Living in JB

[ginfreely]

Interesting article -- effect of inflation on bank loans

http://www.iproperty.com.my/news/1638/Effect-of-Inflation-on-Bank-Loans

"Inflation cancels out bank interest cost
If your personal inflation rate is above the bank interest rate, you actually end up paying less back. For example, if the bank interest rate is 4% (which is the current rate of BLR – 1.8% for residential properties) and your inflation is 5%, you actually end up paying back RM902,181 for a loan of RM1 million. Unbelievable, but it’s true."

Wow so SG interest rate 1%, inflation rate 6% means can save alot more..

 

[Nusajaya]

So, you wanna buy a house in HH?



But, if you are buying the house as an investment, I’m not too confidant you will see the returns you’d like any time soon.

But as you know, I’m all for living in HH. I’m not trying to discourage you from buying a house here…not at all! It’s just that I see some of the comments on FB and it seems like so many people have lofty ideas of making a quick buck by investing in HH.

And honestly, I like having neighbours. The thought of having an empty houses on my left and right and across the street kinda sucks!

Posted on December 8, 2011 by Audrey
http://horizonhills.wordpress.com/2011/12/08/so-you-wanna-buy-a-house-in-hh/

Dear the golf,

Pls take no offense on my following comments. This is my personal opinion and I am just going to state it very candidly.

I am not going to argue every point you put forward and undoubtedly, some of your points make absolute sense. If that was the case, why do we still invest?? The many questions you posed can best be answered by the following very familiar quote post by aangsc

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" - Winston Churchill

It definitely takes alot more than mere optimism to be a good investor. Suffice to say, a good investor will see beyond the obvious. When all the questions are answered, its normally too late and time to enjoy the sunset...... The question should be, are you able to enjoy the sunset or are you still asking whyssss,,,,

 

[chong2011]

Tropez Residences@Tropicana Danga Bay will be launched tomorrow, if anyone going, please update here!

Last week was invited for Privileged Review and booking. 20th floor facing S'pore 2-bedrooms of 958sf for RM600K (623psf) with 8% rebate (~573psf) . No installment till 3yrs upon completion. Before that all bank interest borned by developer. No legal fees for both S&P and loan agreement excluded stamp duty. Early bird also free airconds, master bedroom wardrobe, kitchen cabinet. Quite tempting to make a booking.... at last also gave up!! With current economic full of uncertainies , rather keep $$$ wait and see!

 

[Bluereeff]

Dear the golf,

Pls take no offense on my following comments. This is my personal opinion and I am just going to state it very candidly.

I am not going to argue every point you put forward and undoubtedly, some of your points make absolute sense. If that was the case, why do we still invest?? The many questions you posed can best be answered by the following very familiar quote post by aangsc

"The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty" - Winston Churchill

It definitely takes alot more than mere optimism to be a good investor. Suffice to say, a good investor will see beyond the obvious. When all the questions are answered, its normally too late and time to enjoy the sunset...... The question should be, are you able to enjoy the sunset or are you still asking whyssss,,,,

I think it is written by someone by the name of Audrey as per the link?

 

[wuqi256]

Die mean poor an die because no food. Gangsterism everywhere ie Ang mo kio , yishun and every where all over Singapore... No Corruption mean very low and zero... Try doing business in Indonesia and Myanmar. I will stop here cause no end to this if we are talking about extreme...

Cheers,
PH

PH, sadly, 3 years ago, i shared your exact views. Getting to know more people who needed help however have changed what i thought.

Very low and zero corruption? Probably but we are now number 5.
http://www.straitstimes.com/BreakingNews/Singapore/Story/STIStory_740406.html

Even just recently an MP was found to be corrupted Well yes, if you need to really compare corruption in 3rd world countries.

I am glad at least that you are not saying that there are no homeless in Singapore:
http://asiancorrespondent.com/28316/are-the-homeless-in-singapore-being-raped/
http://asiancorrespondent.com/57462/the-homeless-in-singapore-and-berkeley/

Lets look at some countries:

In Japan, there are people who died because they starved.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/12/world/asia/12japan.html?pagewanted=all

Even in comparable countries like Taiwan.
http://www.straitstimes.com/BreakingNews/Asia/Story/STIStory_661762.html

I won't go on further about comparison but fact is, even in well developed countries, there are people still starve to death. No country is immune.
I saw a case when i was a young boy in 1988, they claimed she died from her fall but everyone knew better.

