Dual Citizenship / NS Obligations / HDB Flats and Migration

[blindswordsman]

As long as you are a local sinkie, and regardless whether you are an elite or a peasant in sinkie land, you have to fight and die when the time comes. Those FT with dual citizenship are nothing else but economic refugees here, Tee kor liang, tee kor chor. SG Govt is stupid to grant dual citizenship. Follow the global trend? See what Americans with dual citizenship did to USA?

 

[blindswordsman]

Single citizenship is simply a punishment on the poor peasants to keep them enslaved to serve the elites.

Single citizenship is your pledge of loyalty to a country where you were born and bred. No matter how rotten the Govt is, you are still a native of your land. You can change the Govt for not looking after you well. Sinkies might be doing it soon. Sinkies want SG for Singaporeans, not FT with dual citizenship. You emigrate, you become a 2nd class citizen in another country. There is always an elite class in every country.

 

[Getloud]

Single citizenship is your pledge of loyalty to a country where you were born and bred. No matter how rotten the Govt is, you are still a native of your land. You can change the Govt for not looking after you well. Sinkies might be doing it soon. Sinkies want SG for Singaporeans, not FT with dual citizenship. You emigrate, you become a 2nd class citizen in another country. There is always an elite class in every country.

I'm feeling 3rd class in SG, (2nd class belongs to FT), although I've my own business in SG.
So, still not bad, being 2nd class in other country.

 

[Leongsam]

Single citizenship is your pledge of loyalty to a country

What is your concept of "loyalty" and why is it important to be loyal to a country in this day and age?

 

[Confused]

Would having single citizenship guarantee the person would be loyal? Is loyalty to government the same as loyalty to country?
Do Singaporeans serve NS because they are loyal and patriotic or is it because forced to?

 

[The_Hypocrite]

That Aussie commander was Bennet and he paid some fishermen to take him away from singapore abandoning his men,,,but he only 1 clown, and he was never charged after the war as he was aussie and got protection from the oz...anyway percival was incompetent too,,,there was plans before the invasion for the poms to attack thailand to prevent the japs from using it to invade malaya,,but poms kiasu etc,,did not do it.

when the navy left to attack the japs in thailand,,the airforce never even offer airsupport to the navy...poms were just bloody incompetent

Well, the superior Brits believe the Japs cannot fly at night. Just because they never expect a "mechanised" infantry cycling down the peninsula, the Brits have their guns pointing the wrong direction and the bombs were useless for land operations. 2 warships sank and the multinational force was in disarry, Indians side the Jap.

Percival was conned, the Aussie commander chickened back to convict land and there are a number of leaders who cannot withstand Singapore weather without their luxurious lives, taxi-dancers and gin & tonic. I see the same problems with the hush hush Singapore elites.

 

[Spock]

Single citizenship is your pledge of loyalty to a country where you were born and bred. No matter how rotten the Govt is, you are still a native of your land. You can change the Govt for not looking after you well. Sinkies might be doing it soon. Sinkies want SG for Singaporeans, not FT with dual citizenship. You emigrate, you become a 2nd class citizen in another country. There is always an elite class in every country.

Does loyalty mean that you confine yourself within imaginary lines drawn on the map? Animals mark their territories using scents, humans use walls and fences, countries use borders. This is to defend the resources on the territories and the territories can only be as large as you can possibly defend.

During the days of yore, when humans migrate and settle in a new area, they would have to fight off the original inhabitants or predators. Thus, people don't usually move unless they run out of resources or desire even more resources. In this day and age, the rich and talented are not hindered by borders as countries actively court them. Why do you think the term "Foreign Talent" was invented? If these people can easily take advantage of resources in multiple countries, why shouldn't ordinary folk be allowed to do so as well? It should be clear that single citizenship is merely a ploy to prevent peasants from gaining access to more resources by making them believe that everyone is being treated equally. It is to give those who are stuck in SG or unwilling to move out of SG some satisfaction in thinking most people can't have the best of multiple worlds.

I find it strange that SG's lack of resources (not to mention the horrible climate) has not pushed more people to seek out alternatives. I can only conclude that either they are all very happy to live in such crowded conditions or they do not have the courage to move out of their comfort zone.

 

[neddy]

We are moving towards an era where the sovereign state no longer define us.
What happened in the Asian Financial Crisis shows that capital has no boundaries, and people need to follow where the capital go.
The passport is an inconvenience we can do without, it is happening in regions like EU's schengen area.
Soon, there will be no global roaming charges for mobile in this area as well

One dangerous idea I have is how loyalty to the sovereign state is holding Singaporeans back.
In many countries, it is loyalty to their race, such as Japanese, Koreans, Greeks.
Or it is loyality through their shared history such as Brazil (Pardos incl. White-branco)

Singaporeans do not have enough shared history in nation building to create natural loyalty.

 

[Confused]

Singaporeans do not have enough shared history in nation building to create natural loyalty.

Which is why NS is important?

