Making A Wrong Turn

jw5 · Jul 11, 2010

I was saddened to read of 2 cases this year, where 2 people I knew from quite long ago got into trouble with the law. Didn't know them well then as in we were not friends, and didn't keep in touch after we left school and NS respectively. But they were like seniors or mentors to some of us.

The first was someone from school. He was a well respected and successful student. His case was that he had misappropriated some money. Don't know all the details like what financial difficulties he was in, and will not be revealing those I do know. But one notable thing was that he was divorced. Makes me wonder whether the woman or the wife controls a man's fate. Once that goes wrong, does it mean that most things will spiral out of control?

The second was someone from NS time. Again he was a well respected soldier to us junior guys. His case was that he was alledged to have paid a bribe to someone to get business. I remember him as a very decent chap, someone whom we thought had a bright future. He did apparently, until this case.

Whatever it is, I feel really sorry for them and their families. And would like to think that they are basically decent chaps who encountered problems which went out of control. What worries me more is that they were the steady, successful "leaders" during the time I knew them, whereas I was rather the rebel and "dissident", both in school and in NS.

I'm just wondering whether it will be my turn soon to make the wrong turn or perhaps whether I've already made it. Depressing. :(

Logisex · Jul 11, 2010

jw5 said:
I was saddened to read of 2 cases this year, where 2 people I knew from quite long ago got into trouble with the law. Didn't know them well then as in we were not friends, and didn't keep in touch after we left school and NS respectively. But they were like seniors or mentors to some of us.

The first was someone from school. He was a well respected and successful student. His case was that he had misappropriated some money. Don't know all the details like what financial difficulties he was in, and will not be revealing those I do know. But one notable thing was that he was divorced. Makes me wonder whether the woman or the wife controls a man's fate. Once that goes wrong, does it mean that most things will spiral out of control?

The second was someone from NS time. Again he was a well respected soldier to us junior guys. His case was that he was alledged to have paid a bribe to someone to get business. I remember him as a very decent chap, someone whom we thought had a bright future. He did apparently, until this case.

Whatever it is, I feel really sorry for them and their families. And would like to think that they are basically decent chaps who encountered problems which went out of control. What worries me more is that they were the steady, successful "leaders" during the time I knew them, whereas I was rather the rebel and "dissident", both in school and in NS.

I'm just wondering whether it will be my turn soon to make the wrong turn or perhaps whether I've already made it. Depressing. :(

Reminds me of my S3 during NS days. This guy was a very smart, well educated and fun fella. A few years after I ROD, I saw his picture on the newspaper and I couldn't believe my eyes. He was sentenced for life for kidnapping. Apparently, he went into financial problems when he lost a lot of money in the stock or futures market. His wife was also pregnant then. He kidnapped a rich man's daughter with another 2 guys and I could not believe how stupid his kidnap plan was:
They were spying on the victim from a pickup where they pretended to be selling durians for a few days. Neighbours already suspected them as they don't seems to be interested in selling durians and they were selling them in pre-packed plastic bags! So when kidnapped happen, the police knew who to go after. Poor fella was less than 30yo then.

Btw why do you think it might be your turn soon or what wrong turn do you think you hav made?

jw5 · Jul 11, 2010

Logisex said:
Reminds me of my S3 during NS days. This guy was a very smart, well educated and fun fella. A few years after I ROD, I saw his picture on the newspaper and I couldn't believe my eyes. He was sentenced for life for kidnapping. Apparently, he went into financial problems when he lost a lot of money in the stock or futures market. His wife was also pregnant then. He kidnapped a rich man's daughter with another 2 guys and I could not believe how stupid his kidnap plan was:
They were spying on the victim from a pickup where they pretended to be selling durians for a few days. Neighbours already suspected them as they don't seems to be interested in selling durians and they were selling them in pre-packed plastic bags! So when kidnapped happen, the police knew who to go after. Poor fella was less than 30yo then.

