Anonymity in Cyberspace

[Queen Seok Duk]

To prevent some websites that you are accessing from tracing your IP.

What about the example I gave ? For some reason Youtube is blocked by the authorities, and I use anonymous server to "bypass" the wall. This is the only reason why I use anonymous server. If I can bypass the wall, doesn't that mean the ISP does not know I'm surfing Youtube ?

 

[scroobal]

Well said.

I advise all. There's no such thing as internet confidentiality or anonymity in Singapore. If you want that, try CCs in Malaysia or Thailand that don't bother to take your IC. Another thing, this one to your comfort, the MDA and police are very busy with other things, they couldn't be bothered with you unless you do something really earth shattering, or at least city shattering, which you're incapable of even if you want to. So don't flatter yourself. Nobody is looking for you or could be bothered about you.

 

[krafty]

If you look at the flow again:

My computer -> internet cloud -> ISP Proxy server -> internet cloud -> Internet Anonymous Proxy -> YouTube

Note that your data travel in both directions,if they installed sniffer like tech. somewhere between your ISP Proxy server to your computer,they will still be able to track you down.

Even if you encrypt your data, all they need is a slightly longer time to decrypt it.

What about the example I gave ? For some reason Youtube is blocked by the authorities, and I use anonymous server to "bypass" the wall. This is the only reason why I use anonymous server. If I can bypass the wall, doesn't that mean the ISP does not know I'm surfing Youtube ?

 

[WayangPartyClub]

If so easy then can tell me why TR is still anonymous?

If so easy to check why govt never check yet?

If you look at the flow again:

My computer -> internet cloud -> ISP Proxy server -> internet cloud -> Internet Anonymous Proxy -> YouTube

Note that your data travel in both directions,if they installed sniffer like tech. somewhere between your ISP Proxy server to your computer,they will still be able to track you down.

Even if you encrypt your data, all they need is a slightly longer time to decrypt it.

 

[krafty]

one thing for sure, they know who you are but for various reasons, they did not take action.

If so easy then can tell me why TR is still anonymous?

If so easy to check why govt never check yet?

 

[WayangPartyClub]

one thing for sure, they know who you are but for various reasons, they did not take action.

Who I am? I am trying to help!

 

[longbow]

1) sammyboy has all the IP addresses and who knows, they may be making good $$ mining the info for the authorities - political hot buttons. unhappiness etc.

2) If the authorities prosecute, it could 1) reveal their methods and the repercussions could be great. Lets say they go after A. This means that they have been keeping track of all activities of A.

What if A had communications with a US citizens or a big shot CEO of MNC or PRC general or his GF's father is a big shot US politican. I am not talking about serious stuff but these counter parties might not like it and it will be bad for corp Singapore. Why invest in Singapore if their messages are being snooped upon. Of course it is happening but unless it is national security in nature authorities would rather not doing anything and wait for the big fish. Once you crackdown everyone becomes more careful and go underground. For all you know, sammyboy is operated by MHA.

 

[krafty]

You are crazy...MHA won't host something like this,for what? act as honeypot???

But I am quite sure that they have pple monitoring such forum. one day,some cuckoo post something like he want to assassinate certain politician or bomb up some place. You think what will happen to the cuckoo?

Anyway, sammyboy confirmed to be registered and hosted in USA. Check this out:

http://www.yougetsignal.com/tools/visual-tracert/

http://network-tools.com/default.asp?prog=whois&host=www.sammyboy.com

Registrant:
Harold Rose Associates
209, great south road
auckland, ni 1709
US

Registrar: ALLINDOM
Domain Name: SAMMYBOY.COM
Created on: 07-AUG-99
Expires on: 07-AUG-10
Last Updated on: 07-AUG-09

[COLOR="_______"]Administrative Contact:
leong, samuel [email protected]
Harold Rose Associates
209, great south road
auckland, ni 1709
US
0508-77819[/COLOR]

1)
What if A had communications with a US citizens or a big shot CEO of MNC or PRC general or his GF's father is a big shot US politican. I am not talking about serious stuff but these counter parties might not like it and it will be bad for corp Singapore. Why invest in Singapore if their messages are being snooped upon. Of course it is happening but unless it is national security in nature authorities would rather not doing anything and wait for the big fish. Once you crackdown everyone becomes more careful and go underground. For all you know, sammyboy is operated by MHA.

