Living in JB 2 (Johore)

[ginfreely]

...................................
Talking about jobless in Singapore and cannot survive, do you think a Malaysian can survive if they are jobless? Mid age crisis happen everywhere not just Singapore.

Middle age crisis happens everywhere but only in Singapore are there massive number of average workers from third world countries let in by the government within a short time to depress the wages and take away the PMET and other jobs that average Singaporean workers can do.

 

[ginfreely]

Actually many people think it is not a privilege to own HDB flats which are overpriced. I would beg to differ. Sporeans are able to buy flats with subsidies for downpayment almost paid fully and for monthly instalment, many couples simply paid off using CPF which effectively cant be used in daily purchases anyway.

After 20 years or so when the flat is fully paid up, they are able to sell for a profit of $200k-$500k. When they want to retire, they can simply sell off their hdb flat for RM 1 million and retire in any part of Malaysia. If they cannot buy, they can rent for RM 1500 a month for a simple terrace. Afterall, they can choose to retire in JB for many years to come with this RM 1 million.

Malaysians are very unlucky lot. Yes, their medicine are super cheap. Their hospital stays are almost free. But as my Malaysian father always said to me, what is the point of giving me cheap medicine and cheap hospital stay??? I have NEVER stayed in a hospital in my 70 years of stay in Malaysia... And after slogging for 50 years, my Malaysian father has zero money in his EPF and only have a terrace worth about RM 150,000. He has never planned to retire as he is very independent and with only RM 150000, that is seriously not enough for him and all of his kids are working in Malaysia

I have checked out those so-called uncles who can retire at 50 year old in Malaysia. Most if not all of them have kids who are earning Singapore dollars. Or they themselves slogged as bus drivers for 20-30 years in Singapore and convert to RM to retire fully in Malaysia. The "real" Malaysians earning RM 1500 a month and still need to pay for car instalment, house instalment during their 20 years of hard work.. they cannot retire.

Now Malaysians cant stay in Singapore to work without a proper work permit. Singaporeans like me for example can stay 1 month in Malaysia without proper permits, come out and stay chop passports and return to stay in Malaysia again. I can sell my Singapore house for RM 1 million and choose to stay in Malaysia permanently if Singapore economy busted or stay in Singapore permanently if Malaysia bumiputras decide to run wild asking to bathe in Chinese blood like how their Home Minister has done a few years back on stage.

The Malaysians cannot run to Singapore if a racial war erupted and the Singapore custom will stop them from entering the country anyway .. I cant say it wont happen but it is getting very scary every day I read the news. DAP = Chinese, UMNO = Malays etc. Politics in Malaysia is really in uncharted territory and a racial war can suddenly erupt and who do you think the 95% Malays in the Malaysia Police Force or Malaysia armies will side?

I have been moving around JB for 1.5 years, seriously I have not see any old and feeble person working in menial jobs in JB, especially Chinese. The most is Malay cleaners who look like in their 60s. It is definitely not a norm for elderly to work in JB (or infact in China or anywhere else in the world). But in the No. 3 richest country, I have seen elderly even in their 70s, frail and bent over still clearing and wiping tables.

 

[hillside]

Hi bro,

i believe many ppl here have la, worst downgrade hdb + little bit of saving, downgrade hdb still have back up rite? is only SGD200k+, many of them pay easily SGD50k downpayment for their house here, some more than 1 house, fyi i am not well to do FT, currently work in M'sia and struggling to look for a house in nusajaya if possible, is really tough.

i am not so sure about setting up business in m'sia, but i have singapore fren doing that, not sure how they do it, for sure he is not mm2h, is bro wugi wife malaysian? or else how he set up business for his wife in msia?

with macs singaporean can stay here for long time or forever at this moment, i don't noticed singaporean banned for entering msia so far, do you know msia will ban for entering spore if staying spore for more than 1 or 2 months without proper permit?

about bangla, my mistake, u sound like, in fact most of the the singaporean against them, i have love hate relationship with them but i have to accept it, both in spore and msia side.

