Australian policy. The PAP govt has said as much when various Ministers led by the PM and old man, admitted to a grand open door policy for Chinese and Indians; well, Indians as well because one, they are also hungry and prepared to slog, and two, to help camouflage the Yellow policy.

What you and I experienced are at the street level. Obviously we dont seem to feel that we are directly discriminating or making Malays feel left out, but the fact is, they do feel that way, and going by the sometimes heated discussions, there are emotional reactions.

What you have written is correct. The reason why these ppl that disagree with such a campaign is they just need to find something to complain against the chinese. Hence you have ppl that write examples which look riddiculously senseless. Chinese ppl speaking mandarin among themselves thus leaving out the non mandarin speaking ppl in the workplace cos of some so called racist policy known as the speak mandarin campaign. Oh please. I have hung out with malay and indian frens and they speak to each other in their own language and i cannot understand them but i don't kick up a fuss like them.

These group of ppl are just simply kicking up a fuss for no reason.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Ibans, Orang Laut n Orang Asli

er sorry for being pedantic once again...but i think u may be wrong on this one bro...

Ibans n Sarawak perhaps...Ibans n Singapore, i dont think so, more like Orang Laut...n as for East Peninsula Malaysia may be Orang Asli but not Ibans...

The original people on these lands in present Malaysia, Sarawak and Singapore are the Ibans.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[GoldenDragon]

Re: Ibans, Orang Laut n Orang Asli

er sorry for being pedantic once again...but i think u may be wrong on this one bro...

Ibans n Sarawak perhaps...Ibans n Singapore, i dont think so, more like Orang Laut...n as for East Peninsula Malaysia may be Orang Asli but not Ibans...

Goh Meng Seng's SBF Exam Results

English : Fail
Economics : Fail
History : Fail
UFO TCSS : To Be Tested

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Yr pov seems rather naive. Political agenda and motives are seldom obvious. They will be sold in as transparent a manner as possible so even those who are targets will not know them. Examples of the political agenda are SAP schools, Speak mandarin campaign, and even the graduate mother scheme. One example of the target is pple like you. You also need innocent and guileless citizens to absorb the messages with religious zeal and without suspicion

Firstly answer me this how does the speak mandarin campaign affect non chinese speaking ppl? If the chinese ppl aren't speaking mandarin they would be speaking dialects to one another. 2ndly if speak mandarin was not implemented then what language would you suggest the chinese ppl learn as a mother tongue? English?

Let me put it this way. LKY has always believed (I daresay it is in his blood) that only a Chinese-dominant Singapore can continue to keep Singapore going. A lot of pple ( such as the 66%) may think that as the 'modern father' of Singapore, the Great Helmsman of Singapore, his integrity and motives can't be selfish and therefore must be beyond question, and like gosh! what were we thinking?

Here's when we need to talk about inconvinent truths and unflattering facts. Why is sg the richest coutry in SEA? Why does it have a higher standard of living and a lower crime rate than its immediate neighbours? That's cos the majority race happen to be chinese. It's not a coincidence that east asian countries all happen to have a higher standard of living and a lower crime rate in contrast to asians from other countries is there?

Btw what is the correlation btw the speak mandarin campaign the the chinese as a majority in the country?

Whether that is justified is irrelevant for now, because he has internalised his thinking into Singapore politics and govt. and that will not change until another party who thinks differently replaces the PAP. in power. E.g. LKY has cited examples over the past yrs why the Japs, and the 'tiger economies' of the Koreans, and Taiwanese and HKies have such hard driving economies because they are homogenous - no need to wait for slaggard minorities to catch up, all in one direction and high momentum etc. Ask LKY and he'll ask you to produce examples of Muslim countries (non-oil exporting) which ranked equal or better than them on the OECD.

It's true isn't it? A homogenous country with ppl from a particular race tend to create a country that is successful and others from some other race create a country that is unsuccessful correct?

Again i am sure i will be called a racist all becos i speak unflattering facts. Let's take a look at western countries that being forced to become more globalised. What happens? Take countries like the UK or france that allow tons of 3rd world ppl into their countries. What happens? The crime rate goes up and the standard of living falls. Compare a place like hk for eg to new delhi. Hk is almost 100% chinese. How is the standard of living compared to new delhi?

So with the 66% like you, the PAP propaganda has worked well. LKY's Yellow Singapore policy is akin to the White Australian policy. The PAP govt has said as much when various Ministers led by the PM and old man, admitted to a grand open door policy for Chinese and Indians; well, Indians as well because one, they are also hungry and prepared to slog, and two, to help camouflage the Yellow policy.

What you and I experienced are at the street level. Obviously we dont seem to feel that we are directly discriminating or making Malays feel left out, but the fact is, they do feel that way, and going by the sometimes heated discussions, there are emotional reactions.

Oic i thought it was all non chinese being left out now it's just the malays. Firstly i'm not the 66%. I voted for the oppo in the last election. What are you talking about?


The national language of this country is malay, the army commands are all in malay and so on. The malays speak to each other in malay and nobody complains. Please be more specific.

You're talking about letting in huge flood of fts. Let me remind you that not only china chinese or india indians but ppl from various nationalities are let in. Filippinos are let in and they are closely related to the malays.

I don't blame the pap for wanting more china chinese to come in to keep the population with the same ratio of chinese. Look at MMVPAP. He admitted himself that his race likes to take it easy. If that's the case the standard of living of this country will fall. We need ppl with ambition and drive to bring this country to new heights. I am sure by mentioning this you'll accuse me of being a racist.