My view will follow.
But what do you think.
Does making money count as the way to Heaven or Hell.
One view is that if you make many and others also benefit you will go direct to Heaven.
Another view is that if you make money it is almost very likely that it is at the expense and misery of others and you will surely go to Hell.
Leemember Old Fart Lee did not publicly claim to be an adherent of any leeligion.
So does it mean that only leeligious persons are subject to the cause and effect of one's actions?
But also leemember that if for eg. you are a Christian or a Muslim does it mean that you can be a murderer but a Christian or a Muslim you will still have a place in Heaven?
By the way Sikhism, Hinduism and Buddhism do not believe in Heaven or Hell. I stand corrected here.
But I am certain that Sikhism and Hinduism believe in the cycle of rebirths. Being a human is the ultimate opportunity to seek an end to the cycle of rebirths. It may take one thousands and thousands of rebirths to get this opportunity to be born as a human and therefore a priceless chance to end this cycle.
Any enlightened soul can correct what I have stated above.
This person has his own view. Do you agree or disagree?
When I was a Christian, I tried to persuade my father to be one as well. He gave me a good reason why he would never be one: going by the logic of Christian teachings, a man like Lee Kuan Yew (LKY) would be consigned to hell in spite of all the good he had done till then. Now, my father was a gangster (lol) and he naturally despised LKY because LKY made it almost impossible for his ‘career’. Every election he would tell me he was going to vote against LKY’s party, the People’s Action Party. But I have no doubt he was convinced LKY was a good man. So it made no sense to him how the Christian God would send this good man to hell.
When my father died, I had to reexamine my faith, especially the part about hell and eternal torment for those who have never ‘invited Jesus into their hearts’. My father was the only one on earth who loved me, and I him. Even if I were to be blessed with a blissful destiny, how would I be able to spend my eternity with joy knowing this loved one of mine would be simultaneously tormented.
Also, when I looked around, I see nice and selfless people who did not believe in Jesus. Was hell to be the final destination for them just because they didn’t know Him? I remember Amin, (when I first saw the name Amin, I said of no, is he talking about my friend Idi Amin Dada -- lol) a Malay Muslim recruit platoon mate of mine who took selfless care of me when I was very sick in the army barracks. Is he hell-bound too just because he betted on the wrong prophet? If only there were a third destiny, good old Death for example, in addition to heaven or hell, would Christianity make sense, I thought. But the mainstream church’s teachings do not allow for it, it seemed.
Frustrated, I put my quest for answers on hold and concentrate on the business of making a living. A few years later, I stumbled on “Christianity vs Atheism” debates on YouTube, and this rekindled my interest in Christianity. This time I thought I would get more involved by volunteering for some ‘churchy’ work. I thought I found one right up my alley; the Anglican Church here in Singapore plants churches in Thailand and therefore would need to equip their missionaries with good Thai language skills, not just spoken but written as well. By God’s grace, I had by then, gained a unique insight into the Thai script system and had devised a teaching method that requires only 4 days for someone keen to master the ABC’s of Thai, while conventional methods would call for months. I somehow got in touch with the relevant pastors overseeing this outreach program and scheduled a meeting with them. When the day and time came, I showed up but they had forgotten about it. Naturally I was surprised. And pissed. What kind of Mickey Mouse operation is this, I thought. Later that day, we managed to meet and I told them my ideas, but not before I gently hinted my ‘pissedness’. They politely pooh-poohed my ideas, saying they were happy with their current setup and saw no need to change. Disappointed, I left, with more questions than answers swimming in my head.
I’ve been taught then that the Holy Spirit has been responsible for the birth and growth of the church. So I believed then that churches were supposedly led by the Spirit which inspired Christians worldwide to do ‘churchy’ work. I thought I was led likewise to seek ‘churchy’ work. So why was the Spirit in me at odds with the Spirit in them reverential dudes above? And what kind of Spirit is it that fosters a we-are-satisfied-we-don’t-need-improving attitude? Is mediocrity the mark of a Spirit driven project? Is this some kind of Divine humour? Another faith crisis ensued.