Bro , the following is basic requirement for MM2H:-

i. Applicants aged below 50 years are required to show proof of liquid assets worth a minimum of RM500,000 and offshore income of RM10,000 per month. For certified copy(s) of Current Account submitted as financial proof, applicants must provide the latest 3 months’ statement with each month’s credit balance of RM 500,000.

ii. Applicants aged 50 and above may comply with the financial proof of RM350,000 in liquid assets and off shore income of RM10,000 per month. For certified copy(s) of Current Account submitted as financial proof, applicants must provide the latest 3 months’ statement with each month’s credit balance of RM 350,000. For those who have retired, they are required to show proof of receiving pension from government approved funds of RM 10,000 per month.

iii. New applicants who have purchased properties worth at least RM 1 million qualify to place a lower fixed deposit amount upon approval

1) OK guys , how many of you here can place a FD of RM500K and proof of income of RM10K a mth ? How many of you here think is ease to apply for one ? Maybe you are one of those well to do FTs in SG , easily qualified .

2) MACs is just a replacement of white cards . Does not allow you to work in Malaysia or conduct biz in Malaysia leh !

3) Which sentence say that I look down on Bangla . Bring me a Bangla , I will kiss him in front of you ! I am saying that is not right to compare Work Permit in SG to MM2H .

 

[hillside]

i am comparing the equal affordability in this sample, the cheapest hdb in ulu area and normal landed property outside nusajaya area.

leasehold example, i totally agreed with you and i foreseen this will happen in the future as well, thats why i mentioned at this moment in my example, Singaporean still can sell their hdb or downgrade and get a house in JB if he really feel comfortable with JB. In fact Singaporean keep upgrading their hdb, 1 of the factor contribute to higher price from my point of view, i could be wrong, the problem is not many ppl willing to taking the risk to lose the hdb and cannot buy back eventually if price going up further, this is the risk that no one can 100% sure now, if not selling, renting out now is equally good to get a house in JB, free + extra pocket money as example given but many ppl here, but most of them want both, keep the hdb for backup or convenience + holiday home resort in the same time, is still achievable for most of the ppl here. Taking about major sers and massive aging flat, this is the main factor i strongly believe will bring down hdb pricing, but then all the scholars will find out the way...hahaa

It doesn't make sense to compare our father generation, this happen everywhere, not only S'pore, is all about inflation and no one can escape.

<Quote>Compare to Msia, do you know how affordable it is for them (despite all their complaints), how long can they pay up loan?[/QUOTE]

It normally take 30 to 40 years for a ordinary ppl to pay up the loan in Malaysia if they are lucky enough, definitely longer than Singaporean. I have explained in my example, more than 30% of their pay in CASH not cpf money for monthly installment over 30 to 40 years.

For first time house buyers, the government of malaysia allow 100% loan for up to certain amount for those income less than RM3000, you can refer to this link and read the comments for more understanding.

http://malaysiahousingloan.net/2010/10/16/100-loan-for-first-time-buyers/

Two things fundamentally wrong with your example. You cannot compare different housing prices after exchange rates. i.e. HDB of 350k vs Msia Landed of 250k RM. It only make sense if you compare equal affordability.

Your leasehold example does not hold water for future generation. When a leasehold goes to old age, do you think the prices still can maintain or continues to appreciate? SG nation is relatively young, with the demand in housing, resale prices higher than new flats can still maintain. In the long run, it's not tenable. Imagine we have MASS numbers of HDBs built in the 80s, once they all reach old age, u think got so much land for SERS? SERS is selective, and cannot catch up once we have massive aging flats.

Our father's generations, how much is HDB price over their pay? Our generation, how much? The next generation?

Compare to Msia, do you know how affordable it is for them (despite all their complaints), how long can they pay up loan?

 

[Whathefish]

i am comparing the equal affordability in this sample, the cheapest hdb in ulu area and normal landed property outside nusajaya area.

leasehold example, i totally agreed with you and i foreseen this will happen in the future as well, thats why i mentioned at this moment in my example, Singaporean still can sell their hdb or downgrade and get a house in JB if he really feel comfortable with JB. In fact Singaporean keep upgrading their hdb, 1 of the factor contribute to higher price from my point of view, i could be wrong, the problem is not many ppl willing to taking the risk to lose the hdb and cannot buy back eventually if price going up further, this is the risk that no one can 100% sure now, if not selling, renting out now is equally good to get a house in JB, free + extra pocket money as example given but many ppl here, but most of them want both, keep the hdb for backup or convenience + holiday home resort in the same time, is still achievable for most of the ppl here. Taking about major sers and massive aging flat, this is the main factor i strongly believe will bring down hdb pricing, but then all the scholars will find out the way...hahaa

It doesn't make sense to compare our father generation, this happen everywhere, not only S'pore, is all about inflation and no one can escape.

