Property News

[Frodo]

Even in today's internet age where anyone can access to current news and latest info anytime, anywhere and your story is still repeated again and again.
People are still as "hiong" and plunge in without due consideration and people still kena burnt.
But instead of industrial buildings it's now condos in Iskandar.
So, blame what now?

Just curious, in your view there is not even one condo project in the whole of Iskandar JB that is worth one investment dollar?

 

[eric3417]

Just curious, in your view there is not even one condo project in the whole of Iskandar JB that is worth one investment dollar?

I guess u alr had your answer Frodo…

 

[snowbird]

Just curious, in your view there is not even one condo project in the whole of Iskandar JB that is worth one investment dollar?

To most people, Iskandar is usually refers to the south western side of Johore state, the Medini, Nusajaya, Horizon Hills, Indaman, LEGOLAND and including Kota Iskandar.
But according to the Iskandar Malaysia website, Iskandar actually means whole of southern Johore stretching from Pulau Kukup and Tanjong Pelepas to Masai and Pasir Gudang and from JB city to beyond Kulai!
And area covered is more than two times bigger than Singapore!

 

[Frodo]

To most people, Iskandar is usually refers to the south western side of Johore state, the Medini, Nusajaya, Horizon Hills, Indaman, LEGOLAND and including Kota Iskandar.
But according to the Iskandar Malaysia website, Iskandar actually means whole of southern Johore stretching from Pulau Kukup and Tanjong Pelepas to Masai and Pasir Gudang and from JB city to beyond Kulai!
And area covered is more than two times bigger than Singapore!

View attachment 27976

Uhhh....and your point being? Maybe you can just stick to the definition you are comfortable with, if you intend to answer my question?

 

[rotikok]

I not so lucky with Malaysian property. Last time I bought a piece of LH land from Johor State Economic Board (forgotten the actual name), hold unto it for a number of years, later sold it off at a loss.

Residential land? Bought at what $ psf? Sold at how much?

Good to know history but also learn to be progressive. After these events, all Indo Chinese take indon names and drop their Chinese names.

1998 is small, the one in 60's few hundred thousand, close to 1 million dead during the uprise of suharto. There after all chinese adopt indon name under suharto president ruling. So the naming policy rooted many decades ago.

From your description of your friend, this couple don't seems to be "earning a decent salary" and have to resort to deciding whether to rent out one of the rooms in their HDB flat.
Nearing retirement with little or no savings for both of them?
So sad that they have to send their teenage kid to board with relatives while they "enjoy life" in their HH terrace house, not quite thoughtful of them.

Trust me, child nowadays enjoy days without parents, more so for boys, provided their relatives are easy going.

 

[Aviator]

Iskandar should also include Desaru/Pengerang areas?... the map might be incorrect

 

[rotikok]

Again, please do not way lay Mr Frodo, you are a Malaysian with deep pockets, what you do or say should have no bearing on average Sinkie. Good luck with you on buying your lottery ticket, for others who spent a lifetime buying lottery, I always ask them if they have at least recovered what they spent and 99.999999% do not, so what's the point?

But most of them enjoy what they cant enjoy in Sg. Such consumable good (since you said those make no investment sense) is out of reach for many singaporean.

To most people, Iskandar is usually refers to the south western side of Johore state, the Medini, Nusajaya, Horizon Hills, Indaman, LEGOLAND and including Kota Iskandar.
But according to the Iskandar Malaysia website, Iskandar actually means whole of southern Johore stretching from Pulau Kukup and Tanjong Pelepas to Masai and Pasir Gudang and from JB city to beyond Kulai!
And area covered is more than two times bigger than Singapore!

View attachment 27976

Diff area will have diff growth. I dont see drawing smaller iskandar map will make it more investable as the land is 'limited', it is just link up with bigger land surrounding. Same thing to Beijing, shanghai, jakarta, kl... those city are not island based. When population reach, the city will continue to expand.

Iskandar should also include Desaru/Pengerang areas?... the map might be incorrect

No, iskandar made up by 5 zones. Desaru pengerang development plan came later after iskandar were drew out.

 

[snowbird]

Uhhh....and your point being? Maybe you can just stick to the definition you are comfortable with, if you intend to answer my question?

Then I'll refer Iskandar as the south western end of Johore as Iskandar, as most people would.
And we shall just stick to condos and people buying as investment and not for self stay in the Iskandar region.

