Elaboration on answers to Housing Issues @ TOC Forum

[scroobal]

Pointless you telling us all this. This should have been better managed from the word go. Your points in this post does show that it was indeed a case of "no up" for WP. Quite condescending. Even Sylvia is too good.

By the way, we all know that it is indeed English and sent Giam as he was more articulate amongst all WP chaps. The language will continue to be a albatross around the WP neck for sometime.

By the way reciprocity is never controlled by a "warrant". It is mutual respect. Notice who represented the other parties and also note that one party has a man close to death representing it. Even GMS chose to wear tie to reflect importance and respect to the occasion.

There's nothing to do with English. If so, Sylvia could have attended. There's nothing to do with me, I'm not even a CEC member. It's been WP policy not to be too highly profiled and unnecessarily involved with other parties, haven't you noticed? I don't see LTK having problem with basically comprehensible English in pre-election boundary conference, election rally and Parliament. There's nothing to explain. An invitation is not a warrant.

 

[Ramseth]

Pointless you telling us all this. This should have been better managed from the word go. Your points in this post does show that it was indeed a case of "no up" for WP. Quite condescending. Even Sylvia is too good.

By the way, we all know that it is indeed English and sent Giam as he was more articulate amongst all WP chaps. The language will continue to be a albatross around the WP neck for sometime.

By the way reciprocity is never controlled by a "warrant". It is mutual respect. Notice who represented the other parties and also note that one party has a man close to death representing it. Even GMS chose to wear tie to reflect importance and respect to the occasion.

To put it bluntly, that man has nobody else left in his party whom he can trust to represent his party respectably. SPP is a lost cause as far as I'm concerned after the Desmond attempted but miscarried coup.

You contradict yourself if indeed Gerald is the most articulate among the WP new batch as you opine. And indeed, he's a published author. Then WP must have see the event very up to send its most articulate, isn't it? Did WP look down on the event you all look down on Gerald?

 

[theDoors]

Removing the grant won't get you votes, more likely it will get you scorn.

 

[scroobal]

He could have asked his wife Lina or his daughter to attend. It is about a repect and common sense.

I did not contract myself. In fact it bolsters my positon that the issue was English.

Anyway, it is common knowledge that English has been a factor for Low and has nothing to do with keeping a low profile. He handles himself very well on one on one interview with journalist. When it comes to forum and no interpreter that he runs to the hills.

Looks like you opened a can of worms as usual.

To put it bluntly, that man has nobody else left in his party whom he can trust to represent his party respectably. SPP is a lost cause as far as I'm concerned after the Desmond attempted but miscarried coup.

You contradict yourself if indeed Gerald is the most articulate among the WP new batch as you opine. And indeed, he's a published author. Then WP must have see the event very up to send its most articulate, isn't it? Did WP look down on the event you all look down on Gerald?

 

[Dreamer1]

He could have asked his wife Lina or his daughter to attend. It is about a repect and common sense.

I did not contract myself. In fact it bolsters my positon that the issue was English.

Anyway, it is common knowledge that English has been a factor for Low and has nothing to do with keeping a low profile. He handles himself very well on one on one interview with journalist. When it comes to forum and no interpreter that he runs to the hills.

Looks like you opened a can of worms as usual.

Still remember that national day speech by MM Lee.

Tony Tan the best but no interest to be PM.

Ong Teng Cheong ok,but Chinese educated with an Australian degree.

Dhana OK,but being an Indian

GCT,below average but made it.

Of course I am not sure whether it is all part of his WARM SEAT plan

I never trust LKY's words when it concern domestic politics,he tells white lies.

 

[Ramseth]

He could have asked his wife Lina or his daughter to attend. It is about a repect and common sense.

That's CST sense and decision.

The other's LTK sense and decision.

There's nothing common about political sense.

Otherwise, there won't be so many parties.

Back to my point, is it a must for SG to attend?

What has English got to do with when someone could win four consecutive elections?

Bluntly again, what's there to agree about when half of them had openly disagreed with WP?

Even more bluntly, it's WP majority members' belief that associating too much with them would cost votes.

If you disagree and wish to see changes, join WP, get into CEC to change their views.

And you haven't replied, what's so lowly about Gerald?

 

[silverfox@]

Wah GMS's housing issue diverted into why GG attended instead of LTK or SL. If I look at the positive aspect, and if its WP really see this forum no up, he wouldn't have sent anyone. Another aspect is GG is slated for bigger role to come. :o


Well, if think of the negative aspect, think Scroobal got the answers.

 

[silverfox@]

PAP's armoury is out in the Straits Times today on prices of COV falling in ALL districts with some notable percentages in certain areas.

Attacking on grants, purchase by PRs, COV is not going to sway much votes over to opposition.

Certain things like how prices were allowed to be escalated, why cooldown came so late, and what are the steps to be taken to prevent it from happening again should be questioned and accounted.

Probably MBT would then come out with his solutions, maybe then GMS can see where the holes are and dig them out for everyone to see. Right now prices are coming down to pave a good way for them to win.

 

[rodent2005]

HDB pigeon holes can never be sold at cost. If you do that, there will never be any aspirations to better one's quality of life by moving ahead in life. And if you do not aspire to better yourself, you will end life as a two-bit computer dealer like GMS who is no economist but talks and talks like he is Lim Chong Yah.

Flimsy excuses. U PAP must be shitting bricks. Time for MBT to look for another job. Maybe he can play R2D2.

