Is HDB a ponzi scheme or BTO shortfall in demand projection? (which is why grants to buy resale HDB are double the grants to buy BTO HDB)?

[bic_cherry]

Is HDB a ponzi scheme or BTO shortfall in demand projection? (which is why grants to buy resale HDB are double the grants to buy BTO HDB)?

If HDB really respected market forces, then the grant for resale HDB should be equal or LOWER than new BTO bought HDB (unless HDB admits to giving an implicit (secret) discount for BTO units)- then the subsidy for resale HDB should be equal to BTO HDB or in fact lower (with the remainder placed into CPF very special account for future new HDB purchase wrt shortened lease of resale HDB be insufficient for owners lifetime due to short ending lease HDB flat purchased).

Otherwise, the subsidy is an implicit funding to artificially increase the prices of resale HDB, which is like fueling a ponzi scheme to deceptively keep HDB resale prices high with tax payers money.

If HDB underestimated the demand by PR and the death rate of HDB owners resulting in diminished supply and excessive demand for resale market HDB flats, then perhaps PR should be temporarily banned from buying HDB flats or be allowed to buy direct from HDB but at a much higher price. Gahmen can also release more land for developers to bid for to lower private property prices so more Singaporeans will upgrade and thus increase supply of resale HDB and so lower prices so taxpayers moneys will not be misused to prop up HDB prices.


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https://blog.carousell.com/property/hdb-resale-flat-singapore-grants/
"There are quite a few government grants and subsidies in Singapore – probably more than you know of! – even if you’re getting a resale HDB flat and not a BTO.
We’ve done the math: You can get up to $160,000 in grants when buying a HDB resale flat. That’s probably a quarter of the price of your new home covered.
P.S. The maximum grant amount you can get for BTO flat is $80,000. So even if your resale alternative is pricier, you’ve got more grants to help!"

 

[knowwhatyouwantinlife]

Cannot calculate like this because when you sell you need to pay back the grant plus accrued interest...

 

[JohnTan]

It's thanks to the PAP that sinkies can have affordable homes. If you think HDB is a ponzi, you are welcome to migrate to HK and buy your new home there.

 

[Insider Player]

Hdb is not a ponzu scheme. The product is marked up so high with huge profit margin how can be ponzi.

CPF is the ponzi but it didn’t started out as one.
It became a ponzi only after empress lost most of the money

 

[bic_cherry]

Hdb is not a ponzu scheme. The product is marked up so high with huge profit margin how can be ponzi.

CPF is the ponzi but it didn’t started out as one.
It became a ponzi only after empress lost most of the money

Ponzi is where u use new investor money to pay out dividends.

Those who cash out do so from new funds injected by investors.

In this case, it's new funds from tax payers (as subsidies and grants to buy resale HDB).

So HDB can manipulate the market to give the impression that resale HDB flats are always higher in price than the respective BTO prices.

In this way, HDB is a Ponzi price scheme.


(Or could be a population projection planning mistake as I had aforementioned earlier (because older Singaporeans now live much longer than PAP expected and so are not releasing their flats to foreigners who are PR holders upon demise, thus the relative shortage of HDB flats in resale market and thus their abnormally higher prices).

 

[laksaboy]

The prices are determined by the number of PRs created.

Think of it as something similar to the Marina Barrage. During high tide, water is pumped out.

 

[bic_cherry]

The prices are determined by the number of PRs created.

Think of it as something similar to the Marina Barrage. During high tide, water is pumped out.

Too many PR, too few old people dying, too few reasonably priced private properties for HDB dwellers to upgrade and sell their HDB units, all cause resale HDB to be overpriced and then squander of tax payers money to subsidise the purchase of these over priced HDB flats.

 

[CPTMiller]

Cannot calculate like this because when you sell you need to pay back the grant plus accrued interest...

That's right.
It is not like a direct discount but rather a rebate with conditions.

 

[CPTMiller]

It's thanks to the PAP that sinkies can have affordable homes. If you think HDB is a ponzi, you are welcome to migrate to HK and buy your new home there.

I got to agreed if housing situation compare between HK and SIN.
We are the the upper hand for now.

 

[Insider Player]

I got to agreed if housing situation compare between HK and SIN.
We are the the upper hand for now.

Hk property prices manipulated by big developers
Sg property prices manipulated by pap
Different but same same
No guarantee we won’t be like hk in not too distant future

 

[bic_cherry]

TS is really like the Lim Tean of Edmw.

So far, NOBODY has given any viable reason why HDB grant for buying resale is DOUBLE that of buying BTO HDB when by right, market forces should prevail, unless this is HDB admission that they had miscalculated the demand for HDB by PR or had over estimated the number of Singaporeans dying and thus giving up their HDB flats.

Thus the need for extra $80,000 SGD subsidy to buy resale HDB flats.

Solution to too many PR demanding HDB flats is to open BTO market to PR but at different pricing (equal to resale HDB pricings but with new 99 year leasehold) or just ban PR from buying any resale HDB for an interim period until resale HDB flat prices return back to an affordable sale price without need for additional government grants or subsidies provided.

 

[bic_cherry]

Stop reading that HDB can manipulate the market. Source?

Obviously is market price manipulation by HDB to give citizens the false impression that resale HDB prices are high, by encouraging people to buy them by giving a grant.

Without the grant, nobody will buy these resale HDB flats due to excessively high price, however, with the grant, they can now afford to pay $160,000 extra, if this is not market manipulation by HDB to create impression that HDB value is high, then what better reason can there be for it? That's why I say that HDB is in some ways a ponzi scheme.


If HDB just wanted to make resale HDB more accessable, then they should not allow private property owners to own HDB as well or rent out entire HDB flat.

HDB flat owners who own private residential properties should also have to pay corporate property tax or residential property tax (which ever is higher) on these properties which they can rent out 100% as they do now.

 

[Papsmearer]

If HDB really respected market forces, then the grant for resale HDB should be equal or LOWER than new BTO bought HDB (unless HDB admits to giving an implicit (secret) discount for BTO units)- then the subsidy for resale HDB should be equal to BTO HDB or in fact lower (with the remainder placed into CPF very special account for future new HDB purchase wrt shortened lease of resale HDB be insufficient for owners lifetime due to short ending lease HDB flat purchased).

Like many sinkies, you truly do not understand how the property market and the HDB works in sinkieland. I will say it once again. There is no market forces in Singapore, there is no free and open market, there is no real property market in singapore. its all a lie and smoke and mirrors. Why? When one entity (the Singapore govt, thru its various subsidiaries such as HDB, SLA, URA, etc.) own and control 90% of the land and 85% of all residential units, there is no property market. Its as simple as that. There is a monopoly. What u pay for your unit is what they tell u to pay. U don't have a damn choice and that is not a market.

 

[sweetiepie]

KNN resale hdb is more expensive than bto hence the grant is more than bto KNN

 

[rushifa666]

Like many sinkies, you truly do not understand how the property market and the HDB works in sinkieland. I will say it once again. There is no market forces in Singapore, there is no free and open market, there is no real property market in singapore. its all a lie and smoke and mirrors. Why? When one entity (the Singapore govt, thru its various subsidiaries such as HDB, SLA, URA, etc.) own and control 90% of the land and 85% of all residential units, there is no property market. Its as simple as that. There is a monopoly. What u pay for your unit is what they tell u to pay. U don't have a damn choice and that is not a market.

The thickos will never get it dont waste your breath. I bet they still say they are home owners lol

 

[Papsmearer]

The thickos will never get it dont waste your breath. I bet they still say they are home owners lol

hahahha, yeah. PAP say they own their homes, so they believe it lah. suckers.

 

[blackmondy]

Everything conjured up by Piss-And-Poop is a Ponzi scheme one way or another.

 

[mojito]

Too many PR, too few old people dying, too few reasonably priced private properties for HDB dwellers to upgrade and sell their HDB units, all cause resale HDB to be overpriced and then squander of tax payers money to subsidise the purchase of these over priced HDB flats.

Resale flat subsidy is something I never quite understand. That only make those PRs cashing out rich.

 

[Papsmearer]

Everything conjured up by Piss-And-Poop is a Ponzi scheme one way or another.

Yup. But 70% think its the best thing since slice bread