Medini (Nusajaya) Community

[Tekkun]

Can understand if they hold it in JB like City Sq to attract the crowd. But Mall of Medini is rather deserted and quiet. Got people go there meh? Maybe visitors who happen to be visiting Legoland.

The article mentioned Medini as the CBD of Iskandar Puteri. I'm still a bit puzzled about the term "CBD".

I usually have the impression that CBD is situated in a large, densely populated city, such as New York, Tokyo, Sydney, KL, Raffles Place in SG, etc where there are many tall skyscrapers and financial centres all congregating at one area. But I don't see any such buildings or plans coming up in Medini?

No activities, you say very quiet.
They organise something to attract crowds, you say should be in City Sq. Very difficult to please.
Organiser is Medini Iskandar, sure la in Medini.

 

[Aviator]

Main Problem with Iskandar is not about lack of demand or interests.
It is about TRAFFIC JAMS at the Causeway and 2nd Link.
Too many horror stories of hours of jams, put many people off.
My family and friends no longer go to JB on weekends unless necessary.

 

[jbrts]

You are absolutely right.

Thank you for your appreciation. Nice to hear that. You're probably one of the rare few who can understand the situation.

Unfortunately, this is a forum about Johor so I do understand "birds of a feather flock together". It'll be easier to discuss investing with more academic and practical sense if this had been a general forum.

But I do also know that not all buy Johor properties for investment. The richer ones got extra cash so they buy without so much care whether it's lose or win money. As always, the money belongs to the individuals. They can buy anything as long as it pleases them.

However, there are those not so rich ones who constantly delude themselves from the facts out there. Sure you can do that, as long as you know the risks you're taking. Just like I can plunge $5k on a 4D number. Someone actually struck big money on a 1st prize doing that before! But would you do the same?

Being stuck with a S$250k Johor property as a foreigner and use it as a "holiday home"....I'm not sure about that. Maybe I'm missing something here. Some say "as long as you like it, it's ok" or "I will use Johor as a base and can drive to Malacca or around Msia". Isn't SG close enough to do that? Why shift your base to Johor and restrict your sights to only that region?

My colleague and his family will be going for a vacation in Tokyo Disneyland, Mount Fuji, etc end of this year. Total price of tour: 2 adults, 2 kids, S$8k only. I might go to Europe or Australia myself for a nice break. In comparison, you plunge your S$250k to buy an Iskandar condo that you visit once a week or month (because you now realize you can't get rental or sell it off), then buy a full year Legoland pass to visit it repeatedly with your family? Which option do you prefer?

Disclaimer: As always, I say it's your life, your money, you decide. Take what you think makes sense. But if anyone doesn't agree, simply walk away.

Ok I better stop here!

 

[xebay11]

Thank you for your appreciation. Nice to hear that. You're probably one of the rare few who can understand the situation.

Unfortunately, this is a forum about Johor so I do understand "birds of a feather flock together". It'll be easier to discuss investing with more academic and practical sense if this had been a general forum.

But I do also know that not all buy Johor properties for investment. The richer ones got extra cash so they buy without so much care whether it's lose or win money. As always, the money belongs to the individuals. They can buy anything as long as it pleases them.

However, there are those not so rich ones who constantly delude themselves from the facts out there. Sure you can do that, as long as you know the risks you're taking. Just like I can plunge $5k on a 4D number. Someone actually struck big money on a 1st prize doing that before! But would you do the same?

Being stuck with a S$250k Johor property as a foreigner and use it as a "holiday home"....I'm not sure about that. Maybe I'm missing something here. Some say "as long as you like it, it's ok" or "I will use Johor as a base and can drive to Malacca or around Msia". Isn't SG close enough to do that? Why shift your base to Johor and restrict your sights to only that region?