 

[Confused]

I find it strange that SG's lack of resources (not to mention the horrible climate) has not pushed more people to seek out alternatives. I can only conclude that either they are all very happy to live in such crowded conditions or they do not have the courage to move out of their comfort zone.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. Many talk or dream about it but when it comes to action they start worrying about job,income,culture,safety,discrimination and this and that.

They do the same thing about the government. Everytime complain about government but when it comes to election time they won't vote opposition because they are worried about affecting the economy, income,job.

NS does not encourage risk taking. Enlistees and NS men learn how to play the game and avoid trouble with their superiors.

 

[neddy]

Which is why NS is important?

It will be pretty naive to think that shared history can be created with conscription for boys.

There has to be some sort of shared struggle/conflicts/wars to create shared history.

Some people do suggest that NS is to keep hot-blooded young men from raising up against PAP - in other words, turn them into PAP "gu-niang"

 

[blur sotong]

Some people do suggest that NS is to keep hot-blooded young men from raising up against PAP - in other words, turn them into PAP "gu-niang"

Bro neddy, that is an unwritten objective of NS. :(

 

[neddy]

Bro neddy, that is an unwritten objective of NS. :(

That is why NS is for men only, and at the age when men are likely to cause trouble/join the gangs, unlike Israel where both men and women serve. Israel trains SAF in the early days.

Even Taiwan's military plans to become an all-volunteer service by 2017.

 

[snowbird99]

Hey everyone, just want to say a big hello to those who have defaulted on their NS obligations, and to tell them not to fret about their situation.

I too am a defaulter, and I am in Canada now. I did miss my friends and relatives, however I met up with them in JB a few times already. Just a bit more inconvenient, but really no big deal. I do not have any need to visit Singapore or even Malaysia in the near future, and after my recent visit where it was so bloody hot in JB, I doubt I would be back for another 10 years at least. I prefer the nicer weather and cleaner air in Canada.

The PAP can take my Singapore citizenship and shove it. The world is such a big place that not visiting Singapore is not a loss at all. Their recent harsh treatment of Brandon Smith from New Zealand, who does not want to serve NS, and Brian Joseph Chow, who served NS but got charged and was sent to prison, just goes to show how narrow-minded and self-serving the Singapore (PAP) government really is. My friends and relatives all wondered why the Singapore government is so vindictive for someone like me who has emigrated long ago away from there.

Needless to say, I will not be going back to Singapore permanently. The world already has a terrible perception of Singapore's politicians and dirty politics, and its non-transparent emigration policies. PAP, please continue with your draconian NS policies, and keep importing people by the boatloads. You are just going to create more and more people like me.

 

[Agoraphobic]

Hello Snowbird (I take it Snowbird is your nick, not your status?). I did not default my NS "obligation." I don't think it is as harsh and as punishing as many blokes describe it to be. To me, I just did it because it was expected of every male citizen coming to that age. Looking back, I actually enjoyed my time in NS. Made friends from different backgrounds, drank lots of tax-free beer, attended lots of parties, experienced military regimentation, and I survived it. I am not in support of NS as being regimented sucks, but just do it. Don't think too much of it.

I have since given up my Singapore citizenship, not because I disliked Singapore, but because she doesn't allow dual citizenship, and I wanted to get my CPF money to pay for a house in Canada, and to get that money, one has to give up that (Singapore) citizenship. As for loyalty and fighting and invading enemy and all that - I do not have any enemies. But if my own family members are endangered, it is my duty and instinct to protect them. So yes, if a hostile army threatens my family and life, I will of course fight. I think this applies to everyone.

BTW, I've been working in Singapore for over five years now. I do not miss Canada as much as I miss my backyard in my house there - barbecue almost every chance I get (even during winter!!) So, when will the liberals legalize pot? Mr. Trudeau promised the voters didn't he? Not that I care - its not going to make any difference to my life. But with the change in the legal status of the weed, there will be some social changes as well.

Cheers!

Hey everyone, just want to say a big hello to those who have defaulted on their NS obligations, and to tell them not to fret about their situation.

I too am a defaulter, and I am in Canada now. I did miss my friends and relatives, however I met up with them in JB a few times already. Just a bit more inconvenient, but really no big deal. I do not have any need to visit Singapore or even Malaysia in the near future, and after my recent visit where it was so bloody hot in JB, I doubt I would be back for another 10 years at least. I prefer the nicer weather and cleaner air in Canada.

The PAP can take my Singapore citizenship and shove it. The world is such a big place that not visiting Singapore is not a loss at all. Their recent harsh treatment of Brandon Smith from New Zealand, who does not want to serve NS, and Brian Joseph Chow, who served NS but got charged and was sent to prison, just goes to show how narrow-minded and self-serving the Singapore (PAP) government really is. My friends and relatives all wondered why the Singapore government is so vindictive for someone like me who has emigrated long ago away from there.

