Hougang By-Eelection & Impact of YSL Saga II

[GoldenDragon]

In fact, I would say that if WP loses Hougang, opposition movement as a whole will gain because it will force WP to consider thrice before going into unnecessary 3 corner fights next GE.

NSP has almost half of the CEC filled with new members. Whatever things you have said about NSP, the effect and impact of it has subsided. In politics, it is always the number game.
Goh Meng Seng

Jokes aside but I honestly think you need to consult a psychiatrist. If $$$ is a problem, no worries. I pay.

Wrt NSP, it will remain where it is, if lucky. If unlucky, south is the only direction for them. All parties are compromised. In the case of NSP, heavily compromised. You know this better than I do.

 

[deepblue0911]

In my view, NSP should not go in for the 3 corner fight because WP should be left to face the music alone and NSP should not be made a scape goat out of it.

I have explained, I dislike monopolies very much and WP is trying to act like a monopoly. Even for WP to lose Hougang is not end of the world as WP still has 5 elected MPs with 2 NCMPs. In fact, it would do opposition movement good for WP to lose Hougang and experience the pain. It will have to learn the hard way that it shouldn't take opposition supporters for granted and its MPs must keep up with their promise of "First World Parliamentarians", don't do hanky panky things like womanizing or plagiarizing other people's work.

In fact, I would say that if WP loses Hougang, opposition movement as a whole will gain because it will force WP to consider thrice before going into unnecessary 3 corner fights next GE.

Goh Meng Seng

You're now saying NSP should not get into a 3-corner fight in Hougang? That seems different from your position not too long ago when you speculated, hinted, suggested that NSP contest in the BE (which I'm sure you would deny it was your position). WP should indeed be left to face the music for the mess they created. But was this ever your clearly stated position all along? I don't recall seeing this view from you? If you did, please enlighten me. If you've not, then you must admit that you've flip-flopped. This change in position is radical.

I just can't understand your theory about monopoly (and many here can't too). Partisan politics will always about gaining and preserving powers, whether its PAP or WP or any other parties. Monopoly is about a single supplier of a certain commodity, you don't have a choice. In this case of politics, neither the PAP or WP (or any other parties) can be accused of monopoly. The Singapore people do have a choice. If you don't like the PAP, WP is not the only opposition parties. The key is quality of these parties.

If there're more people like you in opposition, then my guess is even those who don't like PAP won't vote for opposition and spoil the votes instead. And when that happens, then the "monopoly" you mentioned may really happen. So for the sake of not creating a "monopoly" for WP, in your own words, you should quit politics completely.

 

[cunnilaubu]

Why is this talk about monopoly by WP? To me, it is just a natural progression.

If WP’s long term ambition is to be the alternative party to PAP, then contesting in more constituencies in future elections is the only way forward. In doing so, it will inevitably “encroached” into the “territories” of other opposition parties.

Unless most, if not all opposition parties can worked together to form some sort of alternative alliance against the incumbent, we will see more and more 3- or multi-corner fights in the future.

On another point, GMS seems to suggest that NSP is a one-man/woman party. Is it all about Nichole Seah only. Are the rest of the leadership all useless. People such as Hazel Pao, Tony Tan and Jeanette Chong may be political novice, but they are no idiots.

Having gone through many of his postings in this forum, I must admit that I share the sentiments of many forummers here that GMS has an axe to grind (and a very big axe too), not just with WP but NSP as well. Interesting indeed!

 

[ForFun]

Jokes aside but I honestly think you need to consult a psychiatrist. If $$$ is a problem, no worries. I pay.

Whahhahahha... For this I will call you SIR!. You don't say much BUT you say it with so just the right amount of venom and get your message across.
GMS is not someone anyone should bother to persuade to change his views or his method. He is the most unfortunate thing to happen in our political scene. And sadly now Singapore cannot afford another few years of such rubbishs.
GMS does not need a psychiatrist. He is just so vindictive. He is a woman having menstruation 24/7 the whole year round.

 

[lockeliberal]

Dear Scroo,

GMS has a tendency of seeing the shadow of a swallow and calling out a a Summer/ Spring. The direct translation of the ZB article is a lot more subtle and less direct then GMS makes it out to be and with his tendency of shadow calling all thoughts of subtlety has gone out the window. I can only hope that the present leadership of the NSP is more attuned at reading the subtext and text without emotion than GMS. Finally they should learn to play poker and in particular texas hold em , or Omaha stud. :_))

In essence, NSP will not rule out contesting in HG and in direct response, WP has said it will not rule out contesting in Tampines. Will not rule out, is quite far removed from Will contest , Will not rule out offers a door of accommodation and mutual interest and sanity. Will contest offers a brutal everyone loses but who loses less battle which GMS will delight in and the PAP.