Not even talking about gangsterism, lets just talk about about robberies and murders which happens all over the world
http://www.spf.gov.sg/infomap/infomap_index.htm
http://www.asiaone.com/News/The+New+Paper/Story/A1Story20110110-257445/2.html
http://news.asiaone.com/News/AsiaOne+News/Singapore/Story/A1Story20110704-287343.html

Fact is, no country is immune to anything. I am glad that there are still good charities keeping people fed in Country A.

 

[wuqi256]

So, you wanna buy a house in HH?

With the recent economic turmoil stemming from Europe with no good contagion plan yet and latest spate of cooling measures by the SG govt, making a decision to buy a home in HH seems difficult.

Here’s what I think… HH is a great place to live in. It’s in a central location, sits on a golf course, has exclusive clubhouse facilities and has good security. It wouldn’t be too hard to imagine that HH is located in some corner of Singapore…it’d fit right in. Even your neighbours are probably Singaporean, lol.

But, if you are buying the house as an investment, I’m not too confidant you will see the returns you’d like any time soon.

Why? Well firstly, its priced out of the range for the average Malaysian…for sure. JB is not KL….let me repeat, JB is not KL. The good folks in JB just unfortunately don’t earn as much as the KLites…and while a RM3million house in upmarket KL is normal, this is definitely not the case for JB.

What this means is that there will a very limited number of Johorians (and by this, I mean the local locals who actually work in JB) who can afford to buy a HH. In other words, the demand for HH is mainly dependent on, and driven by, Singaporeans and white collar Malaysians working in Singapore.

If you buy a unit in HH to rent out, it needs to cover your mortgage installments, security fee, golf club membership fee and maybe a few percentage extra to make it worth your while. That can come up to quite a bit given the price of the houses at the moment. The question is…..can you think of any of your Singaporean friends who’d be interested to rent your house? Given that the rent is probably more than what a local earns in a month, it’ll be hard to find local takers. Most of my friends already don’t want to come into JB because they are scared, much less want to rent a place to live here…so honestly, how many renters are really out there?

Furthermore, if the supply of houses for rent is high, how high a rent can a homeowner command? Sure, the agents tell you that you can get RM5000 per month easy…but how many units are rented out at this price? And honestly, would you pay RM5000 a month for rent and still have to endure the daily commute to Singapore for work? If it were me, I’d choose to just rent a HDB flat near my workplace in Singapore for the same price.

It’s true…a number of HH homeowners have managed to successfully rent out their unit. But, I think it’s worth finding out exactly how much did these homeowners paid for their house, no? If they bought their terrace house at only ~Rm300k (back when HH was first launched), how much do you think their monthly mortgage costs them and how much rent do you think these owners need to ask for?

And as for capital appreciation…well, that’s really a very long play. Plus, we’ve already missed the boat. I doubt HH prices can continue to rise much more. The houses cannot be priced out of the range of the middle-class Singaporean (and by that, I mean families earning a combined income of maybe $10 – 15k a month). The main benefit of buying a home in JB is that it’s cheap. Period. If it’s not that cheap anymore, coupled with the inconveniece of having to commute plus other associated security risks, then what’s the point of buying a place here?

But as you know, I’m all for living in HH. I’m not trying to discourage you from buying a house here…not at all! It’s just that I see some of the comments on FB and it seems like so many people have lofty ideas of making a quick buck by investing in HH.

And honestly, I like having neighbours. The thought of having an empty houses on my left and right and across the street kinda sucks!

Posted on December 8, 2011 by Audrey
http://horizonhills.wordpress.com/2011/12/08/so-you-wanna-buy-a-house-in-

I agree with the author.

All good points, in fact when i first came out here 3 years ago, i still remember Mr A, Mrs B and another couple who told me repeatedly i had missed the boat.
Back then, i was already too late, luckily i didn't listen to them. If you are buying for own stay, its never too late. If you are investing though, i cannot comment much as this was always meant to help people living here.

One thing i would beg to differ is that its no longer about the cheap or reasonable price of living for some who made the move. There are definitely lots who are here because of the push factors but some as well here for the pull factors. I think prices have risen quite a bit. Renting out for certain developments is not an issue, its just how much you can cover and how much you can make potentially.

