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Slot games, Casino Rewards & Privileges

On 6 March aurvandil replied to Kia's post :

---Quote---
I don't think they are allow to do so!
---End Quote---

Previously, I had provided some links to documents issued by CRA on the conduct
of slots and other casino games.

The part on the minimum payout is worded rather carefully that the 90% is for
the lifetime of the machine.

There is nothing in the CRA documents about changing the odds at different times
or that slot machines must have fixed odds that cannot change.

Hence under the current regulations, it is perfectly legal to have a slot pay
95% during off peak hours and 93% during peak hours.

With regard to the patents filed by IGT and other slot makers, the key part in
many of the patents is the keeping of records of the odds/payouts for audit
purposes.
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Here is the message that has just been posted by aurvandil :
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---Quote (Originally by jjcc88)---
2. How many credits best to whack at each different game or machine ?
Rough guide pls
---End Quote---

The following might be useful. Based on what you have written, you are playing
"high variance" slots. If you want to stretch your gaming experience,
you should play "low variance" slots.

"Low variance" slots refer to games where the gap between 3/4 of a
kind to 5 of a kind is small. An average gap of 3 to 5 in the payout table
would give you a low variance slot.

"High variance" slots refer to games where the gap between 3/4 of a
kind to 5 of a kind is large. An average gap of more than 10 would be a high
variance slot.

In general, slots with progressive jackpots have a higher variance than an
equivalent slot wihout a progessive jackpot (e.g. Kia's 5Koi that is not linked
to the progessive jackpot).

On the expected return, CRA mandates a minimum of 90%. No casino in the world
however programs slots with such a poor return. This is because the loss would
be so fast and devastating, no one would ever come back to play.

In general, 93% to 97% is the most common expected return for slots in order for
them to be commercially viable. Given all the slots are now linked via wireless
network, it is quite easy to have an application to vary the return at
different times. Since these are well above 90%, there is no running afoul of
CRA regulations.

The casinos vigorously deny doing this and say that this is a conspriacy theory.
However examing the patents filed by big slots makers like IGT reveals that
they have patented technologies that do just this. If the casinos were not
buying and deploying this capability, why would they be doing so much work and
patenting this?

Good advice therefore is to avoid crowded periods like CNY where almost everyone
seems to have lost $$$.


---Quote---
http://www.slotjunkies.net/online-slots/variance.php

For the uninitiated, the word "variance" in this context equates to
the word "risk", or put simply, a low variance slot machine is
basically a "low risk" slot machine. The risk element however does
not affect the expected payout. Most of the video slots featured here at
SlotJunkies have an expected return between 93% and 97% and whether they are
"low variance" or "high variance" doesn't affect that one
bit. What the slots variance does affect is how the slot game pays you and this
has a knock-on effect which should dictate how much you bet on a spin, how
large a bankroll you need and how soon you are likely to run out of money! It
helps to have a good slot strategy in place before you play!

In simple terms, a low variance slot will pay you a combination of half decent
and "token gesture" wins more often, while a high variance slot will
give you mainly token gesture wins and very occassionally a monster! There is
of course some middle ground. How do you tell if a slot is low, medium or high
variance? Well, the only way is to play - or use this site - and while the
paytable can sometimes give you some clues, it's not a decisive indicator. Most
casino software providers don't publish the variance rating of their online
slots either, which is a shame. IGT slots are the exception to the rule and
from their data we can see that most of their slot games fall between 93% and
96%.

If you look at the paytable of most online video slots you often get a hint at
the variance. If you see, for example, that 3 or 4 of a kind pays out
relatively low, while 5 of a kind seems to be a lot more (perhaps 10 times more
than 4 of a kind), the chances are you are looking a high variance slot. If the
gap between 3, 4 and 5 of a kind tends to be in 3-5x range of it's lower paying
cousin, then you're possibly leaning more toward a lower/medium variance. But
this is not decisive - a lot depends on how many symbols there are on a reel,
whether there is a jackpot on the slot or how many paylines the slot has.

