Serious The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussions

[JHolmesJr]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

JohnTan is bizzaro-esque in this thread.

hes filling in for sam.

 

[zeebjii]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

No I am not.

I am stating a fact. Most people, regardless of religion, want prosperity and good health. Only crazies like you who crave martyrdom, desire poverty and ill-health and quote Matthew 5:3.

Why don't you start by donating all your money and get yourself really poor?

LOL i don't think yellowarse is a christian, he is just exposing the hypocrisy. However you proclaim yourself as a pious/devout/whatever shit christian, you are not, never will be, because your DNA dictates you are a chink, and you can never lose the money-crazy chinkiness in you. Just like kong hee and so many fake christians in singapore. Better off worshipping the god of fortune!

 

[SalahParking]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

TS is like a woman in need

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

The reason they do this is because they want a better future. Period.

You are right. And it's not just restricted to Malays but to every race/ethnicity and can be summed up in two simple statements:

1. Women marry for money.
2. Men marry for sex.

​

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

*Duplicate*

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

Malays are minority race in Singapore that is why the rate of mixed marriages in Singapore is higher. Check Malaysia I bet it is lower.

Same with non white races in Canada marrying mixed is also higher.

Simple.

I suspect it is not so much a "minority" thing but a socio-economic issue of people wanting to marry "upwards". So if there is indeed a higher rate amongst the Malays, it would be because there is presently a bigger pool of lower-income Malays. The fact that Malay girls are also seen as being attractive makes it easier for them to marry "up" and "out (of their race/ethnicity)". If not for religion being seen as a "stumbling" block, I am sure the numbers will be very much higher just like for the Pinays.

You see a similar trend in China where no one in her right mind would want to marry a socially "inferior" and poor Chinese a few decades ago. But with an increasingly powerful China and wealthier Chinese, white girls especially from poorer East European countries are now happy to marry "up and out" to these Chinese men.

Likewise for mainland Chinese women who marry "up and out" of their race/ethnicity. As the GT noted, "a foreign male with a Chinese wife or, even more likely, multiple local girlfriends - has become common to the point of cliché" with a study showing that 90% of the mainlanders "intercultural" (interracial) marriages were between Chinese women and "foreigners".

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

Nonsense! My relative daughter married to a male chinese convert. Children follow father surname and race indicate "Chinese"

Her race could have been stated as "Malay" if your niece or parents wanted it to be so.

The old and ongoing misconceptions, clarifications and explanations about this can be found in the thread, "Re: Shooting oneself in the foot: PAP’s screw up of the reserve elections for EP."

 

[JohnTan]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

As i have mentioned is all politics. As majority are muslims in Indon wat better way to shore up support by using Islam as a tool. Tio boh? I also saw ladies taking selfies...smiling away. U call tat violent? Any ppl got killed? Rape? Murder? Shops looted ransacked? The demo seems to be was a peacful one. Just like wat u see at Speakers corner.

They are just one step away from being actual terrorists. Incitement to violence is not peaceful, very different from Speakers corner. You need glasses or a new brain.

Yes. I agree with u. Definitely those ulamas better qualified than me. But is their country. They can do wat they like. Even the Quran already stated watever law or policy u meted out u will be answereable to the Lord. Want me to quote from Quran? Try to understand john. Some of these countries are using Islam as a tool to further strengthen their position. So obvious. U cant see it meh. Need glasses

You seem to be happy when islamists "use islam to strengthen their position" since as a muslim, you will the beneficiary. Is that why islamic apologists like you constantly try to justify and support the actions of islamic militants?

I mentioned normal cos i dont remember any ustaz or ustazah being called up for questioning. Tat means our madrasah are doing just fine. Hey even some of our malay Mps children also attended madrasah. R u also implying their children are terrorist by attending madrasah?

Like I said, we keep our ustaz here on a very tight leash. It is not so for most parts of the world, where overwhelming majority of madrassahs are breeding grounds for islamic militancy and shit stirring.

