Does Goh Meng Seng support cheaper housing, Minimum Wage, 1 year NS, pension, etc

[cheekenpie]

why are you adding to what GMS has said? GMS never mentioned about conduct or capabilities. You are truly despicable. I am going to give you an infraction and I hope others here do likewise.

People like you should not be allowed to post. It is fine that you are a little thin up where it matters but to put words in other people's mouths just to prove that you are right is totally despicable.


This site does not need people like you around. You seem to think it is jolly fine to go around posting scare mongering posts that are based on false premises.

GMS is right, Singapore does not have a professional army! Our army is made up with regulars (professionals), conscripts and reservists.

Nowhere did GMS mention anything on conduct and capabilities and definitely GMS did not put any negative light on the capabilities and conduct on the SG army. GMS was an army captain for goodness sake!

Piang eh... you really behave like PAP dog. I cannot express my opinion or draw conclusion from someone's very vague statement meh?

And since when you become spokesperson for GMS?

In summary, he made a vague statement that SAF is not a professional army. He has since clarified he thinks professional means they only train to fight war and not do NDP.

You say this

GMS is right, Singapore does not have a professional army! Our army is made up with regulars (professionals), conscripts and reservists.

So obvious you also put words into his mouth cos he did not say this. or did he? Hard to tell when people like GMS and you keep changing direction everytime you lose an argument.

 

[eatshitndie]

Yes, identify that battalion or division. There is none. Thus, what we have as regulars are not considered as Professional Army, a Professional Fighting Force, but rather a group of regulars playing supporting roles while we are getting the NSmen, part timers to do the fighting.

Goh Meng Seng

if you just leave it at "army", you're right. but you're wrong about "professional fighting force." much of the navy and air force of the saf are staffed by regulars. in fact, all fighter squadrons comprise professional airmen. same with sub units and frigate units.

 

[ChaoPappyPoodle]

if you just leave it at "army", you're right. but you're wrong about "professional fighting force." much of the navy and air force of the saf are staffed by regulars. in fact, all fighter squadrons comprise professional airmen. same with sub units and frigate units.

Navy does not equate to army. Similarly with the airforce. And keep in mind that the supporting services to the navy and airforce are also made up of non-regulars. Hence, even the navy and airforce are not professional.

 

[cheekenpie]

Yes, identify that battalion or division. There is none. Thus, what we have as regulars are not considered as Professional Army, a Professional Fighting Force, but rather a group of regulars playing supporting roles while we are getting the NSmen, part timers to do the fighting.

Goh Meng Seng

Wouldnt a professional Fighting Force Army as you put it be reliant on regulars and volunteers?

Because realistically, you cannot expect someone to sign up full time as a rifleman? So you will need volunteers to joint the army professionally for made 2-4 yr stints, much like how the US does it.

If not on this short term contract basis, within a few decades you will end up with a bloated 'professional army' that is over staffed and has an escalating defense budget bec everyone is professional.

Ultimately wouldnt that just cost the tax payer more money? Have you really thought this through?

 

[ChaoPappyPoodle]

Piang eh... you really behave like PAP dog. I cannot express my opinion or draw conclusion from someone's very vague statement meh?

And since when you become spokesperson for GMS?

In summary, he made a vague statement that SAF is not a professional army. He has since clarified he thinks professional means they only train to fight war and not do NDP.

You say this

So obvious you also put words into his mouth cos he did not say this. or did he? Hard to tell when people like GMS and you keep changing direction everytime you lose an argument.

None of your business what I do here or anywhere else and for whom or for what. What I have noticed from you is that you have consistently spread false accusations and scaremongering in a large number of your posts.

GMS did not make a vague statement. He made a statement. If you wanted more information then you should asked for it. You did not. Instead, you took it upon yourself to put him in a bad light and to make insinuations against his conduct and hence his character and future exploits. You then went on to put words into his mouth to push your false insinuations further.

You are an absolute arse of a human being and a despicable one at that. You have shown very little of what human beings should be.

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

if you just leave it at "army", you're right. but you're wrong about "professional fighting force." much of the navy and air force of the saf are staffed by regulars. in fact, all fighter squadrons comprise professional airmen. same with sub units and frigate units.