 

[Tristan]

Flimsy excuses. U PAP must be shitting bricks. Time for MBT to look for another job. Maybe he can play R2D2.

This has nothing to do with the PAP.

 

[BusNo64]

hahahaha....goh meng seng will sure kena humtum on dis when he face the younger voters.. ...mark my word...

 

[sinren67]

That's CST sense and decision.

If you disagree and wish to see changes, join WP, get into CEC to change their views.

GMS and TL did that, and failed. Those who know Low and the party well will know how WP members being managed (fixed) is like how LKY managed his PAP members.

The WP's groomed potato, used to be an angry man, now is as tame as a lamb.

 

[annexa]

You all damn strange. HDB talk become personal and start whacking people and political parties. That is why PAP will keep winning. If oppo members keep going personal and cannot focus on issues, Sinkies will not trust them.

 

[scroobal]

Aiyah, this thread despite the various exchanges still has not revealed why Low did not turn up. Maybe advising Obama to save the world. Imagine Chiam and Chee, which was the biggest fallout in opposition politics and even went to court, yet had the courtesy to turn up and sit at the same table. I wonder if the we see another Yaw in the making with the bottled up emotion bursting out again.

The comments and critcisms are important so that they are all aware what the expectations when the hustings begin.

 

[Perspective]

Aiyah, this thread despite the various exchanges still has not revealed why Low did not turn up. Maybe advising Obama to save the world. Imagine Chiam and Chee, which was the biggest fallout in opposition politics and even went to court, yet had the courtesy to turn up and sit at the same table. I wonder if the we see another Yaw in the making with the bottled up emotion bursting out again.

The comments and critcisms are important so that they are all aware what the expectations when the hustings begin.

There are many things I disagree with the WP, but nothing about it and PAP.

The weakness of LTK/the present WP is not seeing a need for political avenues in the eager quest to seek the votes of the apolitical. They fail to realise that the votes you win and the potential members you can rope in do not come from the same market. That results in their present predicament where the membership is stagnant. They have no more Sylvia Lims since quietening down.

However, the sending of Gerald Giam does show something, intentionally or not. It shows LTK's willingness to allow someone else to run a show, something leaders have difficulty doing so. KJ on the contrary was unhappy when Tony Tan was invited by NUS over him. The tension between the two could be discerned.

 

[Ramseth]

Scroobal keeps ranting about why LTK didn't attend. It has all been explained and accounted for if he cares to read. If he disagrees and refuses to accept, there's nothing further I can do. The point about why he feels Gerald is so lowly to grace the occasion has never been answered. The point about LTK giving opportunity to exposure to younger candidates has never been answered. I'm not demanding explanation from him.

 

[Perspective]

Funny, why should LTK or WP see TOC organisers or other parties up?

Why don't they see WP up and join WP?

Fact is, there's no such thing as seeing up or down.

There're differences across all parties, that's why there're so many parties.

Anyway, commanding respect is something to be earned, not demanded.

TOC was founded by someone who resigned from WP.

NSP Sec-Gen. is someone who resigned from WP.

SF Sec-Gen. is someone who resigned from WP.

Enough said, they all have disagreements with WP.

WP sending a CEC member is already giving face enough.

And a good choice at that, someone new and uninvolved in past disagreements.

There's another angle in question too, why so many high profile resignations from WP?

I think let the voters decide who's right.

And the SDP now has a potential next Sec-Gen who also resigned from WP? Gomez I mean.

I think WP can bask on the glory that it's secondary leaders all became primary leaders of other entities. It reflects on the primary leaders who had concealed their real intentions. But WP also has explaining to do as to why it couldn't keep them. The true organisation is one that can hide not only 2 tigers, but many of them - and keep them in unity.

 

[Perspective]

The point about LTK giving opportunity to exposure to younger candidates has never been answered. I'm not demanding explanation from him.

That was my point and I have to agree.

One asset of LTK I admire is never to seize or dominate the limelight, which is at other's expense when you are a high-profile person.

His weakness however is overdoing it until he disappears off the radar, leading people to think he's afraid of PAP.

 

[Perspective]

Wrong. If you want to be treat as an equal, there is an expecation that reciprocity is expected. Thats common sense in any human interaction. The least WP should do is to state beforehand why LTK could not attend well before the picture emerged. They still need to explain.


To stretch the analogy, why not LTK ask you take over at his rep during meet the people sessions for the duration of his terms as you see "no up".

Most people are aware that Low has an issue with forums conducted in English and painstaking avoids it and it is a known weakness. At least find a cock and bull story to avoid suggesting that he is above all of the rest. Its called respect.

You miss out some things:

1) TOC's role and responsibility - if they wanted only Sec-Gens or Chairmen, they should have made it know and declined WP's attempt to send Giam. If they allow a party to send a non-Sec-Gen, they need to ensure that all speakers are treated equally.

2) Why was someone under SDA represented by SPP and not SDA. Which is Chiam's ticket to Parliament.

3) Since SDA was not invited, what happened to PKMS and SJP representatives?

4) For certain case, I have to agree with Ram - like for Soc Front, who else can you send other than the SG? For now at least.

Lastly it would be silly if LTK really wanted to raise the profile of other WP leaders and say so for the forum.

 

[scroobal]

Agree. LTK has to remember he can't keep milking WP brand name for too long. He has to contribute for what he has taken.

His weakness however is overdoing it until he disappears off the radar, leading people to think he's afraid of PAP.