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

If you look at the flow again:

My computer -> internet cloud -> ISP Proxy server -> internet cloud -> Internet Anonymous Proxy -> YouTube

Note that your data travel in both directions,if they installed sniffer like tech. somewhere between your ISP Proxy server to your computer,they will still be able to track you down.

Even if you encrypt your data, all they need is a slightly longer time to decrypt it.

Does installing a sniffer mean they must first identify my IP address and then proceed to track my footprints ?

You've changed my question slightly, and I don't want to get into other issues. I'm not talking about a situation where I'm some Osama fanatics and they're tracking my movements. Lets make this more transparent.

Say there is a video on Youtube that the Government deems an insult to their monarchy, and the Government then decides to block access to Youtube. Now being a curious ass, the decision to block Youtube makes me even more curious, and I want to watch that video in Youtube. At this point, I'm a NOBODY but just one among 10 million Internet users in that country. I use anonymous surfer and I get to watch the particular video in Youtube.

The question is : does the ISP know that I am watching that video in Youtube ?

 

[krafty]

It's possible if they want to check on you, all data packets can be reconstructed.

Another thing that i think is possible is that ISP may also not be aware that maybe,I am saying maybe...that ISD installed sniffer device infront of the ISP's gateway to track pple down.

But relax...as ramseth stated, why would they waste their time and resources on nobody like you, bring you in for watching something on youtube???

Does installing a sniffer mean they must first identify my IP address and then proceed to track my footprints ?

You've changed my question slightly, and I don't want to get into other issues. I'm not talking about a situation where I'm some Osama fanatics and they're tracking my movements. Lets make this more transparent.

Say there is a video on Youtube that the Government deems an insult to their monarchy, and the Government then decides to block access to Youtube. Now being a curious ass, the decision to block Youtube makes me even more curious, and I want to watch that video in Youtube. At this point, I'm a NOBODY but just one among 10 million Internet users in that country. I use anonymous surfer and I get to watch the particular video in Youtube.

The question is : does the ISP know that I am watching that video in Youtube ?

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

It's possible if they want to check on you, all data packets can be reconstructed.

Another thing that i think is possible is that ISP may also not be aware that maybe,I am saying maybe...that ISD installed sniffer device infront of the ISP's gateway to track pple down.

But relax...as ramseth stated, why would they waste their time and resources on nobody like you, bring you in for watching something on youtube???

You're not dealing with the issues I raised.

Why would they want to check on me ? I'm one in a million users. I know ISP has tons of gadgets to track a person if they have some "pre-knowledge" of that person, knows his IP address, and follows him wherever he goes. I'm not looking at that kind of situation.

Please just deal with the example I quoted.

The ISP does not have pre-knowledge of who I'm. Does the ISP know that I have bypassed the wall and watching the banned clip in Youtube ?

 

[krafty]

It's possible if they want to check on you, all data packets can be reconstructed.

You're not dealing with the issues I raised.

Why would they want to check on me ? I'm one in a million users. I know ISP has tons of gadgets to track a person if they have some "pre-knowledge" of that person, knows his IP address, and follows him wherever he goes. I'm not looking at that kind of situation.

Please just deal with the example I quoted.

The ISP does not have pre-knowledge of who I'm. Does the ISP know that I have bypassed the wall and watching the banned clip in Youtube ?

 

[Glaringly]

The ISP does not have pre-knowledge of who I'm. Does the ISP know that I have bypassed the wall and watching the banned clip in Youtube ?

