Singapore is worse than a prostitute...

[char_jig_kar]

Its like everyone is good in water sport in a remote tropical island.

And then one day one smart aleck charismatic politician say, 'Hey. Ice skating IS THE SPORT. Let me tell u why.' And he go on and on and with his good public speaking skill, and communication skill, he succeeded in convincing majority of the people of the island to go for ice skating instead of water sport.

But the problem is, the tropical island don't have the resource for ice skating. Don't have facility, natural environment, talent on ice skating, or money to hire ice skating coach from other countries. After decades, the people there don't do ice skating well, and also, they had lose their water sport skill too. End up, they are not good in water sport nor in ice skating.

Sounds familiar?

 

[Shi Jin]

Please refer to the Jamaica national bobsled team that debuted at the 1988 Winter Olympics in Calgary, Alberta.

 

[char_jig_kar]

but we are no jamican. we are sinkie.

after decades of english as first language policy, most of us still have poor spoken english.

 

[lsalsa]

char_jig_kar so funny. When I read all thru the post. It seems the topic is going now where. No point dwelling onto it. It isn't going to change singapore anyways. Too many political issue in Singapore where the truth might not reveal itself as all the works are from government insider trading tips and secret or whatever-the-reason may be. But from what I see for all the singaporean that must know is for the long term or in the future is to see what will seems bleak or for the greater good.

Singapore is still small with no natural resource. There will be a day it might be hard for Singapore to scale to greater heights. But since it is Singapore 43rd Birthday and am very glad that Singapore have made this far but... not really really far enough to succeed all over the world if singapore kept saying want to be global and reach global heights. What is the point of that?

Singapore should think of taking care of the people first before thinking ahead. Look at how it took singapore so long to lift casino ban. Now finally it made it to Singapore shores. But I am not very sure what happen next. I am no political or economic expert yet.

There are alot of Singapore case study to review on how to make Singapore a better place. But anyway Singapore kept changing which might be a good thing but it might take a longer journey than what it is today.

Because Brazil, India, China are catching up. There are alot of things we need to know more before making a statement, wild accusation, debate, rant, ramble, question or whatever there is happening around.

With the world of internet at our fingertips. We should find out more before thinking what to say next. But believe me not all media are accurate. Most of them hide the truth and distort facts. there are things happening around the world that sells news & info for money to stay ahead.

 

[char_jig_kar]

i don't know why its so difficult to show sporean this absurdity of over emphasis on english. and the not quite right in selling out one's language.

put it this way. in a big family of hokkien. the family is strong in hokkien. everyone speak good hokkien. and they speak hokkien with each other in the family.

one day. a man knock on the door. and say, i give u people, every family member S$10,000. even for kids. now, all of u stop speaking hokkien. start speaking english.

and the family gladly oblige. tell me what is wrong with the picture? anything wrong with it if the family give up hokkien language, and speak to one another in english because of the money?

i think i have more to add to this thread. i am not done yet. akan datang.

 

[char_jig_kar]

kid: but but... what about grandpa? can we speak hokkien to him? he's old and he doesn't know any english...

the man: ***k grandpa. grandpa must give up hokkien too. he must communicate in english too. remember, 10K for each of u!

kid: er.....YES! with 10k i can buy PS3, Xbox, PSP, every fucking console! YIPPE! WOOOOT!!!

mom: ah boy ah, how many times must i tell u not to scold bad words (use vulgar language)??!! wait then u know!

kid: (whine...) but mom! uncle just now also say ***k...

mom: (furious!) AH BOY!!!

 

[Ramseth]

The Hokkien dialect of the Singapore branch harbours the most comprehensive vocabulary of vulgars words and incomprehensible twists in grammar that I've ever heard. It's the chief contaminant of English and Malay resulting in the vulgar and ungrammatic Singlish. Good riddance if it's gone, unless Singaporeans start to speak Hokkien like Taiwanese or Fujianese.