<<Quote>>Compare to Msia, do you know how affordable it is for them (despite all their complaints), how long can they pay up loan?

It normally take 30 to 40 years for a ordinary ppl to pay up the loan in Malaysia if they are lucky enough, definitely longer than Singaporean. I have explained in my example, more than 30% of their pay in CASH not cpf money for monthly installment over 30 to 40 years.

For first time house buyers, the government of malaysia allow 100% loan for up to certain amount for those income less than RM3000, you can refer to this link and read the comments for more understanding.

http://malaysiahousingloan.net/2010/10/16/100-loan-for-first-time-buyers/

Your "affordability" comparison is not correct. Given the same affordability, the person easily can buy 2x landed of your example in Msia, stay in one, rent out one for added returns.

The comparison to last generation is the steep upslope of price appreciation in SG, it's not solely about inflation as the price appreciation many folds over inflation, due to a new nation forming w sudden increase in demand/population. Once stabilised, most countries' leasehold depreciates during old age.

At a broad view of statistics, 30-40 years for ordinary pple to pay loan in Malaysia is not correct. You're quoting those lower income groups.

A typical white-collar could earn 1/2 our pay adjusted via exchange, but only need to pay for less than 1/4 of the housing loan in real terms. So how could he need 30-40 years to pay off?
Check out international affordability index papers too. The affordability index for malaysia is way way better than sg.

 

[spidey]

Check out international affordability index papers too. The affordability index for malaysia is way way better than sg.

That's perception mate and the data is all s@#$%#$....go down to the ground and you will hear a diffeent set of story altogether!! And that's the real deal..
And you always hear the G singing that the inflation rate is manageable at 3% every year for the past 5 year....yeah, 3% my a@#$!!!
All these are make believe and those lower educated ppl in MY are buying into all the just coz of the main media is controlled by the G...
Go read up in Malaysia Today/Kini and then you will know how they so clever to use the tax payers $$ to fund themselves fat!! And i believe the Chinese are the majority of these tax payers!! Come to think of it ..F@#$...i am one of them too!! but I dun get anything back....writign this down makes my blood boil!!:(

 

[spidey]

For first time house buyers, the government of malaysia allow 100% loan for up to certain amount for those income less than RM3000, you can refer to this link and read the comments for more understanding.

http://malaysiahousingloan.net/2010/10/16/100-loan-for-first-time-buyers/

Bro Hillside, i heard there is another story on this Gov funding of 100% loan to the poor - Do you know where they gonna get this funding from? I heard they will be using the funds from EPF! That's right! the people's money! the qeuivalent of CPF for SG.
So, if the G of Singapore uses your money and gives it to those that don't work hard and expect the G to take care of them....wonder how you would feel!
And what's the collateral? What if everyone stop paying their house instalments for any reason...then how? the ppl $$ up in smoke

In the 1st place these ppl are unable to get loan, coz they are not qualified to get one! So how secure is the loan from the CPF?

Just a thot...

 

[hillside]

i leave in 2005, too bad wrong timing

Leave early? The Malaysian chinese who returned to KL left early too in end 2008/early 2009, if she has stayed two years more, she would have sold her 3 room flat at around $300k and not $230k and made additional $70k or more profit.

Which year did you leave? If you have left before 2005/2006, the living and working conditions in SG were still okay then. SG has degenerated alot within a few years since then with the PAP's uncontrolled influx of foreigners.

 

[hillside]

No body like this, if the government have choice, i don't think they want to do that, no country wanted to do that for no reason, i am not sure about the autual motive behind, thousand of reason from economic point from view, no offence and seriously i don't think those scholar behind are not as good as ordinary ppl like us, still working for someone and struggling to survive. Anyway, Singapore is still 1 of the healthy umployment rate in the world. I read some good quote from someone, could be 1 of you here.