Locke

When I saw the sub-header "Conclusion", I though he was going to indicate after the deep analysis who is going to win, how wide the swing etc. It was pure mush. Might as well don't do the analysis. If this was a exam paper, it will get an "F".

GMS, looks like you are not sure about WP or the PAP or what is going to happen. In that case, just do what Ron does. Anything adverse about the opposition he cuts and paste
Dear Scroo






and puts misleading header. In between, he will place innocent video clips, articles and any other non political news to give the impression that he is an objective individual. At least learn from him how to do character assassination and subtle smearing.

People know you got axe to grind therefore and no value placed on your comments. Too obvious.

 

[kukubird58]

hahaha....i try to kay kiang this time......hopefully don't end up with m&d in my face.
now all the wsie pple, pse tell me the logic for saying that amk grc will be holding a BE also.....
1. for lhl to bring in new blood.....only 1 year after GE2011.....kuku reason.
2. to show he (lhl) is the boss and can do what he wants.......another kuku reason.
3. to absorb/redraw the boundary of hg smc.....even more kuku reason
4. because gms said so.......most likely reason.....lol.

hahaha.....u guys are real jokers.....gms already indicatd he is going to call amk grc BE....u guys still spending your time arguing here...
better go and prepare for this, if not later say papee give short notice....lol.

 

[Zombie]

.....gms already indicatd he is going to call amk grc BE....

aiyoh... if you read his words again, you will notice he is talking like the stock market analyst...

something like "the market must break XXX to go up, if market does not break XXX it will go down"..

either way, you can claim credits by playing with the condition XXX


From the first post:

The Inconsequential AMK GRC By-Election Strategy
The initial information I gathered indicated that PAP might want to combine Ang Mo Kio GRC with Hougang SMC while cutting out Yio Chu Kang from the present AMK GRC to form a SMC by redrawing the boundaries prior to the by-election. This would raise the difficulty for WP in defending Hougang and provide a real chance for PAP to take back Hougang SMC while reducing WP's seats in parliament. However, I believe this plan has been shelved because strategically, it is unsound for the ruling party to risk its PM's standing for a SMC which doesn't threaten PAP's ruling party status. It might just worsen PAP's public image of playing dirty with such underhand tactic.

XXX is the risk PM takes

if got combine (see in blue)... "see I told you so, my information is correct after all as PM does not view it a high risk"

if no combine (see in red)... "see I told you so, my prediction is correct after all as PM views it a high risk"

big small also makan...

 

[deepblue0911]

aiyoh... if you read his words again, you will notice he is talking like the stock market analyst... something like "the market must break XXX to go up, if market does not break XXX it will go down"..
either way, you can claim credits by playing with the condition XXX

Exactly. Like that my grandmother also can be political analyst.

This is indeed a very strange world, infested by all kinds of people. GMS is the Number 1 torch bearer for the Shameless kind.

 

[cass888]

The initial information I gathered indicated that PAP might want to combine Ang Mo Kio GRC with Hougang SMC while cutting out Yio Chu Kang from the present AMK GRC to form a SMC by redrawing the boundaries prior to the by-election.

Are you on drugs, Generalisimmo (minus 10 ranks) Goh Meng Seng? Redrawn boundaries do not affect the current Parliament you blockhead.

 

[kukubird58]

aiyoh... if you read his words again, you will notice he is talking like the stock market analyst...

something like "the market must break XXX to go up, if market does not break XXX it will go down"..

either way, you can claim credits by playing with the condition XXX

hahaha.....if u believed that kukubird believes gms.....then u can join the kuku club...
where is your sense of humour.....lol.
cheers.

 

[Zombie]

hahaha.....if u believed that kukubird believes gms.....then u can join the kuku club...
where is your sense of humour.....lol.
cheers.

lolzzz... didn't know you are fake pirated kuku...

my sincerity is hurt... lol

cheers

 

[Zombie]

Exactly. Like that my grandmother also can be political analyst.

Yes... my mother can also predict the end of the world using the same method... lolzzz

 

[GoldenDragon]

Whahhahahha... For this I will call you SIR!. You don't say much BUT you say it with so just the right amount of venom and get your message across.
GMS is not someone anyone should bother to persuade to change his views or his method. He is the most unfortunate thing to happen in our political scene. And sadly now Singapore cannot afford another few years of such rubbishs.
GMS does not need a psychiatrist. He is just so vindictive. He is a woman having menstruation 24/7 the whole year round.

Yes, sir. Agree with your comments. Trust me, GMS is just doing what he is paid to do. He is 100% of sound mind. Period.

 

[TwitSeng]

lets just say SG too many opposition parties liao. resources and support from people are divided.

 

[Perspective]

Let me sum up the arguments.

What is a monopoly? Unless you need help, a political monopoly here would best describe PAP, because it has 75 more seats than the next highest opponent (WP), while WP has 7 more than any opposition party. Compare a 75-seat advantage to a 7-seat advantage - any kid can tell which is obviously a monopoly.