As for rental, though most of the bros here are doing pretty well rental wise, my recommendation would always be to buy for own stay. A point to note though, those coming out here are not only just Singaporeans these days, but also expats coming here for the education/medical as well as their support staff. There are also more business opportunities now hence even folks from Penang, Kedah, Kelantan has become my neighbours and some tenants. They are either working in Singapore or have new businesses here in Johore. Back to Singaporeans, there are also people who rented out their homes in Singapore to live out in Johore, the rental they receive in SG is enough to cover for the same or better housing here.

These are just my humble observations.

 

[Puteri harbour]

Paisei... Talking about helping poor and not about security...

Agree with all above.

Cheers,
PH

PH, sadly, 3 years ago, i shared your exact views. Getting to know more people who needed help however have changed what i thought.

Very low and zero corruption? Probably but we are now number 5.
http://www.straitstimes.com/BreakingNews/Singapore/Story/STIStory_740406.html

Even just recently an MP was found to be corrupted Well yes, if you need to really compare corruption in 3rd world countries.

I am glad at least that you are not saying that there are no homeless in Singapore:
http://asiancorrespondent.com/28316/are-the-homeless-in-singapore-being-raped/
http://asiancorrespondent.com/57462/the-homeless-in-singapore-and-berkeley/

Lets look at some countries:

In Japan, there are people who died because they starved.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/12/world/asia/12japan.html?pagewanted=all

Even in comparable countries like Taiwan.
http://www.straitstimes.com/BreakingNews/Asia/Story/STIStory_661762.html

I won't go on further about comparison but fact is, even in well developed countries, there are people still starve to death. No country is immune.
I saw a case when i was a young boy in 1988, they claimed she died from her fall but everyone knew better.

Not even talking about gangsterism, lets just talk about about robberies and murders which happens all over the world
http://www.spf.gov.sg/infomap/infomap_index.htm
http://www.asiaone.com/News/The+New+Paper/Story/A1Story20110110-257445/2.html
http://news.asiaone.com/News/AsiaOne+News/Singapore/Story/A1Story20110704-287343.html

Fact is, no country is immune to anything. I am glad that there are still good charities keeping people fed in Country A.

 

[cap830]

Hi Wuqi256,

I pm-ed you a problem I'm facing hope you can advice.

 

[wuqi256]

agree with brother here, a healthy dose of scepiticim is good. I'm still rather optimistic with the long term outlook in this region.

Yes, good to look at it from the other perspective. Never put all your eggs in one basket though is my own philosophy.

For me, i am remain optimistic not just for any developments but as a whole for the Iskandar region. With the incoming changes and external influence from neighbouring countries as well as not so neighbouring ones. The dynamics that governed many countries in SEA now may well change. For the better or the worse.

If that really happens, we are in for a rocky ride according to my very learned friends who have long since secured houses in different hinterlands all over. Countries though that may now seemed to be "bankrupt" or have "no future" may suddenly be deemed to be the next big thing. Only change is inevitable.

A really learned friend once shared with me. "If there was no serious reason, there would have been no investment"

 

[wuqi256]

PH, i really enjoyed the discussion with you, no offence meant.
I just wished more people in Country A can be helped.


To those reading this.

Some people in Country A is really very pitiful, people drive around with stickers to be kind to animals but they forgot
people in Country A needs help too. People are animals too! (Be kind to animals & PEOPLE)

Charity begins at home, you don't need to go to a far flung country to help others or build houses.

There are already people suffering in one room rental flats. I know, i used to live in one for years but lacked the power
to help back then. More should be done instead of flying overseas to help others, we can use the money we spend for
hotels/flights to help straightaway.

As it is, there are homeless in Singapore, why worry about shelters for people in other countries when you already have
homeless near you? They deserve more help as they are in 3rd world countries?

Many years, back then i was very keen to be a missionary but someone told me this:
Hunger is as keenly felt by those in first world countries as much as those in 3rd world countries. There is no difference, basic
needs for food, heat and shelter are universal.

We should not discriminate based on the country they are from especially if they are from our own.

 

[wuqi256]

Good points there, I'm not sure about missing the boat, but a healthy dose of scepticism is always good as long as it does not impair one's ability to act.

