Vincent and his No Gay agenda...

[Thick Face Black Heart]

Former PM Lee Kuan Yew would accept a gay MP as long as he/she did his/her job well:

Q: It took time for Singaporeans to be able to accept single women MPs. Do you see Singaporeans being able to accept a gay MP? It's already happening in a fairly widespread fashion in Europe.

A: As far as I'm concerned, if she does her work as an MP, she looks after her constituents, she makes sensible speeches, she's making a contribution, her private life is her life, that's that.


PAP IBs, do you want to contradict LKY on this point??

 

[Thick Face Black Heart]

Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew's comments on homosexuality made in his book and the buzz it generated prompted journalist Elgin Toh to write a feature article in The Sunday Times[8]. However, the final version which appeared in print was subjected to editorial censorship of some of the comments which advocated gay equality made by the members of the LGBT community interviewed:


Jan 23, 2011


Gay MP? 'Her private life is her private life'


But society is not ready for such openness in Parliament: MM Lee
By Elgin Toh


Social mores at one time kept single women out of Parliament. The likes of Ms Penny Low and Ms Indranee Rajah, both sitting MPs and unmarried, prove that frontier has been breached.


Might gay people one day follow in their footsteps? Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew has revealed that he has no problems with having homosexuals in Parliament.


The surprising comment came in an interview in which Mr Lee makes his most comprehensive statement on homosexuality to date. It was published in a new book about his beliefs, Hard Truths To Keep Singapore Going. It is available at bookstores with DVD for $39.90.



Asked about the possibility of gay MPs, he said: 'As far as I'm concerned, if she does her work as an MP, she looks after her constituents, she makes sensible speeches, she's making a contribution, her private life is her life, that's that.'


Mr Lee, however, made it clear that his personal view did not automatically become the policy of the ruling People's Action Party (PAP), which he no longer leads, saying later in the same interview: 'I'm not the prime minister, I told you that before I started. If I were the prime minister I would hesitate to push it through against the prevailing sentiment, against the prevailing values of society.


'You're going against the current of the people, the underlying feeling. What's the point of that, you know, breaking new ground and taking unnecessary risk?'


He said he believed it had been scientifically proven that homosexuals were genetically different from heterosexuals. 'They are born that way and that's that.'


Asked what he would do if he had a grandchild who was gay, he cited the example of former United States vice-president Dick Cheney, who was against homosexuality but whose daughter is gay.


'He says, 'I still love her, full-stop',' noted Mr Lee. 'Do you throw the daughter out? That's life. I mean none of my children is gay, but if they were, well, that's that.' He was more ambiguous about whether same-sex marriages should be allowed or if gays should be given rights of adoption, noting that 'complications' would arise. 'Who is going to bring them up?' he asked.


'Two men looking after a child? Two women looking after a child, maybe. But I'm not so sure because it's not their own child. Unless you have artificial insemination and it's their own child, then you have a certain maternal instinct immediately aroused by the process of pregnancy.'


Calling his view the 'purely practical view', he said 'we cross the bridge when we come to it', adding: 'We haven't come to that bridge yet. The people are not ready for it. In fact, some ministers are not ready for it.'


Political watchers and MPs said Mr Lee's views were more liberal than those of mainstream society, and they did not expect the PAP Government to change its basic stance. 'They'll still be wary about fielding someone who is known to be gay at the next election, because they won't want the election to be sidetracked by the sexual orientation of a candidate,' said Mr Eugene Tan, law lecturer at Singapore Management University.


'But MM is painting the larger picture of how what is acceptable is something that would change and evolve with time.'


Said Mr Charles Chong, an MP for Pasir Ris-Punggol GRC: 'PAP candidates have never been asked to declare our sexual orientation. MM is right in saying an MP should be judged purely on his performance, and not on his sexual orientation.'


Members of the gay community here welcomed some of Mr Lee's remarks.


'Some of what he said was heartening, but I wish he would have extended it to say that decriminalising 377A, legalising same-sex marriage and adoption would therefore make sense,' said communications executive Charmaine Tan, 35, referring to Section 377A of the Penal Code, which makes sex between two men an offence.


Ms Irene Oh, 27, and Ms Olivia Tan, 30, would both like to raise children. One way is to get pregnant through assisted reproduction, such as artificial insemination or in-vitro fertilisation (IVF).


'We know some couples who get it done overseas, but that's very expensive,' said Ms Oh, a software developer and administrator of lesbian website Sayoni.com.