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

But the comments on this thread so far seems to indicate that Malays themselves do not respect their own race and wants to marry outside of it. Even prominent Malays don;t marry within their own community eg. one third of malay marriages are to non malays? Wow. Like that, if they don't respect their own race and will not fight the PAP, then why should the other racial communities care?

You are now stretching your 2 cents view into absurdity just so as to inject the PAP into the picture.

It takes two hand to clap, and to state the obvious, two people to marry.

Going by your claim, the Chinese, Indian, Caucasian, etc marrying that Malay woman would likewise, not be "respect[ing] their own race".

Does your claim make any sense to you?

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

Poor, war torn 3rd world countries is a common theme with overwhelming majority of islamic societies. That's the fruits of a muslim majority society.

You will find an inverse correlation between religiosity vis-a-vis the wealth of countries. The wealthier the countries, the more atheists and "nominal" Christians, Muslims, etc there are. The poorer the people, the more religious they become as they seek solace in religion, see religious apparitions, "miracle", etc as a soothing balm. Look at impoverished Christian Eastern Europe as an example.

I will say it's more of the the majority in such countries embracing Islam then the Islamic religion causing poverty. Otherwise, how do you explain the "Golden Age of Islam" where Muslims, relying on the same Quran and tenets of their faith, that very same holy book and tenets which are now being unthinkingly used and exploited to explain the Muslim world, have ruled and lived in very successful societies, and have gloried in areas of Astronomy, Mathematics, Science, Philosophy, etc?

The fact is civilisations go through cycles. The Muslim world is undeniably going through a rough patch, a fall from its "Golden Age of Islam". Likewise, China underwent a rough patch from its glory days as the "Middle Kingdom" of the world to being a war-torn and impoverished country. But it is now on the rise to reclaim its place in the world. Ditto for the Whites who emerged from their caves to climb up the cycle, rule the world, but are now sliding down the cycle even as we speak.

The Islamic world will get out of its current rough patch and ascend that civilisational cycle once again. It will take a few hundred years but I have no doubt it will happen just as it has happened, and is happening to and for other civilisations.

 

[JohnTan]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

You will find an inverse correlation between religiosity vis-a-vis the wealth of countries. The wealthier the countries, the more atheists and "nominal" Christians, Muslims, etc there are. The poorer the people, the more religious they become as they seek solace in religion, see religious apparitions, "miracle", etc as a soothing balm. Look at impoverished Christian Eastern Europe as an example.

I agree with you there.

Even in western europe, the renaissance and reformation started with the dwindling of church power or political power of organized religion.

I will say it's more of the the majority in such countries embracing Islam then the Islamic religion causing poverty. Otherwise, how do you explain the "Golden Age of Islam" where Muslims, relying on the same Quran and tenets of their faith, that very same holy book and tenets which are now being unthinkingly used and exploited to explain the Muslim world, have ruled and lived in very successful societies, and have gloried in areas of Astronomy, Mathematics, Science, Philosophy, etc?

The islam back then was way more liberal and less organized than it was today. Hence, it was easier for innovation and science to flourish in many islamic kingdoms.

Next, there is no such thing as islamic science just as there is no such thing as christian science and technology. Technology was not invented by religion nor birthed from technology. The inventor(s) may have a religion, but the technology developed is just technology.

The fact is civilisations go through cycles. The Muslim world is undeniably going through a rough patch, a fall from its "Golden Age of Islam". Likewise, China underwent a rough patch from its glory days as the "Middle Kingdom" of the world to being a war-torn and impoverished country. But it is now on the rise to reclaim its place in the world. Ditto for the Whites who emerged from their caves to climb up the cycle, rule the world, but are now sliding down the cycle even as we speak.

The Islamic world will get out of its current rough patch and ascend that civilisational cycle once again. It will take a few hundred years but I have no doubt it will happen just as it has happened, and is happening to and for other civilisations.

I doubt so.

