Raise taxes on the Rich - in Singapore

[The_Hypocrite]

Aiyah,,,this Watchman only watch porn lah,,,he is nothing but a left wing bleeding heart liberal, the sort that are sheep that will follow the west until they jump of the cliff,,,and as sheep,,will follow them off the cliff,,,no logic of his own,,,

Screw you bro, Reagan slashed taxes, not increase them, and the economy grew. Bush did the same thing n the economy rebounded in record time.
Both times, govt revenue grew after tax cuts because the econ into grew.
Better don't try to revise or teach me about USA history bro. I am very familiar with USA.

 

[Fook Seng]

Screw you bro, Reagan slashed taxes, not increase them, and the economy grew. Bush did the same thing n the economy rebounded in record time.
Both times, govt revenue grew after tax cuts because the econ into grew.
Better don't try to revise or teach me about USA history bro. I am very familiar with USA.

But the deficit got larger and larger. In actual fact, it is just borrowing from the future. USA is a crazy case. They don't balance their budget. What they are hoping to do now is to try to find a balance over a period of 10 years. They really give themselves a long time to adjust. In the meantime, a number of their trading partners may have to be conned to fund their excesses. No harm to their country and citizens if they are able to do that but Singapore is not USA. No one will listen to Singapore's bidding.

 

[mojito]

Grover Norquist never go far enough.... a flat tax as suggested by cass888 is inherantly much better than a flat rate tax...

and the best amount for a flat tax is zero...

Bah! Public transportation in Singapore is already a flat tax on the proletariat. Perhaps in order for a flat tax to be affordable, you would support a minimum wage well above subsistence level?

 

[watchman8]

Aiyah,,,this Watchman only watch porn lah,,,he is nothing but a left wing bleeding heart liberal, the sort that are sheep that will follow the west until they jump of the cliff,,,and as sheep,,will follow them off the cliff,,,no logic of his own,,,

And you are a poor prick who think that you belong to the rich men camp, but is actually part of the poor 99%. Even more hilarious is that you are in fact fighting for the 1% to reduce their tax when they are already ripping you a new hole by evading bulk of their taxes.

You think further reducing taxes on those rich prick will help your job security? Dream on, they will only take the money to buy more gold, art pieces, Swiss watches and other silly rich man toys that don't benefit anyone but their own ego.

 

[watchman8]

But the deficit got larger and larger. In actual fact, it is just borrowing from the future. USA is a crazy case. They don't balance their budget. What they are hoping to do now is to try to find a balance over a period of 10 years. They really give themselves a long time to adjust. In the meantime, a number of their trading partners may have to be conned to fund their excesses. No harm to their country and citizens if they are able to do that but Singapore is not USA. No one will listen to Singapore's bidding.

USA politicians are just putting up a wayang show for international audience, to pretend that they are concerned about the strength of usd and their budget deficit. Fact is the country has been in deficit for much of their history, and this deficit is funded by the international community. All USA allies are secretly persuaded to buy Uncle Sam bonds, which will be gradually repaid with ever depreciating usd.

The rich in USA wants big deficit because this will ensure that real wages will always be kept low by high inflation, while the rich gets to maintain their wealth through inflation protected assets. So the rich is always talking about reducing taxes for themselves, to get more cash to buy up assets, and to maintain large deficit that will keep inflation high.

And poor dummies are cheering the tax evading rich on in hope that the rich will create more jobs. Yeah, only accounting jobs to help find ways to evade more taxes.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

If u bother to even read my article,,especially the long one on Pg 5 of this thread,,I have never advocated cutting taxes for the rich,,,I advocated a different way of taxing the rich,,,in the USA case I agree that rich should pay more,,but if u tax the rich they just run away and kill economic growth,,

What I disagree with is left wing liberal scums like u,,with yr rob the middle class to feed the trailer park trash mentality of economics which is causing so many problems in the West...and you want Singapore to through the same route? Are u retarded ? Its scumbags like you that has made the world more fuck up,,we have the rich jewish bankers to contend with and now have to put up with yr flawed liberal ideology,,

Some sort of Watchman u are,,,you are more a Voyeur..so u better stick to watching porn,, as that is where your get your filthy crap ideas from,,,

And you are a poor prick who think that you belong to the rich men camp, but is actually part of the poor 99%. Even more hilarious is that you are in fact fighting for the 1% to reduce their tax when they are already ripping you a new hole by evading bulk of their taxes.

You think further reducing taxes on those rich prick will help your job security? Dream on, they will only take the money to buy more gold, art pieces, Swiss watches and other silly rich man toys that don't benefit anyone but their own ego.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

And why do u think all these industries moved to China? They lost their competitive advantage due to the high taxes,,and as workers get taxed more,,they unions demand more pay,,,and the cycle never ends..

Ang mor land was fucked not because of social democrats, but because of rapid shift of manufacturing to china and services to India. So many people were suddenly out of jobs and there were insufficient jobs to go around. This is the real issue. Not high tax on rich etc.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

Dear Frens,,do you all notice when its an economic thread, those bleeding heart left wing liberals always come out and spew their crap? They are like Pappie dogs,,sprouting crap about policies that dont work and still must implement,,do these people even have half a brain?

 

[watchman8]

And why do u think all these industries moved to China? They lost their competitive advantage due to the high taxes,,and as workers get taxed more,,they unions demand more pay,,,and the cycle never ends..

You are obviously born yesterday. Factories moved to china because china labour cost is very cheap, like $100 PM cheap. It has got nothing to do with tax on the rich. And another issue is that developed countries govt has yet to catch up with global economy in terms of tax. This allowed rich pricks to stash money overseas without paying any tax. Apple gets to pay minimum tax manufacturing overseas. Once all governments get their acts together and close this tax loop holes and tax havens, the rich will have no where else to run.

 

[watchman8]

If u bother to even read my article,,especially the long one on Pg 5 of this thread,,I have never advocated cutting taxes for the rich,,,I advocated a different way of taxing the rich,,,in the USA case I agree that rich should pay more,,but if u tax the rich they just run away and kill economic growth,,

What I disagree with is left wing liberal scums like u,,with yr rob the middle class to feed the trailer park trash mentality of economics which is causing so many problems in the West...and you want Singapore to through the same route? Are u retarded ? Its scumbags like you that has made the world more fuck up,,we have the rich jewish bankers to contend with and now have to put up with yr flawed liberal ideology,,

Some sort of Watchman u are,,,you are more a Voyeur..so u better stick to watching porn,, as that is where your get your filthy crap ideas from,,,

Your ideas are crap. Do you even know that rich pricks are expensing cars under their companies? The rich has army of accountants to find ways to evade taxes. The pap is making the poor and middle class pay for everything, including welfare for the rich. And you are thinking that you can outsmart the pap and their rich cronies with stupid tax ideas?

 

[The_Hypocrite]

So basically,,instead of saying taxing the rich more,,one should say, close the tax loopholes and encourage the rich to invest more in the economy,,

maybe in USA they should not give tax incentive for the rich to invest overseas and reduce their tax for investing locally??? Obama is trying to do that,,but he got stymied by the Republicans and rich democrats,,,

You are obviously born yesterday. Factories moved to china because china labour cost is very cheap, like $100 PM cheap. It has got nothing to do with tax on the rich. And another issue is that developed countries govt has yet to catch up with global economy in terms of tax. This allowed rich pricks to stash money overseas without paying any tax. Apple gets to pay minimum tax manufacturing overseas. Once all governments get their acts together and close this tax loop holes and tax havens, the rich will have no where else to run.

 

[brocoli]

Bah! Public transportation in Singapore is already a flat tax on the proletariat. Perhaps in order for a flat tax to be affordable, you would support a minimum wage well above subsistence level?

talk cock... do every1 need to take Public transportation ???

do you know econ?

IUn the Shapiro-Stiglitz model workers are paid at a level where they do not shirk. This prevents wages from dropping to market clearing levels

www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/1801842?uid=3738992&uid=2&uid=4&sid=21101491160633

even the socialist Lassalle proposed that real wages always tend, in the long run, toward the minimum wage necessary to sustain the life of the worker.

has any1 drop dead from lack of food in singapore...


if anything the rich in singapore faced very high indirect taxation

read this article

http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/sideviews/article/singapore-tax-myths-david-cay-johnston

The reality is quite different, for beyond the posted official tax rates lies a much less visible array of what economists call implicit taxes. Singapore does not have the kind of government openness that many Americans take for granted. Add the obvious taxes to the implicit ones and you get a high tax society, especially for affluent wage-earners with no capital income.

On the surface Singapore is a beautiful and well-run city with clean and smooth streets. Public toilets are as spotless as automated subway cars. Beggars are as hard to find as uniformed police, who rely on cameras to survey the streets. But even though Singapore is widely perceived as moving towards a more open society, old ways persist and many people still look around and then speak sotto voce about economic, legal and business matters.

“There are many things here that are known, but not spoken of” is a phrase, with variations, spoken often here to those who ask probing questions about the public purse.


The implicit taxes are the result of an advanced and sophisticated form of corporate socialism. In the United States public access to how tax dollars are spent declines with each new official function outsourced to contractors. In Singapore, there are disclosures, but the details of public finance remain mostly hidden behind official walls because under Singaporean law the public has no rights to such information.

Singapore’s published tax rates are low, to be sure. Singapore’s top personal income tax rate is just 20 per cent, with the first S$20,000 (RM48,000) exempt from tax and the next S$10,000 taxed at 2 per cent. Little or no tax applies to capital incomes and earnings abroad.

Buy a car, though, and you will see your tax bill soar. A Toyota Camry runs more than S$100,000, equal to US$81,500, because the government taxes cars directly and imposes a second levy, a certificate of entitlement to own a vehicle. Drive during commute hours and automated tolls are imposed under the Electronic Road Pricing system, or ERP, which cynics say is an acronym for “everyday rob people.”


As one tax lawyer explained: “The statutory tax is very low so if you make a typical income, say S$60,000, you will pay less than S$2,000 in income tax, [less than 3 per cent, but then you buy a car that you can keep for maybe 10 years and you pay S$70,000 to the government and now your real tax over the 10 years is S$9,000 each year, which is 15 per cent of your income.”



Modest apartments sell for S$400,000 to S$500,000 while nice ones sell for three or more times as much. Buy a second unit and sell within a year and the government imposes a 16 per cent stamp duty on the entire transaction, not just any gain. The charge is intended to tamp down real estate speculation, but is tantamount to a real estate wealth tax.


The government builds 85 per cent of the housing here, giving it vast influence over housing prices. People who live in their apartments, or hold second ones for more than four years, enjoy tax-free gains when they sell.


The government provides a vast array of tax incentives, one-time tax rebates and other programmes for local residents, promoting itself as working to increase incomes by 30 per cent in the next 10 years, a sharp contrast to the United States where average income in 2009 fell to the 1997 level.
In the annual budget address, Parliament was told the government’s tax-and-spend policies were designed to “enable Singapore to be a first-rate developed society a decade from now.”

The country is perceived as one of the least corrupt in the world, ranking in 2010 at the top with Denmark and New Zealand and just ahead of Finland and Sweden, according to Transparency International. That officials are not on the take goes partly to draconian criminal laws and partly to salaries. The president is paid a multimillion dollar salary and even bus drivers and Customs officers make a comfortable wage.

One indicator of the size of government is the small share of the economy attributable to consumption. In America it is around 70 per cent and in much of Asia 60 per cent. In Singapore it is around 40 per cent with government finance explaining much of the difference.

With a central bank and a tax regime accommodating to international business, Singapore has attracted enough financial companies and regional corporate offices to build a rapidly expanding forest of modern skyscrapers in the financial district. When the markets close in the afternoon, the streets and the underground walkways become a frothy torrent of white-collar workers rushing to their apartments, many financed by a government authority.

The office towers, their air-conditioned interiors as cool as San Francisco in September, loom beside a gigantic casino-hotel-shopping complex on the waterfront. Three wavy hotel towers rise from it, supporting an entertainment complex the size and shape of an ocean liner that seems to ride on waves of steel.
Equities analysts expect gamblers to lose more money in the two casinos here in 2012 than in all of Las Vegas, even though local residents must pay S$100 just to get in, a fee that supposedly discourages those who live on the margins.

Most of the money the casinos win is imported, especially from mainland Chinese players, a net flow of money into Singapore. The Singapore government promotes this as a benefit that also holds down taxes, but it also is a detriment to countries whose players leave their money in Singapore.
The state licenses the casinos, but it owns many other enterprises. Through its Temasek Holdings investment fund, the government owns Singapore Power, which distributes natural gas and electricity.
Temasek also owns MediaCorp Pte Ltd, which in turn owns Singapore broadcast, print and online outlets galore. Temasek also owns 54 per cent of SingTel, as the Singapore Telecommunications Limited phone company is known. It owns 55 per cent of Singapore Airlines. It owns large parts of the subway, plus taxi companies, as well as banks, financial services companies, engineering firms and other enterprises.
The trade-off is that many of these firms are profitable local monopolies whose profits help hold down income tax rates. But would competitive, independent companies charge less and deliver more?
The government also runs a compulsory savings system. Workers must set aside up to 20 per cent of their pay with employers adding up to 16 per cent, which is just additional wages put into the plan. However, people do not get a high degree of clarity in disclosure statements because the mandatory savings scheme is not just for retirement, but also for medical care and for the most part housing.
One academic economic analysis of the S$185.8 billion Central Provident Fund calculated that over 21 years workers got a real annual return of just 1.2 per cent on their mandatory savings, lagging both growth in wages and the overall economy. Over a similar period, returns were estimated around 5.3 per cent annually. When the fund earns more than it credits to worker accounts the net difference, the economists wrote, “is a recurrent annual tax on CPF wealth. It is both large and regressive.”
Visit such public buildings as schools, and you’ll find government enterprises listed as donors, though it is really the taxpayers’ money funding these seemingly philanthropic contributions. So while individual accounts grow slowly, at least the extra earnings go to public benefits.
The government publishes annual reports with limited information about its investments. Two local intellectuals who have tried for years to fathom the finances said asking the government for details is a waste of time. “They simply won’t tell you,” said one, pleading not to be identified.
So the next time you hear Capitol Hill regulars telling you that Singapore is the way to go, ask yourself if you like the idea of government as omnipresent investor. Ask yourself about how much you like the idea of implicit taxes like those that feed the Singapore government

 

[watchman8]

So basically,,instead of saying taxing the rich more,,one should say, close the tax loopholes and encourage the rich to invest more in the economy,,

maybe in USA they should not give tax incentive for the rich to invest overseas and reduce their tax for investing locally??? Obama is trying to do that,,but he got stymied by the Republicans and rich democrats,,,

All major countries must work together to force the rich to pay their fair share. USA and Europe are starting to work, that's why the attack on Swiss banks. Sg will not be far behind.

The globalised world has caused much hardship on the poor and middle class. Middle class in developed nations lost their jobs permanently because the rich moved jobs to super cheap china and India. Next the rich added insult by stashing profits overseas, while demanding governments run deficits to keep up the consumption of their goods made in china. At the same time, the rich pay minimal taxes in USA, but get to enjoy defense and security paid for by middle class and deficits.

So instead of focussing your limited energy bashing the poor, who consumes only a small chunk of govt budget, you should be talking about how to stop the rich from leeching on everyone else. Merely changing tax codes in each country is insufficient. It must be a global concerted effort to close down tax havens.

 

[The_Hypocrite]

Hey Brocoli,,,Singapore is a indirect tax,,,where as in ang mor land is direct tax,,,and in singapore,,,if possible dont get a car,,,u save 9000 in taxes a year,,,and in oz,,capital gains is 50% of profit,,that is alot hor,,,if want to tax the rich,,the best is do it indirectly,,,tax more on luxury car and less on everyday cars...make public transport cheaper and more efficient so that the need to have a car is mitigated,,,some well off people i know take taxis often and its cheaper than getting a car,,,leave the cars to the very rich or to those with families that need the car,,,

In ang mor land,,where direct tax is high for the middle class,,,they do not have the option of paying less tax ,,,that is worse tooo

 

[watchman8]

Hey Brocoli,,,Singapore is a indirect tax,,,where as in ang mor land is direct tax,,,and in singapore,,,if possible dont get a car,,,u save 9000 in taxes a year,,,and in oz,,capital gains is 50% of profit,,that is alot hor,,,if want to tax the rich,,the best is do it indirectly,,,tax more on luxury car and less on everyday cars...make public transport cheaper and more efficient so that the need to have a car is mitigated,,,some well off people i know take taxis often and its cheaper than getting a car,,,leave the cars to the very rich or to those with families that need the car,,,

In ang mor land,,where direct tax is high for the middle class,,,they do not have the option of paying less tax ,,,that is worse tooo

how much COE and car related tax did LHL and his merrymen paid? Close to zilch, because all using govt merc.

And how much COE did property tycoons paid for their fleet of Bentley and Royce? Zilch, because all under corporate use.

Any better ideas?

 

[brocoli]

All major countries must work together to force the rich to pay their fair share. USA and Europe are starting to work, that's why the attack on Swiss banks. Sg will not be far behind.

The globalised world has caused much hardship on the poor and middle class. Middle class in developed nations lost their jobs permanently because the rich moved jobs to super cheap china and India. Next the rich added insult by stashing profits overseas, while demanding governments run deficits to keep up the consumption of their goods made in china. At the same time, the rich pay minimal taxes in USA, but get to enjoy defense and security paid for by middle class and deficits.

So instead of focussing your limited energy bashing the poor, who consumes only a small chunk of govt budget, you should be talking about how to stop the rich from leeching on everyone else. Merely changing tax codes in each country is insufficient. It must be a global concerted effort to close down tax havens.

FULL OF bull shit, you are punishing wealth creators so that there is less wealth to give to the wealth leechers... DO you know how counter intuitive you sound!!!

the poor are less inclined to save than the rich, and as a result, aggregate savings as a proportion of aggregate income may go up if the rich
gain at the expense of the poor. This could affect investment decisions through the effect of the supply of savings on the price of capital. Inequality, in this Kaldorian view of the world would enhance growth.

how much COE and car related tax did LHL and his merrymen paid? Close to zilch, because all using govt merc.

And how much COE did property tycoons paid for their fleet of Bentley and Royce? Zilch, because all under corporate use.

Any better ideas?

do you know that S-PLATE private cars are non-deductible business expense for filing taxes... you really talk a lot of cock... blinded by hatred...

goto IRAS website b4 you spew your venom

http://iras.gov.sg/irasHome/uploade...mployers/ChangesInTaxTreatmentOfMotorCars.pdf

 

[Fook Seng]

And why do u think all these industries moved to China? They lost their competitive advantage due to the high taxes,,and as workers get taxed more,,they unions demand more pay,,,and the cycle never ends..

The marginal tax rate for individuals is in fact
higher in China compared to the US - 45% as against 35%. Individual tax cannot be the cause of the migration of US manufacturing to China. The overall cost of doing things is.

Although US corporate tax is graduated from 15% to 35%, lately the lower tax rates have been removed lifting the effective tax rate for corporations. In China, it is more or less flat at 25%. But corporate tax rate too cannot be the main reason for moving manufacturing to China as most investors will try to play about with transfer pricing to neutralize whatever tax effect. Anyway, China's exchange control regime means it is better to keep profits outside of China.

 

[Fook Seng]

do you know that S-PLATE private cars are non-deductible business expense for filing taxes... you really talk a lot of cock... blinded by hatred...

goto IRAS website b4 you spew your venom

Tax aside, many top managers in large companies do enjoy perks including car allowance or even the use of a company car and this is an indirect form of salary to keep the employee attached to the company.

For business owners, a lot depends on the marginal tax they are paying individually. If their marginal tax is well below the corporate tax rate, I believe to be 18% currently, it does not make much sense to take a car benefit on the company instead of a salary increase because the salary would be taxed well below that of the corporate tax rate and salary can be tax deducted on the company.

On the other hand, if the marginal personal tax is 18% or even more, the business owner is tempted to take a car benefit instead of a salary increase.