My colleague and his family will be going for a vacation in Tokyo Disneyland, Mount Fuji, etc end of this year. Total price of tour: 2 adults, 2 kids, S$8k only. I might go to Europe or Australia myself for a nice break. In comparison, you plunge your S$250k to buy an Iskandar condo that you visit once a week or month (because you now realize you can't get rental or sell it off), then buy a full year Legoland pass to visit it repeatedly with your family? Which option do you prefer?

Disclaimer: As always, I say it's your life, your money, you decide. Take what you think makes sense. But if anyone doesn't agree, simply walk away.

Ok I better stop here!

My thoughts exactly. Expensive holiday homes, for those who don't want to admit their mistake.

 

[jbrts]

Worst is JB condo is different fr Sg condo. When occupancy is low, you can't even dare to stay there. Your neighbors unit may be rented to foreign workers or even broken in. This was what happened in last crisis. Today there are still such condos around.

My thoughts exactly. Expensive holiday homes, for those who don't want to admit their mistake.

 

[Tekkun]

My thoughts exactly. Expensive holiday homes, for those who don't want to admit their mistake.

Buying properties is like buying cars. Of course, you hope to make money in properties. But for cars, it is a sure loss.

If you buy a normal family car, most likely you would think of resale value, fuel consumption or cost of maintenance. You choose very carefully. How much can you afford.

If you buy a exotic or expensive car, it is something else. You are looking at enjoyment and quality of life. Some take it as to show others as sign of success. Depreciation is last thing in your mind. Buy RM500k, resale at RM200k 3 years later, no feelings.

Old car, new car, cheap car or expensive car...it is still a personal choice.

 

[enjoylife77]

Can understand if they hold it in JB like City Sq to attract the crowd. But Mall of Medini is rather deserted and quiet. Got people go there meh? Maybe visitors who happen to be visiting Legoland.

The article mentioned Medini as the CBD of Iskandar Puteri. I'm still a bit puzzled about the term "CBD".

I usually have the impression that CBD is situated in a large, densely populated city, such as New York, Tokyo, Sydney, KL, Raffles Place in SG, etc where there are many tall skyscrapers and financial centres all congregating at one area. But I don't see any such buildings or plans coming up in Medini?

CBD in their context is......... Cannot Be Dead

 

[Frodo]

Buying properties is like buying cars. Of course, you hope to make money in properties. But for cars, it is a sure loss.

If you buy a normal family car, most likely you would think of resale value, fuel consumption or cost of maintenance. You choose very carefully. How much can you afford.

If you buy a exotic or expensive car, it is something else. You are looking at enjoyment and quality of life. Some take it as to show others as sign of success. Depreciation is last thing in your mind. Buy RM500k, resale at RM200k 3 years later, no feelings.

Old car, new car, cheap car or expensive car...it is still a personal choice.

Perhaps it is probably the case that buying a JB condo is a sure loss venture. But that loss can still be tolerable for some. But SG condos are not all sure wins either, and the loss from them can sometimes be more painful. Its like falling down 3 steps is less painful than falling down 3 metres.

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/almost-1-in-3-high-end/2731280.html
http://www.businesstimes.com.sg/opi...ty-may-be-heading-for-long-term-drop-in-value

 

[mpan12]

Perhaps it is probably the case that buying a JB condo is a sure loss venture. But that loss can still be tolerable for some. But SG condos are not all sure wins either, and the loss from them can sometimes be more painful. Its like falling down 3 steps is less painful than falling down 3 metres.

A loss is still a loss. Some of those who bought Iskandar condos in 2013 thinking of "investing" may lose say S$200k if there are no tenants or demand in future. This may be relatively small compared to those who lose S$2 million or more selling their high-end properties in SG now. But in absolute terms, S$200k is quite a lot for a commoner. Whereas for the multi-millionaires, they can still endure the S$2 million loss, even though it could still be a bit painful.

We don't know why those sellers are selling now. Maybe they have better ways to make more profits? So they may lose the S$2million now. But with the remaining cash from the sale, they could perhaps make more than S$2 million? It could be the case of cut losses now, make more money later.