They are also open to adopting children. While welcoming Mr Lee's comments, they disagreed that adopting a child lessened the maternal bond.


Said Ms Oh: 'If MM Lee is right, then even heterosexual couples should not be allowed to adopt, because they, too, have no biological connection with the child. I think adoption is a great act of love, and there is no reason to expect adoptive parents to be any less caring.'


[email protected]

 

[Tadakatsu Honda]

Yeah, good points, and agree including the last sentence which we discussed previously.

I will deduct your points later.

 

[jw5]

I will deduct your points later.

Ok man. :(

 

[BuiKia]

You agree with the old man on this? You think old man knows everything? Ask him how many LGBT people does he know personally?

I'm not trying to contract LKY but to contradict him. The only difference between us and gay is that they like to fuck ass.

Lee Kuan Yew himself that being gay was genetic, not a choice.

Are you trying to contract Lee Kuan Yew here?

Lee Kuan Yew himself also said gay people are no different from you and I.

So again, are you going against LKY here?

 

[BuiKia]

Now you using SPH article and LKY to support your claim?

If being gay is genetic and they do not produce off-spring, the LGBT would have died naturally by now but they still exist. What does this mean?

Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew's comments on homosexuality made in his book and the buzz it generated prompted journalist Elgin Toh to write a feature article in The Sunday Times[8]. However, the final version which appeared in print was subjected to editorial censorship of some of the comments which advocated gay equality made by the members of the LGBT community interviewed:


Jan 23, 2011


Gay MP? 'Her private life is her private life'


But society is not ready for such openness in Parliament: MM Lee
By Elgin Toh


Social mores at one time kept single women out of Parliament. The likes of Ms Penny Low and Ms Indranee Rajah, both sitting MPs and unmarried, prove that frontier has been breached.


Might gay people one day follow in their footsteps? Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew has revealed that he has no problems with having homosexuals in Parliament.


The surprising comment came in an interview in which Mr Lee makes his most comprehensive statement on homosexuality to date. It was published in a new book about his beliefs, Hard Truths To Keep Singapore Going. It is available at bookstores with DVD for $39.90.



Asked about the possibility of gay MPs, he said: 'As far as I'm concerned, if she does her work as an MP, she looks after her constituents, she makes sensible speeches, she's making a contribution, her private life is her life, that's that.'


Mr Lee, however, made it clear that his personal view did not automatically become the policy of the ruling People's Action Party (PAP), which he no longer leads, saying later in the same interview: 'I'm not the prime minister, I told you that before I started. If I were the prime minister I would hesitate to push it through against the prevailing sentiment, against the prevailing values of society.


'You're going against the current of the people, the underlying feeling. What's the point of that, you know, breaking new ground and taking unnecessary risk?'


He said he believed it had been scientifically proven that homosexuals were genetically different from heterosexuals. 'They are born that way and that's that.'


Asked what he would do if he had a grandchild who was gay, he cited the example of former United States vice-president Dick Cheney, who was against homosexuality but whose daughter is gay.


'He says, 'I still love her, full-stop',' noted Mr Lee. 'Do you throw the daughter out? That's life. I mean none of my children is gay, but if they were, well, that's that.' He was more ambiguous about whether same-sex marriages should be allowed or if gays should be given rights of adoption, noting that 'complications' would arise. 'Who is going to bring them up?' he asked.


'Two men looking after a child? Two women looking after a child, maybe. But I'm not so sure because it's not their own child. Unless you have artificial insemination and it's their own child, then you have a certain maternal instinct immediately aroused by the process of pregnancy.'


Calling his view the 'purely practical view', he said 'we cross the bridge when we come to it', adding: 'We haven't come to that bridge yet. The people are not ready for it. In fact, some ministers are not ready for it.'


Political watchers and MPs said Mr Lee's views were more liberal than those of mainstream society, and they did not expect the PAP Government to change its basic stance. 'They'll still be wary about fielding someone who is known to be gay at the next election, because they won't want the election to be sidetracked by the sexual orientation of a candidate,' said Mr Eugene Tan, law lecturer at Singapore Management University.


'But MM is painting the larger picture of how what is acceptable is something that would change and evolve with time.'


Said Mr Charles Chong, an MP for Pasir Ris-Punggol GRC: 'PAP candidates have never been asked to declare our sexual orientation. MM is right in saying an MP should be judged purely on his performance, and not on his sexual orientation.'


Members of the gay community here welcomed some of Mr Lee's remarks.