Someone said they dislike monopolies and therefore WP should lose Hougang. That's a strange theory. The result is that PAP ends up with 82 seats and WP ends up with 6. (Forget about the third candidate winning.) Now, why would anyone who dislike monopolies want PAP to further increase its monopoly by 2 seats to 77 (82-5) just to "reduce" WP's "monopoly" by 1 (from 6 to 5)? Is that person really against monopoly or pretending?

Next, let's examine the correlation between multi-corner fights and monopoly. For a long time, Singapore had straight fights but always end up with a monopoly. However in 1963, four corner fights were everywhere and opposition had about one-third of the seats (Barisan). This is also the norm in other countries like UK. No one has accused Labour or Tories of monopolising.

Because no second party was able to field 87 candidates by itself giving the impression that none are strong, we ended up with a monopoly. But if WP alone fields 87 candidates, some may see that as "monopolising", but if the result is PAP 55 to WP 32 because WP gave people the confidence, PAP is reduced from 81 to 55 - how is that monopolising? Rather, it should be DIS-monopolising.

So anyone who is against a monopoly but insist there should only be straight fights and no multi-corner fights, when straight fights are giving you higher chance of a monopoly, is being incoherent.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not saying which situation is my preferred situation, just questioning some of the weak theories that people try to put up.

 

[Ramseth]

GMS theory of opposition monopoly. If PAP 55%, WP 40% and a third party 5%, WP is the bully. If WP 55% and PAP 45%, WP is arrogant. Why can't the rest win any seat? It's all WP fault. Disband WP then would there be true democracy where opposition keeps losing and keeps fucking PAP. Winning seats spoil everything!

 

[scroobal]

No lah. His notion of monopoly has nothing to do with numbers. If you say that you want to contest Pioneer, then you automatically behaving like a monopoly. This is despite his ex party sending in more candidates than anyone else other than PAP.

GMS theory of opposition monopoly. If PAP 55%, WP 40% and a third party 5%, WP is the bully. If WP 55% and PAP 45%, WP is arrogant. Why can't the rest win any seat? It's all WP fault. Disband WP then would there be true democracy where opposition keeps losing and keeps fucking PAP. Winning seats spoil everything!

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

I really hope you can read Chinese better but no, that's not what Zaobao reported. It reported in a definite tone for WP while more subtle tone in NSP's case.

Goh Meng Seng

Dear Scroo,

GMS has a tendency of seeing the shadow of a swallow and calling out a a Summer/ Spring. The direct translation of the ZB article is a lot more subtle and less direct then GMS makes it out to be and with his tendency of shadow calling all thoughts of subtlety has gone out the window. I can only hope that the present leadership of the NSP is more attuned at reading the subtext and text without emotion than GMS. Finally they should learn to play poker and in particular texas hold em , or Omaha stud. :_))

In essence, NSP will not rule out contesting in HG and in direct response, WP has said it will not rule out contesting in Tampines. Will not rule out, is quite far removed from Will contest , Will not rule out offers a door of accommodation and mutual interest and sanity. Will contest offers a brutal everyone loses but who loses less battle which GMS will delight in and the PAP.



Locke

 

[scroobal]

I am going to sit back and watch where this trail leads to. I was told this recently and I was taken aback - the PAP fears a 3 cornered fight as it suspects that WP voting bloc will remain intact. PAP voting bloc however might be split by a 3rd party or by a well known independent candidate wtth the only exception if Nicole steps in.

As Nicole will not contest, Seb's handlers will not allow him to contest. If you consider Hougang being with WP for 2 decades, it does make sense.

That's is why Hougang getting absorbed by a bigger GRC looks attractive . They will not do it with a sitting opposition MP as it will lead to international ridicule. I however have not heard anything along this line yet.

Dear Scroo,

GMS has a tendency of seeing the shadow of a swallow and calling out a a Summer/ Spring. The direct translation of the ZB article is a lot more subtle and less direct then GMS makes it out to be and with his tendency of shadow calling all thoughts of subtlety has gone out the window. I can only hope that the present leadership of the NSP is more attuned at reading the subtext and text without emotion than GMS. Finally they should learn to play poker and in particular texas hold em , or Omaha stud. :_))

In essence, NSP will not rule out contesting in HG and in direct response, WP has said it will not rule out contesting in Tampines. Will not rule out, is quite far removed from Will contest , Will not rule out offers a door of accommodation and mutual interest and sanity. Will contest offers a brutal everyone loses but who loses less battle which GMS will delight in and the PAP.



Locke

 

[Fook Seng]

Are you on drugs, Generalisimmo (minus 10 ranks) Goh Meng Seng? Redrawn boundaries do not affect the current Parliament you blockhead.

Constitution experts here, does redrawing boundaries so soon after a GE before a BE put you into a constitutional minefield?