Also, we don't know how they got so much money to buy the high-end properties in the first place. Maybe the money could be from some ill-gotten gain? If so, the loss is nothing to them.

Just thinking out loud....

 

[sgcount]

I thought 2nd link should be less crowded than causeway? The last 2 times I traveled in the weekend morning at about 10am it was pretty smooth. But I took a bus so not sure if it's the same as driving in yourself.

Main Problem with Iskandar is not about lack of demand or interests.
It is about TRAFFIC JAMS at the Causeway and 2nd Link.
Too many horror stories of hours of jams, put many people off.
My family and friends no longer go to JB on weekends unless necessary.

 

[Tekkun]

A loss is still a loss. Some of those who bought Iskandar condos in 2013 thinking of "investing" may lose say S$200k if there are no tenants or demand in future. This may be relatively small compared to those who lose S$2 million or more selling their high-end properties in SG now. But in absolute terms, S$200k is quite a lot for a commoner. Whereas for the multi-millionaires, they can still endure the S$2 million loss, even though it could still be a bit painful.

We don't know why those sellers are selling now. Maybe they have better ways to make more profits? So they may lose the S$2million now. But with the remaining cash from the sale, they could perhaps make more than S$2 million? It could be the case of cut losses now, make more money later.

Also, we don't know how they got so much money to buy the high-end properties in the first place. Maybe the money could be from some ill-gotten gain? If so, the loss is nothing to them.

Just thinking out loud....

$1.4 mil loss at Reflections at Keppel Bay

By Esther Hoon / The Edge Property | August 22, 2016 8:00 AM MYT

Two sellers in District 4 sustained hefty losses from the sale of their houses on Aug 4. Both had previously purchased the units in 2007. The bigger loss of $1.4 million was traced to a 2,637 sq ft unit at Reflections at Keppel Bay. The seller purchased the unit from the developer in August 2007 at $2,125 psf and resold it at $1,593 psf. This is the biggest loss sustained at the project since April 2012, when a 4,747 sq ft unit changed hands at a loss of $1.58 million. The transaction also marks the eighth unprofitable deal at the project this year. Of the 16 homes sold at the project this year, only three were profitable. Reflections at Keppel Bay is a 99-year leasehold development comprising 1,129 units on Keppel Bay View. It was completed in 2011.The smaller loss of $726,450 was from a 1,711 sq ft unit at The Oceanfront @ Sentosa. The unit was purchased in October 2007 at $2,125 psf in a sub-sale and resold at $1,525 psf. This marks the second 1,711 sq ft unit from the project sold at a loss this year. In April, a similar-sized unit on the sixth floor was disposed of at a $487,780 loss. The only profitable deal of the four units sold this year at The Oceanfront @ Sentosa was for a 1,216 sq ft unit, which netted a $99,200 gain for the seller. The 264-unit, 99-year leasehold development was completed in 2010.

(These people really can afford to lose)

 

[mpan12]

Notice that all these losses are from the higher-end properties. I see some parallels with those in Medini.

Although properties in Medini sold at RM750-1000psf are often termed "high end", it's really because of their extremely high prices rather than luxurious fittings or design given. A mass-market condo near Johor city centre is selling like RM400 psf?

Here are some descriptions from the CNA article, which have much in common with Medini:

"Tenants are adjusting their expectations by asking for lower rentals and at the same time mortgages are increasing due to rising interest rates."

"...it was the high-end segment which fared the worst in the first quarter of the year."

"Looking at basic indicators – slower GDP growth, pressure on the job market and the soft rental market – the percentage of unprofitable deals is likely to continue to trend up."

Don't forget that SG is already very populated and established yet it is facing this problem. What more with Medini.

Just my opinions and analysis for those interested to think about. Not here to pour cold water. If there is any consolation, the loss is much less for Medini condo "investors". But to me, it's still precious money.

As it has been said many times, Buy with your eyes wide open. Don't delude yourself with "easy sweet talk" from property agents or shiny brochures.

 

[Tekkun]

Notice that all these losses are from the higher-end properties. I see some parallels with those in Medini.

Although properties in Medini sold at RM750-1000psf are often termed "high end", it's really because of their extremely high prices rather than luxurious fittings or design given. A mass-market condo near Johor city centre is selling like RM400 psf?

Here are some descriptions from the CNA article, which have much in common with Medini:

"Tenants are adjusting their expectations by asking for lower rentals and at the same time mortgages are increasing due to rising interest rates."

"...it was the high-end segment which fared the worst in the first quarter of the year."

"Looking at basic indicators – slower GDP growth, pressure on the job market and the soft rental market – the percentage of unprofitable deals is likely to continue to trend up."

Don't forget that SG is already very populated and established yet it is facing this problem. What more with Medini.

Just my opinions and analysis for those interested to think about. Not here to pour cold water. If there is any consolation, the loss is much less for Medini condo "investors". But to me, it's still precious money.

As it has been said many times, Buy with your eyes wide open. Don't delude yourself with "easy sweet talk" from property agents or shiny brochures.

One big difference. Holding power and as long as it is not sold, there's no real loss.
You can calculate, tabulate and forecast all the paper losses from bank interests, loss in empty units etc, but all these doesn't bite when there's no sale loss transactions.

 

[Frodo]

One big difference. Holding power and as long as it is not sold, there's no real loss.
You can calculate, tabulate and forecast all the paper losses from bank interests, loss in empty units etc, but all these doesn't bite when there's no sale loss transactions.

Quite true. If 2 persons buy the same condo project, one decides to hold while the other listens to advice to cut losses and bails out and loses all he had put in so far, but 10 years later the one holding on sells for a profit, then what? Advice giver owes nothing to anyone and bears no responsibility or obligation. At the end of the day, each person has to decide and know for himself that the buck stops with him. The point is, no one knows the future for sure, except God. Whatever decision one makes, do it not because of hearsay, but because you have considered the options before you and have assessed for yourself what is in your own best interests given your own circumstances.

 

[Frodo]

Notice that all these losses are from the higher-end properties. I see some parallels with those in Medini.

Although properties in Medini sold at RM750-1000psf are often termed "high end", it's really because of their extremely high prices rather than luxurious fittings or design given. A mass-market condo near Johor city centre is selling like RM400 psf?

Here are some descriptions from the CNA article, which have much in common with Medini:

"Tenants are adjusting their expectations by asking for lower rentals and at the same time mortgages are increasing due to rising interest rates."

"...it was the high-end segment which fared the worst in the first quarter of the year."

"Looking at basic indicators – slower GDP growth, pressure on the job market and the soft rental market – the percentage of unprofitable deals is likely to continue to trend up."

Don't forget that SG is already very populated and established yet it is facing this problem. What more with Medini.

Just my opinions and analysis for those interested to think about. Not here to pour cold water. If there is any consolation, the loss is much less for Medini condo "investors". But to me, it's still precious money.

As it has been said many times, Buy with your eyes wide open. Don't delude yourself with "easy sweet talk" from property agents or shiny brochures.

Money loss is definitely precious, but as you have noted the consolation is that the losses sustained is lesser compared to if that person has decided to buy a "bao jiak" condo in SG but which turned into a big loss that far exceeds the full price of a JB condo. Losing $250K is much less painful than losing $400K or more, assuming both are not rich people but average folk. Moreover, one probably never loses the entire $250K because there is usually always a residual or "scrap" value for JB property, right? I mean, if JB locals will never pay RM700K for a condo, I am sure some would be happy to pay you RM400K for it.

 

[xebay11]

Ha ha I would like to make an observation today while going to JB, 5 years ago when I started going there weekly, there was no jams on Saturday mornings and evenings from second link and clear on Sunday mornings before 10, I could easily go in and out of JB to have a short getaway, now it seems almost impossible to go in and out quickly without facing at least one hour jams.

It appears that many more sinkies catching on this trend to spend weekends in Johor, shows that Singaporeans purchasing power getting smaller and smaller.

Now here is the good news for property investors, maybe in the next 5 years with VEP coming, many sinkies will not be able to go in and out to enjoy good life, those that can would probably have to live in Johor soon, either rental or buy for own stay.

What do you guys see the next 5 years for Johor? As rising costs and stagnant wages will drive out more economic refugees from Singapore. Singapore is becoming to expensive for businesses as well as its own people!

 

[Frodo]

Ha ha I would like to make an observation today while going to JB, 5 years ago when I started going there weekly, there was no jams on Saturday mornings and evenings from second link and clear on Sunday mornings before 10, I could easily go in and out of JB to have a short getaway, now it seems almost impossible to go in and out quickly without facing at least one hour jams.

It appears that many more sinkies catching on this trend to spend weekends in Johor, shows that Singaporeans purchasing power getting smaller and smaller.

Now here is the good news for property investors, maybe in the next 5 years with VEP coming, many sinkies will not be able to go in and out to enjoy good life, those that can would probably have to live in Johor soon, either rental or buy for own stay.

What do you guys see the next 5 years for Johor? As rising costs and stagnant wages will drive out more economic refugees from Singapore. Singapore is becoming to expensive for businesses as well as its own people!

Unless the VEP are priced prohibitively so high, it would be unlikely that Singaporeans would avoid JB, because it is still the most nearest and cheapest holiday destination outside Singapore that one can go with own car. MY side just want to collect revenue, not so much control car population, so in my view unlikely to charge very high VEP.

 

[xebay11]

Unless the VEP are priced prohibitively so high, it would be unlikely that Singaporeans would avoid JB, because it is still the most nearest and cheapest holiday destination outside Singapore that one can go with own car. MY side just want to collect revenue, not so much control car population, so in my view unlikely to charge very high VEP.

We never know, afterall the traffic situation at the borders changed drastically over 5 years.

 

[Tekkun]

We never know, afterall the traffic situation at the borders changed drastically over 5 years.

However how expensive things are, Johore is still one of very few choice Singaporeans have to space out.
The other choice is to fly. And Johore authorities know that.

 

[mpan12]

One big difference. Holding power and as long as it is not sold, there's no real loss.
You can calculate, tabulate and forecast all the paper losses from bank interests, loss in empty units etc, but all these doesn't bite when there's no sale loss transactions.

Can't really say that. Opportunity costs are involved. Basically money is parked there indefinitely. Or for those with bank loans, every month money goes out (with interest) but no money coming in. Buyers must realize also the saying "Property prices will always go up" does not paint a complete picture.

Consider this example: Suppose one can hold, say the property prices drop within first 5 years. Ok, do nothing. Then in the next 5 years, the price goes back up to the original purchase. Another 10 years later, it's 20% more. You average out over 20 years, it's only 1% per annum. Even if you up it to 40% more, it's only 2% p.a., an amount you can easily get from other investments. What about bank interests incurred, taxes, maintenance, etc. For foreigners, also got to consider currency ex. And then the important question: If one wants to let it go, would anyone want to buy a 20 yr old condo?

I have a friend who bought the shares of a company which he thought would do well. He bought it at more than S$1 when there was so much hype about it. Cut long story short. When it dropped to half the value, he didn't believe in selling to cut loss. He's the buy and keep type. "Holding power" is important, as some here say. He also hoped and hoped that things would do better. Today, the price is worth less than S$0.20. He has lost on paper more than S$20k. Yes, there's no real loss as long as he doesn't sell. But the feeling is not good. Nobody can say if the company can turn around.

Now my friend is just keeping the shares. The money remains stuck indefinitely. The analogy is the same when buying properties without due consideration. Of course, I must always clarify if you don't need the money, are rich or buy to play play and enjoy the place, it is a different story.