The CPF Mystery that has befuddled the Nation

[topspin]

hahaha....it is not that there is no logical explanation.....anyboby with half a brain will know that in the financial world, u don't make money by telling the whole world what you have done and plan to do...
i do not see the need to elaborate as you never change your position despite overwhelming evidence....
you are basically a bapok and stubborn empty vessel..

That sums up ms bapok. She didnt go for her papsmear yet.

 

[Sinkie]

Laughable...why should a service provider tell you how much money theyre making from you.

I might as well ask nike, singtel, louis vuitton etc to publish how much they actually make their products for.

Some businesses markup their goods by anywher from 300 to 1000 percent.

Consumers only need to worry about what price they pay.

And choose.

In this case of course, no choice....so the anger is understandable.

More ignoramus rubbish........Do you know your Financial Planner MUST disclose to you the profit margins and commission he or she is getting when a plan is signed up by you? Do you know the law?

 

[enterprise2]

The short answer is that I doubt if the PAP themselves know what is the actual return. You can calculate the actual returns, but its very time consuming.

First, you would have to track all the CPF money that was sold as SSGS to MAS. Than you would have to see how MAS apportioned the money among the 3 of them (MAS/Temasek/GIC). For example, if $100 billion was sold to MAS as SSGS for a certain year, did MAS park 20% with itself, than 40% with Temasek, and the remaining 40% with GIC? So you have to work this out first, and every year, they have a different apportionment %. I do not believe that it is fixed. I have to believe that the breakdown is at least 50% for GIC because they are the far larger fund. This complicated by the fact that CPF funds is not sold to MAS as SSGS once a year, but instead perhaps monthly or several times a year. So, you would have to trace it like a dye and follow it as it goes through the system.

Once you have this apportionment breakdown, than you have to see what each of the agency did with their money. Using the above example, lets say that MAS bought bonds at 5% with their $20 billion (20%). Temasek maybe parked their $40 billion into a short term instrument and than used it with other funds to buy a company. So Temasek's share is now blended with funds from other investment to buy the company. And lets remember they buy lots of companies a year. Once Temasek sells the company and puts the funds pack into a short term instrument, you can than tell what rate of return CPF's $40 billion with Temasek got. You do the same for the GIC's $40 billion, although they are not as active in the company buying business.

At the end of the day, you take a weighted average of all these returns to arrive at the overall return from the $100 billion CPF money for that year. E.G. MAS's $20 billion made $100 million in interest, CPF's $40 billion earned $200 million (pro-rated) after the company it was used to buy was sold for profit, and similarly GIC's $40 billion earned $300 million. And lets say all of this happened within one calendar year. Than simplistically speaking, the rate of return for 1 year on CPF's $100 billion would be $600 million or 0.6% return. this is just an example. In the years that Temasek and GIC lose money, it will be a negative return.

In my mind, this is the only way i would use to accurately calculate the returns, Unless someone on this forum is a financial investment guru, they can come up with a more efficient way of doing so. I welcome other ideas on it too. Good thread, and in my opinion, these are some of the questions that WP should have been asking in Parliament.

Great!! It's got so BIG and complicated that even the Pappies don't know!!!

 

[winnipegjets]

If u buy an iphone try asking apple how much it actually costs them to make it. .

You don't know the component cost of an iphone? It is common knowledge. We know the cost of the Samsung as well.

Why the secrecy over the reserves? Norway releases the info. Many countries provide the info. A peesai country have to hide that info ...why?

 

[JHolmesJr]

More ignoramus rubbish........Do you know your Financial Planner MUST disclose to you the profit margins and commission he or she is getting when a plan is signed up by you? Do you know the law?

I think youre upset because you know im right.

You see cpf as your personal financial planner that must tell you everything and impress you to keep your business. Wrong.

Cpf is a legal obligation of every citizen and pr....they are obliged to give you the interest rate they publish...not tell you how they achieve it.

 

[winnipegjets]

Great!! It's got so BIG and complicated that even the Pappies don't know!!!