This time I got the answers that I sought fast. Via the internet, I chanced upon Jack Crabtree of the Gutenberg College. Here is a guy who has been a mainstream ‘churchy’ Christian all his life but now is studying the Bible for what it has to say, instead of imposing on the Bible with what the Church has to say, and dedicating his life to teaching what he studied. So I learned that as far as the Gospel is concerned, there are two separate views: the Church’s interpretation, and what the Bible actually says, in other words, the ‘churchical’ and the biblical views. In yet other words, the ‘churchical’ view is ‘another Gospel’. In the ‘churchical’ view, despite the enormous good LKY has done, he is now in hell. No ifs or buts. During the national mourning last week, ‘churchical’ Christians in Singapore were (and still are) in a real bind; they saw that the obvious inescapable good he had done for Singapore was at odds with their basic belief of inescapable hell for non-believers like LKY. It should have really sucked to be a sensitive ‘churchical’ Christian in Singapore then; their real flesh-and-blood hero was hell-bound.
But the biblical view is something else. This is what the Bible really teaches about the afterlife: there is no heaven nor hell. When we die, we simply cease to be. Period. No soul. No nothing. However, we would continue to exist, only in the mind of God as individual ideas, just as we were merely ideas in His mind before we were born, and even before the foundation of the world. But one day there will be the Day of the Final Judgment, when all the dead shall be resurrected to account for their lives lived. Unfortunately, all will face condemnation due to our basic evil nature. However, a fraction of us will receive God’s mercy and will be granted the blessed life for all eternity. The rest of us will be punished in commiseration with the evil done during our earthly lives, after which total destruction follows. No hell. Or heaven. Only extinction or a blessed life eternal as the final destiny for all mankind.
So who will receive mercy and why? Christians will fall over each other to answer: “the ones who accepted Jesus, of course”. They will cite several New Testament passages, which I argue are all divorced from their context; those passages are applicable only to Jews in the Jewish context. Jews were expecting a Messiah and those passages were written to proclaim Jesus as that Messiah. Gentiles don’t have this context. So well meaning Christian evangelicals who went around the Gentile world proclaiming “Just believe in Jesus and be saved!” are proclaiming a half truth, which is as good as a falsehood, I.e., a lie. In Matthew 7:21-23,
And if Christians insist on “no belief in Jesus, no salvation”, then those Old Testament heroes like Abraham et al, would all be disqualified. Also, in the Parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector where the tax collector was instead the one who went home justified, the only thing sought by the tax collector was, mercy. That was what got him justified, his asking for mercy. Jesus clearly did not add a disclaimer of “Oh, and er, he’d also need to believe in Me after I die. Let’s not forget that!”
A huge portion of the Bible is about the Jews, God’s chosen, especially how God dealt with them, and how He will deal with them in the future. Therefore most of the Bible are not directly applicable to us Gentiles. We Gentiles need not be envious or feel left out or ditch the Bible. It is by understanding the Bible that we can clearly know who God is and what He ultimately asks of us, the rest of mankind. The whole Bible actually hinges on only two commandments directly relevant to us Gentiles: love God with all your heart, and love your neighbour as yourself (Matthew 22:36-40). Since loving God is experientially nebulous and hardly tangible, I would have to argue therefore, there is actually only one concrete commandment, i.e., that you love God by loving others as yourself. That, my friends, is to do the will of God, as in Matthew 7:21-23 above,
And now the conclusion according to this gentleman ---- which I completely disagree with.
However, it does not follow that Old Fart Lee and his Evil wife are in Heaven or Hell.
---- and LKY had given his whole life doing just that. LKY worried daily about the welfare of his fellow countrymen till the day he died. Put it in another way, Singapore was LKY’s cross to bear, and bore he did, till the end of his time. LKY did not retire and died. He worked tirelessly till he was admitted to hospital for severe pneumonia and died after more than a month. And so, if the betting offices were still open on the Day of the Final Judgment, I would bet my all on LKY and his wife receiving the mercy of God.
If you think Old Fart Lee and his Evil wife are in Heaven -- I pray please let me hear your views.
If he and his ugly Evil wife are in Hell please let me hear your views.
If you think they are subject to the cycle of rebirths for a missed opportunity again please let me hear your views.
---- All according to your religious views or if you do not believe in any particular leeligion then what do you think?
But what do you think.
Does making money count as the way to Heaven or Hell.
One view is that if you make many and others also benefit you will go direct to Heaven.
