Infidelity in Organisations - the Singaporean notion

[yahoo55]

The other obvious reason why people would want to renounce their Singapore citizenships is to get their hands on ALL their CPF money. A bird in hand is worth two in the bush. Singaporeans tell us to leave the money in CPF as it gives good interest and all that. But I don't believe that will last. I think that CPF is a ponzi scheme. Medishield Life is a way to claw back some of the "interest" paid out on CPF accounts. Temasek is probably not well financially.

Under Sinkie law created by PAP, your CPF money technically does not belong to you, legally it belongs to the CPF board which is controlled by the PAP govt. PAP did this so that they can change and manipulate the CPF rules easily in parliament without ever needing to get CPF account holders approval. PAP can also easily reduce CPF interest rates as the rates are not fixed.

Medishield Life is a scheme by PAP to stop subsidizing medical care for the poor and "new poor", Medishield Life premiums will shoot up in a few years time, and the healthy will be subsidizing the sick. The mandatory Medishield Life premiums will get very expensive for Sinkies in 5-6 years time as the population ages.

Another bad thing about Medishield Life are the high co-payments and deductibles. After the introduction of Medishield Life, PAP also changed the CPF rules such that if Sinkies do not have enough medisave to pay the co-payments in their hospital bills, PAP can confiscate money in their other CPF accounts to pay the hospital bills. That's why I find that PAP's intention for CPF is not for Sinkies retirement but to pay hospital bills and other bills from the govt.

Lastly, I agree with you that ultimately CPF is a Ponzi scheme by PAP. I suspect PAP have been losing billions in their investments and Sinkie's population is aging fast, PAP will not be able to pay back their CPF debt once the withdrawals exceeds the deposits.

 

[nayr69sg]

Under Sinkie law created by PAP, your CPF money technically does not belong to you, legally it belongs to the CPF board which is controlled by the PAP govt. PAP did this so that they can change and manipulate the CPF rules easily in parliament without ever needing to get CPF account holders approval. PAP can also easily reduce CPF interest rates as the rates are not fixed.

Medishield Life is a scheme by PAP to stop subsidizing medical care for the poor and "new poor", Medishield Life premiums will shoot up in a few years time, and the healthy will be subsidizing the sick. The mandatory Medishield Life premiums will get very expensive for Sinkies in 5-6 years time as the population ages.

Another bad thing about Medishield Life are the high co-payments and deductibles. After the introduction of Medishield Life, PAP also changed the CPF rules such that if Sinkies do not have enough medisave to pay the co-payments in their hospital bills, PAP can confiscate money in their other CPF accounts to pay the hospital bills. That's why I find that PAP's intention for CPF is not for Sinkies retirement but to pay hospital bills and other bills from the govt.

Lastly, I agree with you that ultimately CPF is a Ponzi scheme by PAP. I suspect PAP have been losing billions in their investments and Sinkie's population is aging fast, PAP will not be able to pay back their CPF debt once the withdrawals exceeds the deposits.

Yup. Thank goodness I have withdrawn all my CPF money. As I said, a bird in hand is worth two in the bush.

 

[Charlie99]

I have a friend in Australia who migrated there when she was in her teens. She had never applied for Australian citizenship until now. Why? Because of the new Medishield Life scheme.

I believe this issues will wake overseas Singaporeans from their slumber and decide they do not want to pay for something they do not use. Also many Singaporeans realize their roots are now deep in their new home countries and they have less in common with Singaporeans.

The other obvious reason why people would want to renounce their Singapore citizenships is to get their hands on ALL their CPF money. A bird in hand is worth two in the bush. Singaporeans tell us to leave the money in CPF as it gives good interest and all that. But I don't believe that will last. I think that CPF is a ponzi scheme. Medishield Life is a way to claw back some of the "interest" paid out on CPF accounts. Temasek is probably not well financially.

emphasis in BOLD print added.

As an insolvency practitioner, and after reading about the very significant losses resulting from huge investments that have gone South, and the lack of full, fair and transparent disclosure,
I hate to say it, but I have to agree with you that Temasek is probably "Temasick"

 

[winnipegjets]

Yup. Thank goodness I have withdrawn all my CPF money. As I said, a bird in hand is worth two in the bush.

Did you buy a mansion in Calgary? Read that lots of those houses are selling relatively cheap.

 

[winnipegjets]

Under Sinkie law created by PAP, your CPF money technically does not belong to you, legally it belongs to the CPF board which is controlled by the PAP govt. PAP did this so that they can change and manipulate the CPF rules easily in parliament without ever needing to get CPF account holders approval. PAP can also easily reduce CPF interest rates as the rates are not fixed.

