Dual Citizenship / NS Obligations / HDB Flats and Migration

[scroobal]

Can you imagine being posted back as an expat. If its an MNC, you will attend an orientation with mostly ang mos, brought around to see rental properties by ang mo relocation agents in the company of local agents, ( yes nearly all relocation agents are ang mos as their clients claim that we cannot understand our needs). You will also get housing and car allowance.

I have always encouraged those who migrated to come back and enjoy at least 3 years especially after their kids are self sufficient in the new country as schools here for expats are ex and a waste of time for the kids.

Come back as a PR...much better perks than citizens.

 

[scroobal]

No lah, it means that you and your skillset are global and you can command your more than a decent salary. You should see the faces of their ex-collegues when they return on expat terms. I have told about a real case involving an NUS Assoc Prof in Medicine. Migrated to Sydney, spent 2 years then to collect Citizenship. Came back full expat terms including housing, car and same job. Very nice couple, got along with everyone. By the way a full prof in those days gets black and white or Pandan Valley Penthouse.

You got to enjoy life now that you are no longer burden with the PAP and the PAP does look after foreigners well.

If migrate already renounce citizenship and then still have to go back to sinkieland means really cannot make it! Might as well never have migrated!

 

[bobby]

If migrate already renounce citizenship and then still have to go back to sinkieland means really cannot make it! Might as well never have migrated!

Just saying...already burnt my bridges.

Anyway even you come back as PR...ICA will give you a hard time.

 

[scroobal]

No they won't. You just have to fill an additional form for ex Singaporean males. Most MNCs have agency that do that and it will take 3 to 4 weeks as opposed to 1 week for other PR. No other hassle after that.

Just saying...already burnt my bridges.

Anyway even you come back as PR...ICA will give you a hard time.

 

[nayr69sg]

There is nothing to "enjoy" in Singapore. Work is insane. Stress. Crowds. HEAT and HUMIDITY. Awful rude people.

Seriously if my skills are global which it actually is now because I have CCFP. Why would I choose sinkieland? I could go to Australia, New Zealand, UK, Europe, USA.

This is why the FT you get in sinkieland is crap. The cannot make it go to sinkieland. Those who cannot go to Australia New Zealand UK Canada USA. Eg Indian FTs

 

[scroobal]

Notice I mentioned MNCs a number of times. There are a lot of MNCs who have made Singapore their regional headquarters. They are actually quite keen on Singaporeans with 1st world experience and operating in the Asia Pacific space. I do agree it will be a complete waste of time if it is local employer with a local market or a GLC.

Know the daughter of a migrant who came here to work of Temasek PR Department. She had worked in Geneva for the UN, studied abroad since Primary school. She said she learnt nothing while in Temasek and was completely deflated. She left to join another company.

I do agree that FTs in Singapore in the main are crap. No arguments there.

There is nothing to "enjoy" in Singapore. Work is insane. Stress. Crowds. HEAT and HUMIDITY. Awful rude people.

Seriously if my skills are global which it actually is now because I have CCFP. Why would I choose sinkieland? I could go to Australia, New Zealand, UK, Europe, USA.

This is why the FT you get in sinkieland is crap. The cannot make it go to sinkieland. Those who cannot go to Australia New Zealand UK Canada USA. Eg Indian FTs

 

[nayr69sg]

My children are regularly updated and educated on events in Singapore. The CPF the Presidential Malay Election.

They will not waste their time going to Singapore. You learn nothing there and work experience in Singapore is worthless on the world stage.

In any case if they do work for MNCs and are selected to work in Sinkieland as expats, likely Sinkie gahment will reject them and MNCs can see how petty sinkieland is and that would save my children from having to live and work in that hell hole.

 

[scroobal]

Was referring to those who migrated. Not kids of migrant parents. Schooled and raised in the West and with friends and schoolmates there , there is very little connection to come to Singapore. To them it an alien world. If they come, it will be a paid holiday for internship and working holiday or a posting from HQ. The only kids who will even consider to come back are those who are cannot compete in the West and hope their Ang Mo accent will help them here. They will laugh at you if you suggested it. Its like our parents asking us to go back to China to work. The exceptions are those who can command something big because of their skills.

