It is the same with stock market what.
Who buy Apple stock now?
Same with those joker spend how much for some old Leonardo da Vinci painting.
Also those sinkies pay so much for condo in sinkieland. Or COE paper? You
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Bitcoin & cyptocurrencies
- Thread starter zhihau
- Start date
Who buy Apple stock now?
Same with those joker spend how much for some old Leonardo da Vinci painting.
Also those sinkies pay so much for condo in sinkieland. Or COE paper? You
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me?my gold keep dropping steadily for no particular reasons.
Cos people selling gold to buy bitcoin. The money to buy bitcoin got to come from somewhere right?
It is Temasek la
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while the bitcoin bubble has (for now) blessed hundreds of thousands of mom and pop investors with spectacular returns, these gains will only continue as long as the cartel allows them too.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...lem-1000-investors-control-nearly-half-market
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-...lem-1000-investors-control-nearly-half-market
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Yes, and essentially this bitcoin mania shares many traits of a pyramid scheme. It is not one per se, but pretty darn close.
The money from the ones below are used to pay off the ones on top. This pyramid of greed can and probably will grow quite large.
But I'm not getting my hands dirty on this one. This is a great opportunity to observe impassively the mechanics of greed. Its like a David Attenborough moment observing an ant colony self destruct (for lack of a better analogy.)
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I'm afraid it's totally different from the stock market ... Forgive the harshness, but it's a terrible insult to equities to equate it to the status of Bitcoin.
Be very clear: Bitcoin has NO intrinsic value beyond what the next sucker will pay for it. Do not bother wasting brain cells arguing with this statement.
If you cannot embrace this truth, then stay Far, Far away (in the south China Sea ah...) from any attempts to profit from it.
Good luck gentlemen!
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Very interesting hypothesis to follow up on. Do post updates if you have developments on the inverse link between the 2.
Actually with anything the value of whatever you want to sell depends on the next willing buyer.
I know what you mean. Just saying tongue in cheek.
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Just read in http://bitcointalk.org
What type of exchange is it! Waited for 12 hr and still cannot cash out! Has to wait for blockchain confirmation that take days. It is just scam! The exchange's pool of bitcoin should just be in pool that only need tied to accounts, never need to go through blockchain transfer unless someone decides to withdraw bitcoins. So may buy and then sell immediately to "TAKE PROFIT".
people cannot cash out.
What type of exchange is it! Waited for 12 hr and still cannot cash out! Has to wait for blockchain confirmation that take days. It is just scam! The exchange's pool of bitcoin should just be in pool that only need tied to accounts, never need to go through blockchain transfer unless someone decides to withdraw bitcoins. So may buy and then sell immediately to "TAKE PROFIT".
These are con exchanges.
Chan Rasjid.
You have no understanding how it works. It is nowhere close to Pyramid scheme. It is actually an ingenious idea with a noble cause but some have used it for wrong reason - trade in illicit activities.Its operating mechanism - the blockchain is now used across the world for other applications. It works on a distributed ledger system.
Its no surprise that Central Banks who have grasped it are moving to accept and regulate crypto-currency.
In a way it is like our bubbling property market. Periodically bubbles burst. You can't tell people not to buy houses on the basis that it is pyramid scheme or that it is a scam. It is a question of when to step into the market to buy a house.
Bitcoins are clearly overheated. The Chinese Govt stepped in as Chinese are born gamblers and will take a punt in a rising market.
Both the European Union and G7 countries recognise them and they are legal in their eyes. You want to write to them to explain why they are like a pyramid scheme.
Its no surprise that Central Banks who have grasped it are moving to accept and regulate crypto-currency.
In a way it is like our bubbling property market. Periodically bubbles burst. You can't tell people not to buy houses on the basis that it is pyramid scheme or that it is a scam. It is a question of when to step into the market to buy a house.
Bitcoins are clearly overheated. The Chinese Govt stepped in as Chinese are born gamblers and will take a punt in a rising market.
Both the European Union and G7 countries recognise them and they are legal in their eyes. You want to write to them to explain why they are like a pyramid scheme.
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Bitcoin is indeed a scam. There is a lot of deliberate misinformation spread to promote bitcoin and crypto:
1) bitcoin recognized by central banks, authorities, etc - False.
They are neither legalized nor illegal. If people decides to barter bitcoin for other goods, it is the people's choice.Government don't intervene unless they are reasons to do so. There is also deliberate misinformation to say the Japan's government has legalized bitcoin as a payment medium - nonsense! Bitcoin as as legal as potatoes or tomatoes for payments; you cannot pay taxes with them. Japan only licensed the bitcoin exchanges.