Sinkees have been led to believe in the Sinkapore Government Guarantee.

Medishield Life is a scheme by PAP to stop subsidizing medical care for the poor and "new poor", Medishield Life premiums will shoot up in a few years time, and the healthy will be subsidizing the sick. The mandatory Medishield Life premiums will get very expensive for Sinkies in 5-6 years time as the population ages.

Trust the PAP to bastardize a good system to benefit themselves at the expense of the people.

Another bad thing about Medishield Life are the high co-payments and deductibles. After the introduction of Medishield Life, PAP also changed the CPF rules such that if Sinkies do not have enough medisave to pay the co-payments in their hospital bills, PAP can confiscate money in their other CPF accounts to pay the hospital bills. That's why I find that PAP's intention for CPF is not for Sinkies retirement but to pay hospital bills and other bills from the govt.

The government is poorer than you think. They are always finding new ways to squeeze us.

Lastly, I agree with you that ultimately CPF is a Ponzi scheme by PAP. I suspect PAP have been losing billions in their investments and Sinkie's population is aging fast, PAP will not be able to pay back their CPF debt once the withdrawals exceeds the deposits.

I hope the Ponzi scheme will be exposed sooner. There is always an SQ A380 on standby for the PAP elites to run road.

 

[nayr69sg]

Did you buy a mansion in Calgary? Read that lots of those houses are selling relatively cheap.

No. It is too expensive. And I have no need for a mansion. We are happy with our Single Family Home that overlooks COP and the Rockies.

 

[winnipegjets]

From what I have read, it looks that Honourable Minister stood his ground, and appears to be denying his "escapade"
If the MIW believe that they are white and pure, with integrity and on high moral ground, then that said Minister should have voluntarily resigned.

I missed this juicy episode of traitor Shamu ...got link or not?

 

[scroobal]

Euros and Boon Keng Mkt.

It was never at Kembangan :o:o:o

 

[scroobal]

Good to hear from you Bro.

There are few Singaporeans who can hold a candle to Dr Ang. The things that she did in Palestine are immense. Sadly she is one Britain's assets and not one of ours.

The law does allow Singapore to strip her of her Singapore Citizenship even if she did not step into Singapore or even if does not hold another country's citizenship. But this is on the basis that she undermined Singapore's national security, was a threat etc. None of which is the case. They might have something on Francis but not her. They are just playing mind games.

There is another law specific to ICA where if you have a Singapore passport but instead used foreign passport they might charge you for a minor offence. The general rule of thumb for multiple passport holders are to use the passport of that country when you enter and leave.

I know of Singaporeans who are Dual Citizens with homes overseas and have travelled in and out Singaporeans using both passports. The ICA systems can detect who you are based on DOB and place of Birth. So they know who you are. The authorities will however will write a nice letter to you to give up your foreign citizenship if you return to Singapore and remain in Singapore for more than a year. So the trick is not to use your foreign passport to enter or leave Singapore so there is no way for them to know that you possess a foreign citizenship. .

By the way, there are family members of senior folks in Singapore that do have dual citizenships.

In essence there is no such law and no one has been charged in court for dual citizenship since we became a country. If Singapore was determined to stamp out dual citizenship, they would pose that question in the disembarkation card instead they ask if you have entered Singapore with a different name.

Welcome back scroobal - I am certainly glad to have discussions on these issues being taken up once more as they do provide valuable insights for those who contribute their experiences and insights, red herrings included - this debacle around Dr Ang Swee Chai seems to reinforce the perception that if you have dual citizenship it will be stripped away from you - would the grounds be for making a false declaration on "any other citizenship" held? Although it may just be a hopeless reporter's writing, the distinction seems to be muddled even if it is merely technical/adinistrative i.e. is she being stripped of her citizenship or is the issue that she will not be issued a travel document?

"She needs the special papers because she holds both British and Singapore citizenship and does not want to give up either.

"I can come into Singapore with a British passport, but unless there is assurance that the Immigration and Checkpoints Authority (ICA) will not strip me of my Singapore citizenship, I must not risk it," she told The Straits Times in an e-mail.

"The ICA has pointed that out to me... I stand to lose my citizenship if I do so," she added."

"An MHA spokesman said the Government does not allow citizens to hold dual citizenship, and will not issue travel documents if they have not renounced their foreign citizenship. She said Dr Ang's 2012 travel document was issued with a "clear understanding that she would resolve her dual citizenship status expeditiously".

