Did Low Thia Khiang backstab his mentor JBJ? (Revisited)

[GoldenDragon]

LTK did mention in the parliament many years ago that we need a 4th Uni, and PAP did that few years later. That's the only thing i can recall.

My late grandpa told me that in the 70s. He had better vision than LTK.

 

[Ramseth]

My late grandpa told me that in the 70s. He had better vision than LTK.

I'm surprised your dad knew LTK in the 70s. LTK was in NS and Nantah. I'm surprised LTK then already had a vision for benchmarking.

 

[GoldenDragon]

I'm surprised your dad knew LTK in the 70s. LTK was in NS and Nantah. I'm surprised LTK then already had a vision for benchmarking.

Ramseth: Read carefully otherwise you may have to consult Viv B. In the 70s, my late grandpa already anticipated the need for more universities, more HDB flats etc. It is only natural with an increase in population.

Decades later, LTK said we needed a fourth university. Nothing great to be attached to LTK's call for a fourth uni. It was so obvious.

Same for F1 and IRs. If the MIW says the success is because they had this vision, they must have been blind for years, similar to Wawa in Love. And they must have just gotten back their eyesight. The potential benefits of F1 and casinos to our local economy was already predicted by the kpt ah peks and ah sohs way back in the 80s.

 

[Ramseth]

Ramseth: Read carefully otherwise you may have to consult Viv B. In the 70s, my late grandpa already anticipated the need for more universities, more HDB flats etc. It is only natural with an increase in population.

Decades later, LTK said we needed a fourth university. Nothing great to be attached to LTK's call for a fourth uni. It was so obvious.

Same for F1 and IRs. If the MIW says the success is because they had this vision, they must have been blind for years, similar to Wawa in Love. And they must have just gotten back their eyesight. The potential benefits of F1 and casinos to our local economy was already predicted by the kpt ah peks and ah sohs way back in the 80s.

Take away the LTK reference, I'm surprised because in the 70s there was only two universities. Your granddad's vision for a fourth was quite a quantum leap. In fact, they "merged" the two to one, then gradually in following decades restored to two, then increased to three and four.

 

[sinren67]

Perhaps cos Low is a Chinese Ed, so he believe 小心驶得万年船。

To me, WP is simply nurturing the likes of Lee Bee Wah among his candidates who raised question in the parliament - how many ppl had died in the Seletar Reservoir.

There was once WP members bought up suggestion that WP can set up a shadow cabinet so that their potential candidates can tackle some issues. But this suggestion were being shot down by Low immediately by giving lame excuses. So it's not surprise that WP has not been raising any issue that causes an impact. Having say that, i believe they have something in their minds and will only reveal when GE button pressed, e.g. time bomb in last GE.

Low did mention he wants WP to be a world class political party, but i think is world class watchdog, to be precise.

 

[GoldenDragon]

Your granddad's vision for a fourth was quite a quantum leap.

I don't see it as a quantum leap. Just commonsense. If now, in 2011, I tell my grandchildren we will need a sixth or seventh university down the road, I will never be wrong 20 years down the road.

 

[po2wq]

... To me, WP is simply nurturing Lee Bee Wah among his candidates who raised question in the parliament ...

u got name correct? ...

 

[GoldenDragon]

u got name correct? ...

WP may have problems getting the right people but surely they don't need a toilet auntie.

 

[Perspective]

You are struggling to even mention one accomplishment for LTK after 19 years in the field of national policies. Don't have to tell me or answer me - tell the rest. I might be completely wrong.

Remember there is difference between strategy and accomplishment.

If you can't, I suggest that you don't dig a deeper hole.

No, LTK has absolutely no accomplishments to his name. It is immaterial. The issue is whether who to send to the TOC forum is material. My answer: It is also immaterial.

I suggest you stop acting like a 90-year old auntie, not listening and keep talking.

 

[Ramseth]

I absolutely agree with Perspective. Come to think of it, it's quite puzzling that someone (Scroobal) who advocates voting for even bicycle thieves as long as s/he's in opposition, waxes comic lyrical against opposition who could actually win. I thought that's Yellow_People and Chau Ve Nist specialty, but I understand where they're coming from. I may disagree with them but respect their rights to their agenda.

 

[aurvandil]

I absolutely agree with Perspective. Come to think of it, it's quite puzzling that someone (Scroobal) who advocates voting for even bicycle thieves as long as s/he's in opposition, waxes comic lyrical against opposition who could actually win. I thought that's Yellow_People and Chau Ve Nist specialty, but I understand where they're coming from. I may disagree with them but respect their rights to their agenda.

Not really if you understand the actual agenda.

 

[yellow_people]

Low did mention he wants WP to be a world class political party, but i think is world class watchdog, to be precise.

Even watchdog does not apply to LTK and WP anymore. The same applies to SDA/SPP. LTK fancies himself and his party as the alternative to the PAP. Not sure what that alternative is, but from the looks of it, resembles pretty much the PAP status quo; just with different actors wearing the hammer logo. Even the term opposition no longer apply to the WP. Aside from some token resistance and vaguely asking citizens to wait another 50 years, you have to wonder what exactly LTK is opposing?




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[Dreamer1]

Even watchdog does not apply to LTK and WP anymore. The same applies to SDA/SPP. LTK fancies himself and his party as the alternative to the PAP. Not sure what that alternative is, but from the looks of it, resembles pretty much the PAP status quo; just with different actors wearing the hammer logo. Even the term opposition no longer apply to the WP. Aside from some token resistance and vaguely asking citizens to wait another 50 years, you have to wonder what exactly LTK is opposing?