Having played the majority of online slots, I have added a rough indicator of
the slot variance for every game to Slot Junkies [.net]. It's not a bible, but
it does give a pretty good indicator. Once you have got a feel for the variance
of a given game, the most important thing is that you balance your betsize
accordingly. A failure to do this could mean that you run out of money before
you hit a decent win. Players that don't understand this concept are more
likely to feel that a slot game is rigged, whereas none of the casinos using
the top software and listed here at Slot Junkies have the ability, or facility,
to rig games. Every slot has it's bad streaks and variance plays a decisive
role.
---End Quote---

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Here is the message that has just been posted by Kia0042 :
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---Quote (Originally by jjcc88)---
BTW - Kia & other slot "old-hands" here

1. Izzit much much better to go down to the casinos on WEEKNIGHTS rather than
during the Weekends (Fri - Sun) ???
Maybe? Coz many people "donated" during the weekend. :rolleyes:
Personally, I don't think there is any difference
;).

For one, less crowds means more chance at the machines we want to play ?
Does it ALSO mean Better Luck/Wins/etc ????
Slot are random, no matter more/less crowds, do you agree after all these months of playing at the 2IRs? I am still asking this question to myself too. :o

2. How many credits best to whack at each different game or machine ?
Rough guide pls -
Aristrocat machines - Since I only familiar with Aristrocat.
My personal view - MBS slots are more "meant for" 25-30 credits small
time players (2,5,10cts).


3. Do the casinos 'moderate' the slots such that at Certain Timings/Days much
less chances of Good Payouts etc ??
I don't think they are allow to do so!

4. WHEN or WHICH TIMING is better - on average ???
Personally, me thinking that there is no certain good / bad timing, but most will think after weekend/PH has better chance coz many people "donated" liao. ;)

I was thinking - IF go after work during the work week
- if less crowds means more chances at our fav machines
- shoud then be able to utilise our limited capital at those preferred slots
rather than wasting $ at some other 'available slots while waiting to see
whether the fav ones will become free later'
- AND because it's a working week we MUST leave the casino LATEST around 2-3 am
timing or so if we don't want to be a zombie the next day
so that FORCES Out or prevents 9-10-hour long visits

Maybe I should monitor and see how .....
only thing is MOST if not all of my visits (whether weekend or non-weekend) just
end up with Sheer Losses only .... sighzzzz :o :(

EDIT : OK - I realise some questions are just too stupid ....
After all, in casinos we're talking gambling and LUCK for slots especially
Guess if we are not lucky it's just that ... no wins only losses etc etc etc You
are absolutely right, if u r lucky on that day, no matter which machine you
play oso can will, even table games.

For me I realise it's more a case of :
STOP - No more/further play .....
---End Quote---

Imagine lost 2-3k per trip till I hit 14k JP on 4 Mar, it was a 3 consecutive
weeks losses at MBS for me(rws levy expired mid feb), you have no idea how
"jia lat" it was :(.
I consider to renew my RWS levy soon coz I really have no luck at MBS even with
my favourite standalone 5koi. :(
I think I have better luck at RWS coz I feel more comfortable at RWS. At MBS, I
always have a feeling that a "GIANT EYE" is WATCHING at me!
:.
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Last edited:
1 day before I won the 14k JP, I told myself that I must stop betting 300credits(2cts) at MBS and should keep it at 150credits(2cts) and 60credits(5cts) or below. Since then, I managed to minimize my lost, gain longer play time and also able to win $500-$1000 during my last few trips.
No more 300 credits bet at MBS unless the machine is at it's super good timing mode. ;)
Aristocrat games are still my favorites, USA made slots like Platinum JP, Diamonds & Roses, Goldfish, Rescue spin just can't make me stay long with them. And those Atronic slots at MBS, they have been long forgotten by me.

I know what you mean here

I'm the IMPATIENT type so I tend to want to 'hurry' the payouts/free games etc by playing 125/150 credits (in order to get a better Multiplier Effect with the free games)
BUT on certain days there's really NO POINT doing this as those Free Games just REFUSE to come and we're just simply WASTING the credits

Nowadays I try to go for 50/60 credits so that there's at least a 2x multiplier there (With 25/30 credits there's no multiplier effect BUT I've noticed that on certain days/certain machines will only give MORE Frequent Free Games when playing 30 credits compared to playing the higher 60 or 150 credits !)