2) bitcoin's only use is as a medium of speculation, nothing else! As for the hype about blockchain technology, it has yet to been seen.
3) bitcoin is "money created out of empty space!". At least, paper currencies are much, much better as these are created with a content - "thin air". A house has content; bitcoin exists only in computers' memories only and may be deleted tomorrow.
Chan Rasjid.
1) bitcoin recognized by central banks, authorities, etc - False.
They are neither legalized nor illegal. If people decides to barter bitcoin for other goods, it is the people's choice.Government don't intervene unless they are reasons to do so. There is also deliberate misinformation to say the Japan's government has legalized bitcoin as a payment medium - nonsense! Bitcoin as as legal as potatoes or tomatoes for payments; you cannot pay taxes with them. Japan only licensed the bitcoin exchanges.
2) bitcoin's only use is as a medium of speculation, nothing else! As for the hype about blockchain technology, it has yet to been seen.
3) bitcoin is "money created out of empty space!". At least, paper currencies are much, much better as these are created with a content - "thin air". A house has content; bitcoin exists only in computers' memories only and may be deleted tomorrow.
Irrelevant. Sodium cyanide, arsenic, sweet potatoes are also legal by the Communist Party Of China .
Chan Rasjid.
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the bitcoin market is open while wall street closes. as it remains open friday night to saturday it sinks to below $15k at $14,439 as of 1:14pm pt. looks like an elite group of supply siders are manupilating (and dominating) the trading by taking profits in the weekend after the lemmings have done their frenzied buying during the work week. as of 6pm last night at one point it crashed to below $13.3k.
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Cypto currency is built on block chain. Bitcoin is a crypto currency.
I never said block chain is akin to pyramid.
I said Bitcoin is akin to pyramid
I did not say all cyrpto currencies are pyramid like.
If these subtle distinctions escape you, feel free to clarify.
I never said block chain is akin to pyramid.
I said Bitcoin is akin to pyramid
I did not say all cyrpto currencies are pyramid like.
If these subtle distinctions escape you, feel free to clarify.
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With the recent frenzy around the staggering rise in the price of bitcoin, which briefly reached a high of $19,340 trading on the Coinbase exchange on Thursday, "Shark Tank" star and investor Kevin O'Learywants to make one thing about the cryptocurrency crystal clear.
It isn't a currency. It's just too volatile for that.
"I don't consider it a currency and I'll tell you why," O'Leary tells CNBC Make It. He recalls an experience that taught him firsthand the problem with bitcoin's volatility.
"I recently tried to settle a transaction for around $200,000 with bitcoin. It was an international transaction with a European entity and I suggested, 'Why don't we try bitcoin?'" O'Leary explains.
The benefit of using bitcoin would be to eliminate the hassle of exchanging currencies and clearing the money through banks. "The whole idea of bitcoin as a currency is you don't have to do any of that," O'Leary says. "You just buy $200,000 of bitcoin and then send it to them."
Then he hit a snag. The Europeans he'd be paying wanted O'Leary to guarantee the value of the bitcoin against the price of the U.S. dollar.
"In other words, I have to insure [the bitcoin] because it is, as you know, very volatile," O'Leary says.
The Europeans certainly had a reason to be concerned, bitcoin has seen wild swings in recent days. After it hit over $19,000 trading on the Coinbase exchange, it then fell more than 20 percent to just above $15,000. Tuesday, the price had just topped $12,000.
The problem? Imagine O'Leary paid his European counterparts the equivalent of $200,000 on Thursday when the price of bitcoin was trading at $19,000 — that would be roughly 10.53 bitcoin. Later that very day, the same 10.53 bitcoin were worth just over $160,000.
O'Leary decided he didn't want to take on the risk of the value drastically changing either.
The experience taught him bitcoin doesn't work as a currency.
"If clearly neither side thinks it is stable enough to transfer in one minute, and they don't even want to take one minute of risk, it is not a currency," he says.
To think about it another way, consider U.S. dollars. When you use dollars to buy a cup of coffee, you and the coffee shop both expect the value of the dollar to remain stable between the time you order and the time you pay. Each side agrees, $2.50 equals one cup of coffee. O'Leary says bitcoin lacks that quality.
"The fact is, it is so unstable — volatility is both directions, it's up and it's down — that nobody in a substantive transaction will take that risk," O'Leary says. "So it is a long way from being a currency.
"However, is it an asset? Yes. It is one of the most successful assets on the planet right now because it's a global speculation."
Unlike a currency, which is used to assign and exchange value, an asset has its own inherent value based on what people will pay for it.