 

[zack123]

kid: but but... what about grandpa? can we speak hokkien to him? he's old and he doesn't know any english...

the man: ***k grandpa. grandpa must give up hokkien too. he must communicate in english too. remember, 10K for each of u!

kid: er.....YES! with 10k i can buy PS3, Xbox, PSP, every fucking console! YIPPE! WOOOOT!!!

mom: ah boy ah, how many times must i tell u not to scold bad words (use vulgar language)??!! wait then u know!

kid: (whine...) but mom! uncle just now also say ***k...

mom: (furious!) AH BOY!!!

This one from what show? Haven't seen it before.

 

[char_jig_kar]

Listen.

If we read English, listen to English, day in day out, 99 percent of our life, we will be heavily influence by English media isn't it?

From the exposure to English media, such as books, movies, magazines, etc etc, day in day out, we will be heavily influence by the Western way of thoughts, Western way of life isn't it?

So if we stressed too much on English language, we are in fact transforming our way of life from Asian way of life to Western way of life, am i right?

So the question is: our way of life, our belief system, our culture, tradition, our values, are they FOR SALE? Do we give up our Asian way of life, belief system, culture, tradition, and values, for the sake of globlization?

For the sake of globalization, for the sake of some economic edge, is it justifiable to ditch one's language, culture and tradition, values and belief system?

If our language, culture, tradition, our belief system and values are for sale, isn't it we are worse than a prostitute? Isn't it worse than a prostitute who sell her body?

 

[lsalsa]

Listen.
So if we stressed too much on English language, we are in fact transforming our way of life from Asian way of life to Western way of life, am i right?

The main point is does everyone are comfortable speaking English up to this day since Singapore went independent. That is the reason we need to debate on not talk the other way around and since all the topic post is all about how, what , where everything behind the reason about Singapore roots. Isn't it so?

I really wonder why do everyone keep going on. Does it helps matters? Will our Singapore PM be reading the forums news. I guess not as he is too busy with his world affair of the heart.

Oh well, I am at a loss for words....

 

[char_jig_kar]

The main point is does everyone are comfortable speaking English up to this day since Singapore went independent. That is the reason we need to debate on not talk the other way around and since all the topic post is all about how, what , where everything behind the reason about Singapore roots. Isn't it so?

I really wonder why do everyone keep going on. Does it helps matters? Will our Singapore PM be reading the forums news. I guess not as he is too busy with his world affair of the heart.

Oh well, I am at a loss for words....

Nowadays, everywhere we go people speak Singlish/ English. People must be pretty comfortable with the language. But thats beside the point.

The point I wanna make is this: we all speak Singlish/ English most of time, to one another, to our kids, to our friends and love one even though we are Asian, isn't that sell out to our Asian languages? And when we sell out to our Asian languages, isn't that a sell out to our Asian way of life, Asian values and belief system as well? Isn't that worse than a prostitute? A prostitute sell her body. Thats all. But we go further than a prostitute. We sell our language, culture, values and belief system.

 

[lsalsa]

Isn't that worse than a prostitute? A prostitute sell her body. Thats all. But we go further than a prostitute. We sell our language, culture, values and belief system.

Yeah I get what you are getting into. That I understand what the topic is about. But do all the people here in this forums "REALLY" agree that we sell our language, culture, values and belief system.

See what all the forums member has to say in this topic matter and see whether their opinion stay on the same page or might have some distinction on that views.

From what I assume, we sell something in our daily life right so it is not that uncommon to sell our language, culture, values and belief system but the point I would like to know what makes the topic become like this. I was really wondering.

Kindly pardon me as I am new here and the topic just catch my eye so I just stumble here and have a read. It was really a long read until I came to the last post. My eye is bleeding anyways. LOL!!

 

[char_jig_kar]

Yeah I get what you are getting into. That I understand what the topic is about. But do all the people here in this forums "REALLY" agree that we sell our language, culture, values and belief system.

See what all the forums member has to say in this topic matter and see whether their opinion stay on the same page or might have some distinction on that views.

From what I assume, we sell something in our daily life right so it is not that uncommon to sell our language, culture, values and belief system but the point I would like to know what makes the topic become like this. I was really wondering.