Personally, I'm there for a change of lifestyle, hopefully for the better lol. And I'm in it for a slow buck, I'm prepared for a very a very slow one.

I don't think we missed a lot, there are still boats here.

I am here because of my family not really just for $$$. There are easier and faster ways to make money as property investments are long term and long haul. If i was really in it to make money, i would have set up different businesses rather than something for kids.


I may be gone from the world tomorrow but i need to make sure their world is still there when i am gone.
I might not be there forever but my love for them will still manifest itself hopefully long after i am gone.
I ask not for a tear, frown or bow but a smile knowing that my heart is still with them, somehow.
Wuqi256, 2011

 

[Puteri harbour]

No worries. If I find comment out of point, I would not have waste time reply...

Totally agree with the above. I have always help people closest to me first including friends and family members. As for others, I would help if I pay a visit to the country.

Other ways to help including teaching people how to "fish" and make a living instead of giving them "fish" instead of giving them "fish". In fact, I have help many to "fish" successfully instead of working for someone.indirectly, I am also feeding their family members and themselves.

Nice talking to you too.

Cheers,
PH

PH, i really enjoyed the discussion with you, no offence meant.
I just wished more people in Country A can be helped.


To those reading this.

Some people in Country A is really very pitiful, people drive around with stickers to be kind to animals but they forgot
people in Country A needs help too. People are animals too! (Be kind to animals & PEOPLE)

Charity begins at home, you don't need to go to a far flung country to help others or build houses.

There are already people suffering in one room rental flats. I know, i used to live in one for years but lacked the power
to help back then. More should be done instead of flying overseas to help others, we can use the money we spend for
hotels/flights to help straightaway.

As it is, there are homeless in Singapore, why worry about shelters for people in other countries when you already have
homeless near you? They deserve more help as they are in 3rd world countries?

Back then i was very keen to be a missionary but someone told me this:
Hunger is as keenly felt by those in first world countries as much as those in 3rd world countries. There is no difference, basic
needs for food, heat and shelter are universal.

We should not discriminate based on the country they are from especially if they are from our own.

 

[wuqi256]

Thanks PH, helping others fish was exactly the spirit that this thread was started with.
Kudos to you for helping others. May your path in life be as bright as those that you helped light.

 

[wuqi256]

Welcome back Cathlmg, there must be many pages i missed too, its growing a bit too fast for me.
Getting a bit tired these days. Yes they will likely continue to work together, they may need each
other more than most may realise.

 

[wuqi256]

"Inflation cancels out bank interest cost
If your personal inflation rate is above the bank interest rate, you actually end up paying less back. For example, if the bank interest rate is 4% (which is the current rate of BLR – 1.8% for residential properties) and your inflation is 5%, you actually end up paying back RM902,181 for a loan of RM1 million. Unbelievable, but it’s true."

Wow so SG interest rate 1%, inflation rate 6% means can save alot more..

I would still advise against over leveraging, for own stay, buy the biggest you can reasonably afford. For investment, buy a "ship of the line" (depending on the maximum size and type of house you are comfortable with) house for own stay and then, only then, you think of buying others smaller houses.

 

[ericmambo]

I don't think we missed a lot, there are still boats here.

I am here because of my family not really just for $$$. There are easier and faster ways to make money as property investments are long term and long haul. If i was really in it to make money, i would have set up different businesses rather than something for kids.


I may be gone from the world tomorrow but i need to make sure their world is still there when i am gone.
I might not be there forever but my love for them will still manifest itself hopefully long after i am gone.
I ask not for a tear, frown or bow but a smile knowing that my heart is still with them, somehow.
Wuqi256, 2011

WELL SAID, Bro Wuqi........

 

[wuqi256]

Bros who are buying subsale, please do be reminded that you should get your own lawyer and different from the one representing the seller. Even if it costs more.
That way, the lawyer will act in your best interest. Also, there are people who wants the 10% before state consent. State consent is normally granted after a few months but could take a while, 2-4 months typically and some sellers could be needing money before that hence there are some who asks for 10% prior to the state consent.

This is not that rare a request but best to get everything documented in black and white before you commit.