Those who had bought very earlier around RM450/sq ft may be able to break even.
Condo units in Idaman and Ledang Hts on offer now are just asking for around RM550/sq ft are still in the market.
Those who had bought above RM500/sq ft in recent times will have a tough time and have to compete with the whole resale market.
Buying at RM500/sq ft and and if can still sell at RM500/sq ft is not losing lots of money is what and those who bought above RM750, pity them?
Another factor affecting resale is the proximity to amenities, the further your unit is away from it, the further you are away from a good deal.
So it seems like those who had bought after 2013 for investment here, their chance of making money is very remote.

 

[snowbird]

Iskandar should also include Desaru/Pengerang areas?... the map might be incorrect

The map was produced by Iskandar Regional Development Authority (IRDA), so you need to get clarifications from them.

http://iskandarmalaysia.com.my/

 

[whoami]

Nice twist, trying to prata your way out, the main targets were Chinese and an image of a decapitated Chinese woman on a stick being paraded is still fresh in my mind today.

U r the snake twisting here. Beheaded?

My grand dad was from Acheh. I been to Acheh before. So I am not ignorant/naive. I was told by my relatives the Chinese at their hometown were not intimidated/raped/murdered. But there were some mobs raiding some Chinese shops though. Wat cancer in Indonesia?

So can u tell me how many Chinese were BEHEADED tats still fresh in ur mine?

 

[Frodo]

Then I'll refer Iskandar as the south western end of Johore as Iskandar, as most people would.
And we shall just stick to condos and people buying as investment and not for self stay in the Iskandar region.

Those who had bought very earlier around RM450/sq ft may be able to break even.
Condo units in Idaman and Ledang Hts on offer now are just asking for around RM550/sq ft are still in the market.
Those who had bought above RM500/sq ft in recent times will have a tough time and have to compete with the whole resale market.
Buying at RM500/sq ft and and if can still sell at RM500/sq ft is not losing lots of money is what and those who bought above RM750, pity them?
Another factor affecting resale is the proximity to amenities, the further your unit is away from it, the further you are away from a good deal.
So it seems like those who had bought after 2013 for investment here, their chance of making money is very remote.

Ok, so within the people's definition of Iskandar you are of the view that not even one condo project is worth one investment dollar?

 

[sgcount]

Then I'll refer Iskandar as the south western end of Johore as Iskandar, as most people would.
And we shall just stick to condos and people buying as investment and not for self stay in the Iskandar region.

Those who had bought very earlier around RM450/sq ft may be able to break even.
Condo units in Idaman and Ledang Hts on offer now are just asking for around RM550/sq ft are still in the market.
Those who had bought above RM500/sq ft in recent times will have a tough time and have to compete with the whole resale market.
Buying at RM500/sq ft and and if can still sell at RM500/sq ft is not losing lots of money is what and those who bought above RM750, pity them?
Another factor affecting resale is the proximity to amenities, the further your unit is away from it, the further you are away from a good deal.
So it seems like those who had bought after 2013 for investment here, their chance of making money is very remote.

Mine cost RM750psf in Medini! Then how.... jialat right? No amenities also.

People say just use for holiday/weekend home.

Others say hold long term. After 10 years, will have capital appreciation. Haha... I also dunno now. Don't want to think so much.

I'm not sure if there is any problem if leave the unit empty for several weeks or months. I got a friend who did that and the air inside the home feels stale every time he goes back. The inside of his cupboards also starts moulding fast.

Those who do short-term Airbnb can't break even. Some months earn maybe $100 only. When more condo units are completed, I think competition will be a lot fiercer.

 

[sgtsk]

Then I'll refer Iskandar as the south western end of Johore as Iskandar, as most people would.
And we shall just stick to condos and people buying as investment and not for self stay in the Iskandar region.

Those who had bought very earlier around RM450/sq ft may be able to break even.
Condo units in Idaman and Ledang Hts on offer now are just asking for around RM550/sq ft are still in the market.
Those who had bought above RM500/sq ft in recent times will have a tough time and have to compete with the whole resale market.
Buying at RM500/sq ft and and if can still sell at RM500/sq ft is not losing lots of money is what and those who bought above RM750, pity them?
Another factor affecting resale is the proximity to amenities, the further your unit is away from it, the further you are away from a good deal.
So it seems like those who had bought after 2013 for investment here, their chance of making money is very remote.

I don't seem to have heard of buyers of PH condos loosing money.

 

[hasslehoff]

I don't seem to have heard of buyers of PH condos loosing money.

Isn't there a Imperia unit that has been put on auction a few times that has failed to sell? You can see it in Trovit.

I would suspect that demand may still exist across different segments, but it is definitely low, and is definitely in the buyers favor. Where demand exists for Resale units, there is most likely a mismatch between buyer and sellers expectations.

If the price point is not realistic, seller loses sale and buyer moves on. After all buying new from developer is arguably easier and comes with warranty if there is no rush. One may argue that the buyer can not get that exact unit in that location. Well then, it'll just be a waiting game to see who blinks first.

 

[snowbird]

Ok, so within the people's definition of Iskandar you are of the view that not even one condo project is worth one investment dollar?

I had already said my piece there, hope it is not hard to understand.
As far as investment is concerned, we would want a reasonably good return within a reasonable time frame.
That's mine and many people's definition for INVESTMENT.

Earning less than 5% a year, you might as well put your money in FD, safer and no need to do anything.
Investing in a property, you put in a reasonable amount as down payment followed by subsequent monthly loan repayment.
If you are thinking of investing, it would means that you'll be selling it off within a certain time and there are not many who are actually investing for longer term than 10 years to recoup.
To invest, you would want to roll, sell and buy bigger and sell and buy even bigger...........
I've already said that for those who had bought around RM500/sq ft, they need to sell at about RM650/ sq ft in order to break even - after off-setting taxation, legal fees, brokers fees, etc.
And not forgetting, if you are from SG, money had devalued, the RM100,000 @ 2.45 you paid 3 years ago is now only RM82,000 now.
You also need to factor in the opportunity cost for the years your money got tied up in the property.
So, if you had bought like some people here @RM750/sq ft, they would need to sell above RM900/sq ft just to break even, possible???

 

[Frodo]

I had already said my piece there, hope it is not hard to understand.
As far as investment is concerned, we would want a reasonably good return within a reasonable time frame.
That's mine and many people's definition for INVESTMENT.

Earning less than 5% a year, you might as well put your money in FD, safer and no need to do anything.
Investing in a property, you put in a reasonable amount as down payment followed by subsequent monthly loan repayment.
If you are thinking of investing, it would means that you'll be selling it off within a certain time and there are not many who are actually investing for longer term than 10 years to recoup.
To invest, you would want to roll, sell and buy bigger and sell and buy even bigger...........
I've already said that for those who had bought around RM500/sq ft, they need to sell at about RM650/ sq ft in order to break even - after off-setting taxation, legal fees, brokers fees, etc.
And not forgetting, if you are from SG, money had devalued, the RM100,000 @ 2.45 you paid 3 years ago is now only RM82,000 now.
You also need to factor in the opportunity cost for the years your money got tied up in the property.
So, if you had bought like some people here @RM750/sq ft, they would need to sell above RM900/sq ft just to break even, possible???

Uhh...you are sharing on the mechanics of what in your opinion would be a good investment, but I was asking whether you think not even one JB condo project is worth investing in. Maybe that was your indirect way of saying "yes"?

 

[Tekkun]

Isn't there a Imperia unit that has been put on auction a few times that has failed to sell? You can see it in Trovit.

I would suspect that demand may still exist across different segments, but it is definitely low, and is definitely in the buyers favor. Where demand exists for Resale units, there is most likely a mismatch between buyer and sellers expectations.

If the price point is not realistic, seller loses sale and buyer moves on. After all buying new from developer is arguably easier and comes with warranty if there is no rush. One may argue that the buyer can not get that exact unit in that location. Well then, it'll just be a waiting game to see who blinks first.

Auctions? If you have a million, would you buy a auction unit?

 

[mpan12]

I had already said my piece there, hope it is not hard to understand.
As far as investment is concerned, we would want a reasonably good return within a reasonable time frame.
That's mine and many people's definition for INVESTMENT.

Earning less than 5% a year, you might as well put your money in FD, safer and no need to do anything.
Investing in a property, you put in a reasonable amount as down payment followed by subsequent monthly loan repayment.
If you are thinking of investing, it would means that you'll be selling it off within a certain time and there are not many who are actually investing for longer term than 10 years to recoup.
To invest, you would want to roll, sell and buy bigger and sell and buy even bigger...........
I've already said that for those who had bought around RM500/sq ft, they need to sell at about RM650/ sq ft in order to break even - after off-setting taxation, legal fees, brokers fees, etc.
And not forgetting, if you are from SG, money had devalued, the RM100,000 @ 2.45 you paid 3 years ago is now only RM82,000 now.
You also need to factor in the opportunity cost for the years your money got tied up in the property.
So, if you had bought like some people here @RM750/sq ft, they would need to sell above RM900/sq ft just to break even, possible???

