Liverpool Season 2009-10

[Owen69]

Kop could be left in the cold

THEY'VE won it five times, as their fantastic fans love to remind us.
But the stark reality is Liverpool may have to get used to life outside the Champions League.

England's most successful team in Europe's elite competition will finish sixth at best in the Premier League this season and be reduced to playing in the Europa League.

And if tomorrow's game at Eastlands goes the way I expect it to, I fear it could be five years or even longer before the Kop are able to muscle their way back into the top four.

If Tottenham win, they will secure fourth spot and finally be able to get that lasagne-eating monkey off their backs and hold their heads up high in the company of Arsenal fans, who have taunted their north London rivals about their European inadequacies for so long.

But if City win, they will be in the box seat for Sunday's final day of the season when they play at West Ham and Spurs go to Burnley.

I do fancy City to win and finish fourth... and before you start screaming Spurs fans, it is not because of my Arsenal heritage.

Nor is it because my boy Shaun plays for City. I just think Tottenham, despite having an incredible season under Harry Redknapp, are not always the best on the road.

Harry is a good friend of mine and I'd love to see him do well. But I'm not sure his team will be able to go to City under this pressure and get the result they need.

City know they will never have a better chance to finish fourth. And if they do, it is not only Tottenham who should be disappointed and apprehensive.

For it would alter the landscape of the Premier League and Champions League, if not for ever, then certainly for the forseeable future - particularly at Anfield.

If or, more likely, when City get into the Champions League, it is unlikely to be a flying visit.

It would give their mega-rich owners fresh reason - as if any was needed - to buy expensive new properties.

Many of the players who have served them so well and helped achieve their dream this season would simply be deemed surplus to requirements.

Stars moving to Eastlands on bank-busting contracts would no longer have to use money as a reason. They would be able to say they were joining to play Champions League football.

It would make the blue machine even more unstoppable in their quest for domestic, European and, dare I say it, global domination.

And it would also leave Liverpool out in the cold.

Courtesy of SEM Group.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2957578/Kop-could-be-left-in-the-cold.html#ixzz0mwFa0dRB

 

[Ramseth]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

I have nothing against both Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester City. As for one of the next Top 4, I'd prefer Manchester City. Otherwise, the balance of powers would be lopsided towards London with three clubs. Actually, I'd even prefer both Manchester City and Tottenham Hotspur in the Top 4. But too bad, there's no way for either of them to catch Arsenal now.

 

[elephanto]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

But too bad, there's no way for either of them to catch Arsenal now.

Nah, Ramseth, 2 wins for Spurs & 1 last game loss for Gunners would put Spurs into 3rd place 1 pt ahead of Arsenal...

So it is not strictly NO way, you just didn't expect Arsenal to lose to Blackburn last night ...

 

[jw5]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

I have nothing against both Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester City. As for one of the next Top 4, I'd prefer Manchester City. Otherwise, the balance of powers would be lopsided towards London with three clubs. Actually, I'd even prefer both Manchester City and Tottenham Hotspur in the Top 4. But too bad, there's no way for either of them to catch Arsenal now.

Either Spurs or Man City can catch Arsenal if they win their last 2 games and Arsenal loses its last game.
But since Spurs and Man City are playing each other tomorrow, both can't catch Arsenal, only possibly either one.

 

[elephanto]

Owen69's post of Ian Wright's commentary - for a moment I was thinking why a nick like that supports Arsenal ... oh, it is a Sun article written by Wrighty ....

Until Hicks & Gilette are gone will there be hope for Liverpool.
Only when new stadium construction is underway will there be a new lease of life for the once English giant.

Only when the financial lifeline is restored can a new revival be realistic.
A good Manager needs funds to build a sustainable army.

Personally, I am rooting for Spurs now that Liverpool is out of Top 4.

For a club of Spurs flair & history & especially after the aborted mini revival under Martin Jol, Spurs fans deserve to see their club play CL football next season.... Moreover, City & moneybags football are bad - more inflation if City were to be in CL next season! Poor Villa, they could have still had a chance...

But it is all in their own hands...

 

[Ramseth]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

Either Spurs or Man City can catch Arsenal if they win their last 2 games and Arsenal loses its last game.
But since Spurs and Man City are playing each other tomorrow, both can't catch Arsenal, only possibly either one.

Yeah, the point being, there's no way that Arsenal could fall out of Top 4 now, yeah? If Manchester City and Tottenham Hotspurs draw, Arsenal is clear. If one side wins, Arsenal is clear also. The only thing is to remain in Top 3 to avoid the ECL play-off. Falling out of Top 4 is impossible.

 

[jw5]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

Yeah, the point being, there's no way that Arsenal could fall out of Top 4 now, yeah? If Manchester City and Tottenham Hotspurs draw, Arsenal is clear. If one side wins, Arsenal is clear also. The only thing is to remain in Top 3 to avoid the ECL play-off. Falling out of Top 4 is impossible.

You did say that "there's no way for either of them to catch Arsenal now".
It should be "there's no way for both of them to catch Arsenal now".
Sorry, I sound like Sam.

