Going Back to Tanaka and Zhou EnLai in 1972 on the Senkaku Issue.

[drifter]

Thanks chunkyworld for all the information ... Guess we really need to have an open mind

 

[chuckyworld]

Japanese vets admit on film to Nanjing atrocities
Last Updated: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 | 2:17 PM ET
CBC News
http://www.cbc.ca/news/arts/film/story/2010/03/31/nanjing-documentary.html

To the Japanese, the Chinese were considered to be even lower than the sub-human Koreans. Tamaki Matsuoka, a retired teacher, who had spent a decade interviewing more than 300 Chinese victims and 250 Japanese soldiers. Japanese veterans admit on camera their crimes in the documentary "Torn Memories of Nanjing". Tomokazu Takeda said, "Many of the soldiers still did not see Chinese people as human beings. It seems they had no opportunities to correct or reflect on that view after the war". Out of the 250 former soldiers interviewed, only 3 expressed regret for their actions, Tamaki Matsuoka said.

 

[chuckyworld]

Thanks chunkyworld for all the information ... Guess we really need to have an open mind

Hey Drifter, we all can't be right all the time, i do make mistake till i do a research on it, China under Mao does have lot of skeleton too but still prefer him over the KMT, at least the country is whole no divided and under foreign control, that will be another subject on another thread.

How is your missy doing, pray that she is fine and well and you too.

 

[drifter]

Hey Drifter, we all can't be right all the time, i do make mistake till i do a research on it, China under Mao does have lot of skeleton too but still prefer him over the KMT, at least the country is whole no divided and under foreign control, that will be another subject on another thread.

How is your missy doing, pray that she is fine and well and you too.

Yes , we are all humans and we don't know each and every single things around the world .. Everyday we are learning from one another . Learning is part of growing up . And we must seek the truth rather then assuming . Every coin have 2 sides we must all look at things from different perspective only then we can know the truth ..

Thanks chuckyworld , she is fine now . Thankyou for your kind words . Hope ppl here can also have an open mind for everything not only about Nanking .... Cheers .

 

[Sideswipe]

I'm definitely not bias at all. That was my pt all along so what if mao thanked them? The fact of the matter is mao was involved in a civil war with GMD His thanking of them was due to the circumstances that allowed him to win. That's all there is to it. It doesn't even prove anything.

there were wartime reports from Chungking of the Chinese Communist colluding with the Japanese to attack Nationalist troops. Chungking chose to suppress those reports to save face and for the sake of national unity, to expose the Communist would mean open civil war which was not desirable at that time. the Kuomintang government did not want it's people and the outside world to know that they cannot control their Communist.

One of the men in the group of party workers at Sian was from Shantung. He told me the story of the wiping out of Chin Chiyung's forces, which I later found was known to everybody in Chungking.
General Yu Hsueh-chung's twenty thousand troops were being transferred, and a force under another commander was being sent to replace them. Before the new troops had arrived, one of the Communist leaders, Li Fo-cheh, led his troops to attack the Central troops from the south, while the Japanese attacked them from the north. Being hopelessly outnumbered and surrounded, Chin committed suicide rather than surrender, on August 7, 1943.
( by Dr Lin Yutang, Vigil of a nation 1945 )

Chairman Mao Zedong was naturally thankful to the Japanese for the latter never exposed the Chinese Communist war time collusion activities with them.

I'm saying it's possible that crime are committed by the locals ..as I say many many times it's a controversy issue in Nanking ..until now still they are still debating
Looks like there's too much controversy in nanjing

Nanjing massacre is a true fact. the Chinese had the death figures at 300-350K. Professor Hata Ikuhiko, out of his limited conscience, estimated that about 40K Chinese were massacred in Nanking.

China under Mao does have lot of skeleton too but still prefer him over the KMT, at least the country is whole no divided and under foreign control, that will be another subject on another thread.

the rise of Mr Mao Zedong was the biggest tragedy to happen for China, before and after 1949. Mao was not a simple agrarian reformer nor a Marxist Communist, he was simply an opportunist with no values nor principles. that's why he can sacrifice the Chinese people and colluded with the Japanese invaders during wartime.