Btw why do you think it might be your turn soon or what wrong turn do you think you hav made?

I also knew an officer during my NS time who got into trouble with the law. Didn't like him at all, so his case is different from those other 2 guys.
This guy was a full lieutanent and platoon commander leading exercises and training. Before long he was made captain and transferred to HQ and went around appraising peoples' exercises and training. Must have been some kind of scholar, although not the top level type.
After I left NS, read a newspaper report that he was charged and convicted of some financial misappropriation case after he left the saf. My first thought was that he should have stayed. Never thought much of him again until your post.

Why my wrong turn? :smile:

Firstly, I was the rebel and dissident while these 2 guys were the leaders and mentors.
Secondly and more importantly, I'm finding myself losing my cool with people more and more often, at work and in public places. If you read my posts, you may guess that it's mainly where justice has not been done, even with strangers cutting queue, to use a simple example.
Thirdly, I have some disputes with certain people, which may eventually lead to a wrong turn. Not elaborating further, I'm afraid, except that I don't think I have made the wrong turn yet.

krafty · Jul 11, 2010

what did you do? can i ask?

jw5 said:
I also knew an officer during my NS time who got into trouble with the law. Didn't like him at all, so his case is different from those other 2 guys.
This guy was a full lieutanent and platoon commander leading exercises and training. Before long he was made captain and transferred to HQ and went around appraising peoples' exercises and training. Must have been some kind of scholar, although not the top level type.
After I left NS, read a newspaper report that he was charged and convicted of some financial misappropriation case after he left the saf. My first thought was that he should have stayed. Never thought much of him again until your post.

Why my wrong turn?
Firstly, I was the rebel and dissident while these 2 guys were the leaders and mentors.
Secondly and more importantly, I'm finding myself losing my cool with people more and more often, at work and in public places. If you read my posts, you may guess that it's mainly where justice has not been done, even with strangers cutting queue, to use a simple example.
Thirdly, I have some disputes with certain people, which may eventually lead to a wrong turn. Not elaborating further, I'm afraid, except that I don't think I have made the wrong turn yet.

manokie · Jul 11, 2010

Logisex said:
Reminds me of my S3 during NS days. This guy was a very smart, well educated and fun fella. A few years after I ROD, I saw his picture on the newspaper and I couldn't believe my eyes. He was sentenced for life for kidnapping. Apparently, he went into financial problems when he lost a lot of money in the stock or futures market. His wife was also pregnant then. He kidnapped a rich man's daughter with another 2 guys and I could not believe how stupid his kidnap plan was:
They were spying on the victim from a pickup where they pretended to be selling durians for a few days. Neighbours already suspected them as they don't seems to be interested in selling durians and they were selling them in pre-packed plastic bags! So when kidnapped happen, the police knew who to go after. Poor fella was less than 30yo then.

WOW sounds so Grand Theft Auto..

In my opinion, it's better to make mistakes when you are younger like in teens or in NS, when you can get charged but nothing will be a criminal record against you.

Some adults grow up not making any mistakes due to fear and in the end, it's too late when they make a grave mistake because they reached a position where they either have nothing to lose or when they become cocky.

:o

jw5 · Jul 11, 2010

krafty said:
what did you do? can i ask?

For the strangers who cut queue, I tell them to get in line.
For the disputes, I already said that I will not be elaborating further.

Logisex · Jul 11, 2010

jw5 said:
I also knew an officer during my NS time who got into trouble with the law. Didn't like him at all, so his case is different from those other 2 guys.
This guy was a full lieutanent and platoon commander leading exercises and training. Before long he was made captain and transferred to HQ and went around appraising peoples' exercises and training. Must have been some kind of scholar, although not the top level type.
After I left NS, read a newspaper report that he was charged and convicted of some financial misappropriation case after he left the saf. My first thought was that he should have stayed. Never thought much of him again until your post.

