Tony Tan & Son lose the plot or jus tplain dishonest

[SneeringTree]

Tony and son have indeed nothing to hide or fear. What's your problem anyway? I've just said in NS nothing is fair and nothing could be fair. There'd be tougher jobs and softer jobs. Even some rich men's sons got tougher jobs. Even some poor men's son got softer jobs. What enquiry? Everybody wants a softer job. If you get it, good. If you don't get it, just do it and get it over and done with.

Are you seriously that daft? It is not a question of getting a cushion vocation (we all know that there are tough vocations and rather easy ones). The question is whether anyone is making an exception by granting him continuous 12, 13 years of disruption to pursue his studies AND to give him a position in a outfit which is not regular NS vocation place. To give an analogy, one would raise the same question if he was sent to Lian Bee Corporation to carry cement sacks to fulfill his 2.5 years of NS liabilities.

 

[Debonerman]

Parliamentary Select Committee Hearing 2011
The Patrick Tan Beng Ooi National Service Liability Matter
Terms of Reference


A. Matter of Deferment
1) Was his deferment from NS done in accordance with policy and accepted practice at that time.
2) Did his application for deferment follow his course of academic study
3) Who are individuals and parties involved in approving his application and did it follow the normal practice.
4) Who are those granted similar deferment for that and prior years and the details of their deferment

B. Matter of Subsequent Deployment
1) Who gave the instruction as claimed by Dr Patrick Tan and on what basis was that instruction given
2) Who handled the matter of his rank and vocation status and on what basis
3) Are there others in the same cohort or prior that followed a similar path
4) What was his status in DSA and the National Cancer Centre

C. Matter in regard to his Reservist Obligation
1) Identify his entire reservist activity and to determine if it falls within the policy and practice
2) Identify the individuals or parties if (2) was not within policy and practice and the reasons for the deviation

D. Special Instruction to the Committee
1) Committee is to disregard all matters that occur after any precedent set by Dr Patrick Tan involving other individuals. It is well known that corrupt regimes tend to normalise bad or unauthorised activity by legistimising by offering similar privileges to other after the unauthorised precendence is set.
2) 2 eggs in one plate of Char Kway Yeow is not an acceptable argument in any one of the above mentioned matters.

Tony Tan is hoping against hope that you will suggest making a Police Report instead. It will join the Tin Pei Ling file in the priority basket. I have complete faith In the Singapore Police Force and our system of Law!

 

[DoctorEvil]

Parliamentary Select Committee Hearing 2011
The Patrick Tan Beng Ooi National Service Liability Matter
Terms of Reference


A. Matter of Deferment
1) Was his deferment from NS done in accordance with policy and accepted practice at that time.
2) Did his application for deferment follow his course of academic study
3) Who are individuals and parties involved in approving his application and did it follow the normal practice.
4) Who are those granted similar deferment for that and prior years and the details of their deferment

...

No need to be so ambitious. I'll be more than happy with an inquiry into the matter of deferment and how he got to defer for 12 freaking years.

 

[lockeliberal]

Dear Scroo

Patrick, the scion unlike many scions of that era did not realize that there was a decent limit to "kenning" and "seeking a cushy posting" for your NS. At 18, seeking to avoid OCS, trying all means to be a clerk after BMT was common. A friendly specialist , all sorts of ailments and sports injuries all but guranteeded an easy NS life if one sought it. Others oddly enough wanted to be officers, wanted to lead etc etc but it was a fair choice made at 18 or 19.

They were privileged enough to know that with wealthy parents , the world after NS was an Oyster to seek. thus for many it was just a thirty month break/ holiday etc. to see a different side of life and to well grow up a little be more.

Patrick obviously did not lack the means to support himself nor the ability , but he sough prestige and a quick route into his desired path. No one would have said anything if he was a medic for 2.5 years at Gombak after 18 , or a clerk but he was not willing to wait.

Perhaps he really wanted OCS, but OCS was also then the means to a President's scholarship and an early disruption. because rules are rules and he would not have had a private sector scholarship and deferment.

Suffice to say is that he got both the Prestige and the early disruption but in that whole equation where does Moral Responsibility come in. ? Under what terms did PSC grant him a President's
scholarship ? Under what circumstances and conditions did the SAF allow his disruption for "medical training " and then his inexplicable later deferment ?

locke

Yes. I wonder if he made the application for medicine but left the details out. Either that he changed programme after admission which is quite common.

 

[Leongsam]

Others oddly enough wanted to be officers, wanted to lead etc etc but it was a fair choice made at 18 or 19.

I sought exemption on the grounds of lunacy but they made me an occifer instead.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

these questions sld br PUT to TT n PT...no doubt abt it...the SOCIAL LEGAL CONTRACT that obliged n continues to oblige singgie males to serve NS requirements warrants this...regardless of whether TT runs for PE or not...take out the emotions fm the equation...just stick to the finding out the FACTs...

The normal maximum age for admission to OCS is 28 if I remember correctly. The age limit for MOCC may be higher though. That is also the maximum age for BMT and SISPEC. This is why people who take up citizenship after the age of 27 do not normally get conscripted (NS call up is actually at the discretion of the Armed Forces Council). Patrick Tan went back to serve NS at the age of 31, so there is no way he would have been asked to join OCS. Given his age when he re-enlisted, it would have been unlikely that he would be assigned to a combat vocation.