Since then, ICA has reminded Dr Ang to do so four times - the last reminder was last month, on Feb 4, a spokesman said. "ICA will process her request for such a document, once she shows proof she has started the process of renouncing her British citizenship."

http://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/re-entry-issue-for-singaporean-with-uk-passport

 

[scroobal]

There is no such law and there is no clause in the constitution or any other statutes of the land that states that holding foreign citizenship is illegal or prohibited. Sec 134 and 135 states that Govt "may" deprive you of your citizenship if you acquire foreign citizenship or exercised the right of foreign citizenship. This same or similar condition is present in the UK laws in the event the Home Secretary wants to act against a British Citizen who becomes a threat to the UK.

The word "may" is the key operating word here. Unless you give grief to this country, you would not be an issue. I would love to see the Minister draw up a reason for deprivation for an ordinary citizen who has acquired foreign citizenship.

Although the Singapore government "does not allow citizens to hold dual citizenship"
it does not appear that the Singapore Constitution indicates that it is illegal.

For that individual, it appears that the Singapore did not deprive her of her Singapore citizenship,
or took active steps to strip her of Singapore citizenship.
There is nothing for the Singapore government to gain by stripping her of her Singapore citizenship.

It appears that the Singapore may not wish to publicize the possibility of Singapore citizens holding dual citizenship,
as long as it does not jeopardize other significant Singapore's policies, such as obligations to serve NS.

 

[winnipegjets]

Thank you Charlie99 for your advice and encouragement back in 2004. If not for this forum and the information I got I would not be in Canada. So thank you everyone, and thank you Leongsam for this wonderful forum.

How about all the canucks, ex-sinkees, come back to makan with us who are trapped here?

 

[winnipegjets]

The irony is that I was very happy working at the windows factory and very happy working at the land admin company.

Unhappy being a doctor again. I did leave Singapore. But I now know that one of the reasons that led me to leave was also because I disliked working as a doctor. So now I am back in the same profession. Granted the money is good but I am unhappy at work. I really do not feel like anyone worth respecting and admiring. I have given up my happiness in exchange for financial security. Certainly not what I had in mind when I moved to Canada.

Nevertheless, as I said, it was never really about me but for my family. I just never counted on being happy working in minimum wage jobs and moving up the corporate ladder and instead being unhappy doing what I was trained in Singapore to do. Perhaps it is because of my Singapore experience that poisons my view of medicine. I will never know.

My wife and kids are happy though so I guess that's most of what I set out to do.

Why so unhappy as a family doctor? You could always reduce your load, can't you?

Fortunately, you became a doctor, otherwise you would be a number in the unemployed Albertan statistics.

 

[scroobal]

The CPF after 1984 became an escrow for the Government to ensure that HDB repayments and any medical bill incurred is paid off. It no longer is a pension find. It has become a security deposit during the lifetime of a resident to reduce the burden of the state. It has also become a major generator of income for the govt.

They shave off a major % of the returns. The full return on the sum is never revealed. There are no representation from the members on any board or committee that has an influence on the rules and conduct of the Fund. No other first World country will allow this unilateral approach of handling pension fund of its members. The Govt continues to rely on the guarantee as the single basis on why they run it the way they want to.

Under Sinkie law created by PAP, your CPF money technically does not belong to you, legally it belongs to the CPF board which is controlled by the PAP govt. PAP did this so that they can change and manipulate the CPF rules easily in parliament without ever needing to get CPF account holders approval. PAP can also easily reduce CPF interest rates as the rates are not fixed.

 

[winnipegjets]

Wendy so chio meh?. If kee chiu wants her, he must be really sex starved, unless he is aiming for a threesome kinky together with david.

Kee Chiu is a psychologically scarred man; that's why CON U was able to make him his dog. Kee Chiu needed a father and CON U became his new father.

Solly lah....Wendy just a lau kway boo, nothing, if compared to the mature essence of a serene or even the slightly oldish Pamela. Just one flower vase to be used for pcc on a close & intimate basis and most likely to be tossed aside by david eventually for younger mangoes ....such are the sexy privileges provided to the darth overlords using pa, rc, ccc mangoes....no wonder so many want to join in the ranks of the whiteys ....

PAP elites have no taste ...they are just greedy.

 

[Charlie99]

I missed this juicy episode of traitor Shamu ...got link or not?

It has been posted by several individuals, at this Sammyboy forum.
May be [scroobal] could provide the url or link?

 

[frenchbriefs]

The CPF after 1984 became an escrow for the Government to ensure that HDB repayments and any medical bill incurred is paid off. It no longer is a pension find. It has become a security deposit during the lifetime of a resident to reduce the burden of the state. It has also become a major generator of income for the govt.

They shave off a major % of the returns. The full return on the sum is never revealed. There are no representation from the members on any board or committee that has an influence on the rules and conduct of the Fund. No other first World country will allow this unilateral approach of handling pension fund of its members. The Govt continues to rely on the guarantee as the single basis on why they run it the way they want to.

nonsense,nothing but fabrications and lies about the cpf,any attempts to uncover the truth behind the stolen cpf returns will be met with defamation charges amounting up to 150k and not exceeding two and a half peanuts.

funny that u bring that up,the entire purpose of the CPF from the start was designed to reduce the burden of the state.....individualized retirement accounts my ass.another excuse for not implementing state welfare and state pensions.

why so many of our pioneer generation and elderly cannot afford to retire?

decades ago,when cpf was first implemented,the contribution rate to CPF was only 10 percent(including employer's) and the minimum sum was much much smaller,i heard it was only 55k or less,Goh Keng Swee and Albert winsemius at the time probably thought CPF was more or less the golden key for retirement,a $500 monthly pay out was probably thought to be a princely retirement suitable for a sinkie king.fast forward to today 2015,when HDB flats cost $400k a pop,a bowl of curry chicken rice cost $7,a 15 minute taxi ride cost about $17,a bah bao cost $2.50.skyrocketing inflation thanks to gdp growth at all cost.coupled with the low interest rates in CPF from the 1980s to 2000s that is barely enough to beat inflation.....thats when the pioneer generation knew they were royally screwed,their cpf decimated and reduced to peanuts thanks to hyperinflation,doomed to a life of bondage slavery hoping to scrape together $50 a day for survival till the day they die scrubbing toilets and clearing dishes.

the government analysts and statisticians then realised their great folly and panicked,overnight the contribution rate on cpf jumped from 10 percent to 36 percent.the minimum sum was raised from 55k to 155k and the government is still increasing it by 8k every year like theres no tomorrow.

all those who put your faith in the CPF will be doomed to the same fate,those who do not remember the past are doomed to repeat it.

 

[zhihau]

all those who put your faith in the CPF will be doomed to the same fate,those who do not remember the past are doomed to repeat it.

The Devil is always in the details. CPF on its own is a brilliant scheme compared with other forms of retirement funds around the globe. The only thing stupid about this retirement fund is the way holes are poked in them, big holes mind you!

FUCK the PAP for saying that HDBs are affordable! Bleeding 400-500 thousand dollars on a 1000 sq ft BTO in a matured estate, topping off the insult with a 99 year lease. PTUI! Fuck their mothers dead!

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

The Devil is always in the details. CPF on its own is a brilliant scheme compared with other forms of retirement funds around the globe. The only thing stupid about this retirement fund is the way holes are poked in them, big holes mind you!

FUCK the PAP for saying that HDBs are affordable! Bleeding 400-500 thousand dollars on a 1000 sq ft BTO in a matured estate, topping off the insult with a 99 year lease. PTUI! Fuck their mothers dead!

The CPF was a scheme designed by the British with the best of intentions and in the beginning it truly served the purpose of retirement. Then the greedy PAP saw the potential for exploitation and they saw no qualms about it as they had such decisive political majority in Parliament. It is truly despicable. They made the CPF serve the housing market, pushing up property prices, and now delaying the drawdown age and withholding funds via the CPF Life scheme. Also a cheap source of financing for GIC and Temasek. Truly a rotten government.

 

[scroobal]

The section of the population that benefited from the CPF were the early baby boomers. As they progressed thru their career, and as their balance were growing, changes were made such as to allow CPF for private housing, investment etc. When they reached retirement, they were able to withdraw and treat it as a sizeable endowment. They were also lucky as they were at final half of their career and beneficiary of the 50%+50% rate, never to be repeated again. It is now a mere shadow of what it was until the early 80s. To the young Singaporeans it is different world.

The CPF was a scheme designed by the British with the best of intentions and in the beginning it truly served the purpose of retirement. Then the greedy PAP saw the potential for exploitation and they saw no qualms about it as they had such decisive political majority in Parliament. It is truly despicable. They made the CPF serve the housing market, pushing up property prices, and now delaying the drawdown age and withholding funds via the CPF Life scheme. Also a cheap source of financing for GIC and Temasek. Truly a rotten government.

 

[duluxe]

The section of the population that benefited from the CPF were the early baby boomers. As they progressed thru their career, and as their balance were growing, changes were made such as to allow CPF for private housing, investment etc. When they reached retirement, they were able to withdraw and treat it as a sizeable endowment. They were also lucky as they were at final half of their career and beneficiary of the 50%+50% rate, never to be repeated again. It is now a mere shadow of what it was until the early 80s. To the young Singaporeans it is different world.

Scroo,
You are spot on.