 

[elephanto]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

quote=Ramseth;457004
Yeah, the point being, there's no way that Arsenal could fall out of Top 4 now, yeah? huh ?
You sure :p

If Manchester City and Tottenham Hotspurs draw, Arsenal is clear.
Fair enough..

If one side wins, Arsenal is clear also. The only thing is to remain in Top 3 to avoid the ECL play-off. Falling out of Top 4 is impossible.

It matters if Spurs win the last 2 matches & Gunners lose their last.
Then Spurs will occupy 3rd place, 1 point ahead of Arsenal.

So you are wrong to say, falling out of Top 4 is impossible for Arsenal.

 

[elephanto]

"Rescue Liverpool' - an open letter by a football analyst

Reproduced from soccernet.com, a MUST-READ for all concerned Liverpool Fans.

The arrival of a new responsible owner will determine if Liverpool, as we know it, can be reborn or will suffer a slow death....

Finance expert predicts bleak Liverpool future

By Harry Harris, Football Correspondent


<!-- end story header --> <!-- begin left column --> <!-- begin page tools --> May 4, 201



<!-- end page tools --> <!-- begin story body --> <!-- template inline -->Liverpool's asking price for a takeover may be as much as an inflated £800 million, according to analysis from a leading City expert in football finance.
• Agent: Benitez has no offers and wants to stay

Empics
The replacement or refurbishment of Anfield is a key issue in any takeover.



And David Bick, Chairman of Square 1 Consulting, argues that Liverpool are in urgent need of a "rescue" package rather than a takeover, as the club need to move from their crumbling Anfield to a new stadium, and are in danger of losing star players such as Fernando Torres and Steven Gerrard.

Bick is an advisor to Keith Harris, who has been behind two abortive takeover bids for the stricken club in the recent past, and says City sources have informed him that even the reduced price the two American owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett might accept, £500 million, is far too high, saying: "Rumours abound of a price being asked from £500 million up to an incredible £800 million."


While Harris is a leading light in the 'Red Knights' group heavily linked with trying to buy out the Glazers at Manchester United, Bick has focused on their North-West rivals and warns of an impending £10 million fee to be imposed by the Royal Bank of Scotland to extend bank-loan facilities for a further six months.(Fuck me, the Yankees have really fucked the club big time)


And Bick suggests that, while the club is due to publish and publicise a £35 million profit, there are huge similarities with the recent Manchester United bond issue launched after a similar posting of a putative financial gain.


As part of their bond prospectus, United were able to claim a £48.2 million profit, having sold Cristiano Ronaldo for £80 million while Liverpool sold Xabi Alonso for £35 million to Real Madrid last summer - almost the exact amount Bick believes will be trumpeted as this year's profit.


In a damning indictment of financial affairs and long-standing neglect at Liverpool, Bick writes in an open letter:


"Liverpool has potentially reached its most important historic point. T

he club has now gone 20 years without winning the English League title. It has never won the Premier League.


It was drummed out earlier than expected from this year's Champions League and now, as one of the world's biggest clubs, faces the ignominy and reality of failing to qualify for next season's premier European competition.


"To my mind, the people running the club over the last two decades must bear the bulk of the responsibility and the brunt of the criticism.



On a recent visit to Anfield to watch my team, West Ham, play like a pub team with a Force 10 hangover, one had only to look at the stadium to see the years of dreadful neglect at first hand. Unbelievably, there are still pillars holding up one roof!


"Whether it comes down to incompetence or thoughtless arrogance at Liverpool, we have seen the club left behind by the other great clubs like Arsenal, Manchester United, Manchester City, Chelsea and Spurs.



They have rebuilt their stadia to high standards and, largely speaking, to capacities that accommodate their substantial fan bases.



Yet all Liverpool fans have heard is talk and a string of broken promises.


"The other clubs have built their revenue streams or attracted owners that have given them the wherewithal to compete effectively at the top of the modern game.



It seems to me that the Liverpool fans are being treated to a 'product' that is rooted in the 1970s. Sadly, in very recent times, Liverpool has also been owned by people who have said much and delivered little of the stated vision. Replacing them is a very urgent imperative.


"Liverpool claimed in a recent statement that it has 'overseen a significant improvement in the financial performance of the club since 2007'. Well, that's difficult to assess. The management has not published accounts for Kop Football (Holdings) Limited - the main trading company - since the filing for the year to 31 July 2008 and, in that year, the business showed net losses of over £42 million and net interest payments on debt of £35 million not covered at all (let alone adequately) by operating profit - pre-player amortisation and trading - of £25 million.


"Debt remains stubbornly near a reported £240 million, so what profits are produced do not leave much, if anything, for the manager to work with,

even if we believe rumours of a £35 million profit for the year that will end this 31 July.



In short, Liverpool's financial structure can't work in my opinion and, since the sale of the club in 2007, it was never going to.


"If the manager cannot operate competitively in the transfer market, he has no chance of competing regularly in the top four. We have now seen the first concrete sign of this with the failure to even stay in the top four.