You guys are missing the point. The anomaly here is the 12-year deferment that he got, not the fact that he siam-ed MOCC/OCS or any combat vocation, which is actually in accordance with established policies. Being assigned to DSO is also not uncommon for disruptees. You guys should focus on why on earth he was give a 12-year deferment and why he was allowed to do a MD-PhD program despite the known length of the program. This is like allowing our NUS medical disruptees to do their specialization before going back to SAF, which is of course never allowed unless the MO is a sign-on.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

do not bring in issues like moral responsibility, the President Scholarship,emotions etc...just confuses the public...n TT n his pr spin team appear to be doing their best to fudge n spin along these lines...

simply PUT to TT the critical issues at play...

what was the the SAF Policy wrt to disruption of NS obligations/liabilities at the material i.e. PT's time of applying n being ganted...including reservist obligatrions etc...

following on what r the FACTS of PT's particular case...

Suffice to say is that he got both the Prestige and the early disruption but in that whole equation where does Moral Responsibility come in. ? Under what terms did PSC grant him a President's
scholarship ? Under what circumstances and conditions did the SAF allow his disruption for "medical training " and then his inexplicable later deferment ?

locke

 

[MightyMouse]

Tony and son have indeed nothing to hide or fear. What's your problem anyway? I've just said in NS nothing is fair and nothing could be fair. There'd be tougher jobs and softer jobs. Even some rich men's sons got tougher jobs. Even some poor men's son got softer jobs. What enquiry? Everybody wants a softer job. If you get it, good. If you don't get it, just do it and get it over and done with.

As usual, you are setting up a straw man to knock down with your arguments. Please read carefully, no one here is complaining about those who managed to find cushy appointments during NS such as mess boys and clerks. We are asking why PT's disruption violated MINDEF's own policies and how he got away with it. Get it?

 

[myfoot123]

It warrants a thorough investigations. A son of Singapore has breached his fundamental obligations and should head into Detention Barrack least to speak. Who knows if their future grandson may exploit the systems if TT misused his office as president. On top of which, it also serves to warn all those ministers who have seen thru the loopholes of having their children escape National Service. Legally and morally what Tony Tan did was totally unacceptable. He needs to face judgement and accept the consequences of exploiting his role as Minister of Defence then.

NOBODY IS ABOVE THE LAW!!! Now that his grave mistakes have been exposed and Trust has been broken, he should willingly step down as President hopeful and face the law squarely.

 

[Spock]

He spends his time taking soil samples.

Well, I guess it would be ok if he did his collecting in the army camps or exercise areas but I have never heard of or seen a reservist doing such tasks anywhere.

 

[Forvendet]

He has breached nothing. He followed all the legal procedures as passed by Parliament (not his father alone) and all are documented.

 

[I_Hate_Pappies]

With all these findings, i'm not surprise if TT still becomes the next EP! :oIo::oIo::oIo::oIo::oIo:

 

[MightyMouse]

He has breached nothing. He followed all the legal procedures as passed by Parliament (not his father alone) and all are documented.

He disrupted under the overseas medical studies scheme but is enrolled in Stanford which is not even in the list of approved medical training institute. Legal?

 

[Forvendet]

He disrupted under the overseas medical studies scheme but is enrolled in Stanford which is not even in the list of approved medical training institute. Legal?

Stanford not approved? That's news to me.

 

[MightyMouse]

Stanford not approved? That's news to me.

http://singapore.usembassy.gov/uploads/images/gUKZM7OFtm50I7xWbjpAQw/MedicalRegistration_03.pdf

Stanford was approved in 2003 after PT has ORD. So, does this constitute abuse of the medical studies scheme?

 

[The_Hypocrite]

Dear Frens,

the issue with is there is alot of nepotism in our country. and sad to say the 60% agree to it. Also from another perspective, like with the British royal family and to a certain the USA. The nepotism is much less. Look at Prince Harry, when he went to Sandhurst etc, there is no favoritism to such a degree that the SAF has shown. Like White horse getting heaps of MC and still can graduate and this Dr Tony Tan son getting endless deferments. And I was told in western militaries, if the person is a 'white horse' like father is General etc, they better keep quiet if not kena Tekan even more.

But sad to say in the SAF a white horse gets the most benefits. Maybe we have not grown up yet.. thanks 60%

 

[ashjaw]

Wish this will open a can of worms and more people got dragged in and more 12-yrs-deferment type of white horses got exposed.

 

[MightyMouse]

Wish this will open a can of worms and more people got dragged in and more 12-yrs-deferment type of white horses got exposed.

Probably won't happen. The 86 cases cited by MINDEF are in all likelihood normal medical studies disruption cases, not going beyond 8 or 9 years. The challenge is getting the 2nd disruption for the MD and Phd program. Under normal circumstances, the disruption application will never be approved.

 

[Forvendet]

http://singapore.usembassy.gov/uploads/images/gUKZM7OFtm50I7xWbjpAQw/MedicalRegistration_03.pdf

Stanford was approved in 2003 after PT has ORD. So, does this constitute abuse of the medical studies scheme?

Post-dated approval.

Anyway, jokes aside and use your brain. Singapore was and is in no position to disapprove Stanford, whether for medical or other faculties.

 

[MightyMouse]

Post-dated approval.

Anyway, jokes aside and use your brain. Singapore was and is in no position to disapprove Stanford, whether for medical or other faculties.

Aiyo, switched tack again. Not recognized means not recognized. Got nothing to do with using the brain or not. Want to blame the person not using the brain, go find the Minister in charge.