Serious When is CPF going to do this?

[ginfreely]

the ringgit will take a severe beating over the next few decades. no matter what malaise-ans do, their retirement funds denominated in ringgit will never see light of day at the time of lump sum cash out. it's a currency you wish to not hold right now before it loses more value.

They can use EPF to buy house to hedge against this risk. Same as Spore CPF.

 

[ginfreely]

all the paper differences mean shit if the ringgit collapses, and it will.

Are you saying the country going to collapse ? Disappear from world map? It's just currency weakening due to oil and govt instability, the latter is no thanks to the mudlanders whining non stop about Najib.

 

[eatshitndie]

They can use EPF to buy house to hedge against this risk. Same as Spore CPF.

then they better do it quickly while there's a glut and prices are down.

 

[winnipegjets]

Actually the difference is not that bad for EPF as their dividend rates declared for last 5 years are pretty high from 6% to 6.75%. So the compounded return over five years is 35.9%. After offset by 19. 2% exchange rate decline (based on your above rates) still got 9.8% nett return. Versus Spore CPF 2.5% compounded over five years return of 13.1% only difference by 3.3% lesser . But more importantly is the transparency offered by EPF and their attempt to benchmark dividend rate at 2% above inflation rate.

http://www.kwsp.gov.my/portal/about-epf/investment-highlights/dividend-rates/dividend-rates

Exchange rate difference should not be a factor in the comparison of returns for obvious reasons.

 

[eatshitndie]

Exchange rate difference should not be a factor in the comparison of returns for obvious reasons.

when the ringgit becums banana or rubber plantation money you cum tell me.

 

[ginfreely]

Exchange rate difference should not be a factor in the comparison of returns for obvious reasons.

In that case CPF negative returns below inflation is really like shit compared to EPF positive returns above inflation.

 

[frenchbriefs]

anybody can declare whatever dividend interest rate they want if their currency is depreciating like toilet paper and the price of kopi kaya and kitty toys is going up by 20 percent a year.pretty soon every one in epf will be billionaires while exchange rate of RM to USD will be 3000 to 1.there will be vast riots on the streets and USD will become a black market commodity and everytime i visit malaysia i have to carry a wheelbarrow or sack of money.

if i was a malaysian i would ask what percentage of epf investments is in USD denominated investments and how many in malaysian companyies/bonds....if he says anything less than 99 percent i will withdraw my epf immediately,pack my bags and run for the hills before the nazi germany reaches my doorstep.

 

[frenchbriefs]

U also have to factor in the difference in inflation rates. On average from 2011 to 2014, the average inflation rate for malaysia for these 4 years was 2.525%. For Singapore, it was 3.3% (officially. Unofficially maybe 6%). So actually, the Singapore CPF is in negative return for the last 4 years, which makes the EPF even better performing versus the CPF.

exchange rate is linked to inflation obvious,and if malaysia's inflation rate is only 2.52 percent i will chop,theres a reason why they are offering six percent interest.every year their currency becomes more and more toilet paper like.the huge dip in their exchange rate reflects the underlying inflation.

 

[Papsmearer]

exchange rate is linked to inflation obvious,and if malaysia's inflation rate is only 2.52 percent i will chop,theres a reason why they are offering six percent interest.every year their currency becomes more and more toilet paper like.the huge dip in their exchange rate reflects the underlying inflation.

If you are spending the money in Malaysia, it does not matter to you. U get your EPF out in ringgit, you spend it in ringgit. It has no effect on you, especially when the inflation rate is still under control at 2.52%. It only effects you when you travel and have to convert the currency to something else. If you are earning over 6% per annum on your EPF, the spread is your real return on investment. In singapore the spread is negative. In Singapore, if you have negative return for donkey number of years, your Sing dollar has to appreciate by a huge amount. And you will only realize the appreciation when you withdraw it to buy USD or ringgit or whatever it is. But then, if you withdraw it and convert it, how will u live in singapore? USD and Ringgit is not the currency of use here.

 

[Papsmearer]

all the paper differences mean shit if the ringgit collapses, and it will.

U some sort of tarot card reading old cunt? U can call the ringgit collapse from the Bay Area?

 

[frenchbriefs]

If you are spending the money in Malaysia, it does not matter to you. U get your EPF out in ringgit, you spend it in ringgit. It has no effect on you, especially when the inflation rate is still under control at 2.52%. It only effects you when you travel and have to convert the currency to something else. If you are earning over 6% per annum on your EPF, the spread is your real return on investment. In singapore the spread is negative. In Singapore, if you have negative return for donkey number of years, your Sing dollar has to appreciate by a huge amount. And you will only realize the appreciation and withdraw it to buy USD or ringgit or whatever it is. But then, it if you withdraw it and convert it, how will u live in singapore. USD and Ringgit is not the currency of use here.

so u believe theres very little inflation in malaysia only 2.5 percent,everything is under control and all is well,their currency exchange rate is dropping like a rock because malaysians are very generous and likes giving money and value away?theres a reason why their bank interest and epf interest rates are at 6 percent and thats because they are trying to keep up with inflation and inflation is likely to be even higher,if sg banks and cpf start giving away 8 percent interest rate like last time i wouldnt be jumping for joy i would be running away as fast as i can.the interest they are giving out is because there is huge amounts of excess liquidity being pumped into the economy and driving their currency to toilet paper quality.fucking hell,in the investment world,the only countries or companies that give high interest rates or high yielding bonds are highly risky companies or economies bordering the edge of insolvency with risky insufficent assets or poor balance sheets.are u willing to buy sri lankan or bangladesh government bonds if they offered u 8 percent interest coupons?