Complains are just voices from the people, some valid, some nonsensical. It takes wise leaders to discern which is which. It takes lazy leaders to ignore all. It takes morally corrupted leaders to sleeve out those which serves their own purposes. It takes stupid leaders to work on all complains.

Middle age crisis happens everywhere but only in Singapore are there massive number of average workers from third world countries let in by the government within a short time to depress the wages and take away the PMET and other jobs that average Singaporean workers can do.

 

[cathylmg]

Not a foreign Elite but a cheap foreign worker, i used to work in SG, own a HDB and Car in Singapore during that time, i earn less than 3k but can live comfortable during that time, i get much better pay in Malaysia now but find hardly survive with the same living style when i was there , so just share my own experience.

After reading almost half of your post, I can't help but wonder, how come you didn't convert to Singapore citizenship when you have said so much good things about being a Singaporean? And what did you do with your HDB flat? Did you profit from it?

 

[hillside]

hi, is the same situation from my point of view.

High End property price up - will bring up other middle and lower housing price, like Private and HDB price gab effect, it can be paper value but surely affected.

M'sia Govt - lift to 500k, help to up the price further as foreigner don't really care as they are looking for high end house, those close to 500k will be >= to 500k now.

Housing price up - inflation due to higher price- everything up, hopefully wages.....worker like boss hate.

Business who benefits - love Singaporean.
Low class worker or those business not benefits - blame the increase of cost - hate.

Some Malaysians told me the locals hate Singaporeans because Singaporean have driven up the property price..

When china or Indians folk buying up singapore properties, I don't think we hate them.. I think we are disgusted with the govt who don't have enough control on them to drive up our public housing.. Malaysian govt in fact do the good thing in making sure foreigners can only buy 500k and above house.. The locals still can buy cheaper houses in many part of Johor... For the middle class who hate Singaporeans, I think they are confused. They don't believe their higher end properties are worth so much and they get angry when they see themselves missing the opportunity.. For this group of middle income executives who have plan to buy higher end properties, I think they should buy now...and then they will like singaporeans to help them pushing up their investment... For the low wage workers, we have no impact on their affordability and livinghood...

 

[greddy88]

chill guys!
grass is always greener at the other side.
in fact, there are pro and con in each.. it is up to an individual's tolerance/acceptance given the facts.

example, some are OK to travel the causeway and put up with jams everyday, some are not.
to them, 1++ hr jam nia... other countries people have to drive hours to get home/work.

just have to lay down the facts on your drawing board, then see if it is acceptable to u and family.

 

[jasonjst]

hi, is the same situation from my point of view.

High End property price up - will bring up other middle and lower housing price, like Private and HDB price gab effect, it can be paper value but surely affected.

M'sia Govt - lift to 500k, help to up the price further as foreigner don't really care as they are looking for high end house, those close to 500k will be >= to 500k now.

Housing price up - inflation due to higher price- everything up, hopefully wages.....worker like boss hate.

Business who benefits - love Singaporean.
Low class worker or those business not benefits - blame the increase of cost - hate.

Then millions of those FTs come drive up HDB prices and take away jobs at all levels, we Singaporean not supposed to complaint. We suppose to be grateful that they are doing us a great service. Now even to the extend that some of us are force to stay in JB, also must be grateful that it is make possible by PAP. Thank you , all my dear FTs in Singapore .

 

[wuqi256]

I love Malaysia but I am not ready to take up a Malaysia citizenship and renounce my Singapore citizenship. By holding onto a Spore citizenship, I am able to come to Malaysia with Sing dollars and still able to stay on as long as I like and chop my passport every other month. Its really enuff to stay and work in Singapore OR Malaysia. My Malaysia relatives visit Singapore very often and the Singapore immigration would always "interrogate" them as to what the hell are they doing in Singapore. Where are they gota stay etc...[/QUOTE]


Even for Singaporeans, we get questions like that too even if dressed for work.

 

[hillside]

You know why? in Malaysia, who want to employ elderly if they can get cheap labour like bangla/china/indo/pino, no subsidy from gahment somemore, go around the foodcount in malaysia especially KL, you will see who is the one who clearing and wiping tables. Some Malaysian from poor family or less education background, they will take out the job for <RM800 or some even <RM500 to wiping table, the problem in Singapore is cannot find enough ppl like this, so eldely get the job.

