HERO or HOOLIGAN OR ANOTHER FALSE FLAG?
In online video, man accuses another of taking pictures of girls in mall. Netizens argue over whether he used too much force when he grabbed suspect
By Ho Lian-Yi
January 05, 2009
WAS this the behaviour of a 'brave vigilante' or a brash bully?
That is the question raised after a video, titled 'Brave vigilante nabs guy who took photos of girls', was featured on The Straits Times website Stomp.
Judging from the mostly negative comments left behind by viewers, people were not quite so positive about the man's behaviour.
The burly man in a tucked-out shirt had been filmed, apparently in VivoCity, with one hand tightly gripping his victim's collar.
With his other hand pointing at the other man's face, he said, facing the camera: 'This guy takes pictures of girls!'
The 'victim', a far scrawnier man wearing a black T-shirt, seems to deny his accusations.
This appears to enrage his captor, who presses his free hand against his throat, and yells vulgarities.
Then they are led away, apparently by shopping centre security personnel.
This scene was originally posted on video-sharing website YouTube by a user named fsasava in August 2008. He did not respond to The New Paper's inquiries.
It was not clear what led to the fracas, though the general speculation is that the other man may have been taking indecent photos of women.
In comments accompanying his video, fsasava said he didn't know what had happened before he was alerted to the scene by shouting.
Many of those who posted comments after seeing the video on YouTube or Stomp felt the man in white had crossed the line between civic action and unreasonable aggression.
n0vice1234, wrote: 'I also feel like the man in white is more like a BULLY and HOOLIGAN. He has no right to do what he did. He could have just alerted the security.'
Getting the facts straight
Another user, laogenjudi, wrote: 'Before we are so quick to label the fellow as 'Brave vigilante' let us get the facts straight. What has the boy done wrong? Can we not say that the man was bullying?
'Manhandling is unlawful and a criminal offence. The boy can consider taking a civil suit against him. Keep the video in case his lawyer needsit.'
Mr Chong Jiayi, 28, a technical director, thought the video was 'quite funny' after seeing it.
Even if the man in black was taking improper pictures of women, he said: 'It's not something that warrants this kind of aggression in public.'
Miss Lye Peixian, 26, a client relations associate, said: 'I think it's quite violent. I don't think he needed to go that far.
'He could have gone through legitimate means like calling security or the police, instead of using violence.'
But there were others who applauded the vigilante's actions.
On YouTube, a user named thypaid wrote: 'Well, imagine the guy taking a photo of your girlfriend, wife or, worse, even mother. Would you not beat the crap out of him? I would do it without hesitation.'
One Stomp user, pinkbutterfly88, said: 'This man in white is quite a hero...'
'Some perverted men think taking photos of chio (pretty in Hokkien) women can brag to friends as girlfriends or upload to blogs. Kudos to this gentleman because fewer perverts will dare hit VivoCity!'
She ended her comment by pleading for 'MrVigilante' to go to the Commonwealth area where she claimed she was often sexually harassed.
Mr Joel Lim, 24, a photographer, said he thought what the man in white did 'took some guts' and his actions were 'justified although a bit heavy-handed'.
'Did he go too far by laying his hands on the guy? Probably. But I think if he didn't the guy (taking the pictures), he would have just got away instead of being stopped.'
Was what the vigilante did wrong from a legal perspective?
Though it's not clear from the video if the man in black had committed a crime, lawyer Anthony Lim said any civilian can use 'reasonable force' to apprehend anyone breaking the law.
What is deemed 'reasonable force' depends on the circumstances.
'But he went beyond that boundary by using vulgarities,' he said.
Foul language
He used the example of policemen making arrests. 'Do they use abusive words? No,' he said.
But he added that if the man had indeed stopped a crime, he should still be commended for doing a good deed.
Mr Lim said there is no provision for the punishment of 'unreasonable force'. It would be a separate offence.
For example, he could not 'hammer a person's face' just because the latter was photographing somebody's underwear. For that, he could be charged with causing grievous hurt, and jailed if found guilty.
If he caused lacerations while holding a criminal's neck, he could still be charged with causing hurt, and fined.
'But usually in cases of causing hurt, like abrasions, the police will just warn the person,' Mr Lim said.