The islamic society today has developed an organized mechanism to entrench its ideas and to resist innovation. Societies climb out of their backwardness when they start to do things differently. Islamic societies today blame their woes on others constantly and seek solace by being even more religious and rigid and intolerant. It is not just at the political level but also at the grassroots level. There is no similar reformation enlightenment movement in islam.

It is easier for the chinks to climb out of their hole because the chinks are able to adapt and have a policy of self improvement. The chinks are also way more tolerant, allowing different beliefs in their own country to flourish. You don't see the Taoists, Buddhists, Confucianists and Animist busy trying to slaughter each other or kill their own followers for leaving the religion.

The chinks also have a similar work ethic to the Protestant work ethic. Not all cultures and beliefs are equal. Some lead to a better life, others just exponentially increases your odds of getting stuck in a poverty, violent trap with little way out.

Even in a mixed marriage, kids who identify themselves as chinks stand a higher chance of doing better in life than those who identify themselves as m&d. It's a hard truth.

 

[scroobal]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

Intermarriages are no longer a phenomenon except in highly homogenised countries. Take Chinese and Japanese out of their country and they intermarry with little hesitation particularly when they are better educated. The agenda is similar interest rather than similar traits.

The new generation have no reason to please or accomodate their relatives or look for acceptance within their own racial communities. Concepts such as the superiority of one's ancient cultures who discovered maths, chess etc are no longer relevant.

Note the case of Angeline Khoo and Jed Francis. Angeline, a Malaysian heiress gave up her multi-million dollar inheritance to marry a West Indian Data Scientist that she met in Oxford. And ironically she and him are in the same trade that her father groomed her for, hoping that she will take over Laura Ashley.

Nothing to do with religion or race. So to the next generation, don't fuck up, cast your net wider. There are great choices out there. The World is your oyster.

 

[PTADER]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

Next, there is no such thing as islamic science just as there is no such thing as christian science and technology. Technology was not invented by religion nor birthed from technology. The inventor(s) may have a religion, but the technology developed is just technology.

I said they gloried in areas of "Astronomy, Mathematics, Science, Philosophy, etc". I did not say "Islamic Astronomy", "Islamic Mathematics", etc.

The islamic society today has developed an organized mechanism to entrench its ideas and to resist innovation. Societies climb out of their backwardness when they start to do things differently. Islamic societies today blame their woes on others constantly and seek solace by being even more religious and rigid and intolerant. It is not just at the political level but also at the grassroots level. There is no similar reformation enlightenment movement in islam.

You are assuming the worst for these Islamic societies, i.e. that this status quo is an unchanging constant and will remain forever. If this is indeed the case, the factors that contributed to the "Golden Age of Islam" would, as unchanging constants, result in the "Golden Age of Islam" carrying on to this present day. Needless to say, it has not. I see the factors contributing to the present status quo not as constants but as variables that contribute to the rise and fall cycle of civilisations.

It is easier for the chinks to climb out of their hole because the chinks are able to adapt and have a policy of self improvement. The chinks are also way more tolerant, allowing different beliefs in their own country to flourish. You don't see the Taoists, Buddhists, Confucianists and Animist busy trying to slaughter each other or kill their own followers for leaving the religion.

Again, this is the current status quo of the Chinese, that they have "adapted" and "climb out of their hole". Cast your mind back to just a century plus ago where they were lazing around, smoking opium, slaughtering each other in civil wars, etc.

Contrary to what you say, different "beliefs" are not "allowed to flourish" in China. Only five "official" religions are allowed. All are kept on a tight leash and controlled by a department under the State Council, the State Administration for Religious Affairs. Followers of non-state sanctioned religions are regularly harassed, imprisoned, tortured or forced to convert.

The chinks also have a similar work ethic to the Protestant work ethic. Not all cultures and beliefs are equal. Some lead to a better life, others just exponentially increases your odds of getting stuck in a poverty, violent trap with little way out.

Again, this is cyclical in nature. Otherwise, how do we explain the lengthy period of poverty and hardship that the Chinese underwent? It was only in the last 30 years that 700+ million plus Chinese were lifted out of poverty. They were dirt poor before that and poverty was passed on from one generation to another. Hundreds of millions of Chinese continue to be poor today.

And how do we explain the impoverished societies of Europe before the Renaissance and Industrial revolution? The Chinese and WASPs' work ethics are not immune to this cycle. The conservative values, emphasis on hard work, savings, discipline, family (formed by marriage between a man and a woman) which led to the ascent of WASP societies on the cycle have been, and continues to be steadily eroded and replaced with liberal ideas of welfarism (leading to laziness), uncontrolled spending, fixations with gay marriage "equality", etc and are factors that have led to decline of WASP societies along the cycle.

Even in a mixed marriage, kids who identify themselves as chinks stand a higher chance of doing better in life than those who identify themselves as m&d. It's a hard truth.

There's no denial that IQ is a factor but it is also because there is a very strong cultural emphasis placed on education by Chinese and East Asians. It's no different from highly intelligent white kids who do not perform as well academically but are more "rugged" and perform better in sports because of the cultural emphasis and importance placed on sports, the outdoors, etc for such kids.

 

[whoami]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

I am curious to know a non-muslim can step inside a regular mosque? It's an offence to the muslims?

I have been to beach road sultan mosque but it is a tourist spot. Cannot step inside the main hall by barricade, look and take photo from outside only.

I believe if u have make an appointment with the Mosque committee they would gladly let u in. Not insinuating anything but tere were cases money in the donation box were stolen.

 

[whoami]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

Her race could have been stated as "Malay" if your niece or parents wanted it to be so.

The old and ongoing misconceptions, clarifications and explanations about this can be found in the thread, "Re: Shooting oneself in the foot: PAP’s screw up of the reserve elections for EP."

No doubt. But She left it to her husband to decide. She dont force her children to indicate as Malay. Unlike most forummers like to assume Islam force converts to adopt Malay name and indicate race as malay.

 

[whoami]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

They are just one step away from being actual terrorists. Incitement to violence is not peaceful, very different from Speakers corner. You need glasses or a new brain.


You seem to be happy when islamists "use islam to strengthen their position" since as a muslim, you will the beneficiary. Is that why islamic apologists like you constantly try to justify and support the actions of islamic militants?


Like I said, we keep our ustaz here on a very tight leash. It is not so for most parts of the world, where overwhelming majority of madrassahs are breeding grounds for islamic militancy and shit stirring.

Nope. I dont see it like the way u see it. Very stereotype. Just cos they wave islamic flag they are terrorists. They simply not happy with Ah Hock. I ever asked some Indon Chinese whether Ah Hock is at fault. They said yes hes at fault too. He shouldnt question the ulama cos hes not a Muslim. Like i told u many times all these demo were politically motivated.

Yes i agree. The FPI is a extremist group headed by Habib Rizieq was arrested for sex scandal. Just like most extremist group they hijacked Islam and shore up support to gain the individual popularity. Such acts are mere hypocrisy. They will be judged. Islam dont encourage one to demo and to kill one another.

Oh btw. Do u know tere were free drinks distributed for the recent demo against ah hock? Free drinks? If u have the brain then i need not tell u where those drinks come from and who sponsor them. Remember wat i told u mths back. A mere rp10k the culprite can mobilise thousand of "supporter". This is politic. Nothing to do with Islam. I suggest u mix around more often with those indon then u will have a better and clearer picture. Dont just rely on social media alone.

Just cos few madrasah ustaz were extremist u started single out all madrasah as breeding ground for extremists. Very stereotype and it doesnt help much to have a healthy discussion. In Pakistan, Afganistan or some war torn muslim countries i agree lah. As i had mentioned those poor countries cant afford to have employ good qualified teachers or ustaz. And to make things worst, there are civil wars too. Tats where extremist groups came in. Burnei, Malaysia and Spore also have madrasah. So u are implying all those madrasah are breeding ground for extremists too? U been to a madrasah before? Do u know wat they are learning tere? Go tere personally before u simply shoot ur mouth and stereoype all madrasah as terrorist related.

 

[whoami]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

The Islamic world will get out of its current rough patch and ascend that civilisational cycle once again. It will take a few hundred years but I have no doubt it will happen just as it has happened, and is happening to and for other civilisations.

Amiiiin...and fair comment tere. Not like those stereotype post by John.

 

[JohnTan]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

You are assuming the worst for these Islamic societies, i.e. that this status quo is an unchanging constant and will remain forever.

Yes I am. This is because in order for the islamic societies to improve, they actually need to be more liberal, defang their power hungry ulamas and join the modern world. Currently, the islamic movement is visibly moving towards intolerance and radicalism

If this is indeed the case, the factors that contributed to the "Golden Age of Islam" would, as unchanging constants, result in the "Golden Age of Islam" carrying on to this present day. Needless to say, it has not. I see the factors contributing to the present status quo not as constants but as variables that contribute to the rise and fall cycle of civilisations.

Again, this is cyclical in nature. Otherwise, how do we explain the lengthy period of poverty and hardship that the Chinese underwent? It was only in the last 30 years that 700+ million plus Chinese were lifted out of poverty. They were dirt poor before that and poverty was passed on from one generation to another. Hundreds of millions of Chinese continue to be poor today.

Your cycle theory works only on hindsight assuming civilizations last long enough. Meso-American and Mexican civilizations cycle ended with the coming of the Spaniards. It's the same for the Zoroastrians of Persia and Buddhists of Afghanistan. Same for the Roman and Byzantines. Either wiped out, or reduced to an insignificant speck. No more cycle. The end.

And how do we explain the impoverished societies of Europe before the Renaissance and Industrial revolution? The Chinese and WASPs' work ethics are not immune to this cycle. The conservative values, emphasis on hard work, savings, discipline, family (formed by marriage between a man and a woman) which led to the ascent of WASP societies on the cycle have been, and continues to be steadily eroded and replaced with liberal ideas of welfarism (leading to laziness), uncontrolled spending, fixations with gay marriage "equality", etc and are factors that have led to decline of WASP societies along the cycle.

There are some theories. The Renaissance happened in societies that were gradually decentralized, which were mostly in Italy city states and western europe. In Eastern europe, the feudal lords grew stronger and strongly discouraged innovation and prevented their societies from moving in the direction that would encourage renaissance. It's for the same reason why breakthroughs in technology occured in the decentralized parts of europe, such as the printing press in the german states.

There is nothing wrong with liberalism per se. Liberalism from the mid 19th century onwards focused on human rights, and played a core part in ending slavery, starting independence movements against colonial empires and gave us many rights. Liberalism started to go downhill when it starts to swing too much to the left.

It's the same for innovation. Innovation works best in societies with a right mix of central government and decentralization to allow room for innovation and freedom of ideas. You don't see that in islamic societies, where it has moved very strongly towards centralization of not just government, but also of philosophy and idea. Examples would be like jailing or killing of apostates, regular mob violence for "blasphemy".

The WASP may be approaching the end of their cycle if they don't fix their demographic problem. It's the same for Singapore and many other developed societies. I doubt they will ever recover if the demographic nature of their continent changes from WASP to muslim or turkic or north african. They generally don't have a good work ethic, are intolerant, disrespect women, get defensive about their silly beliefs and lie about it to preserve a good image.

Seeing things as merely cycles is too simplistic. Not all societies last long enough to experience ups and downs. Some go up, then down and kaput. The chinks are just lucky to be one of the few civilizations that are large enough to make mistakes and not get wiped out.

Nope. I dont see it like the way u see it. Very stereotype. Just cos they wave islamic flag they are terrorists. They simply not happy with Ah Hock. I ever asked some Indon Chinese whether Ah Hock is at fault. They said yes hes at fault too. He shouldnt question the ulama cos hes not a Muslim. Like i told u many times all these demo were politically motivated.