'Some of what he said was heartening, but I wish he would have extended it to say that decriminalising 377A, legalising same-sex marriage and adoption would therefore make sense,' said communications executive Charmaine Tan, 35, referring to Section 377A of the Penal Code, which makes sex between two men an offence.


Ms Irene Oh, 27, and Ms Olivia Tan, 30, would both like to raise children. One way is to get pregnant through assisted reproduction, such as artificial insemination or in-vitro fertilisation (IVF).


'We know some couples who get it done overseas, but that's very expensive,' said Ms Oh, a software developer and administrator of lesbian website Sayoni.com.


They are also open to adopting children. While welcoming Mr Lee's comments, they disagreed that adopting a child lessened the maternal bond.


Said Ms Oh: 'If MM Lee is right, then even heterosexual couples should not be allowed to adopt, because they, too, have no biological connection with the child. I think adoption is a great act of love, and there is no reason to expect adoptive parents to be any less caring.'


[email protected]

 

[lifeafter41]

You agree with the old man on this? You think old man knows everything? Ask him how many LGBT people does he know personally?

I'm not trying to contract LKY but to contradict him. The only difference between us and gay is that they like to fuck ass.

I'm not trying to contract LKY but to contradict him. The only difference between us and gay is that they like to fuck ass

There isn't much of a choice, isn't it?.

 

[ray_of_hope]

As for you, be prepared for you and your great grand children to be ruled by pap for the next 100 years.
I say this even though we both probably agree that WP is doing a good job as the opposition.

Indeed! I had many moons ago prepared for such. I find that it is useful to be prudent.

 

[ray_of_hope]

I am wondering what will happen if WP decides to field a known gay candidate or one of their MPs is revealed to be gay. Will you be made to eat your words?

Well said!

In politics, eating one's words is a common occurrence.

Also, in politics, fairness is not a common occurrence.

It is also as well to also remember that in politics, addressing oneself to what is known as an objective fact is a common occurrence.
Equally, in politics, not addressing oneself to hypotheticals is a common occurrence.

 

[3_M]

I am wondering what will happen if WP decides to field a known gay candidate or one of their MPs is revealed to be gay. Will you be made to eat your words?

Being a gay and pursuing gay agenda are different matter. VW claimed he is a gay with no gay agenda but his actions contradict what he said. It better for VW to draw a line by refraining from attending events like the Pink Dot which can be construed that he is endorsing those views that advocate same sex marriage etc. As politician, there is only a fine line between official and personal.

In any case WP is not a suitable political platform for anyone who wants to further the gay right.

 

[jw5]

Indeed! I had many moons ago prepared for such. I find that it is useful to be prudent.

Can tell you are "prudent", even without meeting or knowing you, just by reading your posts.

 

[tanwahp]

Well said!

In politics, eating one's words is a common occurrence.

Also, in politics, fairness is not a common occurrence.

It is also as well to also remember that in politics, addressing oneself to what is known as an objective fact is a common occurrence.
Equally, in politics, not addressing oneself to hypotheticals is a common occurrence.

You sound like Goh Meng Seng is the most model politician that Singapore should extol to the sky.

 

[tanwahp]

In any case WP is not a suitable political platform for anyone who wants to further the gay right.

As long as LTK and SL are there, but no one knows what will happen if another person takes over.

 

[ray_of_hope]

You sound like Goh Meng Seng is the most model politician that Singapore should extol to the sky.

I'm but a lowly peasant. I learn from intellectual greats like you and jw5.

GMS? I think not... :o

 

[HorGauGan]

some PAP doggie leeder's son also gay wat. angmoh hubby summore.

which supreme doggie said tat gayness is genetics?

 

[ChewCheng]

Im so glad that I turn out straight.

 

[steffychun]

[video=youtube;GEyskY0pg_g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEyskY0pg_g[/video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEyskY0pg_g

If you were gay

 

[3_M]

As long as LTK and SL are there, but no one knows what will happen if another person takes over.

Possible only if there is a net gain of votes by fighting this cause. I still don't see how can one party gain more votes by piggybacking gay agenda. It still doesn't pay to offend that larger group of conservative bloc just to please a small group of radical homosexuals. u win their votes but lose a bigger pie.

 

[KoalaJack]

this gay shit thing...worse than communism, worse than nazism...and defintitely worse than Satanism....

 

[BuiKia]

They can fuck each other's ass all day but please do not force others to accept them as norm. They are not normal!

this gay shit thing...worse than communism, worse than nazism...and defintitely worse than Satanism....