Well, for the navy and air force, they are supporting roles. The army is still the main force which would do the clearing on the objectives.

For example, could the Airforce or navy accomplish any mission of capturing enemy objectives without the army? Apparently not. We do not have MARINES like US. But for the army, it is not impossible to capture any enemy objectives without Airforce or navy if your enemy is weak.

Well, even if we consider Airforce and Navy as professional force, it doesn't add altogether into one fighting force without the army. And in a sense, in the case of Airforce and Navy, yes, NSmen are playing the supporting roles instead of the main roles. They do have reserves made up of ex-regulars as well which may stand in for the main roles. If the army is to adopt the doctrines of such system, National Service will be very different.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

Wouldnt a professional Fighting Force Army as you put it be reliant on regulars and volunteers?

Because realistically, you cannot expect someone to sign up full time as a rifleman? So you will need volunteers to joint the army professionally for made 2-4 yr stints, much like how the US does it.

If not on this short term contract basis, within a few decades you will end up with a bloated 'professional army' that is over staffed and has an escalating defense budget bec everyone is professional.

Ultimately wouldnt that just cost the tax payer more money? Have you really thought this through?

If you think having a professional army is more expensive than getting NSmen to do reservist training, then you may be wrong.

You pay NSmen their CIVILIAN SALARIES when you recall them back for training. A CEO may be paid tens of thousands just to be a corporal in reservist training. SAF may spend hundreds of thousands just to recall one battalion back for 3 weeks of reservist traning.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[cheekenpie]

None of your business what I do here or anywhere else and for whom or for what. .

And why are you so concerned about what i do. How is it any of YOUR BUSINESS? hmmm?

 

[cheekenpie]

If you think having a professional army is more expensive than getting NSmen to do reservist training, then you may be wrong.

You pay NSmen their CIVILIAN SALARIES when you recall them back for training. A CEO may be paid tens of thousands just to be a corporal in reservist training. SAF may spend hundreds of thousands just to recall one battalion back for 3 weeks of reservist traning.

Goh Meng Seng

You pay the civilian salaries only for the period you call them up for (2 weeks maybe once a year.

If you employ the entire army strength full time, defense budget must go up, and you bloat the public sector with a professional army with no war to fight. Isnt that waste?

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

You pay the civilian salaries only for the period you call them up for (2 weeks maybe once a year.

If you employ the entire army strength full time, defense budget must go up, and you bloat the public sector with a professional army with no war to fight. Isnt that waste?

Do you know that SAF has all year round reservist training?

Goh Meng Seng

 

[ChaoPappyPoodle]

And why are you so concerned about what i do. How is it any of YOUR BUSINESS? hmmm?

Because you are of a despicable character. In Hokkien, we call you lanchio lang! :oIo:

I already said, if you thought something was vague, you ask for clarification or let it be.

Instead of clarifying, you went on to attack that person for something you thought was vague. A non-lanchio lang would have asked for clarification before shooting off their 2 inch dicks in public.

KNNPCB! :oIo:

You useless piece of shit!

 

[cheekenpie]

Do you know that SAF has all year round reservist training?

Goh Meng Seng

Care to elaborate and complete your thoughts? Wait idiots like that doggy say i misunderstand,

 

[Ramseth]

if you just leave it at "army", you're right. but you're wrong about "professional fighting force." much of the navy and air force of the saf are staffed by regulars. in fact, all fighter squadrons comprise professional airmen. same with sub units and frigate units.

It's commonsense. You can send a few thousand NSmen to any jungle to be killed by enemies or wild animals, you can't send NSmen to pilot warplanes or battleships. You'd never know where they'd turn up and bomb!

Once Lta. GMS led his reservist coy to Australia, supposedly for desert warfare training near Darwin but turned up near crocodile-infested greenpeace-protected swarmland near Perth. It was rumored that SAF paid an undisclosed compensation for the harm did to protected ecology and endangered species. They promoted GMS to Cpt. to keep his mouth shut about NSmen can't really topo, read map or compass. But when in danger, they can shoot like hell without regard to what or where is the target.