Former MOS Tay Eng Soon's daughter Margaret went to the US , married Ang Mo and settled there for good. Was working in the US for Goldman Sachs, then posted to HK. She is now forms the leadership in Temasek. She is paid a ton. Smart girl, her uncle whacks the daylight of the PAP every opportunity her gets and she is making good money at the same time.

My children are regularly updated and educated on events in Singapore. The CPF the Presidential Malay Election.

They will not waste their time going to Singapore. You learn nothing there and work experience in Singapore is worthless on the world stage.

In any case if they do work for MNCs and are selected to work in Sinkieland as expats, likely Sinkie gahment will reject them and MNCs can see how petty sinkieland is and that would save my children from having to live and work in that hell hole.

 

[nayr69sg]

If Margaret forms the leadership in Temasek it means she is a piece of shit looking at the crap performance of Temasek. No good talent would be working for Temasek. Temasek over pays for mediocre.

Likely she is there because of connections. All the Temasek assholes ar connected.

While sinkies think that money is everything other people in the world do not think the same.

 

[ZorrorroZ]

Just remembered the old SBF after all these years.... the mob is still here!!

So how's things back in SG land? Glad to see Scroobal is still active. Your advice has been invaluable, most appreciated.

Thanks for all the fish!

 

[scroobal]

Welcome back bro.

And thanks, alway ready to help.

Just remembered the old SBF after all these years.... the mob is still here!!

So how's things back in SG land? Glad to see Scroobal is still active. Your advice has been invaluable, most appreciated.

Thanks for all the fish!

 

[nayr69sg]

http://stomp.straitstimes.com/singa...izenship-told-to-obey-the-laws-of-his-country

Aussie blokes....you're screwed!

 

[nicolewong]

The ICA questionnaire trap:

10. Have you been granted citizenship of another country? If yes, state the country.

11.If you are residing in the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (HKSAR), have you
been issued with the HKSAR passport and choose to retain the right of abode in HKSAR?

 

[busybee1688]

HDB Issues

Naturally those who are migrating are quite apprehensive about their new country and as an insurance tend to hold onto their HDB flat, downsize or even buy one in case they have to return.

HDB does not allow sale to take place unless you have been residing ( not only owning but physically residing) in the flat for a certain period prior to sale. The last I heard is 2 years. I have known familes that had to return temporarily for 2 years in order to sell their flat. I also know that these families have written to their MPs citing hardship but have been turned down. I know of only one case that was given exemption.

Of course, others find ways to avoid this by claiming that they have been residing prior to sale or do not rent out at all and except mails wacthed over by relatives.

A better way is to buy private property such as condo which I know is more expensive. That way, if you need cash in your new country, you can liquidate your asset here quickly. Alternatively, place it in a more liquid asset.

HDB generally does not allow non-citizens and those who have given up PR in Singapore to hold on to HDB flats. They will however give you time to sell if your appeal fails but the minimum residency requirement will likely hold. Parents who have given up their citizenship but who have dual citizenship kids can use that angle to hold on citing things like the kid can stay there during NS if NS is required.

Hi, just wonder is HDB ok with 1 SG citizen and the other one renounced the sg citizenship. Or later give time frame to sell etcs. Think my partner can take out the cpf SA and MA account $ first. Selling the HDB few years later as his parents still live in that HDB. I think I saw the forum somewhere mentioned not a issue as later part after selling the HDB CPF go back to sg bank account instead of CPF account if renounced. I think CPF board will notify HDB lor. May be forced to sell later.

 

[Don Muthuswamy]

Long time have not been to this forum. Again my child situation is haunting me. Just want to make long story short here. Is a child holding dual citizenship (EU and SG) will be fine living in Malaysia without being asked to pay bond, force to come back for NS? I took him out to France when he was 3 and now he's 7 yrs old. Circumstance make us wants to move to Malaysia.

This post was like 11 years ago but still relevant today. Thanks bro Scroobal.

 

[Don Muthuswamy]

I'm sorry winnipegjets. This discussion is going nowhere. You're saying the same things you said back in 2004. The things that helped convince me to leave Singapore. I thank you for that.