Kindly pardon me as I am new here and the topic just catch my eye so I just stumble here and have a read. It was really a long read until I came to the last post. My eye is bleeding anyways. LOL!!

maybe they had bought the PAP propaganda, that we gain more, and nothing is lose by placing huge emphasis on English?

question is, is it true?? nothing is lose?

say a bunch of british, starting from 3 years old, they listen to japanese, speak japanese read japanese write japanese, day in day out, 99 percent of their life. when they are young adult, they read japanese classics, literature, and also, occassionally they read on english classics such as shakespare in japanese translation (but its not a compulsory subject), so that they still have their 'roots'.

after 3 decades, these bunch of british, do they feel more close, more comfortable to japanese way of thinking and way of life OR british way of thinking and way of life??

 

[angry_one]

Talking to char_jig_kar is like talking to a brick wall. Like ordinary sinkees who lump together PAP, nation, police and state, this disgruntled chinese/asian chaunivist insists the English, education, PAP and western ideas are the same thing. They are NOT.

Those who have argued against him are trying to tell him:

- Mastering English is NOT selling out Asian roots. English the the language of the world, everyone learns it. It is no longer a product of the British.

- We can remain Asian while mastering english. Sinkees' thinking is still VERY ASIAN, despite a lifetime of english education and media exposure.

- If by Western influence you mean respect for individual rights, freedom of expression, equality....i say LET'S ALL BE INFLUENCED!

- English education and PAP ideals are different things. English was the obvious way to modernise our country, no matter what govt is in charge it will decide on this.

 

[char_jig_kar]

Talking to char_jig_kar is like talking to a brick wall. Like ordinary sinkees who lump together PAP, nation, police and state, this disgruntled chinese/asian chaunivist insists the English, education, PAP and western ideas are the same thing. They are NOT.

Those who have argued against him are trying to tell him:

- Mastering English is NOT selling out Asian roots. English the the language of the world, everyone learns it. It is no longer a product of the British.

- We can remain Asian while mastering english. Sinkees' thinking is still VERY ASIAN, despite a lifetime of english education and media exposure.

- If by Western influence you mean respect for individual rights, freedom of expression, equality....i say LET'S ALL BE INFLUENCED!

- English education and PAP ideals are different things. English was the obvious way to modernise our country, no matter what govt is in charge it will decide on this.

There's a difference between mastering english as a subject and SPENDING 90 PERCENT OF OUR TIME DEALING WITH IT. ALMOST ALL OF THE SUBJECTS IN SCHOOL ARE IN ENGLISH!!!

STOP KIDDING YOURSELF THAT WE COULD REMAIN ASIAN BUT SPEND 90 OVER PERCENT OF OUR LIFE DEALING WITH ENGLISH LANGUAGE AND MEDIUM!

STOP APOLOGIZING FINDING EXCUSE FOR THE PAP FLAWED LANGUAGE POLICY!

 

[char_jig_kar]

- If by Western influence you mean respect for individual rights, freedom of expression, equality....i say LET'S ALL BE INFLUENCED!

- English education and PAP ideals are different things. English was the obvious way to modernise our country, no matter what govt is in charge it will decide on this.

- respect for individual rights, freedom of expression, equality ARE NOT COPYRIGHTED BY THE WESTERN COUNTRIES. THE ASIAN COUNTRIES HAVE THAT TOO. ITS A MISCONCEPTION THAT THOSE RIGHTS ARE THE PRODUCT OF NO OTHER CIVILIZATION BUT THE WESTERN CIVILIZATION.

- THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LEARNING ENGLISH AS A SUBJECT AND SNUFFING OUT THE LIFE OF ALL ASIAN LANGUAGES. RIGHT NOW IN OUR COUNTRY, ALMOST ALL OF THE SUBJECTS IN SCHOOL ARE IN ENGLISH. THATS A PAP SIGNATURE POLICY. NO OTHER COUNTRY (maybe except for south africa according to sam leong) HAD PUSH ENGLISH AS 1ST LANGUAGE AND DEMOTE THEIR NATIVE LANGUAGES AS SECOND LANGUAGE IN ALL OF THEIR SCHOOL.

- Wanna sell out language, value, culture for 'Modernization'? Sure. JUST QUIT PRETENDING TO BE A VIRGIN. ACCEPT THE FACT THAT SINGAPORE IS WORSE THAN A PROSTITUTE.