In online video, man accuses another of taking pictures of girls in mall. Netizens argue over whether he used too much force when he grabbed suspect
By Ho Lian-Yi
January 05, 2009
WAS this the behaviour of a 'brave vigilante' or a brash bully?
That is the question raised after a video, titled 'Brave vigilante nabs guy who took photos of girls', was featured on The Straits Times website Stomp.
Judging from the mostly negative comments left behind by viewers, people were not quite so positive about the man's behaviour.
The burly man in a tucked-out shirt had been filmed, apparently in VivoCity, with one hand tightly gripping his victim's collar.
With his other hand pointing at the other man's face, he said, facing the camera: 'This guy takes pictures of girls!'
The 'victim', a far scrawnier man wearing a black T-shirt, seems to deny his accusations.
This appears to enrage his captor, who presses his free hand against his throat, and yells vulgarities.
Then they are led away, apparently by shopping centre security personnel.
This scene was originally posted on video-sharing website YouTube by a user named fsasava in August 2008. He did not respond to The New Paper's inquiries.
It was not clear what led to the fracas, though the general speculation is that the other man may have been taking indecent photos of women.
In comments accompanying his video, fsasava said he didn't know what had happened before he was alerted to the scene by shouting.
Many of those who posted comments after seeing the video on YouTube or Stomp felt the man in white had crossed the line between civic action and unreasonable aggression.
n0vice1234, wrote: 'I also feel like the man in white is more like a BULLY and HOOLIGAN. He has no right to do what he did. He could have just alerted the security.'
Getting the facts straight
Another user, laogenjudi, wrote: 'Before we are so quick to label the fellow as 'Brave vigilante' let us get the facts straight. What has the boy done wrong? Can we not say that the man was bullying?
'Manhandling is unlawful and a criminal offence. The boy can consider taking a civil suit against him. Keep the video in case his lawyer needsit.'
Mr Chong Jiayi, 28, a technical director, thought the video was 'quite funny' after seeing it.
Even if the man in black was taking improper pictures of women, he said: 'It's not something that warrants this kind of aggression in public.'
Miss Lye Peixian, 26, a client relations associate, said: 'I think it's quite violent. I don't think he needed to go that far.
'He could have gone through legitimate means like calling security or the police, instead of using violence.'
But there were others who applauded the vigilante's actions.
On YouTube, a user named thypaid wrote: 'Well, imagine the guy taking a photo of your girlfriend, wife or, worse, even mother. Would you not beat the crap out of him? I would do it without hesitation.'
One Stomp user, pinkbutterfly88, said: 'This man in white is quite a hero...'
'Some perverted men think taking photos of chio (pretty in Hokkien) women can brag to friends as girlfriends or upload to blogs. Kudos to this gentleman because fewer perverts will dare hit VivoCity!'
She ended her comment by pleading for 'MrVigilante' to go to the Commonwealth area where she claimed she was often sexually harassed.
Mr Joel Lim, 24, a photographer, said he thought what the man in white did 'took some guts' and his actions were 'justified although a bit heavy-handed'.
'Did he go too far by laying his hands on the guy? Probably. But I think if he didn't the guy (taking the pictures), he would have just got away instead of being stopped.'
Was what the vigilante did wrong from a legal perspective?
Though it's not clear from the video if the man in black had committed a crime, lawyer Anthony Lim said any civilian can use 'reasonable force' to apprehend anyone breaking the law.
What is deemed 'reasonable force' depends on the circumstances.
'But he went beyond that boundary by using vulgarities,' he said.
Foul language
He used the example of policemen making arrests. 'Do they use abusive words? No,' he said.
But he added that if the man had indeed stopped a crime, he should still be commended for doing a good deed.
Mr Lim said there is no provision for the punishment of 'unreasonable force'. It would be a separate offence.
For example, he could not 'hammer a person's face' just because the latter was photographing somebody's underwear. For that, he could be charged with causing grievous hurt, and jailed if found guilty.
If he caused lacerations while holding a criminal's neck, he could still be charged with causing hurt, and fined.
'But usually in cases of causing hurt, like abrasions, the police will just warn the person,' Mr Lim said.