AND I might even switch to 2 credits but on 15 lines instead of the usual 25 playing 30 credits (as then only the Final Line '2 blocks' are blocked out)
(but also occasionally can 'regret' if it turns out FIVE full fishes/coins/dragons/'A's/ etc so miss out on the FULL Higher Payout there)

Eg for the High Limit 10c Shen Long Dragon slots
I now play 30 credits rather than 50 credits AND STILL am able on lucky days to get some good spins/returns from that
Of course no way have I obtained the very high returns that you Kia has gotten, but I'm happy if I can grow my $50-100 note 2x-4x there !
 
Hmmm ... wonder if that good trend will continue if I go to RWS instead
Should I go RWS this evening and/or maybe after my Spa appointment this Fri PM ?

Jialat - spoke too soon (pantang ?)
I lost all yesterday's "saved capital" plus another 1k withdrawn tonight
Simply a Bad Night especially at the 1st Half

Maybe I shouldn't have :
- gone to mBS tonight but to RWS instead
- made that bad decision to start play at the L1 Fafafa slot
- stuck myself to that lousy machine for so long (being my usual stubborn self etc )

The 1st Half tonight was just terrible
Play what lose what etc until all capital gone :mad: :(

Later on with the fresh 1k, things were slightly better but at the end I also played until all capital/winnings were eroded away :o
eg went back to that same Classic Winners slot, got a $200 win etc and grew my $100 into $300++ BUT instead of stopping play I continued until everything was lost before willing to shift from my seat and calling it a night !!!

Didn't know it was raining heavily tonight sighsssss ....

Also confirmed this finding :
Must NOT wear this particular blue top for the casino as I noticed Sheer/Bad Losses whenever I wear it :eek:

Think I'll take a break on Fri (not a 'lucky day for games of chance/gambling')
Most probably might go on Sat-Sun and next Wed mid-week ??
 
Thanks jjcc88 for retrieving the previous posts.

The MBS slots seems quite "friendly" to me recently, I'm fine with lower bet at MBS now. The "jialat" experience for the month of Feb was a very good lesson to me. I have now "adjusted" myself to lower bet at MBS. ;)
 
Hey - what happened to bro blackhole's Sat posts ???
Did u delete them ?

Anyway after the disastrous Thurs losses I stayed away until Sun when I met my friend for tea Sun afternoon
She returned me cash for the LV handbag charm I'd paid on her behalf with my credit card during our Feb CNY trip
So using that as well as what was in my wallet - very very modest capital of just $750 (didn't want to draw from ATM as balances really horrifyingly low :o) for just what I thought would be a very brief slot session tonight (after watching the 8 pm Wonder Full display - don't really like it as such shows shouldn't have 'subliminal messages' there I feel with the images and the water-waves were simply too 'monotonous' etc :rolleyes::confused:

Surprisingly tonight turned out to be a Good Session - tho' NOT a short one as intended !!!
Had I stopped after playing the 2 slots I would have retained ALL of my grown $750 profit - exchanged out $1.5k
Had a good session at 1 CashTrain Express Fortune King slot (NOT my usual favs) and then at my fav Diamonds & Roses progressive slot
But ITCHY Me instead of going straight up the escalator to catch a cab home before mid-nite, had to DETOUR and go back to the CashTrain Area where I played 4 other Fortune King slots there and ended up losing like $400 of my $750 profits before 3 am !!!! :( :o

BTW - when it came to my turn at the taxi-queue - unfortunately got a pricey Limo Cab tonight
Wow - instead of my usual $18 average fare with the midnite charges, tonight's cab must be the most expensive to-date at $30.30 (he waived off the 30cts). THey start off at $5 rather than $3 etc
Next time this happens, I must 'siam' and go for the regular-priced cabs :o :p
Of course when you compare to my losses, this is really nothing BUT ....... :rolleyes:

The next 'good gambling day for me' is supposedly Wed
Now should I go to RWS instead of MBS then ????
MBS is much more convenient for me tho'

BTW was exploring one of the gift shops at MBS
Saw this compass stuck to some stationary pad
Was thinking of buying it - then decided to check its 'accuracy' with 2nd compass and one was 'off'
Decided against buying it after that
Think better buy a pure accurate compass from somewhere else :eek:

Well tonight I had the discipline to play with much lowered capital
But NOT the discipline to stop and have a SHORT Session .... sighsssss

I hope I"ll be able to preserve my profits/capital for a much much longer timeframe as then no need to have to draw from the ATMs