But the people who are benefitting personally from our money know how much their bank accounts have grown. That's all that matters.

 

[JHolmesJr]

You don't know the component cost of an iphone? It is common knowledge. We know the cost of the Samsung as well.

Why the secrecy over the reserves? Norway releases the info. Many countries provide the info. A peesai country have to hide that info ...why?

What about rolex submariner?

 

[winnipegjets]

I think youre upset because you know im right.

Spoken just like a PAPpy!

You see cpf as your personal financial planner that must tell you everything and impress you to keep your business. Wrong.

It is our money. We want to know because we know we have been fleeced. Our money, kept by the government purportedly for benefit, is eroded by inflation because of the low return.

Cpf is a legal obligation of every citizen and pr....they are obliged to give you the interest rate they publish...not tell you how they achieve it.

This is daylight robbery. When the market returns 20-30 percent, we get a miserly 2.5 percent.
A huge sovereign fund can easily beat the market, even an ETF can match the market. So, there is NO justification for paying such ridiculous returns on our savings.

 

[kukubird58]

This is daylight robbery. When the market returns 20-30 percent, we get a miserly 2.5 percent.
A huge sovereign fund can easily beat the market, even an ETF can match the market..

hahaha...jokes and politics aside...
pse tell us where can get 20-30% guaranteed returns for investments....
we are very very interested....

 

[Papsmearer]

hahaha...jokes and politics aside...
pse tell us where can get 20-30% guaranteed returns for investments....
we are very very interested....

Temasek already claims over 17%, look it up. And GIC does not reveal its returns, but their losses are definitely less than Temasek. So, if Temasek is getting 17%, its not beyond the PAP to claim GIC is getting over 20% due to lower loss rate. hence the averaging out of the returns can be in the low 20%s, which is within the realm of winipegjets 20-30%. Get it or not, stupid.

 

[kukubird58]

Temasek already claims over 17%, look it up. And GIC does not reveal its returns, but their losses are definitely less than Temasek. So, if Temasek is getting 17%, its not beyond the PAP to claim GIC is getting over 20% due to lower loss rate. hence the averaging out of the returns can be in the low 20%s, which is within the realm of winipegjets 20-30%. Get it or not, stupid.

hahaha....double confirmed empty vessel.....
why everytime kpkb for the sake of kpkb...
just provide the name of the funds that one can invest to get GUARANTEED 20 -30% returns per year...period.

you also have one of the thickest hide on planet earth....make all the wild allegations and still so howlian about it...
pse note we are still waiting for your inside info on the names of lky mistress and illegitimate son.

 

[Unrepented]

................

It often ended up costing even more as 3 highly paid techs were required to perform calibration and preventive maintenance of the automated machine on a regular basis.

Automation brings about savings only because the yields and quality levels are usually a lot better as human error is eliminated. Machines are a lot more consistent provided they're well maintained and calibrated.

.............so which one cost more...........

 

[Papsmearer]

I thought the more pertinent question is where is the difference disappearing to. Is it with GIC/Temasek? Or does it flow back to MOF? Or does it, as Roy suggest, flow to ...

it does not flow back to MOF. It remains with the 3 agencies MAS, temasek and GIC. Other than MAS, the CPF money allocated to Temasek and GIC are largely illiquid. If MOF requires money from Temasek or GIC, these agencies would have to liquidate their holdings in one or more of the companies they own. This is not an ideal situation as it may result in a loss on the investment. In any case, They do not usually have a large cash position. I would think their cash position is no more than 5% of their funds under management. If MOF needs money, it directs the govt. to issue bonds for sale to the public or to institutional investors. There was one instance that I recall where the money flowed back to MOF and that was during the subprime crisis when the President signed for the funds to be release. These funds transferred to MAS, Temasek and GIC form part of the national reserves which the President is supposed to have oversight over. So, therefore, it does not flow back to MOF.

The real question is as Roy alluded to, where are the checks and balances to really safeguard this money.