Another view is that if you make money it is almost very likely that it is at the expense and misery of others and you will surely go to Hell.
Leemember Old Fart Lee did not publicly claim to be an adherent of any leeligion.
So does it mean that only leeligious persons are subject to the cause and effect of one's actions?
But also leemember that if for eg. you are a Christian or a Muslim does it mean that you can be a murderer but a Christian or a Muslim you will still have a place in Heaven?
By the way Sikhism, Hinduism and Buddhism do not believe in Heaven or Hell. I stand corrected here.
But I am certain that Sikhism and Hinduism believe in the cycle of rebirths. Being a human is the ultimate opportunity to seek an end to the cycle of rebirths. It may take one thousands and thousands of rebirths to get this opportunity to be born as a human and therefore a priceless chance to end this cycle.
Any enlightened soul can correct what I have stated above.
This person has his own view. Do you agree or disagree?
Is Lee Kuan Yew In Hell Now?
April 1, 2015One of the greatest in modern times has recently passed on. Despite the great things he has done for his countrymen, conventional church teachings clearly conclude that Lee Kuan Yew is hellbound. What gives? Or did Mr Lee’s passing make a mockery of the church’s teachings?
When I was a Christian, I tried to persuade my father to be one as well. He gave me a good reason why he would never be one: going by the logic of Christian teachings, a man like Lee Kuan Yew (LKY) would be consigned to hell in spite of all the good he had done till then. Now, my father was a gangster (lol) and he naturally despised LKY because LKY made it almost impossible for his ‘career’. Every election he would tell me he was going to vote against LKY’s party, the People’s Action Party. But I have no doubt he was convinced LKY was a good man. So it made no sense to him how the Christian God would send this good man to hell.
When my father died, I had to reexamine my faith, especially the part about hell and eternal torment for those who have never ‘invited Jesus into their hearts’. My father was the only one on earth who loved me, and I him. Even if I were to be blessed with a blissful destiny, how would I be able to spend my eternity with joy knowing this loved one of mine would be simultaneously tormented.
Also, when I looked around, I see nice and selfless people who did not believe in Jesus. Was hell to be the final destination for them just because they didn’t know Him? I remember Amin, (when I first saw the name Amin, I said of no, is he talking about my friend Idi Amin Dada -- lol) a Malay Muslim recruit platoon mate of mine who took selfless care of me when I was very sick in the army barracks. Is he hell-bound too just because he betted on the wrong prophet? If only there were a third destiny, good old Death for example, in addition to heaven or hell, would Christianity make sense, I thought. But the mainstream church’s teachings do not allow for it, it seemed.
Frustrated, I put my quest for answers on hold and concentrate on the business of making a living. A few years later, I stumbled on “Christianity vs Atheism” debates on YouTube, and this rekindled my interest in Christianity. This time I thought I would get more involved by volunteering for some ‘churchy’ work. I thought I found one right up my alley; the Anglican Church here in Singapore plants churches in Thailand and therefore would need to equip their missionaries with good Thai language skills, not just spoken but written as well. By God’s grace, I had by then, gained a unique insight into the Thai script system and had devised a teaching method that requires only 4 days for someone keen to master the ABC’s of Thai, while conventional methods would call for months. I somehow got in touch with the relevant pastors overseeing this outreach program and scheduled a meeting with them. When the day and time came, I showed up but they had forgotten about it. Naturally I was surprised. And pissed. What kind of Mickey Mouse operation is this, I thought. Later that day, we managed to meet and I told them my ideas, but not before I gently hinted my ‘pissedness’. They politely pooh-poohed my ideas, saying they were happy with their current setup and saw no need to change. Disappointed, I left, with more questions than answers swimming in my head.
I’ve been taught then that the Holy Spirit has been responsible for the birth and growth of the church. So I believed then that churches were supposedly led by the Spirit which inspired Christians worldwide to do ‘churchy’ work. I thought I was led likewise to seek ‘churchy’ work. So why was the Spirit in me at odds with the Spirit in them reverential dudes above? And what kind of Spirit is it that fosters a we-are-satisfied-we-don’t-need-improving attitude? Is mediocrity the mark of a Spirit driven project? Is this some kind of Divine humour? Another faith crisis ensued.