I also went to MBS LiveWire to claim my BigSweep 3D prize (from the $10 Million Toto Ang Pow pack) and SURPRISE SURPRISE
Instead of the $30 I was expecting, I got $60 because '147' came out Twice
Well I bought System 7 Toto and April Big Sweep - hope I strike something BIG this time round ! :D;)
 
Hi JJcc and BroKia and all brothers and sisters here, Golden Dragon and Silverfox,

Yah lor, something happpened and my posts were gone! Something not right here lah. Anyway, I've stopped going to the casinos for quite some time. Went with friends to US and stole a look at the RWS casino. Played the Aliens Vs Gladiators.Not bad. Won $400 ! Capital $100.Levy $100. Left the casino quite happy.Did not lose this time. Lost quite a lot at MBS last year.So keeping a very low profile....

Thanks for the FR on the slots. I've come to the conclusion: play slots, win MUST RUN! stay longer, all the winnings plus capital surely gone. so please be very careful with these " one arm monsters" - they simply gobble all your money! one auntie told me at RWS, she had just lost $4K on slots alone!!! one single morning! she must be playing maximum! Another uncle told me he won $3K playing maximum Aliens Vs Gladiators! I don't know how much he had lost. But in the long run, the Game Of Large Numbers will eat up all our winnings. So do play with great restraint and caution.

Good Luck to your TOTO DRAW and to all your slots too!!!
 
Pretty good game time I had last evening, no big win thought but had a great time playing Fortune King, 5 Dragon, 5Koi and also Fortune Foo which I started to pay a little attention to it recently.
Able to win about $500-600 after playing 4hours, last minute before leaving, hit the Prosperity JP2 1.9k, that made my total win to 2.4k. Call it a night. :p
 
Pretty good game time I had last evening, no big win thought but had a great time playing Fortune King, 5 Dragon, 5Koi and also Fortune Foo which I started to pay a little attention to it recently.
Able to win about $500-600 after playing 4hours, last minute before leaving, hit the Prosperity JP2 1.9k, that made my total win to 2.4k. Call it a night. :p

Congrats Bro Kia!!! Take it easy okay. I hope more big JPs will come your way.I'm still in the dumps.Dare not play too much and too long. Still feeling the pain of the previous losses.
 
Thanks kia - the links work now :)

I'm the previous jjcc88 now jjcc888 hahaha .... couldn't register old nick somehow

Kia - have you signed for fresh annual levy at RWS - or still only doing MBS now ???

My last RWS trip last mid-week was the usual disaster-loss :mad:
My Monday trip to MBS was good .... will be going again to MBS tonight :p
 
I have not renew my RWS levy. After all these weeks of playing at MBS, kinda " get used to it". I have no intention to renew RWS levy in short future coz they treat me like "grass" even I have earned 50,000GP in a year.:mad: I have not receive any news from them about my upgrading of card status.
For the month of March, I have been doing pretty well at MBS except last week I tried to bet higher (300-600credits) and the result is - Burnt & Lost Fast. :( So now I keep to 150credits play at MBS.
I have earned lots of Premier Dollars winthin this 2 months and redeemed for suite stays last Feb, Mar and coming April. Redeemed a bottle of PD1k red wine at Imperial Tresure. PD doesn't "grow" if exceed PD20k, spend it or waste it !;)
 
I might be joining MBS after my current RWS levy ends as it seems they have better benefits judging from Kia experience.

Btw, is it true u buy in 100k chips at MBS and they will auto give u dunno what membership and from then on u can enjoy free parking? After get membership, just change back the 100k to cash.
 
I think it is Paiza card, I am not sure 100k can "buy" the card, really??:confused: You need to maintain a certain game points every month in order to keep our Paiza card. They can downgrade you anytime if you cannot meet their requirement.

I was invited to become a Paiza gold member, Gold level is the lowest end within the Paiza card, there are Paiza Platinum & Paiza Diamond.

Oh yes btw, I also received a total of $2,000 (eqv to 1 yr levy) food voucher on this promotion month - March. Earn 500 points and get $500 food voucher each week.

Free parking for Diamond & Paiza card members and in additional, Paiza has reserved lots at B4, valet parking for Paiza members at casino and hotel are also free.

MBS gives loads of benefits but seldom let me WIN from their games. :(
RWS never give me any but let me WIN most of the time. :o
 
Hi Kia and JJcc,

So nice to hear from both of you. Happy to know that Kia is doing well in MBS. And JJcc is getting more cautious and playing smart keeping the winnings and prevent losses.