- Modernization doesn't need to be a zero sum game between English and Native languages. The PAP English as first language policy is playing a zero sum game, marginalizing asian languages here in spore. We could use English as 2nd language and be a modernize country. DON'T HAVE TO BE A EXTREMIST AND USE ENGLISH AS FIRST LANGUAGE AND MARGINALIZE ASIAN LANGUAGE HERE IN OUR COUNTRY! ENGLISH AS 2ND LANGUAGE IS SUFFICIENT! WHO IS THE CHAUVINIST HERE? THE PAP AND THOSE WHO SUPPORT THEIR ENGLISH AS FIRST LANGUAGE ARE THE CHAUVINIST. NOT ME.

 

[lsalsa]

- THERE'S A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LEARNING ENGLISH AS A SUBJECT AND SNUFFING OUT THE LIFE OF ALL ASIAN LANGUAGES. RIGHT NOW IN OUR COUNTRY, ALMOST ALL OF THE SUBJECTS IN SCHOOL ARE IN ENGLISH. THATS A PAP SIGNATURE POLICY. NO OTHER COUNTRY (maybe except for south africa according to sam leong) HAD PUSH ENGLISH AS 1ST LANGUAGE AND DEMOTE THEIR NATIVE LANGUAGES AS SECOND LANGUAGE IN ALL OF THEIR SCHOOL.

- Wanna sell out language, value, culture for 'Modernization'? Sure. JUST QUIT PRETENDING TO BE A VIRGIN. ACCEPT THE FACT THAT SINGAPORE IS WORSE THAN A PROSTITUTE.

Alamak LOL!! Well from my perspective on char_jig_kar's opinion with his mindset. From what I analysis that he wants Singapore to have first language in Chinese then 2nd language in English.. That is my assumption. I am not sure yet and I can't read his mind as well.

From his expression point of view is that what he mean is China is catching up and his vision is a way to tell us that Chinese langauge will one day become a universal language because China population is so big that will one day capture the world all over.

Well that is all for now. Anything feel free to debate or rather ingore that issue. GG!! ^_^ For now I am speechless that topic became so popular. Oh well I might as well move this topic to my blog for all the world to see. LOL!! That would be an interesting insight.

*giggles*grins*

 

[Ramseth]

Charjikar, you must be Sotp.

 

[char_jig_kar]

Alamak LOL!! Well from my perspective on char_jig_kar's opinion with his mindset. From what I analysis that he wants Singapore to have first language in Chinese then 2nd language in English.. That is my assumption. I am not sure yet and I can't read his mind as well.

From his expression point of view is that what he mean is China is catching up and his vision is a way to tell us that Chinese langauge will one day become a universal language because China population is so big that will one day capture the world all over.

Well that is all for now. Anything feel free to debate or rather ingore that issue. GG!! ^_^ For now I am speechless that topic became so popular. Oh well I might as well move this topic to my blog for all the world to see. LOL!! That would be an interesting insight.

*giggles*grins*

I am not interested in pushing Chinese as the ONLY first language of this country. What I suggest is this: the Singaporean Chinese use Chinese language as first language, and Singaporean Malay use Malay as first language, so on and so forth. And we use English as 2nd language.

Its not about China becoming strong whatsoever. Don't u get it? One don't sell out one's language and culture because this and that country or these and those countries are strong. Wanna do business with them strong countries? Sure, learn their language, as 2nd language. NO NEED TO SELL ONE'S NATIVE LANGUAGES.

For example. China become strong now? And Malay wanna do business with them? The Malay could learn Chinese language as 2nd language. NO NEED TO GO ALL OUT AND SELL THEIR MALAY LANGUAGE AND CULTURE, START SPEAKING MANDARIN AT HOME GIVING THEIR BABIES CHINESE NAME ALL BECAUSE CHINA IS BECOMING STRONG OR CHINA HAS BECOMING A ECONOMIC SUPERPOWER.

English is use by many countries? Its a important business language? Sure. Lets learn it as a 2nd language. We don't have to go to the extreme and do a sell out on our Asian languages.

 

[lsalsa]

Sotp.

Ramseth, might I kindly ask you what does Sotp stand for? Pardon for my ingorance.