 

[eatshitndie]

U some sort of tarot card reading old cunt? U can call the ringgit collapse from the Bay Area?

it doesn't require a rocket scientist.

 

[frenchbriefs]

it doesn't require a rocket scientist.

View attachment 26883

how come george soros never short the myr?

 

[eatshitndie]

how come george soros never short the myr?

there's no need to. it's useless and self-destructible.

 

[lifeafter41]

If you are spending the money in Malaysia, it does not matter to you. U get your EPF out in ringgit, you spend it in ringgit. It has no effect on you, especially when the inflation rate is still under control at 2.52%. It only effects you when you travel and have to convert the currency to something else. If you are earning over 6% per annum on your EPF, the spread is your real return on investment. In singapore the spread is negative. In Singapore, if you have negative return for donkey number of years, your Sing dollar has to appreciate by a huge amount. And you will only realize the appreciation and withdraw it to buy USD or ringgit or whatever it is. But then, it if you withdraw it and convert it, how will u live in singapore. USD and Ringgit is not the currency of use here.

While not sure on the 2.52% inflation reported, I believe inflation is much higher than that, especially last year.

Coupled with the fact that Malaysia introduced GST, with a depreciating ringgit, their people are certainly getting much less for their money.

It's quite surprising that the epf is able to make payout of 6%. They must have a very good team to be able to do that.

 

[Papsmearer]

so u believe theres very little inflation in malaysia only 2.5 percent,everything is under control and all is well,their currency exchange rate is dropping like a rock because malaysians are very generous and likes giving money 0and value away?theres a reason why their bank interest and epf interest rates are at 6 percent and thats because they are trying to keep up with inflation and inflation is likely to be even higher,if sg banks and cpf start giving away 8 percent interest rate like last time i wouldnt be jumping for joy i would be running away as fast as i can.the interest they are giving out is because there is huge amounts of excess liquidity being pumped into the economy and driving their currency to toilet paper quality.fucking hell,in the investment world,the only countries or companies that give high interest rates or high yielding bonds are highly risky companies or economies bordering the edge of insolvency with risky insufficent assets or poor balance sheets.are u willing to buy sri lankan or bangladesh government bonds if they offered u 8 percent interest coupons?

Its not a question of what I believe or not believe. The Malaysians say their inflation rate is such and such. And I took the average over the last 4 years and it worked out to be 2.52%. I did the same for the Singapore inflation rate. I don't live in Malaysia, so I don't have empirical evidence as to whether the rate is realistic or not. However, I can tell you the singapore rate is completely under reported. It should be at least 3% higher.

How they disburse their EPF money has really nothing to do with the inflation rate in Malaysia. A blind man can see that. Their EPF rate of return is a function of how well they invest their money. Its not a function of what the inflation rate is. If they use a good team of professional fund managers and they can get their account holders over 6% return, then more power to them. We in singapore are already behind the 8 ball because we have a fixed return of 2.5%. Any idiot throwing darts at a stock chart can get over 2.5%.

Stop shooting your mouth off about excess liquidity, high yield bonds and all that shit. U don't know what you are talking about.

 

[Papsmearer]

While not sure on the 2.52% inflation reported, I believe inflation is much higher than that, especially last year.

Coupled with the fact that Malaysia introduced GST, with a depreciating ringgit, their people are certainly getting much less for their money.

It's quite surprising that the epf is able to make payout of 6%. They must have a very good team to be able to do that.

It could be that inflation is higher then officially reported in malaysia. But i know that country is self sufficient in many things, while singapore is self sufficient in nothing. Malaysia grows or rears its own food, is a exporter of petrol and make many of the goods and services they use, including cars. When their dollar is lower, they just source more from within their country and hence keep the inflation rate and the cost down.

In singapore, the opposite is suppose to work. As singapore makes next nothing for itself, a strong sing dollar means they can buy goods and services cheaper and hence is supposed to keep the inflation rate down. But the sing dollar strength does not necessarily translate to lower costs in singapore. Look at petrol for example. Worldwide oil prices have fallen, coupled with the appreciation of the sing dollar against even the US, yet, do you see the price of petrol getting lower significantly? In Malaysia, RON 97 has dropped from RM$2.90 in March 2014 down to RM$2.05. So for a Malaysian who might have been hurt from a higher inflation rate, he sees that he is paying much less for petrol. But has singapore petrol prices gone down correspondingly?