Why my wrong turn?
Firstly, I was the rebel and dissident while these 2 guys were the leaders and mentors.
Secondly and more importantly, I'm finding myself losing my cool with people more and more often, at work and in public places. If you read my posts, you may guess that it's mainly where justice has not been done, even with strangers cutting queue, to use a simple example.
Thirdly, I have some disputes with certain people, which may eventually lead to a wrong turn. Not elaborating further, I'm afraid, except that I don't think I have made the wrong turn yet.

I also had the problem of losing my cool with people cutting queue, unreasonable people, bullies and conmen esp after I came to China. I'm just afraid that one day I must lose control and whack somebody real hard. I nearly whack a bully up recently and had also rammed a shopping cart against someone who cut queue.
I had also lost my coolness with my HR and boss over pay issues and on hindsight felt bad about this as it so unprofessional of me.

There was a case recently in China where a multi billionaire property developer was sentenced to death. He got into a disbute with a boss of a contruction company and was really pissed about it. His assistant suggested that he can help teach him a lesson. His assistant whacked the construction co. boss up with another guy but accidentally killed him. In the end, all kenna death sentence over just a commercial dispute.

You have to stand up for yourself and others but dun let your ego gets in the way. There is always a trigger point. Once you breach that and anger/greed takes over, its all out of control. Always step back and give yourself at least 5seconds with 3 deep breaths.

Spiky · Jul 11, 2010

Hi guys,

Good post.

A good reminder for myself.

The older I get, the quicker the temper ...... and the worst part being .... I've got high blood pressure.

jw5 · Jul 11, 2010

Logisex said:
I also had the problem of losing my cool with people cutting queue, unreasonable people, bullies and conmen esp after I came to China. I'm just afraid that one day I must lose control and whack somebody real hard. I nearly whack a bully up recently and had also rammed a shopping cart against someone who cut queue.
I had also lost my coolness with my HR and boss over pay issues and on hindsight felt bad about this as it so unprofessional of me.

There was a case recently in China where a multi billionaire property developer was sentenced to death. He got into a disbute with a boss of a contruction company and was really pissed about it. His assistant suggested that he can help teach him a lesson. His assistant whacked the construction co. boss up with another guy but accidentally killed him. In the end, all kenna death sentence over just a commercial dispute.

You have to stand up for yourself and others but dun let your ego gets in the way. There is always a trigger point. Once you breach that and anger/greed takes over, its all out of control. Always step back and give yourself at least 5seconds with 3 deep breaths.

Don't know whether you have heard this story, as I've said it before in this forum. :smile:

Once I was in the Beijing airport queueing to board the plane.About 20 people in the queue, I was about 10th in line.
3 people who seemed to be locals (2 guys and a lady) walked up and nonchalantly plonked themselves in front of the guy behind me. A little gap had opened up between him and me as he was looking at his hp.
I asked them to get in line, they ignored me.
I asked them again, the guy behind me also asked them, they ignored us.
I immediately went to the people behind the guy and told them that 3 people had cut the queue in front of them.
Immediately, they started shouting and scolding the threesome and there was back and forth bickering for some time.
Finally, the 3 lan lan go to the back of the queue, starring daggers at me.
If they were allowed to carry sharp objects up the plane, maybe I won't be typing this now..................
Sometimes, it's necessary to get others to help with the work.

Spiky · Jul 11, 2010

jw5 said:
Don't know whether you have heard this story, as I've said it before in this forum.

Once I was in the Beijing airport queueing to board the plane.About 20 people in the queue, I was about 10th in line.
3 people who seemed to be locals (2 guys and a lady) walked up and nonchalantly plonked themselves in front of the guy behind me. A little gap had opened up between him and me as he was looking at his hp.
I asked them to get in line, they ignored me.
I asked them again, the guy behind me also asked them, they ignored us.
I immediately went to the people behind the guy and told them that 3 people had cut the queue in front of them.
Immediately, they started shouting and scolding the threesome and there was back and forth bickering for some time.
Finally, the 3 lan lan go to the back of the queue, starring daggers at me.
If they were allowed to carry sharp objects up the plane, maybe I won't be typing this now..................
Sometimes, it's necessary to get others to help with the work.