I had a short fling after my lunch at MBS. Played the 5 cent Panda at B1. Not bad.Hit several features and also the Big Panda appeared twice. I walked away with a credit of $500. Not bad for a cautious start.

I think the Quick Hits have stopped paying. I have also stopped playing. ChoySanYah is still not too bad. The bank buster also not too bad. The white tooth tiger is also not bad.

Overall after three hours of play...played 30 and 50 credits only...won a bit and left a very cautious player now.

Wishing all of you good luck and big big JPs!!!

Good Luck to all and hope you all strike big big.
 
Ya I am playing with reduced capital most days now
From 2k or/& above to just 1k - 1.5k level nowadays
This also forces the stay to be 'shortened in a sense' as less $$ to turnover
(ie. if not withdrawing more from the ATM - keep telling myself NOT to do this BUT .... :( )


Anyway this week so far at MBS :

- Mon was good ie. postive

- Wed was lousy - lost half my playing capital

- Tonight Thurs was good again as I managed to recoup my Wed's lost capital - had I stopped my slot play earlier would ALSO have retained some extra $300 odd profits
Had a very good initial run at my fav CashTrain Fortune King slot - nice double retriggers etc - made some $800++ with just 3 x $50 notes
Made a little at WOF (Wheel of Fortune) tonight
Kia's standalone 5Koi also behaved itself well tonight for the earlier stretch of the night but not the latter part !!!)
Also played briefly the B1 Panda (haven't touched it since like last year !) but not so fun/good-paying as previously :confused:
I had a fun lucrative time playing just 30 credits at the 2 10cts Shen Long slots at the High Limit Area which were pretty responsive tonight (didn't bother with the nearby QuickHits since so hard to be positive playing those)

- I guess I'll be at MBS on my FRI PM OFF again as very last day on Sat to claim their Gift Voucher for this week's points (didn't bother to claim an earlier $15 one since value was so small)
Also have until end-March for their 'Club' Promo - in April

Think will make 2nd RWS visit for month of March during the weekend
Need to play minimal 25 points TWICE a month - in order to get the Annual Passes for Universal Studio etc (wonder whether it's worth it)
If only I could get some DECENT WINS from RWS
The lucky break-out at RWS didn't last at all - seems like rotten play most times (losses)

Next Mon - will take PM Leave with a couple of secretaries for MBS
(Thought might as well since Mon is supposedly an auspicious day of sorts for me too (hopefully it includes gambling and not just romance etc) & just using my CNY 4 Feb Fri P.Hol 'half-day credit-back' - since now no more 'Cheaper/Offer Rooms' from MBS will see whether the secretaries are keen to go to the SkyPark for free with the 2 complimentary passes available to Diamond Members' guests etc (after the D&D in Jan it was not possible for a SkyPark visit as it was already closed and some secretaries were hoping to do that at my future 'free' MBS Stay (unfortunately that is a thing of the past as now no more such benefits :mad: ..... remember the driving point for my paying the 2k levy for MBS and earning/playing HARD for Membership Upgrade was to be able to enjoy the FREE ROOM Benefits (or at least Offer-Rate Rooms) !!!!!! %%&#@$**** Felt so played out now :mad::( )

Kia - I DON'T have 20k PD like you as I'm NO high-roller player
My PD balance is only a fifth of yours at just above 4k
I don't think I'll ever get that invitation for Paiza Gold (me just small-time slot junkie BUT with heavy losses at this terribly expensive blood-sucking hobby sighzzzzz)

BTW - I left MBS before 2am tonight (Wed I left just after 3am !!!!)
Now IF ONLY I can stop my slot play by 10 - 10.30pm, then don't need to pay the mid-nite cab charges. Find the express bus already too crowded by the time it arrives at the MBS Bus Stop - so not a very comfortable option as the air-con is way too cold too !
 
Last night saw a lady won 50k jackpot at mbs cashtrain 2cent. Woow i wonder how it feel :) but the lady don't seems that high ley.. Btw, could it be u jjcc888?:)
 
I was at the cashexpress area too but I didn't notice someone won the JP, ha.
Althought I 've won the Prosperity JP2 (1.7k), still I didn't make any profit home, nevertheless, I had a fun time last evening, lost a few hundred dollars for 6-7hours play .;)
 
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