The bottom line is purchasing power. Given the same basket of goods and services, can the malaysian buy more or less vis a vis the singaporean? Lets not also forget the power of compounding. The malaysian is earning at 6% or more for his EPF. But he is not allowed to touch it until 55. So, its sitting there compounding. While the Singaporean is compounding at 2.5% At the end of the day, the Malaysian's advantage is significantly more then a singaporean, regardless of what the exchange rate is.

 

[Papsmearer]

Using the compounding interest calculator with a monthly contribution of $500 for CPF/EPF. Lets say both the malaysian and the singaporean enter the work force at age 25 and work in it for 30 years. Lets further assume, they started with zero balance in their CPF/EPF accounts. AFter 30 years:

The singaporean will have $268,241 in his account assume 2.5% per annum interest from the CPB
The malaysian will have $504,768 in his account if you assume 6% per annum return from EPF

big difference that over rides anything you want to talk about regarding exchange rate or anything else.

 

[frenchbriefs]

Its not a question of what I believe or not believe. The Malaysians say their inflation rate is such and such. And I took the average over the last 4 years and it worked out to be 2.52%. I did the same for the Singapore inflation rate. I don't live in Malaysia, so I don't have empirical evidence as to whether the rate is realistic or not. However, I can tell you the singapore rate is completely under reported. It should be at least 3% higher.

How they disburse their EPF money has really nothing to do with the inflation rate in Malaysia. A blind man can see that. Their EPF rate of return is a function of how well they invest their money. Its not a function of what the inflation rate is. If they use a good team of professional fund managers and they can get their account holders over 6% return, then more power to them. We in singapore are already behind the 8 ball because we have a fixed return of 2.5%. Any idiot throwing darts at a stock chart can get over 2.5%.

Stop shooting your mouth off about excess liquidity, high yield bonds and all that shit. U don't know what you are talking about.

so u dont live in malaysia,u dont have any evidence what the inflation is like in malaysia so u take their government's word for it.but u live in singapore and u experience what inflation is like in singapore and u think the government is lieing?brilliant deduction.if u dont see it it doesnt exist?

u completely disregard the fact that the malaysian currency has lost 20 percent of its value agianst the sgd over the past two years and even more against the USD,which means its purchasing power and ability to import goods,equipment and resources and pay for services has been roughly reduced by twenty percent,which is more likely to mean high rate of inflation.companies are more likely to raise prices by twenty percent to make up for the losses in order to account for their decline in profits when they receive payments in malaysian ringgit?

and u think epf is a function of how well they invest their money and not a function of inflation and how fast their currency is devaluing?since the epf is essentially paying out its trustees in malaysian ringgit,the returns they get is essentially based on the strength of their currency?if their currency is losing 10 percent of its value a year,they can essentially set the interest rate at a high level of 6 to 8 percent since their currency is being debased by 10 percent per year?in fact if they dont set epf interest rates,or bank interests rates at 6 percent or more there is no reason for malaysians to keep their ringgit in the bank or in their epf cause the value of their money is declining drastically at a rate of 10 percent per year.even at 6 percent they might still be losing value.they might as well take all their money out and spend it now,or use it to buy houses or property or exchange it for USD or buy gold while the malaysian ringgit is in a state of decline?lets not forget the malaysian government can print money anytime to pay their investees,which means more liquidity,more inflation and more devalution.and they will have to raise the epf interest rates again which is a endless horrible cycle.im sure 10 percent currency devaluation a year is a anomaly but the average inflation in malaysia is still pretty high i would guess their currency has been losing 5 percent a year since the 90s.

and yes high interest and high yields are all relevant,high interest and yields normally mean high risk in the investment world,the 6 to 8 percent interest in epf and their bank deposits are justified because im taking alot of risk that the malaysian economy is weak,inflation is high and the risk that their currency is losing its value and turning to toilet paper at the rate of 5 percent a year.theres a reason why the sgd myr chart is a downwards slope and their currency has declined from 2.27 to 3.0 in the last 10 years which is a lost of 35 percent.

 

[ginfreely]

If you are spending the money in Malaysia, it does not matter to you. U get your EPF out in ringgit, you spend it in ringgit. It has no effect on you, especially when the inflation rate is still under control at 2.52%. It only effects you when you travel and have to convert the currency to something else. If you are earning over 6% per annum on your EPF, the spread is your real return on investment. In singapore the spread is negative. In Singapore, if you have negative return for donkey number of years, your Sing dollar has to appreciate by a huge amount. And you will only realize the appreciation when you withdraw it to buy USD or ringgit or whatever it is. But then, if you withdraw it and convert it, how will u live in singapore? USD and Ringgit is not the currency of use here.

Exactly, a strong SGD is of no use when you live in Spore. Fucking stupid people cannot understand that and rejoicing over strong SGD which somehow does not translate to cheaper petrol, cheaper COE, cheaper medicine, cheaper hawker/food court/restaurant food, cheaper condo or even HDB, cheaper hospital stay or medical consultation and the list goes on and on.