You have got balls. Very courageous.

I hate such things too but I lack the guts to tell people off.

Usually end up enduring such nonsense and blood pressure escalates higher .....

Logisex · Jul 11, 2010

jw5 said:
Don't know whether you have heard this story, as I've said it before in this forum.

Once I was in the Beijing airport queueing to board the plane.About 20 people in the queue, I was about 10th in line.
3 people who seemed to be locals (2 guys and a lady) walked up and nonchalantly plonked themselves in front of the guy behind me. A little gap had opened up between him and me as he was looking at his hp.
I asked them to get in line, they ignored me.
I asked them again, the guy behind me also asked them, they ignored us.
I immediately went to the people behind the guy and told them that 3 people had cut the queue in front of them.
Immediately, they started shouting and scolding the threesome and there was back and forth bickering for some time.
Finally, the 3 lan lan go to the back of the queue, starring daggers at me.
If they were allowed to carry sharp objects up the plane, maybe I won't be typing this now..................
Sometimes, it's necessary to get others to help with the work.

The last time when I was in BJ airport, this asshole pretended to be on the phone and walked all the way to the front of the taxi queue. 2 middle east guys actually ran up to him, told him off in some foreign language and pulled him back to the end of the queue.

And just as I was watching the commotion, a teenage girl got infront of me. My wife wanted to catch hold of her but was too late. She already got into the taxi.

Fark those PRCs.......

manokie · Jul 11, 2010

Logisex said:
The last time when I was in BJ airport, this asshole pretended to be on the phone and walked all the way to the front of the taxi queue. 2 middle east guys actually ran up to him, told him off in some foreign language and pulled him back to the end of the queue.

And just as I was watching the commotion, a teenage girl got infront of me. My wife wanted to catch hold of her but was too late. She already got into the taxi.

Fark those PRCs.......

PRC don't really know what is queuing.

Not part of what they learn in School

jw5 · Jul 11, 2010

Spiky said:
You have got balls. Very courageous.

I hate such things too but I lack the guts to tell people off.

Usually end up enduring such nonsense and blood pressure escalates higher .....

I probably would not have done it in a convenience store in Beijing at midnight.
In the airport, I figured that I could start running the moment we landed. :smile:

But incidents like these and other cases of injustice and inconsideration simply infuriates me. My heart beat always gets faster when I see such cases, whether I interfere or not. I think it beats faster when I do interfere.

Logisex · Jul 11, 2010

manokie said:
PRC don't really know what is queuing.

Not part of what they learn in School

Yep. I still rememeber those TV commercials during the BJ Olympics where they teach PRCs how to queue up, throw litter into the rubbish bin etc.

They have volunteers getting people to queue up at bus stops during peak hours. Those volunteers are still there everyday.

Logisex · Jul 11, 2010

Spiky said:
You have got balls. Very courageous.

I hate such things too but I lack the guts to tell people off.

Usually end up enduring such nonsense and blood pressure escalates higher .....

Last time I also live and let live but was chided by my wife for being guniang. I don't see much of these cases in Singapore then but when I came to China, I see them everyday until I got no more strength to fight with them liao.
But sometimes really got to tell them off and if my wife is around, they will sure kenna jialat jialat.

tanwahtiu · Jul 11, 2010

jw5 said:
I was saddened to read of 2 cases this year, where 2 people I knew from quite long ago got into trouble with the law. Didn't know them well then as in we were not friends, and didn't keep in touch after we left school and NS respectively. But they were like seniors or mentors to some of us.

I'm just wondering whether it will be my turn soon to make the wrong turn or perhaps whether I've already made it. Depressing. :(

I knew of this chap in my NS days too. He was smart and did well in his uni after ROD. He studied overseas and came back to a dotorate qualification. He joined NUS as a psychologist lecturer and did well in his career.