Soviet diplomat Peter Vladimirov, Soviet representative to Yan'an said that he accidentally saw a telegraph report from the New Fourth Army. the report clearly stated that the leaders of the Chinese Communist Party and the the Japanese supreme command in China had maintained long term contact. the telegraph showed that contact with the Japanese headquarters reports were regularly sent to Yan'an. Vladimirov later confirmed that the link between the Chinese Communist military and the Japanese staff agencies has been maintained for a long time. the contact was Yan'an and Nanking. Mao Zedong liaison agent was a part of General Okamura Yasuji Nanking headquarters.
( from Vladimirov's diaries )

the Chinese Communist troops' activities during the war suggested that they seemed to have reached a non-aggression pact with the Japanese. the CCP concentrated full efforts on expanding it's territories by fighting against Nationalist troops and local militias, not Japanese invaders.

our fixed policy during the war are 70% expanding territory, 20% negotiating with the Kuomintang, 10% fighting the Japanese
( Mao Zedong directive to political workers of the Eighth Route Army, October 1937 )

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

there were wartime reports from Chungking of the Chinese Communist colluding with the Japanese to attack Nationalist troops. Chungking chose to suppress those reports to save face and for the sake of national unity, to expose the Communist would mean open civil war which was not desirable at that time. the Kuomintang government did not want it's people and the outside world to know that they cannot control their Communist.

One of the men in the group of party workers at Sian was from Shantung. He told me the story of the wiping out of Chin Chiyung's forces, which I later found was known to everybody in Chungking.
General Yu Hsueh-chung's twenty thousand troops were being transferred, and a force under another commander was being sent to replace them. Before the new troops had arrived, one of the Communist leaders, Li Fo-cheh, led his troops to attack the Central troops from the south, while the Japanese attacked them from the north. Being hopelessly outnumbered and surrounded, Chin committed suicide rather than surrender, on August 7, 1943.
( by Dr Lin Yutang, Vigil of a nation 1945 )

Chairman Mao Zedong was naturally thankful to the Japanese for the latter never exposed the Chinese Communist war time collusion activities with them.

Yeah i see thanks for this explaination now it makes clearer sense. Well you aren't biased you showed that both sides weren't angels. I mean trying to say that the nanjing massacre did not occur and even worse when you read the descriptions of how the japs were giving the citizens of an enemy country money. I mean is this the jap army that was looting, killing, raping all across so many asian countries? If they were so nice to the citizens of nanjing then this must be the special section of the jap army cos their comrades were busy doing the exact opposites in other asian countries if that account was true.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

James McCallum wrote in his diary on January 8, 1938 that he had heard a Chinese refugee testify, “I can prove that the rape, looting and arson were committed by Chinese soldiers, not Japanese soldiers”

James McCallum, one of the 27 Westerners who stayed in Nanjing, wrote in his Family Letter :

"Never have I heard or read of such brutality. Rape: Rape: Rape: We estimate at least 1,000 cases a night and many by day. In case of resistance or anything that seems like disapproval there is a bayonet stab or a bullet. We could write up hundreds of cases a day...."

Chinese women would try to disguise themselves as men, or old women, or don blackface to avoid being gang-raped by Japanese soldiers.


If the same approach is used for the number of Rapes, i.e.
Use "3 months" of continuous Rape , in the larger "Nanjing Special Municipality" as the city boundary , and add the number of girls and women Raped but were too ashame to tell , plus the huge number of girls and women Raped but were killed immediately after the Rape that has been confirmed by many former Japanese soldiers as their common practice to hide their Rape crimes ,


Actual number of girls and women Raped could be more than 100,000 instead of only 20,000.

Look at this. 2 different accounts of the same exact person. Hey it's very easy to dispute the rape of nanjing. Didn't drifter post about an international press that arrived with the japs. Well seriously why have they not published their facts to dispute all of that? In fact it would serve their interests to do that since that would embarrass china in the international eyes. China is the enemy now and a bigger threat while japan is more like the ally and a dog to the westerners. Seriously if the international press was there according to drifter's post how in the hell could iris chang even publish her book the rape of nanking? She would have been discredited.

 

[apogee]

japan should do the right thing by invading and raping the chinese because that is the only language they understand. After all, the monggolians did this 800 years ago and probably every china man has monggolian blood in his veins. Its time to impregnate japanese blood in chinese veins.

That is because the Han Chinese fucked not only the Mongolians but the Manchurian as well. That is why, you do not see any significant Mongolian or Manchurian legacies in China today.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

a Chinese American named Iris Chang wrote a book entitled, The Rape of Nanking. It tells about the brutal massacre by the Japanese in Nanking. It became a bestseller in the USA and other countries, and spread the lie of the Nanking Massacre. Later, Chang’s book was much criticized by many other authors. It has been pointed out that what she wrote and the photos in her book were not related to the so-called Nanking Massacre. She shot herself by pistol and died in 2004.