-

Longer than 50 years man,LTK just being polite.

But he is just being more practical,down to earth!

 

[cass888]

There was once WP members bought up suggestion that WP can set up a shadow cabinet so that their potential candidates can tackle some issues. But this suggestion were being shot down by Low immediately by giving lame excuses.

Please lah. A shadow cabinet must be filled with MPs. You want LTK to be shadow PM/MOF/MHA/MINDEF/MND/MOT/MTA and Sylvia as shadow ENV/MCYS/MOH/MOE is it?

 

[Perspective]

In 1997, NSP President Tan Chee Kien said he wanted NSP to become ruling party in 20 years. A more "zhi qi" expectation than LTK, yes. It has been 13 years and NSP doesn't have a single seat.

Both Tan CK and LTK were predicting when the ruling party was going to falter completely and the people preparing to change them, and not telling people when they are ready to take over - which I think both are ready to take over anytime. Both probably have significant number of friends, like myself, who would not consider voting anything other than the PAP. If there is anyone whose only friends are in this forum, all wanting to vote out PAP this year, then they are a sorry lot I can say, not because of being myopic but because it's sad to hear they have made no friends prior to becoming a netizen.

You can disagree with LTK, but to say that is a sole or primary measure of competency baffles me. He's saying the people are not ready to change the PAP, not saying he's not ready to take over.

 

[Char_Azn]

I think on that count LTK is being realistic. I mean just look at the current state of the opposition parties. Which one of them can really come out and take over the PAP as the ruling party.

SDA? They can't even seem to agree with themselves right now

SDP? If anyone bothered to read anything they even proposed on their website, the majority of their proposed policy are either stupid or unrealistic.

RP: Only just started, hard for them to make any sort of real impact.

WP? As you put it they are too quiet for us to realize what is going on behind the scene. As far as I can tell, Low seem to be realistic. He knows that his party is unable to take over PAP, instead he is building up his force and act as a "shadow council" as stated in one the the earlier post which is effectively what he and Chiam have been doing all these years. The role is to keep proper check and balance. With only 2 opposition seat in Parliament, there isn't much that he can do.

Alone, none of them are strong enough to displace PAP. Even if they are able to via a freak result, I seriously doubt any of them will be able to form an effective government. The best and fastest way would be for all of them to come together and form a opposition party big enough to seem creditable at challenging the PAP similar to what is happening in MY. The problem is the parties themselves can't even seem to stop bickering among their own members, let alone be united with another party. Just look what happened in MY, almost immediately after the elections, the opposition parties start fighting one another. The next MY general election does not look good for the opposition parties if they allow this to continue

The alternative may come from an interesting point brought up by an article posted a short while ago. Have the opposition party go head to head with one another instead of trying to avoid each other and force the emergence of a single powerful party among them via natural selection. This however will take far too long. Even if say they do this during the coming election and the opposition who managed to win over most of the opposition crowd start building from there, it would take at least another 3-4 elections before we are able to see any concrete results.

 

[sleaguepunter]

i always find it strange that ppl from this forum always have an axe to grind against every non pap politicians in singapore. If u guys thinks they are doing a lousy job to dislodge the pap, maybe if time for u guys to show your greatness instead of being an armchair critic who can only MA HOU PAO.

As for LTK have not make done anything for singapore or not is not for you to judge. As a voter who twice voted for LTK, i am please at his efforts in hougang considering the resources he had in hand. He should continue to expand WP, increase the number of WP MPs in parliment as first priority. There no need for him to give sugguestions to pap on how to run the country, that is the job of the money grabbing ministars. All he have to do is to oppose any pap policies that is disadvantages to the pink ic holders.

 

[kukubird58]

hahaha...just to kaypoh a bit s i have not seen this mentioned....
even if there is some good suggestion from the opp, u can be sure they will shot down first and then later reappear as papee initiative....

 

[jw5]

In this forum, LKY is probably the one who kenna the most brickbats.
In this thread, LTK also kenna.

But all these people holding pink ICs also have to shoulder some blame:
1. Those who support LKY and benefit from his policies and ideas.
2. Those who didn't support or benefit directly but never did or said anything.
3. Those who scold pap and/or opposition, but never stepped forward, stepped forward only once, or hung around in the periphery.

All if us have to shoulder some blame. It's no use saying that because we didn't "put up our hands" or "we had our own reasons", we can point the finger at someone else for not making Singapore better.

 

[patrickv]

I think on that count LTK is being realistic. I mean just look at the current state of the opposition parties. Which one of them can really come out and take over the PAP as the ruling party.

SDA? They can't even seem to agree with themselves right now

SDP? If anyone bothered to read anything they even proposed on their website, the majority of their proposed policy are either stupid or unrealistic.

RP: Only just started, hard for them to make any sort of real impact.

WP? As you put it they are too quiet for us to realize what is going on behind the scene. As far as I can tell, Low seem to be realistic. He knows that his party is unable to take over PAP, instead he is building up his force and act as a "shadow council" as stated in one the the earlier post which is effectively what he and Chiam have been doing all these years. The role is to keep proper check and balance. With only 2 opposition seat in Parliament, there isn't much that he can do.

Alone, none of them are strong enough to displace PAP.
.

PAP dog,

every party to you other than PAP is no good. no need type such a long reply, your PAP dog tail is showing again. :oIo::oIo::oIo: