Stallholders in row with Workers Party town council

[scroobal]

WP should stick to their guns. This thing will die down.

Now you know why parents work hard to send their kids to school and not become hawkers. No one wants to be used as political pawns.

I wonder if Vivian Balakrishnan remembers his maiden speech in parliament where he promised to change the PAP from inside. NEA comes directly under him. The ball is in his court. It is also an opportunity for him to shows leadership and display his moral compass for all to see. Errors and mistakes are made all the time. This was an obvious error in communication. Will he man up or will he remain quiet.

For the hawkers and the petty minded the light is on WP when it is actually on PAP and the Govt and Vivian Balakrishnan.

 

[scroobal]

The term " within his expectation" is his escape clause when things goes against him. So far every political event that he has speculated on and taken a position on has been wrong. And in all the cases the loses were not even close. He will then claim that is "within his expectation".

I guess we are resigned to the fact that this forum will forever serve as his gym (Goh's Gym?) with a Wplast (not Everlast) brand punching bag.

Given the acts of finding fault from all non-existent stuff and bypassing or ignoring the easily-derived rebuttals.

 

[zhihau]

wonder if Vivian Balakrishnan remembers his maiden speech in parliament where he promised to change the PAP from inside.

last remembered Tharman also wanted to change things from within... :o:o:o

 

[bebo]

For the hawkers and the petty minded the light is on WP when it is actually on PAP and the Govt and Vivian Balakrishnan.

Don't forget Grace Fu is the Second Minister, together with Vivian Balakrishnan. She's paid millions and thus expected to work to resolve this hawker issue.

 

[bebo]

Well, now the hawkers have upped the saga by another notch.... By asking for compensations from AHTC...

Goh Meng Seng

Can't help thinking AHTC's true opponent are the hawkers and not NEA

 

[tanwahp]

For the hawkers and the petty minded the light is on WP when it is actually on PAP and the Govt and Vivian Balakrishnan.

I don't think anyone can blame WP for ignoring the petty minded. If you take something as a punching bag, well, punching bags don't talk back.

 

[cass888]

You may be right when it comes to "community" stuff. But when it comes to dollars and cents and when the hawkers come back to a hawker centre with the ceiling uncleaned (after foregoing business for a few days) you can be sure they are royally pissed.

The hawker "leaders" who started this are so to speak your typical distant neighbour who's not close with other households and serves in your RC downstairs, or the fellow shopkeeper who serves in your building's MCST. We haven't learnt that when such things come everyone stays in their partisan lines and people cross camps if there are matters bigger than the comfort zone, like housing and transport matters.

If WP called for independent unions and do away with PA turns away the cleaner aunties or taiji aunties, WP would not have been able to win so many wards. I am confident of Singaporeans ability to discern.

 

[tanwahp]

You may be right when it comes to "community" stuff. But when it comes to dollars and cents and when the hawkers come back to a hawker centre with the ceiling uncleaned (after foregoing business for a few days) you can be sure they are royally pissed.

In politics never assume everyone thinks the same way. There will be unhappy people, but some with WP, some with NEA.

A few may switch from WP to PAP/NEA after seeing how things are different from what was under PAP. There are also those who see the injustices in full-blown view and switch the other way at the next GE. Only in 2016 do we know where is the majority.

 

[HTOLAS]

It's the hawkers' 'leaders', probably beholden to the PAPzis formally (through PA) or indirectly, on threat that they might get checked more regularly if they don't conform, who are the 'true opponents' of AHPTC.

Can't help thinking AHTC's true opponent are the hawkers and not NEA

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

This has dragged on long enough. Three points for the detractor in this thread:

(a) Has NEA miscommunicated with AHPETC about who should pay for the scaffolding cost? Yes.

(b) To date, has WP fulfilled its TC obligations under the TC Act Chp 329A, and thus far, has the cleaning of the hawker centres been done according to NEA regulations, namely, cleaning of common areas once per quarter, and high areas once a year? Yes.

(c) Has WP committed itself to rectifying the present situation? Yes.

Yes, yes and yes. Apa lagi GMS mahu?

 

[ahkow]

Goh Meng Seng PAP dog aka mr Dua Pao Xian

Don't know how to answer is it? Don't act blur


http://www.singsupplies.com/showthr...kers-Party-town-council&p=1546925#post1546925

reading GMS political commentaries always cause me to fall off my chair. What a joker!

 

[lockeliberal]

Dear Scroobal, Arun

For those who have long memories or longer memories, the loss of SDP and Ling How Doong started at the local level and the employment of his wife. Of course his lack of charisma and the dispute within the SDP did not help, but it was a local factor and how far one outwieghs the other is something I can't tell as I was not even politically aware then.

1. For someone as rooted to the ground as the WP, I am curious as to why they are picking fights and the manner they are picking fights with the Hawker Centres Associations. These are the people who are in many ways your "assentors" on the ground, them and the markets. Do u really want to pick a fight with them and on such an issue ? it just creates more and more bad press.

2. As more and more explanations come forth, Who is actually at fault, who is in dispute with who it just gets lost what sticks and what remains as the dispute escalates is WP in dispute with hawkers.


3. At the end of the day the follow issues remain unclear.

1) Last years Annual Spring cleaning. Who actually did the scaffolding ? NEA says that according to its RECORDS, AJHTC did not. But then what were its records and why would it even have such a record ? Because what is clear is that AJHTC did the cleaning, the issue is now who paid for the scaffolding.

2) The issue of who was authorised to tell the hawker association that it should built the scaffolding. Well it has become an issue because "Pritam" put his name to it saying no one authorised did. Then there was obviously a meeting between NEA AJHTC and the Hawkers over this whole scaffolding issue so this who issue as to who was authorised or not becomes murkier and murkier on all parties.


3) The fact that NEA was present at a three eyes meeting means some sort of dispute was simmering over minor municipal issues.


4) Which goes to the point, why pick a fight ?



Locke

WP should stick to their guns. This thing will die down.

Now you know why parents work hard to send their kids to school and not become hawkers. No one wants to be used as political pawns.

I wonder if Vivian Balakrishnan remembers his maiden speech in parliament where he promised to change the PAP from inside. NEA comes directly under him. The ball is in his court. It is also an opportunity for him to shows leadership and display his moral compass for all to see. Errors and mistakes are made all the time. This was an obvious error in communication. Will he man up or will he remain quiet.

For the hawkers and the petty minded the light is on WP when it is actually on PAP and the Govt and Vivian Balakrishnan.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

Sometimes Scroobal, I really wonder whether you are trying to destroy WP or trying to help them.

WP should cut loss, do a political retreat, apologize and promise to investigate and review the system they have now. Case close.

If WP listen to you and stick to whatever lousy guns they have and if there is a scandal evolves out of this, they are dead meat.


Goh Meng Seng

WP should stick to their guns. This thing will die down.

Now you know why parents work hard to send their kids to school and not become hawkers. No one wants to be used as political pawns.

I wonder if Vivian Balakrishnan remembers his maiden speech in parliament where he promised to change the PAP from inside. NEA comes directly under him. The ball is in his court. It is also an opportunity for him to shows leadership and display his moral compass for all to see. Errors and mistakes are made all the time. This was an obvious error in communication. Will he man up or will he remain quiet.

For the hawkers and the petty minded the light is on WP when it is actually on PAP and the Govt and Vivian Balakrishnan.

 

[bebo]

Makes me wonder now if Workers Party's Town Council for Hougang (before winning Aljunied) clean the high areas of Hougang's hawker centre with scaffolding. Don't tell me there is no hawker centre in Hougang SMC

 

[DEDEER]

GMS PAP Agent,

Don't siam. Your answer is needed. Why did you lie blantantly.

The only assessment I have made wrong is the level of unhappiness Singaporeans had against PAP. YSL destiny predicted no doubt and the reasons used to sack him have been deliberated as well. In fact I was amazed at the similarity of the reasons
LTK gave and I am still hopeful the core values are intact.

The drop of support in HG is at the lower end of estimation and that is a bit surprising, though not unexpected. The unexpected result lies in PEBE. which shock all political observers.

As for TKL, I can only tell you that losing deposit is within expectation though we hope for the best. It is unfortunate as study is done before TJS stepped in. Not everyone is born politician but that doesnt mean that they are no good ans definitely, it doesnt mean those born politician are better in anyways. I still stick with my choice based on core values I believed in.

Similar to say, those so call politicians are having so much problems now because they dont,have strong principled core values.. from plagiarism,YSL saga, vote buying via lucky draw to this present saga... it has everything to do with a screw up unprincipled attitude of Smart Alec.

Just,mark my word, this is not going to be end of WP sagas... well, you may blame PAP or MSM but it takes two to clap. It has everything to do with the quality and character of WP...

Goh Meng Seng

http://www.singsupplies.com/showthr...kers-Party-town-council&p=1546925#post1546925

For those who are in the know, they will realize that some of the core supporters who have supported him initially have left him. The problem may not lie with TCB but rather, some of his own supporters who really act like PAP/PA people. In fact, TCB's main core group consists of mainly PAP and PA people now. For some strange reasons, these people are actually chasing away other core supporters who are not within their own network.

TKL is not the one who should worry about his deposit. TCB and TJS are the ones who should be worried about their deposits. Put it simply, TJS are playing the opposition mode which he hopes to garner those 40% of voters who have voted opposition. However, he is gravely mistaken because those who have voted opposition in GE2011 consists of only 20% or less of hardcore anti-PAP while the other are made up of swing voters who are generally the silent majority.

TJS may not get ALL of those hardcore opposition votes, especially when he goes full blast into opposition mode of aggressiveness. Technically speaking, he has embarked on a suicidal mission with a mistaken understanding of voters profile. Those people who surround him giving him the wrong advice are basically hardcore anti-PAP people. This is the most suicidal composition in view of multi-corner fight. If it is one on one, maybe not so bad. But in multi-corner fight, we know that voters will go for those with more centrist and milder version of opposition positioning.

TCB's campaigning messages are not inspiring at all and keep repeating grandfather story of his past glories. Not many people can resonate with that kind of stories. The worse part is for him to make a few critical mistakes. Accusing others as "vote buying" when they offer to donate part or huge part of their own Presidential salary really looks bad on him. He has been contesting under PAP and there are even MORE DIRECT vote buying by PAP through HDB upgrading and such but he has kept quiet all this while but now, suddenly, he said he has principle not to buy vote? And such reasoning of vote buying is so weak! This is the main reason why he should worry of his deposit.

Goh Meng Seng

I am not that optimistic though.

WP will suffer a 3% drop upfront now, as their refusal to talk and negotiate may agitate SDP hardcore suppoters. These people may just vote KJ or DL instead of WP. Thus, in actual fact, WP will need a total of 11% vote swing against PAP.... LLL is not JBJ. Not possible.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[tanwahp]

Sometimes Scroobal, I really wonder whether you are trying to destroy WP or trying to help them.

WP should cut loss, do a political retreat, apologize and promise to investigate and review the system they have now. Case close.

If WP listen to you and stick to whatever lousy guns they have and if there is a scandal evolves out of this, they are dead meat.

Goh Meng Seng

Why do you think Scroobal or anyone are saying all these for WP's ears. Right or wrong, what AHPE did or said is a done deal and we need not add legs to a snake. Furthermore, he was responding to you and would not have said anything if you did not. No one is interested in carrying WP's balls here.

Scroobal and others are saying what they are saying because they are conscious of something called facts. Those with grudges, scores and hatred tend to be not.

I remember I once said that it's true some people support WP blindly but if support can be blind, hatred can also be blind. And hence some people hate WP blindly. Sometimes, hatred can easily be more blinding than love.

 

[ray_of_hope]

NEA has come out with a response, just saying AHPETC must not postpone the cleaning to Nov but must do it later this month. It is silent on the email. Why?

 

[Hawkeye1819]

NEA has come out with a response, just saying AHPETC must not postpone the cleaning to Nov but must do it later this month. It is silent on the email. Why?

This is the 4th time NEA has avoided the issue. Why? Why focus on the nitty grittiness and yet avoid the facts Pritam raised?

Basically intellectual dishonesty plus intention to make mountain out of molehill.

 

[Seee3]

.....

1) Last years Annual Spring cleaning. Who actually did the scaffolding ? NEA says that according to its RECORDS, AJHTC did not. But then what were its records and why would it even have such a record ? Because what is clear is that AJHTC did the cleaning, the issue is now who paid for the scaffolding.

2) The issue of who was authorised to tell the hawker association that it should built the scaffolding. Well it has become an issue because "Pritam" put his name to it saying no one authorised did. Then there was obviously a meeting between NEA AJHTC and the Hawkers over this whole scaffolding issue so this who issue as to who was authorised or not becomes murkier and murkier on all parties.


3) The fact that NEA was present http://.com/forum.phpat a three eyes meeting means some sort of dispute was simmering over minor municipal issues.


4) Which goes to the point, why pick a fight ?
P


Locke

Based on the exchanges among the 3 parties, probably

1. Stallholder paid for the scaffolding during the first cleaning. The 3 parties should have met and record is probably from the minutes of meeting.

2. I suspect that the real issue is on the method of cleaning. Probably 1 party wanted scaffolding to be used but such requirement was not clearly spelled out while the other party felt there was no official requirement to use scaffolding. The 3rd party helped to mediate by paying for the scaffolding. The next issue is on whether ceiling level cleaning needs to be done only once a year or during every spring cleaning which was also not clearly spelled out.

3. If my guess is correct, this silly fight is due to ambiguous official requirements on the method and frequency of ceiling cleanings required.

 

[winnipegjets]

Dear Scroobal, Arun

For those who have long memories or longer memories, the loss of SDP and Ling How Doong started at the local level and the employment of his wife. Of course his lack of charisma and the dispute within the SDP did not help, but it was a local factor and how far one outwieghs the other is something I can't tell as I was not even politically aware then.

1. For someone as rooted to the ground as the WP, I am curious as to why they are picking fights and the manner they are picking fights with the Hawker Centres Associations. These are the people who are in many ways your "assentors" on the ground, them and the markets. Do u really want to pick a fight with them and on such an issue ? it just creates more and more bad press.

2. As more and more explanations come forth, Who is actually at fault, who is in dispute with who it just gets lost what sticks and what remains as the dispute escalates is WP in dispute with hawkers.


3. At the end of the day the follow issues remain unclear.

1) Last years Annual Spring cleaning. Who actually did the scaffolding ? NEA says that according to its RECORDS, AJHTC did not. But then what were its records and why would it even have such a record ? Because what is clear is that AJHTC did the cleaning, the issue is now who paid for the scaffolding.

2) The issue of who was authorised to tell the hawker association that it should built the scaffolding. Well it has become an issue because "Pritam" put his name to it saying no one authorised did. Then there was obviously a meeting between NEA AJHTC and the Hawkers over this whole scaffolding issue so this who issue as to who was authorised or not becomes murkier and murkier on all parties.


3) The fact that NEA was present at a three eyes meeting means some sort of dispute was simmering over minor municipal issues.


4) Which goes to the point, why pick a fight ?

Locke

I don't see the WP picking a fight ...the PAP insurgents (RC, CCC) are using the hawkers to stir up unrest in the WP wards, kicking up a non-issue. If the WP don't stand up to it, more of such skirmishes will come about.