Needless to say, I will not be going back to Singapore permanently. The world already has a terrible perception of Singapore's politicians and dirty politics, and its non-transparent emigration policies. PAP, please continue with your draconian NS policies, and keep importing people by the boatloads. You are just going to create more and more people like me.

 

[snowbird99]

Hi Agoraphobic, funny thing your nickname indicates the opposite of where you should be right now. Canada, after all, has a much lower population density.

After the Liberals were voted in, to the demise of the Conservatives, marijuana shops have been opening all the place. I believe Justin Trudeau is going to fulfil his promise, quite soon.

May I ask why you are back in Singapore working? Is it the pay, or the quality of career advancement back there? I ask because living in Canada is just so much better... fresh air, less crowd, much cheaper cars, pretty ang moh women, etc.

 

[Agoraphobic]

Well, after settling down in Toronto (Markham actually), the first trip back to Asia was to China. I joined a group tour that visited Beijing, Shanghai, and Changsha. I actually liked Changsha so much, I started making inquiries about available work there. I am disadvantaged in this - I am hopeless at Mandarin, flunked my GCE O levels in Chinese, so working in China was out of the question, then a few years later, on a vacation trip back to Singapore, I bumped into my ex-boss (the first company I worked for after graduating), The company had grown and was now operating in other Asian countries, my boss then offered me a regional position as Sales Manager, (I suppose I must have left a good impression when I first worked for him), and I took it on. He understood my position now that I have a family and offered me a position under Employment Pass. Even thought I am based in Singapore, my responsibility is over other ASEAN territories. Singapore's position is advantageous for regional work. So here I am, with my family. In a place I am familiar and grew up in. Only thing I hope is that Singapore's currency remains strong, which it is holding up very well. Earning Sing Dollar, and spending vacations in Malaysia and Indonesia makes sense, so I make full use of the position I have. Only thing I have to do without here in Singapore is ganja. Better not smoke that shit here, so I drink beer instead. Now that there is an openness to Craft Beer, this suits me fine! I am not paid that much, but I do not have a high-expense lifestyle. Even though many things in Singapore are expensive (eg. cars!), I am happy to settle for lower priced items, live simply, enjoy the company of my friends, and relatives. Try to be happy with the simple things in life.

Cheers!

Hi Agoraphobic, funny thing your nickname indicates the opposite of where you should be right now. Canada, after all, has a much lower population density.

After the Liberals were voted in, to the demise of the Conservatives, marijuana shops have been opening all the place. I believe Justin Trudeau is going to fulfil his promise, quite soon.

May I ask why you are back in Singapore working? Is it the pay, or the quality of career advancement back there? I ask because living in Canada is just so much better... fresh air, less crowd, much cheaper cars, pretty ang moh women, etc.

 

[kingat33]

That is why NS is for men only, and at the age when men are likely to cause trouble/join the gangs, unlike Israel where both men and women serve. Israel trains SAF in the early days.

Even Taiwan's military plans to become an all-volunteer service by 2017.

NS or no NS.....Singapore will have to follow the rest of the world and implement dual citizenships. Heard it is already in the pipeline.

 

[Charlie99]

Well, after settling down in Toronto (Markham actually), the first trip back to Asia was to China. I joined a group tour that visited Beijing, Shanghai, and Changsha. I actually liked Changsha so much, I started making inquiries about available work there. I am disadvantaged in this - I am hopeless at Mandarin, flunked my GCE O levels in Chinese, so working in China was out of the question, then a few years later, on a vacation trip back to Singapore, I bumped into my ex-boss (the first company I worked for after graduating), The company had grown and was now operating in other Asian countries, my boss then offered me a regional position as Sales Manager, (I suppose I must have left a good impression when I first worked for him), and I took it on. He understood my position now that I have a family and offered me a position under Employment Pass. Even thought I am based in Singapore, my responsibility is over other ASEAN territories. Singapore's position is advantageous for regional work. So here I am, with my family. In a place I am familiar and grew up in. Only thing I hope is that Singapore's currency remains strong, which it is holding up very well. Earning Sing Dollar, and spending vacations in Malaysia and Indonesia makes sense, so I make full use of the position I have. Only thing I have to do without here in Singapore is ganja. Better not smoke that shit here, so I drink beer instead. Now that there is an openness to Craft Beer, this suits me fine! I am not paid that much, but I do not have a high-expense lifestyle. Even though many things in Singapore are expensive (eg. cars!), I am happy to settle for lower priced items, live simply, enjoy the company of my friends, and relatives. Try to be happy with the simple things in life.

Cheers!

Are you still in Toronto or Markham?

 

[Agoraphobic]

Now, in Singapore. Have to make plans to return to Canada. I doubt I will be going back to Markham. Or Toronto. Wouldn't mind Mississauga, more jobs. More local activities too! Been toying with the idea of going to Calgary, (more jobs? - dunnno) Love Vancouver, but can't afford to live there - housing is way beyond affordable, too many Chinks!

Cheers!

Are you still in Toronto or Markham?