Some of the eldely got filial son, is the fact where developed country is lesser....Malaysia is going into this situation soon.

Sorry to say but some cannot survive and leave early lo, how to survive until today.

The aging issue in Malaysia is much better hence you will see lesser elderly as compare to Singapore.

I have been moving around JB for 1.5 years, seriously I have not see any old and feeble person working in menial jobs in JB, especially Chinese. The most is Malay cleaners who look like in their 60s. It is definitely not a norm for elderly to work in JB (or infact in China or anywhere else in the world). But in the No. 3 richest country, I have seen elderly even in their 70s, frail and bent over still clearing and wiping tables.

 

[wuqi256]

Bros/Sisters, misleading others through deliberate misinformation is very different from those posting out of sheer ignorance or just plain confused.

Some just sent this to me:

Subject: Beware

Hey bro, that he/she (you know who lah) is still in the forum, just using another nick and pretending to be one of u in Johor. Off and on, that person will post some good comments just to "camo" herself and con unsuspecting people but then take pot shots. I saw that she still doesn't reply directly to u when u reply her but replies to others instead with some of the points directed to u.

 

[cathylmg]

Last time yes it is highly prized by Malaysians but none of those I met in recent years want to convert. They told me "what for?". Only met one couple with one spouse changed to SG citizenship to apply new HDB flat and for cheaper education for children as I was told.

After they get all the subsidies for HDB, education and government subisdies, and when they finally finished, they still have an advantage. The second generation Singaporean has a choice to choose to convert back to being a Malaysian again. Not alot of people knows about this.

 

[wuqi256]

No country is perfect and everyone is entitled to complain about their country but please use facts, things like these are not so helpful:

1. MACS can be used to set up business - With or without MACS, you can still set up, just best to use a professional firm to set things up properly.
2. Singaporeans can convert to Malaysian citizenship easily - You can't, not even PR. Even 10 year MM2H isn't so easily attainable.
3. Malaysians cannot stay or go to Singapore without jobs - 30 days and even then can extend.
4. Lots of Malaysians do not buy properties and only rent in Singapore - Enough said
5. Few hundred thousand of profit from HDB - Used to be, now its getting harder and harder

Spidey, i still have lots of friends who haven't converted even after working and living in Singapore for years and years.
I asked my staff yesterday if they would convert especially those who came back from Singapore. All said yes to PR and
no to citizenship.

 

[wuqi256]

I dont get any questions as to what I am doing in Singapore whenver I travel back to Singapore. This is a no-brainer question and if any custom boys were to ask this question, I would simply show him my passport. AS a Singapore citizen, why would Singapore custom officers ask me what I am doing in Singapore? To report for reservist ?


I did show but yes, it just goes to show that they do this so automatically that they are not deliberately giving anyone issues but just standard. We only got this occasionally at 2nd link but not at all at the first link.

 

[jasonjst]

Yes you are right on this. But those Malaysian buyers are rich Malaysians. How about the poor Malaysians? Those staying in Bukit Indah are hating Sporeans because Bukit Indah terraces are launched and sold at RM 400k + already. Just 5 years back, the price is only RM 100-rm200k.

Poor Sporeans staying in normal 3-4 rooms flat, struggle for 20-30 years in Spore and use their CPF to pay for their HDB loans fully can easily sell the HDB and pocket RM 1 million. If they still cannot pay up a simple HDB loan in 30 years, then we must question what they have been doing for the past 30 years? Lazing around? I see hardworking Malaysian old men coming in and out of Spore for over 30 years to work. It does means that jobs are plenty in Singapore in the past 30 years. Many losers like to gamble, drink and smoke for 40 years in Singapore, find China girls to be their girlfriends thinking there are real love, obviously we cant be bothered with them. If you give them S$1 million today, the next week they will blow up the million in MBS or RWS.

I thought you say "I was reading the papers last week and PM Najib announced that flats which cost RM 170,000 will be sold to Malaysians @ just RM 40,000. The voters living in that part of the ulu kampong is extremely happy. "