I present to you this scenario:

The PAP has lost the elections, and the new party coming in is in a vengeful mood and will be looking to prosecute and investigate as many Lees and kwas as they can for corruption, conflict of interest, etc. Before the changeover takes place, Whore Jinx directs the CFO of Temasek to transfer whatever they have in cash and short term securities to an offshore account held by a nominee company owned by her. Then she sells whatever companies owned by Temasek in the allowable time frame and also transfer the proceeds of sales to this offshore account. Long time chairman and PAP lackey Dhanablan signs of on this. How can this be done? Well, it turns out that Temasek Holdings is just a regular limited liability company, and as such the CEO and CFO can order funds to be transferred any where they like. It happens all the time. Temasek has only one shareholder, and that is MOF. But by the time MOF finds, out, the funds are long gone and Whore Jinx is in a country with no extradition treaty. Uncle in Law Tony Tan can run interference in this little theft and delay or hinder any measures to prevent this by sole virtue that he is ultimate the arbiter of the funds in his role as President. As well, Gay Loong's cousin Kwa Chong Seng is deputy chairman and director of temasek, as well I think another temasek director kua Hong Bak is also a nephew. So, my question is : how do you overcome this kind of scenario? basically, as I see it temasek money is their get away funds.

 

[Papsmearer]

hahaha....double confirmed empty vessel.....
why everytime kpkb for the sake of kpkb...
just provide the name of the funds that one can invest to get GUARANTEED 20 -30% returns per year...period.

you also have one of the thickest hide on planet earth....make all the wild allegations and still so howlian about it...
pse note we are still waiting for your inside info on the names of lky mistress and illegitimate son.

Please note, we are still waiting for you to stop raping your grandson's asshole. has this happened yet?

 

[virus]

the kid got hole meh?

 

[kukubird58]

Please note, we are still waiting for you to stop raping your grandson's asshole. has this happened yet?

hahaha....u are really the worst kind of animals on planet earth.....
u made some wild allegations.....
when confronted u made even wilder allegations.....
and you are so proud of your behaviour.......what type of animals behave like that???

ok for the sake of everyone on planet earth who is waiting to celebrate..... i have stopped raping my grandson's asshole....
now can you tell us the inside info what is the name of lky mistress and illegitimate son.

 

[virus]

got rape meh? ...

 

[kukubird58]

hahaha...look at what papsmearer posted:

Originally Posted by papsmearer

Sigh..............I have to explain everything again. That is not his "personal friend". That is his half brother that he went to Taiwan to see. Back in the 70s and 60s, Old Goat LKY had a mistress in Taiwan. The Mistress was handpicked for him by Chiang Ching Kuo. He was always travelling to Taiwan in those days, usually without Gecko. Gecko allowed him to have the mistress on the condition it was not in singapore. The half brother is almost Gay Loong's age, and people who have met him say he even looks like Gay Loong. I believe that all this was revealed to Gay Loong when he became PM, and his father ask him to go and see the brother. Can you imagine that Gay Loong would risk such a serious political implication if it was not a significant event. I guess going to meet your half brother for the first time is a significant event and worth the risk to him. You really think Gay Loong went all the way to Taiwan to fuck a pussy or fuck a gay? Please. Singapore got plenty of whores of both male and female persuasion, go all the way there to fuck them? Makes no sense right? My story is the right one. I am related to a very reliable source who knows this.

nobody maligned him....he claimed to be related to a very reliable source....
now he backed down and made even wilder allegations when confronted with this....
this is the type of idiot whose only credential is papee smearing.....
i also notice that he picked on "perceived" weaklings or cyber bully...

 

[winnipegjets]

hahaha...jokes and politics aside...
pse tell us where can get 20-30% guaranteed returns for investments....
we are very very interested....

If you had invested $1 million with David Tepper 20 years ago, your investment would now be worth $149 million years ago.

 

[dr.wailing]

The Govt needs to disclose the historical returns in order to ensure that CPF account holders are actually getting the bulk of the returns and that wanton profiteering is not happening.

And why the secrecy on the actual returns.

You have raised some good points here.

If you don't mind me asking, how you would turn what you have discussed into rallying points for opposition candidates?