This time I got the answers that I sought fast. Via the internet, I chanced upon Jack Crabtree of the Gutenberg College. Here is a guy who has been a mainstream ‘churchy’ Christian all his life but now is studying the Bible for what it has to say, instead of imposing on the Bible with what the Church has to say, and dedicating his life to teaching what he studied. So I learned that as far as the Gospel is concerned, there are two separate views: the Church’s interpretation, and what the Bible actually says, in other words, the ‘churchical’ and the biblical views. In yet other words, the ‘churchical’ view is ‘another Gospel’. In the ‘churchical’ view, despite the enormous good LKY has done, he is now in hell. No ifs or buts. During the national mourning last week, ‘churchical’ Christians in Singapore were (and still are) in a real bind; they saw that the obvious inescapable good he had done for Singapore was at odds with their basic belief of inescapable hell for non-believers like LKY. It should have really sucked to be a sensitive ‘churchical’ Christian in Singapore then; their real flesh-and-blood hero was hell-bound.
But the biblical view is something else. This is what the Bible really teaches about the afterlife: there is no heaven nor hell. When we die, we simply cease to be. Period. No soul. No nothing. However, we would continue to exist, only in the mind of God as individual ideas, just as we were merely ideas in His mind before we were born, and even before the foundation of the world. But one day there will be the Day of the Final Judgment, when all the dead shall be resurrected to account for their lives lived. Unfortunately, all will face condemnation due to our basic evil nature. However, a fraction of us will receive God’s mercy and will be granted the blessed life for all eternity. The rest of us will be punished in commiseration with the evil done during our earthly lives, after which total destruction follows. No hell. Or heaven. Only extinction or a blessed life eternal as the final destiny for all mankind.
So who will receive mercy and why? Christians will fall over each other to answer: “the ones who accepted Jesus, of course”. They will cite several New Testament passages, which I argue are all divorced from their context; those passages are applicable only to Jews in the Jewish context. Jews were expecting a Messiah and those passages were written to proclaim Jesus as that Messiah. Gentiles don’t have this context. So well meaning Christian evangelicals who went around the Gentile world proclaiming “Just believe in Jesus and be saved!” are proclaiming a half truth, which is as good as a falsehood, I.e., a lie. In Matthew 7:21-23,
And if Christians insist on “no belief in Jesus, no salvation”, then those Old Testament heroes like Abraham et al, would all be disqualified. Also, in the Parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector where the tax collector was instead the one who went home justified, the only thing sought by the tax collector was, mercy. That was what got him justified, his asking for mercy. Jesus clearly did not add a disclaimer of “Oh, and er, he’d also need to believe in Me after I die. Let’s not forget that!”
A huge portion of the Bible is about the Jews, God’s chosen, especially how God dealt with them, and how He will deal with them in the future. Therefore most of the Bible are not directly applicable to us Gentiles. We Gentiles need not be envious or feel left out or ditch the Bible. It is by understanding the Bible that we can clearly know who God is and what He ultimately asks of us, the rest of mankind. The whole Bible actually hinges on only two commandments directly relevant to us Gentiles: love God with all your heart, and love your neighbour as yourself (Matthew 22:36-40). Since loving God is experientially nebulous and hardly tangible, I would have to argue therefore, there is actually only one concrete commandment, i.e., that you love God by loving others as yourself. That, my friends, is to do the will of God, as in Matthew 7:21-23 above,
And now the conclusion according to this gentleman ---- which I completely disagree with.
However, it does not follow that Old Fart Lee and his Evil wife are in Heaven or Hell.
---- and LKY had given his whole life doing just that. LKY worried daily about the welfare of his fellow countrymen till the day he died. Put it in another way, Singapore was LKY’s cross to bear, and bore he did, till the end of his time. LKY did not retire and died. He worked tirelessly till he was admitted to hospital for severe pneumonia and died after more than a month. And so, if the betting offices were still open on the Day of the Final Judgment, I would bet my all on LKY and his wife receiving the mercy of God.
If you think Old Fart Lee and his Evil wife are in Heaven -- I pray please let me hear your views.
If he and his ugly Evil wife are in Hell please let me hear your views.
If you think they are subject to the cycle of rebirths for a missed opportunity again please let me hear your views.
---- All according to your religious views or if you do not believe in any particular leeligion then what do you think?
Last edited:
