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NMP Viswa Sadasivan Puts PAP MPs To Shame

HTOLAS

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
You are mostly right. It's just that every now and then 'undesirables' get past and are then embedded in the system and they find it inexpedient to get rid of them. Singapore examples - Tan Cheng Bock; Justice S Rajendran.

Overseas examples - Chiang Ching-guo was supposed to continue the despotic rule of his father Chiang Kai-shek but chose to democratise Taiwan; King Juan Carlos was chosen by dictator Francisco Franco to be absolute monarch to continue his fascist policies. King Juan is now a constitutional monarch of a very vibrant democracy.

Let's not give up hope.

Bla bla bla. One big wayang. In the end NOTHING IS DONE.

Don't forget that all NMPs are pre-screened by the PAP. This man is still of the system.

This is just like wrestling. The clowns buck up and put on a fight for us to see.
 

KKC007

Alfrescian
Loyal
with Harry and acolyte Ng En Hen's rabid responses i would say Viswa has struck blood...keep at it Viswa, you speak the truth and from the heart:smile:

btw Harry would have been better advised to stick to his physiotherapy treatment yesterday instead of making himself look like the old political dino that he is, stuck in his own time warp between 50s-80s...really sad and pathetic for a once great statesman:rolleyes:

How could Harry not step up to the plate when Viswa said

"63. I suspect it could partly be because as a society we seem to have lost the oral tradition of sharing experiences and telling stories. We need to revive this, and fast, while we still have enough people of the older generation who have the stories and are in a condition to share them. "

http://nmpviswasadasivanmaidenspeech.blogspot.com/2009/08/nmp-viswa-sadasivans-maiden-speech-in.html

:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
 

Porfirio Rubirosa

Alfrescian
Loyal
23) Steve Wu on August 21st, 2009 1.31 am
It looks like the Old Man is showing his age. He had the date for the US Declaration of Independence wrong even while reading it from the prepared text. You may review this episode in Part 1 (around 5:30 in the video). It’s 1976, 1977, back to 1976 while it should have been 1776 all along.

Of course, the MSM graciously provided the written text of the speech as it was intended (not a verbatim transcript) http://www.asiaone.com/News/the+St...20-162122.html .

The point is this. No one expects him to be a historian. However, that he has gotten things muddled up by a margin of more than 220 years without realizing it. It points to a more serious problem.

Not long ago, he claimed to have read a letter from the president of IBA praising the judiciary of Singapore when such a letter did not exist. More recently, he claimed credit for ExxonMobil’s investment as a direct result of meeting with the senior executives but ExxonMobil quickly denied that.

These episodes may not be unrelated. It is unsurprising if he is rapidly losing memory and not completely lucid at his age. The 3-million-dollar question is if he is still mentally fit to hold office.

“He (NMP Viswa) will know Indians are not equal. Brahmins will not be in Sinda. It is the non-Brahmins who are in Sinda.”

Regardless of his age, his racist and class-conscious views are still very dangerous today as they were in the past.

29) physicsnerd on August 21st, 2009 8.08 am
I find his wry and witty humour thoroughly entertaining, honestly. I guess that’s the result of a British education. Actually, I’d just like to know what he meant by his quip about Brahmins. That thoroughly hurt my family and I, being part of the Brahmin community here. I think such comments should not be publicly made, especially in Parliament. I’ve also come to realise that LKY is the only one who can be as blunt and dry as he likes… unfortunately.

31) lefleche on August 21st, 2009 8.14 am
LKY is grasping at straws. In a way i feel sad to see a man who had done so much for Singapore slipping downward this way. Nowadays, it seems that the things he says seemed more and more to justify and defend his own record, his son, his family, his party than anything that really benefits the country or its people. and the worst thing is that it usually does not make any sense. yet the nonsense it is usually delivered with a paternalistic tone.

His is fast losing his legacy. i think this is the saddest thing that can happen to any person; the more he tries to hold on to power and to leave a name in history, the more he destroys it.

LKY is not immune to the failings of man. i believe the ST has worked overtime to create a myth about his infallibility but the truth is unveiling itself with time. This has been proven in history time and again and even if the ST continue to work overtime they will not be able to sustain the myth of superman. in fact the more they try, the worst everything will look when it all falls a part. i believe if a broad view of history is to be taken, say, in 100 years time when historians write the history of Singapore (assuming PAP no longer dominates which i believe it wont), they will identify this era we live in as the start of the rot with LKY putting his son, hanging on to power to keep things within the family, ho ching’s appt etc. History may even judge people like CSJ and JBJ to be truer patriots than LKY even though LKY did do alot for Singapore before the rot started.

it will be a sad ending for someone so illustrious.
 

Porfirio Rubirosa

Alfrescian
Loyal
'Increasing the sense of rootedness among young Singaporeans.'

MR KANG CHOON TIAN: 'The focus on Nominated MP Viswa Sadasivan's focus on the Pledge ignored other key concerns in his maiden parliamentary speech, namely increasing the sense of rootedness among young Singaporeans by improving the study of Singapore history, liberal policies in bringing in foreign workers that depress wages of low-income Singaporeans and whether university students are politically apathetic. The Government should examine how the young feel about nationhood and patriotism.'
 

Porfirio Rubirosa

Alfrescian
Loyal
with due respect to siew, viswa is in a different league and by age and experience more mature...can't remember whether he was in roundtable, but he appears to be in the same class and quality of this group...well at the least the one's who appear to have still kept their conscience and not 'sold out'...

i wish him well


Bro I remember telling Scroobal that this Viswa chap is not going to sit easy and I was right. He has a better record on his first day than Siew Kum Hong has in about three days - actually getting the old man to sit up and rebut him.

However I am not sure how he would go from here now that the old man himself took him to task. And whether he'll end up like SKH in 2 years' time.
 

Porfirio Rubirosa

Alfrescian
Loyal
once again harry appears to have undermined his son...oh and made a real hash while at it...a sad pathetic old political dino...

Actually I was surprise LKY voice out to counter the NMP remarks.
Should have been the job of the PM LHL himself to answer the NMP since he is the most senior position in the cabinet and it was his party that rule Singapore for 50 years.
It shows no doubt LKY is still the rightful ruler of the land.
 

Porfirio Rubirosa

Alfrescian
Loyal
I feared MM was going to fire salvos at me
New NMP relieved MM Lee reacted to his 'highfalutin ideas' with more of a lecture on how Pledge started
By Andre Yeo

August 21, 2009




PERCEIVED as roasting the Government in his maiden speech in Parliament on Tuesday, he got a roasting of his own yesterday - from one of Singapore's founding fathers, no less.


His reaction: He felt as if a noose was hanging over his head.

But, Mr Viswa Sadasivan quickly added, he thoroughly enjoyed his first session in Parliament.

The 49-year-old CEO of a training and consultancy company was speaking to The New Paper about his eventful debut as a Nominated MP (NMP).

On Tuesday, he tabled a motion that Parliament reaffirm its commitment to the nation-building tenet in the National Pledge when debating national policies, especially economic policies.


ST FILE PICTURES
In the 50-minute speech, he called on the Government to do away with racial categorisation and suggested Singaporeans were afraid to voice their opinions, among other things.

His motion drew a slew of responses from MPs, including Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew, who yesterday said his arguments were flawed and wanted to amend the motion.

Mr Lee said he had decided to speak up because 'I think it was dangerous to allow such highfalutin ideas to go undemolished and mislead Singapore'.

Speaking to The New Paper last night, Mr Viswa said he was a little surprised by the intensity of the attention his speech had attracted from the House.

At yesterday's sitting, he had a bad feeling when MM Lee stood up.

Mr Viswa felt MM Lee looked rather unhappy.

Said Mr Viswa: 'When I saw MM come in today and he stood up to speak, I suddenly felt this noose above my head.

'You don't expect your first speech in Parliament to gain so much attention.

'I think it caught the attention of a lot of front benchers who felt the need to respond with the Government's point of view.'

Mr Viswa, who had to make a summation at the end of yesterday's session, admitted to having trouble focusing on what he wanted to say.

'Here I was trying to make notes and deciding what to highlight. And as I am doing it, I see MM standing up.

'All this fear of whether he is going to fire some salvos at you came up. And the apprehension of accurately paraphrasing what MM was about to say.

'Thank goodness it was more of a lecture on how the Pledge started.

'And I tell you, I never enjoyed feeling like a student more.'

In the end, Mr Viswa managed to find the words for his closing comments.

'Misunderstood'

He told the House some parts of his speech may have been misunderstood.

He clarified that he did not say that the democratic process was flouted by the Government, but rather that there was a perception that there wasn't a level playing field on the ground.

And, he added, he did not say self-help groups should be done away with.

On the contrary, being with the Singapore Indian Development Association for 12 years made him see how important such groups were.

Rather, he said what he meant was that the existence of such groups might somehow send a message to young Singaporeans and make them feel this contradicts multi-racialism.

Mr Viswa and eight others were sworn in as NMPs on 20 Jul to begin their 21/2-year term.

Married to freelance writer Audrey Perera, 48, they have a 10-year-old daughter, Maya.

He said that, going by media reports yesterday, he felt he had achieved his goal in getting people to discuss what he felt were important issues.

He had wanted to be an NMP for the opportunity to bring up such issues in Parliament, and he felt he was ready to make a contribution.

This was not possible some years back when he applied to be an NMP and failed. He said: 'I don't know why I did not get it. I was probably deemed not good enough.'

It was reported in November 2004 that Mr Viswa was among several others who were not selected to be an NMP.

Mr Viswa said, politically, he had always been involved on the fringes, never in the heart of it.

He was the chairman of the Feedback Unit Political Division, and was on the Economic Review Committee.

The former Feedback and Talking Point host said being an NMP now made him a part of the political process where he could influence policy-making and ministers through informal lobbying.

He could do this while not belonging to any political party, and that is the way he likes it.

'I can say what I want without having to clear it with anyone. It's a great feeling to know you are able to make a contribution, yet you are only answerable to your own self and your own conscience.'

After his maiden speech, he felt more confident that he would be able to perform his role as an NMP.

And after yesterday's baptism of fire, he said he could use a stiff drink.

Said Mr Viswa: 'We know how fiery MM can be, and this was something close to his heart.

'I was gearing myself to be marauded.'
 

NgEjay

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
I feared MM was going to fire salvos at me
New NMP relieved MM Lee reacted to his 'highfalutin ideas' with more of a lecture on how Pledge started
By Andre Yeo

parleement.jpg


READ the full text of Mr Viswa Sadasivan’s maiden Parliamentary speech here.

Sgpolitics.net Special Feature (Part Two)
Written by Ng E-Jay
20 Aug 2009


On Wednesday, Parliament accepted an amended version of the motion submitted by NMP Viswa Sadasivan, after a total of 14 MPs had taken turns over a two-day period to lambast Mr Viswa’s “highfalutin” ideals.

Amongst those who severely criticized Mr Viswa’s motion was Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew who delivered his scathing rebuttal in a rare Parliamentary appearance after his previous speech in April 2007 during which he defended ministerial pay increases.

Opposition MP Low Thia Khiang also gave Mr Viswa a very humiliating thumbs down by dismissing his motion altogether, and stating categorically that he did not want to have anything to do with the debate.

The MP for Hougang also said that the National Pledge should not be brought up unnecessarily, and that we should not invoke it for the sake of argument.

With both PAP MPs as well as Opposition MPs ganging up against Mr Viswa, and mainstream media channels like Channel News Asia zooming in on the new NMP in an attempt to portray him as acting nervous under pressure, it is time to give an objective assessment of the debate.

Two False Dichotomies

The arguments advanced by PAP MPs present to Singaporeans two false dichotomies.

Firstly, PAP MPs have once again resorted to using bogeymen like the racial riots of the 1960s and the current political unrest in countries like Thailand to scare Singaporeans into accepting that the ideals enshrined in statements like the National Pledge must often be compromised for the sake of stability and pragmatism.

Education Minister Ng Eng Hen in particular questioned whether Mr Viswa’s political ideals would “magically” work for us, citing the problems faced in India, the Philippines, Taiwan or Thailand where the factionalism of coalition or competing parties have led to political paralysis.

In my opinion, this line of reason presents to Singaporeans a false dilemna, because society has evolved tremendously over the past 5 decades of self-government, and it is increasing unproductive to engage in fear-mongering by projecting our republic as forever hanging on a knife’s edge.

Furthermore, countries like India, Thailand and Taiwan are so varied and their political situations so distinct from one another that it is misleading to lump them all together in an attempt to argue why the PAP has done the right thing for Singapore. Clearly PAP MPs here are talking their own book without any substantial basis.

Secondly, Minister Mentor Lee Kuan Yew put forth the argument that Mr Viswa’s call for equal treatment of all races was in conflict with the Constitution which expressly provides for special recognition of Malays and which places a duty on the Government to pay extra attention to the needs of minority races.

In my view, MM Lee has also presented a false dichotomy to us.

There is no conflict between upholding the tenet of “regardless of race, language or religion”, and taking care of the interests of racial and religious minorities, including (rightfully) recognizing Malays as the indigenous people of Singapore.

The tenets enshrined in the Pledge fail to be upheld ONLY when there is discrimination against a particular race or religious group in the negative sense, NOT when there is affirmative action for a particular race or religious group in the positive sense as indicated by the Constitution.

It is my stand therefore that the Pledge and the Constitution can co-exist on equal footing and with each deserving equal consideration, not with one being merely regarded an “aspiration” that “may take centuries to realize”, in MM Lee’s own words.

We must continually recognize and reject the false dichotomies that the PAP continually present to us, because they hold back our nation’s progress.

Why the fury over Mr Viswa’s speech?

Why has there been such an outcry by PAP MPs over Mr Viswa’s maiden Parliamentary speech, with MM Lee going so far as to say that his views must be demolished?

Mr Viswa has not suggested anything that is racially inflammatory or discriminatory. Upon reading his speech in detail, one can readily tell that his intentions are noble and he is all for racial and religious unity.

It was not too long ago when Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong called for sensitive issues like race and religion to be openly discussed in a responsible manner. In his National Day Rally, he said that from time to time, we have to discuss such topics honestly but tactfully, to recognise the trends in our society and tell ourselves where we need to do better.

Mr Viswa’s views were as broad ranging as they were hard-hitting. But they are definitely not upsetting or divisive. They were well-considered, sincere and meaningful.

Why then the outrage and the need to demolish Mr Viswa’s message at first sight? Why is the PAP shying away from the chance to coolly address Mr Viswa’s points and rebut them in a calm and collected manner, as per PM Lee’s suggestion?

Obviously, the ruling party is not walking their own talk. They have shown that they don’t mean what they say, and that is sad.

Has the ruling party belittled the Pledge?

By denying that the Pledge represents any ideology and consigning it to a mere “aspiration” that can only be tentatively approximated but not fully realized for eons to come, has the ruling PAP belittled the Pledge?

What do we tell our school children who recite the Pledge faithfully every day at assembly? Do we tell them they are reciting words that represent merely an abstraction, that are not “down to earth”?
If the ruling party thinks the Pledge is only an aspiration, what is their view about the National Anthem? Only an aspiration and an abstraction too?

This is yet another example of the PAP using its monopoly on political philosophy and ideology to rudely abuse our common sense notion of what our national tenets and what our Pledge means.

The only way to end this peculiar conundrum is for Singaporeans to recognize how our national values are being systematically undermined, and to speak out forcefully in public and at the ballot box.
 

ChaoPappyPoodle

Alfrescian
Loyal
This viswa chap was running the Pappies' feedback unit that provided info on Tang Liang Hong and was used to demolish Tang Liang Hong. Anyone that trusts a pappy prostitute is silly. This whole hoohaha is a sideshow directed by the pappies to use viawa as an example to others who may want to put their thoughts out for public consumption. This episode is a reminder of Tang LIang Hong and what happened to him. The story is similar but the proponents are different. What is ironic is that the man that provided the information on Tang Liang Hong is back at it again althought from a different side of the fence. I would have thought that someone like him would have more sense but power breeds stupidity and these are indeed stupid people because it seems that they can only fools stupid people all the time.

The old man worked for the kempetei. Of all the civil structures inplace he found it a necessity to work for the kempetei. He very likely orchestrated Operation Cold Store that killed an entire generation of thought-holders and nation builders. Never trust anything that is close or related to the old man. He is not what the media here and his cronies make him out to be. The old man is the biggest devil in sinkieland. Do any of you believe that without lky we would be a thoughtless, morally bankrupt, uncaring, money-grabbing bunch of people? Does anyone not believe that our other fatherly figures would have put us in good steed with the use of our port and other infrastructures and political partners? the oldman is nothing but a dictator and the only thing that we should take out of this episode is how diabolocal and senile he has become and also how the pappies and their machinery can create a scene to ensure that others kowtow to the tune of the pappies.

He onlydeserves respect for the way he managed to control everyone and his country. Other than that he is actually very weak at everything else.
Back to viswa, never trust a pappy and a pappy dog he is.
 

MentisMortis

Alfrescian
Loyal
Dear All,

Before long the Hock Lee Bus Riots will once again make the headlines! The perennial PAP bogeyman will be played once again to remind you how precarious race relations are in Singapore, despite the fact that many of us care not a hoot or even half a hoot about and don't see race among Sgeans as an issue.

Nevermind that it was orchestrated by the PAP and the British to cause fear.

The only "Us against them" situation is where Sgeans cannot accept the influx of 3rd world trash openly welcomed by the PAP into this nation. I think Sgeans stand united against this no matter of what ethnicity they may be.

I have good friends who are of all races and would stand beside them to protect what is theirs as would they for me.

Hock Lee or Maria Hertogh is not an issue, we have moved way beyond that and have better heads on our shoulders. All Sgeans care about is where there next meal is coming from and if their meals for the next few years are a sure thing.

When I first joined the original SBF some years ago, my first post was "Do you believe in the National Pledge?"

The same answers, replies and arguments have once again been raised here some 6 years later.

All I can say, is that after 44 years of indoctrination in kindergartens, primary schools etc...Sgeans are now told the pledge is merely an aspiration!

Nothing but a dream and not a guarantee. Democracy, peace and justice is a dream and will be conferred upon you when deemed fit.

Well done PAP! I am so glad I am leaving this country, thanks for making it an easier decision.

Cheers,

MM
 

makapaaa

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
At yesterday's sitting, he had a bad feeling when MM Lee stood up.

Mr Viswa felt MM Lee looked rather unhappy.

Said Mr Viswa: 'When I saw MM come in today and he stood up to speak, I suddenly felt this noose above my head.

Viswa is an AssAF LTC. How to lead his men to fight wars when his balls shrink juz cos 1 Old Fart scolded him? Are all AssAF paper generals and senior officers like this? Compare CSJ's fearlessness and tekan of Old Fart and his useless son till one stutters and the other speechless!
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
with due respect to siew, viswa is in a different league and by age and experience more mature...can't remember whether he was in roundtable, but he appears to be in the same class and quality of this group...well at the least the one's who appear to have still kept their conscience and not 'sold out'...

i wish him well
Perhaps I am short of brain cells, but what I fail to understand is why an idealogy cannot also be an aspiration, which is not the present reality.
Why can't the pledge be an idealogy, and something which the nation aspires towards, since it is not the practical reality at the moment?
Does it not make sense that everyone should be treated equally, but that due to practical circumstances, this idealogy / aspiration cannot be attained currently? And that the "special" treatment should apply to all who need it, and not simply to a certain group or groups of people?
 

HTOLAS

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Asset
I am actually more curious how you can aspire to anything which you have not beforehand decided is worthy, i.e. an ideological position.

Perhaps I am short of brain cells, but what I fail to understand is why an idealogy cannot also be an aspiration, which is not the present reality.
Why can't the pledge be an idealogy, and something which the nation aspires towards, since it is not the practical reality at the moment?
Does it not make sense that everyone should be treated equally, but that due to practical circumstances, this idealogy / aspiration cannot be attained currently? And that the "special" treatment should apply to all who need it, and not simply to a certain group or groups of people?
 

Perspective

Alfrescian
Loyal
Perhaps I am short of brain cells, but what I fail to understand is why an idealogy cannot also be an aspiration, which is not the present reality.
Why can't the pledge be an idealogy, and something which the nation aspires towards, since it is not the practical reality at the moment?
Does it not make sense that everyone should be treated equally, but that due to practical circumstances, this idealogy / aspiration cannot be attained currently? And that the "special" treatment should apply to all who need it, and not simply to a certain group or groups of people?

There is a slight difference between ideology and aspiration. Ideology is a certain school of thought, whereas an aspiration is an aim that spells goals that may not conform to a school of thought.

For example, an ideology would be "We believe that a table made of wood with four legs stands the best". An aspiration is "We strive to make a table out of the best material possible and the strongest legs available".
 

jw5

Moderator
Moderator
Loyal
I am actually more curious how you can aspire to anything which you have not beforehand decided is worthy, i.e. an ideological position.
Exactly.
I simply don't understand why they appear to be mutually exclusive, just because it is not the current practical reality.
 
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