Now look at this here. Go check out iris chang's bio. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iris_Chang

Look at the post by drifter here. It just states she shot herself by pistol in 2004 after she was supposedly critizied by "many authors" this gives the impression that she actually shot herself out of guilt for posting misinformation on nanking and her book even got to become a best seller. Imagine that. Writing a book that didn't even present the facts correctly and became a best seller for 10 weeks on the new york times and even had a movie that was based on this book that was filmed in 2007. Seriously i mean if that was to happen then she must have magical powers to somehow write a fictionious story and tried to pass it off as fact and then made it to 10 weeks on the best sellers list of the ny times which is like the oscars of the novel world and then even have a movie influenced by the book that was filmed 10 yrs later even though the book is supposedly fake or that is what drifter posted.

Yes she was critized by a professor at a san diego uni but not for spreading misinformation BUT rather for trying to incite anger against the japs rather than try to heal the wounds and please take note that is the opinion of this professor. Please learn how to read and discern for yourselves what one's opinion is on the subject and what outright misinformation means.

Quoted ad verbatim: The book attracted both praise for exposing the details of the atrocity, and criticism because of alleged bias and inaccuracies. Alvin D Coox, a professor at San Diego State University, said of Chang's book, "As a work of history, Chang's book is flawed, as we have sought to demonstrate. If it is a politically motivated work of partisan propaganda, it is successful to a certain degree. But shouldn't Chang's compassion extend to the healing of old wounds rather than their revival?"[SUP][8][/SUP] After publication of the book, Chang campaigned to persuade the Japanese government to apologize for its troops' wartime conduct and to pay compensation.




Look at the last sentence that i made larger. Now if the rape of nanjing did not even happen how in the hell is she supposed to campaign for the jap govt to apologize?


Now the last sentence in drifter's post that she committed suicide in 2004 but no reason was stated but from the way it is written it seems to imply she killed herself out of guilt for spreading misinformation about the nanjing massacre which is of course horseshit if you read further.

She was heavily into medication and lacked sleep while researching about the bataan death march in the philippines. Therefore the issue isn't even on china anymore. From her suicide notes the US govt might have played a hand in forcing her to commit suicide probably due to her promoting about the chinese in america but let's get this straight she didn't kill herself due to guilt about making up stories on the nanjing massacre.

The ppl of nanjing actually built a statue to honor her. Now for those that think the rape of nanjing did not exist and that the japs actually liberated them why in the hell would the ppl build a statue for her then? Oh yes cos you know they could somehow get some money by building a statue in her memory. You know iris chang being an author of a best seller should be filthy rich and with her death the money should obviously fall into her parents hands and by building the statue in her honor her parents will be so touched by it they will donate money to the citizens of nanjing or maybe the US govt will do it. Man those evil tiongs sure have astounding logic to get their money.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

On the day when the Japanese troops entered Nanking, more than 100 press reporters and photographers entered together with them. The press corps were not only from Japan, but also from European and American press organizations, including Reuters and AP. However, none of the press corps reported the occurrence of a massacre of 300,000 people. Paramount News (American newsreels) made films reporting the Japanese occupation in Nanking, but did not report the occurrence of a massacre.

The British newspaper North China Daily News, which was published in China in English on December 24, 1937, eleven days after the Japanese occupation of Nanking, carried a photo taken in Nanking by their photographer. The photo was entitled "Japanese distribute gifts in Nanking." In the photo are Japanese soldiers distributing gifts, and Chinese adults and children receiving the gifts and rejoicing. Is this the scene of a massacre?

OMG press reporters from various countries in europe and the US where the hell are you guys? Why have you not published the story denying the rape of nanjing that was created by the evil tiongs to cheat japan of some coffee money? China is the big bad guy now. You know the guy that is stealing all your jobs and making useless household appliances that you use. While the beautiful japan with their nice sony ps3, anime, porn and nice fast cars are being pressured by the evil china once again. Why have not the whole bunch of you written up an article or at least donated your pictures to some magazine to refute the rape of nanjing. You could have gotten time magazine to write it. Time is anti china but pro india oh they would be so pleased to have written an article denying the rape of nanjing and to spare their ally their beloved japan from this ransom that china is holding them. Seriously i wonder why these 100 reporters some from reputated news agencies have not stepped forward to refute the rape of nanjing. Oh yes perhaps because it actually did occur.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

japan should do the right thing by invading and raping the chinese because that is the only language they understand. After all, the monggolians did this 800 years ago and probably every china man has monggolian blood in his veins. Its time to impregnate japanese blood in chinese veins.

Hello nigger do u know it's estimated that perhaps 1 in 10 men the world over might have ghengis blood in them and possibly a larger proportion with mongol blood and that it involves men of many ethnicities and not just chinese but many countries including india, europe and central asian countries. Some ppl actually feel proud about this but let's get to the pt. You're trying to showcase that many chinese ancestors got raped but i just want to tell you that many races were raped. Actually i'm not even sure if china even suffered extensive damage at all because you see the yuan dynasty of china was one of the shortest dynasties and they got overthrown by the chinese. I think it was probably like 100 yrs long. Now that is very different from how the mongols ruled say northern india for eg.