1. If a seller persists in delaying signing the S&P, its a bad sign.
2. If an agent offers to return you your cheque the very next day.
3. Always appoint your own lawyer even if it costs you more. Do not listen to agents asking you to use theirs or
only theirs can handle it.
4. Soft negotiations can be done sometimes, instead of disbursing 10%, ask for 5% or the right to move in early
to the house.
5. Where a deal goes south or even after a deal concludes well, you have the right to ask for a discount from the
lawyers if you find that the service was tardy or slow.
6. Don't be afraid to seek legal advice, there are reputable ones such as Syed Alwi, Ng & Co*.
7. Where possible, buy direct from developer or from direct owners if you really cannot get it direct.
8. Agents* should normally only be getting the comms direct from the seller unless somehow that agent saved you
a ton of money.

*Wuqi256 is not in any way related to agents or any law firms.

 

[Icyraine]

Bros who are buying subsale, please do be reminded that you should get your own lawyer and different from the one representing the seller. Even if it costs more.
That way, the lawyer will act in your best interest. Also, there are people who wants the 10% before state consent. State consent is normally granted after a few months but could take a while, 2-4 months typically and some sellers could be needing money before that hence there are some who asks for 10% prior to the state consent.

This is not that rare a request but best to get everything documented in black and white before you commit.

1. If a seller persists in delaying signing the S&P, its a bad sign.
2. If an agent offers to return you your cheque the very next day.
3. Always appoint your own lawyer even if it costs you more. Do not listen to agents asking you to use theirs or
only theirs can handle it.
4. Soft negotiations can be done sometimes, instead of disbursing 10%, ask for 5% or the right to move in early
to the house.
5. Where a deal goes south or even after a deal concludes well, you have the right to ask for a discount from the
lawyers if you find that the service was tardy or slow.
6. Don't be afraid to seek legal advice, there are reputable ones such as Syed Alwi, Ng & Co*.
7. Where possible, buy direct from developer or from direct owners if you really cannot get it direct.
8. Agents* should normally only be getting the comms direct from the seller unless somehow that agent saved you
a ton of money.

*Wuqi256 is not in any way related to agents or any law firms.

Thank you for your constant help and contribution to the community, bro, you are the man!

 

[ODYSSEY]

Bros who are buying subsale, please do be reminded that you should get your own lawyer and different from the one representing the seller. Even if it costs more.
That way, the lawyer will act in your best interest. Also, there are people who wants the 10% before state consent. State consent is normally granted after a few months but could take a while, 2-4 months typically and some sellers could be needing money before that hence there are some who asks for 10% prior to the state consent.

This is not that rare a request but best to get everything documented in black and white before you commit.

1. If a seller persists in delaying signing the S&P, its a bad sign.
2. If an agent offers to return you your cheque the very next day.
3. Always appoint your own lawyer even if it costs you more. Do not listen to agents asking you to use theirs or
only theirs can handle it.
4. Soft negotiations can be done sometimes, instead of disbursing 10%, ask for 5% or the right to move in early
to the house.
5. Where a deal goes south or even after a deal concludes well, you have the right to ask for a discount from the
lawyers if you find that the service was tardy or slow.
6. Don't be afraid to seek legal advice, there are reputable ones such as Syed Alwi, Ng & Co*.
7. Where possible, buy direct from developer or from direct owners if you really cannot get it direct.
8. Agents* should normally only be getting the comms direct from the seller unless somehow that agent saved you
a ton of money.

*Wuqi256 is not in any way related to agents or any law firms.

I want to reiterate that every point shared by Wuqi above is absolutely true! My friends and I bought our house from sub-sale and we have experienced some of the above events in one way or another. Buying from sub-sale is not as easy as from developers so please heed the advice given, or shared by all the good bros here. As reminded by Wuqi, it is imperative to get ur own lawyer - a good one for that matter; someone who can and will protect ur interest (instead of the seller, or even worst the agent's). Don't believe everything the housing agent tells u. Go into a deal with both eyes wide open and u will be fine. Note point 6, if still in doubt, check with ur lawyer before taking the next step. That's what u r paying them for. Thanks Wuqi once again, for these timely reminders! One can never be too careful when buying from sub-sale. One truly bad incident can really dampen and spoil ur plan in living in JB.

 

[Batok Seri]

Having been to Johor Premium Outlets today, here's my route guide for people looking for value factory outlet shopping..
Going north on NS highway, take exit 304.
Straight to Senai Airport.
Then take a flight to Bandung.