Angry and confused because of Joseph Prince

[confusedagain]

Hi everybody,

I have found this forum googling for Joseph Prince. Seems like there are people here who know him and also question his integrity.

Now there are many who criticize Prince and say he is filthy rich and that he's preaching a false gospel which is only about health and wealth.
I did not accept those things and thought that Prince is ok because he always preaches on Grace and makes Jesus the center.
But I have also always been drawn between thinking that Prince is allright and doubting wether he is really what he claims to be. For example something which I noticed is that years ago he looked decent and then suddenly he started dressing "hip" and looking almost like a celebrity. Why this change? This already made me sceptical.

I own a book from him and also recently bought an expensive 5 dvd series about the holy communion. By the way, something which also always bothered me is that ALL his sermons cost money. If he is really SOOOO keen on helping people and getting the word out why does everything cost so much money? Why not make the sermons available free for download? Freely receive, freely give!?

And now I have come across 2 problematic points in short time which totally bother me.
For example Prince says that when God chasteneth us then it means "child training" and that God would never make a christian sick.
But I did a deeper study on the greek word which is used in Hebrew 12:6 for chasteneth and it is exactly the same word which is used in the gospels to describe how Jesus was TORTURED! If it is the same word then how can Prince simply claim that it only means "child training"?
Jesus did not receive a "child training" from Pilate's soldiers....

And the other really problematic thing which Prince said is this here:

Joseph Prince talked about the fiery serpents in the desert.
He said when the people rebelled against God God removed the protection and then fiery serpents came.
He said that this means that all the time God protected them and when he removed the protection the fiery serpents came.
This implies the serpents basically have been in the desert all the time before but they could not get to the people. This is not what the bible says. The bible says God SENT them!

Numbers 21:6
And the LORD sent fiery serpents among the people, and they bit the people; and much people of Israel died.

These small details are really starting to upset me. I can't believe that Joseph Prince doesn't know the bible well enough to know that God sent them. Then why does he twist details!?

I am really upset about this because I spent a lot of money for the DVDs and I also do not know what to think about this at all.
I feel like dismissing everything he said. How can I trust a pastor who twists details? Then I also can't accept all the other things Prince taught about healing and grace and the character of God.
What do you think about this? I do not think I am overreacting. A pastor must not twist scriptures but I feel like this is what he purposely does in order to make God fit to what he teaches. What would you do about this?
I already emailed his church but they do not offer questions they told me to discuss this with my pastor. I do not think this is ok at all. His ministry should be willing to answer questions and to clarify things which he teaches and to help people understand. If they are really convinced of his message then they should be able to defend it and not shy away.

I really don't know what to do or think now. Even if Prince should teach 99% truth and then 1% error then this 1% error still becomes a stumbling block to people like me. How shall I trust somebody who simply makes false claims?

When you listen to Prince you'll also often notice that he says things like "in the original greek it says this or that" and he never gives a quote or a proof. I also wonder now if those things are true or also false.

 

[guy-uninterrupted]

first premise, do you believe in God as in only one God and no other god but GOD Almighty?

 

[confusedagain]

I sure do!

 

[tanwahtiu]

Confusedagain,

All these 'animals names and so call beast' are coded or psyudoneum to present an event, place, person. Who is known as the lamb in Revelation? Jesus, and his son Jesus Justus. Who is known as the leper? Did Jesus heal the lepers? No, Leper is someone nickname.

Therer are over 2,000 mistakes in the Bible. Jesus did not die on the cross for you. He lived to form his Christianity wiht Paul and in Revelation it speaks about how Jesus formed Christianity in coded messages - beast, trumet, angel 7 or 7 angels, dragon (nick for Pharassie Hig priest), God (nick for Sadduces High Priest) and so on...

 

[guy-uninterrupted]

second premise, do you believe that there will be a day of judgement? A day when all mankind will be asked of what they used to do?

"on the day when every soul is faced with all that it hath done of good and all that it hath done of evil, every soul will long that there be a mighty space of distance between it and that"

 

[commoner]

read some better books like

Jesus misquoted by Bart Ehrman,,,,,

Godless,, by Dan Barker

 

[glockman]

I sure do!

Please allow me to ask you some "radical" questions. Have you ever entertained the thought :

-that there is no god? Every religion has its own god or gods. Each claiming their god is superior. What makes you think they even existed?

-that the bible was actually compiled by men who wanted readers to see things in a certain way, and kept certain books out of the bible just because these books did not suit their cause?

-that whatever a certain pastor, priest, deacon, preacher, canon (or whatever else they choose to call themselves) is simply to make you conform to their ideal? And each one's ideal is different because they will adopt a certain passage from the bible that suit their cause.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suseKsLEWKo&feature=player_embedded#!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhef6wa2Mpc&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-L7cQ3BrD5U&feature=related

The above is just to get you thinking in an alternative way. A rational and logical way. Why? Because when religion gets into the picture, a person becomes emotional and seem to throw logic to the wind. Analyse religion in the same way you approach solving a practical world problem (such as work, studies, finance, etc) and you would be surprised at what you can turn up. And then suddenly, Prince and all the likes of him, would not matter anymore.

 

[gsh]

This is not the right forum to discuss this issue. For your own research, try reading Stillhaventfound.org blog. http://www.stillhaventfound.org/category/christianity/new-creation-church/

He is pro NCC but does give a balance perspective.

I am not from NCC. I do not agree with many things that were thought but I have also seen a lot of good things happened in people's life.

So I will reserve my comments.