If the ISP successfully blocked those traffic that attempts to watch that banned Clip, then they have information of these groups.

If you can access via another backdoor, how does the ISP knows? If for this particular instance, I say no way. Not unless they scanned through the thousand of anon server for the web addresses.

To be 99.99% sure... Like I first suggested, use a anon server that provides encryption.

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

It's possible if they want to check on you, all data packets can be reconstructed.

You're back in the loop again, Krafty. Is my English that poor ?

What do you mean "IF THEY WANT TO CHECK ON YOU" ?

I have already told you they don't have pre-knowledge of who is likely to use anonymous surfer to access Youtube. They're NOT tracking me and are NOT waiting at my doorsteps to see where I'd be heading.

The task of the ISP is to block access to "Youtube". If 1000 users decided to use different anonymous surf to bypass and get into Youtube, will the ISP know that 1000 users have in fact bypassed and got into Youtube ?

I have painstakingly avoided using the term "I", so that you don't come back and tell me "If they want to check on YOU etc...."

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

If the ISP successfully blocked those traffic that attempts to watch that banned Clip, then they have information of these groups.

If you can access via another backdoor, how does the ISP knows? If for this particular instance, I say no way. Not unless they scanned through the thousand of anon server for the web addresses.

To be 99.99% sure... Like I first suggested, use a anon server that provides encryption.

Ah...now I know somebody understands what I'm saying.

At best the ISP knows I have accessed an anon surfer site, but where I surf from there the ISP wouldn't know, right ? And isn't that the purpose of anon surfer ?

In between my computer and the ISP, I believe the company that offers the wireless service in my condo will know.

 

[Ramseth]

I'm kind of lost in this exchange.

Queen Seok Duk asked "Why do they want to check on me?"

Krafty replied "It's possible if they want to check on you."

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

I'm kind of lost in this exchange.

Queen Seok Duk asked "Why do they want to check on me?"

Krafty replied "It's possible if they want to check on you."

Should be the other way round.

Krafty remarked: "if they want to check on you"

QSD asked : "why would they want to check on me ?"

But Ramseth, knowing you, I suggest you refrain from joining in the discussion. Glaringly seems to be on the same frequency.

Krafty constructs his answers on the presumption that the ISP is like some papparazzi. That is, my identity is known before I'm being tracked and the ISP is waiting at my doorsteps with sniffer.

All that I'm asking is whether ISP knows whoever [and not necessary I] bypasses the blockage using anon surfer.

 

[Queen Seok Duk]

relax lah! unless you are CSJ, MHA will not really give a shit about you!

don't think too highly of yourself...LOL!

This again is an answer built on a wrong presumption and has nothing to do with what is being asked.

Try to keep the comments within the technical realm, and not personal inference.

 

[Ramseth]

Should be the other way round.

Krafty remarked: "if they want to check on you"

QSD asked : "why would they want to check on me ?"

OK, my mistake, lost among the quotes. Apologies.

 

[krafty]

you make me feel so dumb by responding to you...

all along, I thought you have been targetted by the authority...

And if they want to check...err...I mean if they want to block 1000 users from accessing youtube via anon proxy,they can do it by

1. blocking access to anon proxies known

2. comparing and blocking your data stream from their server end(Data Analyser). Your data stream header contains info where your data is coming from.

and so long...:oIo:

You're back in the loop again, Krafty. Is my English that poor ?

What do you mean "IF THEY WANT TO CHECK ON YOU" ?

I have already told you they don't have pre-knowledge of who is likely to use anonymous surfer to access Youtube. They're NOT tracking me and are NOT waiting at my doorsteps to see where I'd be heading.

The task of the ISP is to block access to "Youtube". If 1000 users decided to use different anonymous surf to bypass and get into Youtube, will the ISP know that 1000 users have in fact bypassed and got into Youtube ?

I have painstakingly avoided using the term "I", so that you don't come back and tell me "If they want to check on YOU etc...."