We somehow lost touch for a while and I saw in the newspapers he was on a hunger strike. From then onwards his life was never the same and got sued for defamations some more.

krafty · Jul 11, 2010

my MT sergeant during NS time, he was charged and sentenced to 20 years in China. I was quite stunned! he is those blur,blur,friendly and like to talk cock kind of person. Moreover, we attended the same Secondary school, SAP school,though he was few years my junior. On the news report, he was being accused of money laundering,one of the biggest case in China.

Charlie258 · Jul 11, 2010

jw5 said:
Don't know whether you have heard this story, as I've said it before in this forum.

Once I was in the Beijing airport queueing to board the plane.About 20 people in the queue, I was about 10th in line.
3 people who seemed to be locals (2 guys and a lady) walked up and nonchalantly plonked themselves in front of the guy behind me. A little gap had opened up between him and me as he was looking at his hp.
I asked them to get in line, they ignored me.
I asked them again, the guy behind me also asked them, they ignored us.
I immediately went to the people behind the guy and told them that 3 people had cut the queue in front of them.
Immediately, they started shouting and scolding the threesome and there was back and forth bickering for some time.
Finally, the 3 lan lan go to the back of the queue, starring daggers at me.
If they were allowed to carry sharp objects up the plane, maybe I won't be typing this now..................
Sometimes, it's necessary to get others to help with the work.

Where I used to live, the worst ones were the 50+ years old retired PRC's. They seemed to believe that it was their god-given right to be able to walk straight to the front of every queue as if all the other people were not alive......no, were totally non-existent!

But how do you pick a fight with someone your parent's age?

But you guys have got to understand PRC culture. It is unique. It is a non-culture. It is Law of the Jungle in PRC. That is why I say, 'Heaven help Singapore.' We escaped death by the hand of PRC in the late '60's. We may not escape death by the hand of PRC in the 2010's.b:(

jw5 · Jul 11, 2010

Charlie258 said:
Where I used to live, the worst ones were the 50+ years old retired PRC's. They seemed to believe that it was their god-given right to be able to walk straight to the front of every queue as if all the other people were not alive......no, were totally non-existent!

But how do you pick a fight with someone your parent's age?

But you guys have got to understand PRC culture. It is unique. It is a non-culture. It is Law of the Jungle in PRC. That is why I say, 'Heaven help Singapore.' We escaped death by the hand of PRC in the late '60's. We may not escape death by the hand of PRC in the 2010's.b:(

You don't need to pick a fight, but you should definitely take them on if they insist on cutting queue.
1. They have at least another 20 to 40 years of life, they need to learn.
2. They are teaching children and soon, grandchildren. It will be terrible if all of them end up behaving like that.
3. I don't believe that elderly people deserve more respect in life. It depends on their behaviour and knowledge.

Yes, it's a jungle in PRC especially if we are not familiar with the place.
But in SG, we are. Use that to your advantage. Never let the prcs rule over you, but also know where and when to take them on.

Ramseth · Jul 11, 2010

In uncouth lower-middle class PRC culture, voice and dominance are very important in everyday life. You go to a coffeeshop and shout at the coffeeboy or even coffeeuncle to sound your voice and exert your dominance first. You behave and sit in an aggressive posture to signal your readiness for any fight if you're not served to your satisfaction.

When driving, you blast your horn whether you have right of way or not, to intimidate others into giving way to way. It's all very childish. Like Singapore schoolkids cursing and swearing in disgusting vulgarities that they themseleves understand the meaning, just to exert superiority and dominance over those more timid.

But when the matter got blown up big enough for Gong'an (police) to come, they're cowered like cowards you've never seen before. Just like school bullies got caned by teachers and principals. They know, police can just execute them on the spot and makeup a justifying report later. That's the law and law enforcement in PRC.

Making A Wrong Turn

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