 

[da dick]

this always look like a bunch of fanboys going apeshite talking about their fav characters and quotes of movies. petty.

 

[2cents]

Hi everybody,

I really don't know what to do or think now. Even if Prince should teach 99% truth and then 1% error then this 1% error still becomes a stumbling block to people like me. How shall I trust somebody who simply makes false claims?

When you listen to Prince you'll also often notice that he says things like "in the original greek it says this or that" and he never gives a quote or a proof. I also wonder now if those things are true or also false.

Hi,

I hope I can help you out a little. First of all, there are NO preachers I have heard that preach 100% accuracy or at least 100% that I totally agree. There will always some minor points here and there that are disagreeable among preachers.

Sometimes preachers will play with scriptures and see certain things that others don't see like the small details that you mentioned earlier. But that doesn't mean that they are wrong in the rest of the message. If you do not agree with it you can always reject it or KIV for future reference.

What I usually do is just ignore the disagreeable first and KIV and check with the Bible till I can be sure I am right. NEVER take any preacher's sermons wholesale without checking with the Bible. By that I don't mean be suspicious of your pastor all the time. Learn to listen to the witness of the Holy Spirit in your spirit, if something is from God there is a witness that say "yes". If something is error, there will be an uneasy feeling in your heart. But this you have to learn and it's not easy. But if your heart is right and sincerely God will show it to you.

The most important thing is the fundamental doctrines that cannot be compromised such as the death and resurrection of Christ, forgiveness through His blood, 2nd coming etc. Foe example, if anyone says Jesus is not God or the Bible is not the Word of God, then don't listen to him. Don't over worry about small variation of details. Just ignore it.

Keep reading the Bible, the more you read the more you will know the truth and the truth will set you free.

As for the original greek or hebrew thingy, you can buy a concordance from the bookstore and check them out or just google them. I have heard different preachers who give different meanings to the same greek/hebrew word too but I usually just KIV them till I check with appropriate sources.

God Bless You!

 

[gsh]

Amen to that, 2cents.

I recommend you search Tim Keller of Redeemer Presbyterian Church.

He preaches a wonderful message of grace but caters more to the intellect.

 

[Dreamer1]

It seems to be Joseph is more keen to get into good book of LKY & LHL,especially after Kong Hee kena whacked real hard by PAP and the actions taken against pastor Tan.

Followers of Joseph,pl enjoy the KTV by his insurance super salesman and the taosit oriest who are no in tiop form with PAP

Lord Jesus bless you all!Hope u manages to bring the father & son to Lord Jesus

 

[bob557]

Pastor Prince is not paid by NCC. He write books and put his preaching into the cd. He gets royalty when books and cd are sold.
More than 25,000 flocked to attend his service every Sunday and they are blessed.
AS fo you and those who are not happy, please go to another church where you can be happy

 

[fishbuff]

http://philosophyofjoel.xanga.com/697346786/joseph-prince-paid-500000-this-year/

============================================

SINGAPORE (AFP) - - A Singapore-based church paid one of its leaders more than 500,000 dollars (329,000 US) in its last financial year, a report said Monday.


The New Creation Church, which raised 19 million Singapore dollars in just one day in February for the construction of its new premises, paid one employee between 500,001 and 550,000 dollars in the financial year ended March 31, 2008, the Straits Times said.

It said the church did not confirm if the money was paid to its leader, Senior Pastor Joseph Prince.

But New Creation's honorary secretary, Deacon Matthew Kang, was quoted by the newspaper as saying it was the church's policy to "recognise and reward key contributors... and Senior Pastor Prince is the main pillar of our church's growth and revenue."

Kang also described Prince as "the key man responsible for bringing in about 95 percent of our church's income," and added "he has enriched the church and not the other way around."

Two other employees of the church were paid between 150,001 and 200,000 dollars, but no names were given, the report said.

One of Singapore's fastest growing churches, New Creation had an income of 55.4 million dollars and net assets of 143.36 million dollars in its last financial year, according to its website.

Singapore is a predominantly ethnic Chinese society with deep Buddhist and Taoist traditions, but Christians here are known as devout and relatively affluent.

 

[bob557]

Since 2009 Pastor Prince never take a cent from NCC.

 

[bob557]

Since 2009 Pastor Prince never take a cent from NCC

 

[drifter]

This is not the right forum to discuss this issue. For your own research, try reading Stillhaventfound.org blog. http://www.stillhaventfound.org/category/christianity/new-creation-church/

He is pro NCC but does give a balance perspective.

I am not from NCC. I do not agree with many things that were thought but I have also seen a lot of good things happened in people's life.

So I will reserve my comments.

lu siao is it ? ask ppl to find answer in a christain website ? is that the best you could offer ?

 

[drifter]

Since 2009 Pastor Prince never take a cent from NCC

talk is cheap ..are you that "pester" prince ?

 

[Speros]

Re: Joseph Prince does not get paid by NCC

Since 2009 Pastor Prince never take a cent from NCC.

Why would he need to get paid by NCC?

He is a successful tele-evangelist, author, and charlatan, who advertises his merchandise during his sermons, and right outside the doors of the auditorium.

I'd probably work for free too, if it meant free advertising for my money machine.

The whole setup is catering to greed. The fact that there is a huge following does not make it righteous. A soft gospel will always attract large numbers. Poor old Job would be turning in his grave.

 

[GOD IS MY DOG]

Re: Joseph Prince does not get paid by NCC

Only the most...............naive.................brain-dead...................mindless..................goons will believe this conman.....................