Your point of view makes a lot of sense. It's what any sensible investor, property analyst and financial adviser will say. I think after more than a year of "ding-donging" between Invest and Not to Invest in Iskandar, you can deduce by now many here are not investors. They are buying the properties for their own use or "holiday home".

There are also those who are fed up with SG's expensive properties and can't live like the rich in SG. Some feel SG will be doomed in 10 years' time because the cost of living will become too high and the place will be overcrowded. So they now buy to "book a place" first in Johor.

Then there are those who want to invest but are too lazy to learn it properly. They argue if everything else cannot invest, then how? Are you smart enough to tell me what else to invest besides Iskandar? So they put down their precious money on Iskandar, for a lack of better investment objective.

I believe also a good handful here are worth at least RM10 million in net worth excluding their own main residential property. So to them, spending close to RM1mil on a property is less than 1/10th their wealth. They don't care too much if their properties won't appreciate in price. It's just a place to chill out and enjoy.

One big fallacy I see even among some here is their thinking that property is "brick and mortar" -- you can see and feel. If you got "holding power", it will surely increase in value. That's not true. If you care to do enough reading or research, you will know there are places where property prices actually dropped in value even after 10 long years. One could have put that money to better use elsewhere.

With Iskandar in particular, have they considered other risk factors? It's common to only want to hear the good stuffs: HSR, Legoland, Educity, race track, etc. But there are other inherent risks that have to be weighed in too, especially for foreign buyers.

For serious investors, I do agree 10 years is too long a timeline to wait and HOPE. Hope is something that's dangerous when investing. Otherwise, you can throw your money on anything and simply hope it will do well. That's a very high risk. And of course, stupid. But people still do it. They still get scammed. It's human nature. There's always some greed in humans to want to make money the easy way.

 

[Frodo]

Your point of view makes a lot of sense. It's what any sensible investor, property analyst and financial adviser will say. I think after more than a year of "ding-donging" between Invest and Not to Invest in Iskandar, you can deduce by now many here are not investors. They are buying the properties for their own use or "holiday home".

There are also those who are fed up with SG's expensive properties and can't live like the rich in SG. Some feel SG will be doomed in 10 years' time because the cost of living will become too high and the place will be overcrowded. So they now buy to "book a place" first in Johor.

Then there are those who want to invest but are too lazy to learn it properly. They argue if everything else cannot invest, then how? Are you smart enough to tell me what else to invest besides Iskandar? So they put down their precious money on Iskandar, for a lack of better investment objective.

I believe also a good handful here are worth at least RM10 million in net worth excluding their own main residential property. So to them, spending close to RM1mil on a property is less than 1/10th their wealth. They don't care too much if their properties won't appreciate in price. It's just a place to chill out and enjoy.

One big fallacy I see even among some here is their thinking that property is "brick and mortar" -- you can see and feel. If you got "holding power", it will surely increase in value. That's not true. If you care to do enough reading or research, you will know there are places where property prices actually dropped in value even after 10 long years. One could have put that money to better use elsewhere.

With Iskandar in particular, have they considered other risk factors? It's common to only want to hear the good stuffs: HSR, Legoland, Educity, race track, etc. But there are other inherent risks that have to be weighed in too, especially for foreign buyers.

For serious investors, I do agree 10 years is too long a timeline to wait and HOPE. Hope is something that's dangerous when investing. Otherwise, you can throw your money on anything and simply hope it will do well. That's a very high risk. And of course, stupid. But people still do it. They still get scammed. It's human nature. There's always some greed in humans to want to make money the easy way.

I am sure that among those who do invest in JB condo, there are some who KNOW what they are doing and have made a considered decision regarding where and what to buy. Like I said, not all JB condos are the same. Some will be better buys than others.

 

[hasslehoff]

Isn't there a Imperia unit that has been put on auction a few times that has failed to sell? You can see it in Trovit.

I would suspect that demand may still exist across different segments, but it is definitely low, and is definitely in the buyers favor. Where demand exists for Resale units, there is most likely a mismatch between buyer and sellers expectations.

If the price point is not realistic, seller loses sale and buyer moves on. After all buying new from developer is arguably easier and comes with warranty if there is no rush. One may argue that the buyer can not get that exact unit in that location. Well then, it'll just be a waiting game to see who blinks first.

Auctions? If you have a million, would you buy a auction unit?

The question posed was whether investors had lost money from PH area.

The Imperia unit I'm referring to is RM1.8million auction reserve price. (Failed to sell a few times). Advertised price/Market price for similar 2500sqft unit is RM2.8 million. (Does this imply that someone is going to lose money? You decide for yourself)