 

[cheekenpie]

Because you are of a despicable character. In Hokkien, we call you lanchio lang! :oIo:

I already said, if you thought something was vague, you ask for clarification or let it be.

Instead of clarifying, you went on to attack that person for something you thought was vague. A non-lanchio lang would have asked for clarification before shooting off their 2 inch dicks in public.

KNNPCB! :oIo:

You useless piece of shit!

Thanks for the clarification. I now understand. Thank you for enlightening me. Have a nice and pleasant day.

 

[ChaoPappyPoodle]

Thanks for the clarification. I now understand. Thank you for enlightening me. Have a nice and pleasant day.

:oIo::oIo::oIo:

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

Care to elaborate and complete your thoughts? Wait idiots like that doggy say i misunderstand,

The SAF conduct reservist training for NSmen all year round. There are many NSmen units accumulated over the years. Imagine each year you have 2 to 3 battalions of NSF getting into reservist, how are you going to manage them? Train them adequately for fighting roles?

Each year, there will be rotation of training for different NSmen units and this naturally will men that some units do not go for training in some years. Main training schedules are planned accordingly for different NSmen units in rotation while smaller skill traning like shooting range and such are just routine.

In short, round the year, there will be training for some NSmen units in rotation. Meaning, SAF is paying lots of money just to recall these NSmen back to camp for training. Comparing this to having a professional army? It is less efficient and effective. NSmen being partimers, will need time for refresher courses each and every time when they go back to camp for training. eg. Every time you go back for reservist training, you will have to spend time to learn how to set up a tentage, familiarization of small arms...etc.

All these incur cost. At the officer level, it is difficult for them to remember each and every operation doctrines after one or two years. The trainers will have to teach them all over again. Even the drawing of military symbols needs to be relearned each and every time. This is simply because we are just partimers.

This is why our Defence budget is more than 10 billion for a small country like ours even though we do not run a professinal army.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[Ramseth]

TheIn short, round the year, there will be training for some NSmen units in rotation. Meaning, SAF is paying lots of money just to recall these NSmen back to camp for training. Comparing this to having a professional army? It is less efficient and effective. NSmen being partimers, will need time for refresher courses each and every time when they go back to camp for training. eg. Every time you go back for reservist training, you will have to spend time to learn how to set up a tentage, familiarization of small arms...etc.

All these incur cost. At the officer level, it is difficult for them to remember each and every operation doctrines after one or two years. The trainers will have to teach them all over again. Even the drawing of military symbols needs to be relearned each and every time. This is simply because we are just partimers.

No wonder I heard some reservist units sent to ROC landed in Fujian province PRC; Senior Minister Goh was emergency rushed there to explain, since it involved a Captain surnamed Goh too; believed to be relatives.

 

[Sideswipe]

This is why our Defence budget is more than 10 billion for a small country like ours even though we do not run a professinal army.

any ideas why PAP never consider a professional army?

 

[Goh Meng Seng]

any ideas why PAP never consider a professional army?

I must make some corrections here. We have one battalion of professionals which does not consist of Singaporeans but Nepalese. During peace time, they operate as police guard forces instead of army duties. But they are capable of fighting as an arm force.

I think there are many considerations of not wanting a National Professional army. One is the lack of human resources but this is irrelevant when you take a look at the amount of time used by normal civilians in training.... NSF as well as NSmen reservist training. Second, it is about the power of the generals will be increased if there is a regular professional army. It may prove to be politically challenging.

Goh Meng Seng

 

[halsey02]

Yes, identify that battalion or division. There is none. Thus, what we have as regulars are not considered as Professional Army, a Professional Fighting Force, but rather a group of regulars playing supporting roles while we are getting the NSmen, part timers to do the fighting.

Goh Meng Seng

Why are we splitting hairs over these army issue, we never had a professional army in the first place since we became indpendent, it is a deterrent force. the question now beg to be answered today is, are we proud to defend SINGAPORE our nation or a PAP NATION?. What is the point of having NS for 1 yrs, 1.5 yrs, 2,5 yrs or a professional army, when we are not even proud to defend SINGAPORE as a nation, regardless of it is GMS political party is in power, any other or the PAP.

That is the serious question we have to look into..not NS , professional army....

The pride of a country...we fight for!