But really it is going nowhere. One moment sinkies are incapable of independent thinking. Then there are those who can provide leadership. Sinkies? I thought they were incapable? Not the role of sinkies to provide solutions. Role of sinkies is to kpkb. Then the incapable of independent thinking sinkies are supposed to magically vote in people who can provide the vision and leadership. Presumably from the pool of incapable of independent thinkers as well. It's the same old line I keep hearing from Singaporeans. "I am not paid millions so why ask me? Ask the ministers!" "PAP control all the media and the elections what to do?" "The opposition is of poor quality so I have no choice but to vote PAP" "Government is bad" "Government is better than Malaysia one lah. Look at Indonesia good god" Same old.

You're a socialist. Communism would be more acceptable to you than Conservatism. It has nothing to do with elections. The leaders that emerge should just take power forcibly because the people are incapable of voting them in.

I wish you all the best and hope that your vision for Singapore whatever it is, and whatever we think the somehow leaders who are out there or not have for Singapore is a bright and successful one.

My future is in Canada. Where the country is bigger than any political party. Cons come and go. Liberals come and go. It matters but it doesn't destroy the country. Cheers!

Hi doc,
I remember that you used to be in the old SBF forum. Your analysis of Sinkees is spot on, complain and kpkb to no end buy 0 actions. It'll take a lot of guts and determination to do what you have done, migrate, especially when you had a comfortable life in Singapore as a doctor, and especially when there were lots of negatives posted by trolls about Canada and Australia. Most Sinkees would have freaked out at those posts and would have given up the thoughts of migration if they had any but given that you had uprooted you and your family and are enjoying your lives in Canada is pretty impressive. You have done the righr thing sir. Singapore is just a pathetic place. Life in places like Australia and Canada can be 1,000 times better as compared to Singapore. Feel really happy for you sir.

 

[Don Muthuswamy]

Yes doc, would like to catch up with you as well fir a coffee, lunch or dinner, we could do it when we both visit Singapore or if we visit each other's hometown, for sure.
My family and I have migrated. We are in Sydney Australia now and we are Australian citizens. My daughter is on a scholarship and is doing her PHD in University of NSW in medical chemistry and my son is training to be a chef. He will be turning 21 next year and he's planning to give up his Singapore citizenship( the tips from people like scroobal have really helped me on this). I'm blessed to have made the move. If they had been in Singapore, they would probably would have gone to IT and once finished, start with a miserable $1.5k salary. My son would also have to do his NS if he was still.in Singapore.

I currently own a landed property in Sydney in which I'm residing, not huge but comfortable and bought a few other properties in Queensland that I am renting out (mostly from my CPF money that I withdrew). In Singapore, I could not even have a HDB and was staying with my mom. I'm not rich, a very average middle class guy here but am happy. If I want to have a similar life in Singapore, I must be a millionaire. I now consider everyday to be a blessing. You and me, we are the rare ones who have made the move doc, and I've got to thank so many of the bros in Sammyboy forum who have given a lot of tips and ideas on migration. Tips and ideas from people like you, scroobal and even Sam have been really helpful, they have changed my life for the better, what more can I ask for???? Most of the other Sinkees, all they do is kpkb about the PAP but have no guts to change anything, keep voting for the PAP.

Sometimes doc, we might not like certain things in our lives but I have learnt to look at a glass half full rather than half empty. Don't worry doc, just carry on doing what you're doing, sometimes things that we don't like might happen and there is nothing that we could do but down the track we tend to realize that it's all for our best.

 

[Don Muthuswamy]

Never help Singaporeans. Please.

I agree doc. They are ungrateful idiots.

 

[JohnDoe]

I agree doc. They are ungrateful idiots.

Can't agree more with the two of you. The worst kinds are the ones that emigrate and thereafter, day in day out still sing praises about Sinkieland. If Sinkieland so good, fucking go back to it. We don't need your loser mentality here.

 

[indig10]

I know someone like this here in Canada. Married and had a kid in Canada, enjoying a good life. Touched on the question while chatting about kids about whether might bring kid back to Singapore and that acquaintance said “No, Canada is good.” This I can understand.

But when topic changed to politics, the reply was “PAP is the best. All the other political parties are crap. Singapore is fantastic.”

The level of irony was so strong a rebar could’ve smacked us across the face.

That person regularly posts photos of the good life in Canada. I never stayed in touch after that. Good riddance.