O'Leary's fellow "Shark Tank" star Mark Cuban explains the value of bitcoin this way to Vanity Fair: "It is like collecting art, like collecting baseball cards ... something is worth what somebody else will pay for it."
But just as with a painting, the value is hard to pinpoint.
While the price continues to surge, O'Leary suggests caution when regarding what bitcoin is really worth.
"I have no idea what its value is, and neither does anybody else," he says. "The volatility makes it very difficult for me as an investor to put that into a portfolio. So to me, it is a speculation."
-from CNBC
It isn't a currency. It's just too volatile for that.
"I don't consider it a currency and I'll tell you why," O'Leary tells CNBC Make It. He recalls an experience that taught him firsthand the problem with bitcoin's volatility.
"I recently tried to settle a transaction for around $200,000 with bitcoin. It was an international transaction with a European entity and I suggested, 'Why don't we try bitcoin?'" O'Leary explains.
The benefit of using bitcoin would be to eliminate the hassle of exchanging currencies and clearing the money through banks. "The whole idea of bitcoin as a currency is you don't have to do any of that," O'Leary says. "You just buy $200,000 of bitcoin and then send it to them."
Then he hit a snag. The Europeans he'd be paying wanted O'Leary to guarantee the value of the bitcoin against the price of the U.S. dollar.
"In other words, I have to insure [the bitcoin] because it is, as you know, very volatile," O'Leary says.
The Europeans certainly had a reason to be concerned, bitcoin has seen wild swings in recent days. After it hit over $19,000 trading on the Coinbase exchange, it then fell more than 20 percent to just above $15,000. Tuesday, the price had just topped $12,000.
The problem? Imagine O'Leary paid his European counterparts the equivalent of $200,000 on Thursday when the price of bitcoin was trading at $19,000 — that would be roughly 10.53 bitcoin. Later that very day, the same 10.53 bitcoin were worth just over $160,000.
O'Leary decided he didn't want to take on the risk of the value drastically changing either.
The experience taught him bitcoin doesn't work as a currency.
"If clearly neither side thinks it is stable enough to transfer in one minute, and they don't even want to take one minute of risk, it is not a currency," he says.
To think about it another way, consider U.S. dollars. When you use dollars to buy a cup of coffee, you and the coffee shop both expect the value of the dollar to remain stable between the time you order and the time you pay. Each side agrees, $2.50 equals one cup of coffee. O'Leary says bitcoin lacks that quality.
"The fact is, it is so unstable — volatility is both directions, it's up and it's down — that nobody in a substantive transaction will take that risk," O'Leary says. "So it is a long way from being a currency.
"However, is it an asset? Yes. It is one of the most successful assets on the planet right now because it's a global speculation."
Unlike a currency, which is used to assign and exchange value, an asset has its own inherent value based on what people will pay for it.
O'Leary's fellow "Shark Tank" star Mark Cuban explains the value of bitcoin this way to Vanity Fair: "It is like collecting art, like collecting baseball cards ... something is worth what somebody else will pay for it."
But just as with a painting, the value is hard to pinpoint.
While the price continues to surge, O'Leary suggests caution when regarding what bitcoin is really worth.
"I have no idea what its value is, and neither does anybody else," he says. "The volatility makes it very difficult for me as an investor to put that into a portfolio. So to me, it is a speculation."
-from CNBC
It always a struggle to understand the difference between intrinsic and market value. There is also the concept of fiat and asset backed currency. This is despite that this “currency” has been in used for exchange for good and services in the last few years. Including purchase of land and properties.
Reminds me of the time when our people had to resettle to HDB flats from Kampungs and shophouses. The usual housewives’ stories and myths - lift will fall down, water pressure poor, don’t buy near the sea as the windows will rust and fall down, not convenient, etc.
In a decade, everyone will have crypto currency wallet and it will be usual skeptics that will claim that they knew its value from day1.
The rising value is due to hedge funds and speculators buying big, futures market trading approved etc. It certainly is a bubble. The rise will attract more miners and oversupply and rationalisation will take place and the value will eventually find its level like all currencies.
It worth watching the journey, the supporters, speculators and skeptics.
Reminds me of the time when our people had to resettle to HDB flats from Kampungs and shophouses. The usual housewives’ stories and myths - lift will fall down, water pressure poor, don’t buy near the sea as the windows will rust and fall down, not convenient, etc.
In a decade, everyone will have crypto currency wallet and it will be usual skeptics that will claim that they knew its value from day1.
The rising value is due to hedge funds and speculators buying big, futures market trading approved etc. It certainly is a bubble. The rise will attract more miners and oversupply and rationalisation will take place and the value will eventually find its level like all currencies.
It worth watching the journey, the supporters, speculators and skeptics.
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- Joined
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