Btw you say impregnante chinese blood with blood from other races well do you know it can happen the way you don't intend it to. Like it's more likely for the chinese to rape the japs therefore you can say the chinese blood has mingled with jap blood but not in the way u intended correct?

Just like how chinese blood has mingled with malay blood when i fuck a nice hot minah. So is this ok?

 

[chuckyworld]

Look at this. 2 different accounts of the same exact person. Hey it's very easy to dispute the rape of nanjing. Didn't drifter post about an international press that arrived with the japs. Well seriously why have they not published their facts to dispute all of that? In fact it would serve their interests to do that since that would embarrass china in the international eyes. China is the enemy now and a bigger threat while japan is more like the ally and a dog to the westerners. Seriously if the international press was there according to drifter's post how in the hell could iris chang even publish her book the rape of nanking? She would have been discredited.

Jah, you can alway dig deeper, all have link to site, you cannot depend on 1 source you need to verified from other source too, the last few post i post has site link, you can alway check the authentic of the comments by james McCallum simply bo going to Yale divinity school in USA.

To the Japanese Nanjing Massacre "denying camp", Martha said, " We have never had Japanese ultra-nationalists come here and look at these records because it is very clear to anyone, looking at these records, that it occurred. You have several different people giving independent accounts and they were all documenting the same events. These could not possibly be any kind of way that they were making up what they saw.

Former navy sailor Sho Mitani, 90, said he chose to speak out when Tokyo's conservative governor Shintaro Ishihara in a 1990 magazine interview denied the Nanking massacre as a "lie." "I told myself, 'Now that's wrong,' because it really happened," said Mitani, who said he witnessed killings through a telescope from a navy destroyer. "I had to tell the truth".


Many of the western missionaries' diaries and letters that elaborately depicted the scale and character of the Nanjing Massacre are all available at the Yale Divinity School Library, where Martha Smalley works as the archivist.

 

[Received_by_Kings]

Zhou Enlai is an opportunist and a realist.

He works to save his own skin first. Notice how he blows up to Mao Zedong whom he disagreed with to avoid persecution and punishment?

 

[Bigfuck]

Japanese vets admit on film to Nanjing atrocities
Last Updated: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 | 2:17 PM ET
CBC News
http://www.cbc.ca/news/arts/film/story/2010/03/31/nanjing-documentary.html

Go educate Gaijin drifter for the SBF to have an open mind. This topic cannot have open mind for East Asians or East Asian wannabes and the blame game will continue even if the past history was settled diplomatically. Whatever angmoh account, even if it looks or is objective (if it is ever possible in non-technical sciences), will be disputed. NHK, for example, as bad as CCTV, is a propaganda agenciy that will conveniently censor these topics and both agencies have ridiculous budgets to do it. S Korea is no different either. Look at the Fukushima debacle you will know. Early video footage broadcast came from the 30 over american technicians working at Fukushima Daiichi but no Japanese news wants to mention the credits. Everyone thought some goon Japanese took it. Please lah, old Jippun fogey using a video capture on phone? First class censorship continues and it would not really matter what the truth is as the fabricated ones are easier to remember. Truth is stranger than fiction because the truth will never be a coherent whole. Many things happen at the same time and not in the logical sequence best suited for remembering and analyzing. It is better to masturbate a fake perception of the truth than to have a grocery list of items that happened which makes little sense as a whole. East Asia or Northeast Asia has a 3,000-5,000 written history (take your pick as all 3 countries dispute each other's historical roots) legacy to fuck the 3 main country members. It will continue and there is no need to participate in the business of a region that is not ours. It was never a talk about truth but an assertion about prevailling lies. If assertion cannot be done by shouting and words, fists will come in which will not end well and eventually it will escalate to guns and missiles to eliminate whatever dissenting breath that exists. I have seen tendencies among all 3 species in all 3 nations, and even in fist-fights that I stopped, mediated directly or witness, the call for the blood of death is still strong and if any of these 3 species had access to a bigger gun they would use it. I attribute it to their language and historical censorship of information and thought control as the main cause. Anyhow, the show is going to get exciting as everyone else in the world watches.

 

[scbccb]

Which generation baboon are you? Your ancestor cooperated with Nazis and East Asian Imperialists, leemember that. Don't putu mayam coconut just because India sent a failed mission to the moon.

Talk so much for fuck? What generation chink are you? Your ancestor ran away from china, REMEMBER THAT. Don't yaya papaya just because China is up there now.