The riots started because a muslim candidate went around saying that muslims should are not allowed to vote for non-Muslims. Do you agree or disagree with that statement that muslims are not allowed to be led non-muslims? Yes or no only.

Ahok disagreed, said that the voters were being misled, and a doctored clip of the incident was spread, the ulamas took that opportunity to mobilize their mosque resources to get rid of a christian chinese governor. The judges, all muslim, were also visited by mainstream mosque reps to ensure they voted correctly to jail Ahok. So what is the difference between politically motivated and religiously motivated to you then?

 

[whoami]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

The riots started because a muslim candidate went around saying that muslims should are not allowed to vote for non-Muslims. Do you agree or disagree with that statement that muslims are not allowed to be led non-muslims? Yes or no only.

Ahok disagreed, said that the voters were being misled, and a doctored clip of the incident was spread, the ulamas took that opportunity to mobilize their mosque resources to get rid of a christian chinese governor. So what is the difference between politically motivated and religiously motivated to you then?

Not easy to have a healthy discussion with you when you side with lies to get rid of non-muslim elected leaders simply because you feel the need to side with your own religion's people regardless of any reason.

NOw u change to riot? See how u manipulate twist and turn. Isnt tat a white lie?

Whether i agree or disagree why should i bother. I am not an indon. If its religiously motivated then hes a hypocrite cos he himself involve with sex scandal. U consider him religious jus cos hes a muslim? I say hes a "warlord".

Well u too. Very steretype. I quote so many verses fm the Quran. Yet u didnt bother to pause and contemplate but keep shooting ur mouth and keep repeating same even over and over again like old broken record. Ah hock ah hock...riot??? Wooo...scary sia. But i dont see any of the demo carrying parang guns or rifles. To the indon such demo is the norm. Carrying islamic placard is also a norm in most muslim counties. ONly a frog like u in sinklie well doesnt mix around with tourists from Indon only know how to assume tis and tat. Even Indon chinese agree tat it was all politically motivated. But u being a sinkie put the blame of Islam. Everything blame on Islam but unable to quote verses from the Quran

 

[JohnTan]

Re: The strange phenomenon of mixed marriages in the Malay community, and repercussio

NOw u change to riot? See how u manipulate twist and turn. Isnt tat a white lie?

It is a demonstration that called for violence and issued death threats. Police had to come in and forcibly disperse them. Not a riot? Are you simply lying again just because you share the same religion as the rioters?

Whether i agree or disagree why should i bother. I am not an indon. If its religiously motivated then hes a hypocrite cos he himself involve with sex scandal. U consider him religious jus cos hes a muslim? I say hes a "warlord".

He is religious because he is a trained religious scholar, and he harnessed the manpower of mainstream islamic groups and stirred shit and spread lies within the mosques, vast majority of whom were very wiling to go along with him as long as it could bring down the christian governor.

Well u too. Very steretype. I quote so many verses fm the Quran. Yet u didnt bother to pause and contemplate but keep shooting ur mouth and keep repeating same even over and over again like old broken record. Ah hock ah hock...riot???

Are you quoting to us verses from the period when Muhammad was very weak? That part of the quran is very peaceful, just like the muslim minority in Singapore. It's okay to live in harmony with non-muslims, it is okay to leave islam, no compulsion in islam. But when muslims become the majority, those peaceful verses are revoked and you get the other side of islam. You want to leave islam? You will be killed. You want to be atheist, grassroots muslims are free to issue death threats and kill you. And blasphemy mobs are also the norm.

Wooo...scary sia. But i dont see any of the demo carrying parang guns or rifles. To the indon such demo is the norm. Carrying islamic placard is also a norm in most muslim counties. ONly a frog like u in sinklie well doesnt mix around with tourists from Indon only know how to assume tis and tat. Even Indon chinese agree tat it was all politically motivated. But u being a sinkie put the blame of Islam. Everything blame on Islam but unable to quote verses from the Quran

Most of us do not consider this sort of demonstration to be peaceful even if they aren't carrying guns yet. Only muslims like you do, simply because you share the same religion.