Manchester United, a club manfully trying to cope with a similarly onerous financial structure will also, I believe, start to experience similar problems, although their state of decline is nowhere near as advanced as Liverpool's.
(Ah Wayne, your worst nightmare is coming soon too ...... )


"It seems axiomatic to me that Liverpool needs new, responsible owners and new top-flight, football-experienced executive management. It will not be beyond the wit of man, the new well regarded chairman included, to find such a new owner.



But first of all, Liverpool needs to stop spinning silly numbers. Rumours abound of a price being asked from £500 million up to an incredible £800 million, the lower of which is, in my view, way over the top for a club in its current condition and by any sensible comparison with Arsenal or Manchester United.


Bick pinpoints the burning issue of a new stadium, a project that has stalled during over three years of American ownership, and says that this can only make any takeover more complicated.


"Financially at least, Liverpool must have a new stadium if it is to have any hope of restoring past glories," he writes. "But the finance for that, and any subsequent financial benefit to owners, must accrue to those who put up the money. In any case, this will not be a conventional acquisition of a football asset - it is more likely now to be a rescue.


"The new owners will need to be people of high calibre. They will need to have access to very large sums of money to build the new stadium, revitalise the management and allow for a well thought-through strengthening of the playing squad."


On the current and much-debated issue of Rafael Benitez's future as Liverpool manager, Bick expresses the pressing need for stability to be restored or else the club could face a doomsday scenario.



"Right now, Liverpool is at risk of losing its manager and some of its best players, demoralised by a recent Europa Cup semi-final defeat and a poor season. While no-one is irreplaceable, such an exodus will leave a new owner with an even more difficult task. Therefore, the new chairman of Liverpool needs to act with some swiftness.


"Once decline becomes precipitous, even money may not prevent the decline spiralling into permanency."


Bick's open letter, headed 'Rescuing Liverpool', seen by Soccernet, may well cause shock waves among the Premier League community and not just at Anfield.

 

[Gallego99]

Re: "Rescue Liverpool' - an open letter by a football analyst

Manchester United, a club manfully trying to cope with a similarly onerous financial structure will also, I believe, start to experience similar problems, although their state of decline is nowhere near as advanced as Liverpool's.

The only similarity between MU and Pool is the debt the owners saddle the club with after the buyouts. As far as the other 'onerous financial structures' which the writer suggest that could lead to a calamitous spiral downwards, all he needs to do is to look at the balance sheets, financial levers and non financial related structures available to both clubs-macam comparing Toyota and BMW.???
What I would agree is that Yankees have to be kicked back to States(both Glazers and the H&G) as they have not brought an iota of value since their acquisition years ago.

 

[Gallego99]

Man Utd have only themselves to blame.
If they go into the last 2 games of the season expecting other teams to do them a favour, they don't deserve to be champions this season.
As for Liverpool, I don't think any of the players wanted to lose to Chelsea, but their performance was really listless and tepid. Then again, most of the team has been poor all season, except Reina whom I think is one of the best keepers in the world.
As for Benitez, he claims that previously, he stayed for the fans. Now, he should go for the fans, without any compensation. I can't stand hypocrisy.

They should blame old fart and no one else for missing out on EPL title. Din watch the game but last week's mauling by Chelsea was the last straw. Wigan will be slapped silly by Chelsea this weekend.

 

[elephanto]

TRIVIA PURSUITwas reading Ian Rush's Autobiography & came across this interesting tidbit ...

He was writing about season 81/82. Then a rookie playing in Liverpool reserves, he described how he eventually became a regular 1st teamer on account of David Johnson's injury & his goal-scoring ability was starting to show.

He described his first ever hattrick for Liverpool in the Old First Division against Notts County (together with Swindon Twon, they had their time in top flight too). He scored 3 & the score was 4-0.

Could have been more if not for the heroics of a certain Notts County Goalkeeper ................. Raddy Avramovic ! - today, Singapore's National Football Coach !

At least in 81/82, he was playing in English First Division - especially at a time when there were very few foreign players in British Football.

 

[Ramseth]

They should blame old fart and no one else for missing out on EPL title. Din watch the game but last week's mauling by Chelsea was the last straw. Wigan will be slapped silly by Chelsea this weekend.

Good calls, both. Yes, Alex Ferguson is to be blamed. And yes, Chelsea slapped slapped Wigan as silly as 8:0 can get.

 

[jw5]

TRIVIA PURSUITwas reading Ian Rush's Autobiography & came across this interesting tidbit ...

He was writing about season 81/82. Then a rookie playing in Liverpool reserves, he described how he eventually became a regular 1st teamer on account of David Johnson's injury & his goal-scoring ability was starting to show.

He described his first ever hattrick for Liverpool in the Old First Division against Notts County (together with Swindon Twon, they had their time in top flight too). He scored 3 & the score was 4-0.

Could have been more if not for the heroics of a certain Notts County Goalkeeper ................. Raddy Avramovic ! - today, Singapore's National Football Coach !

At least in 81/82, he was playing in English First Division - especially at a time when there were very few foreign players in British Football.

I already highlighted that in a post made in Sep 2009.
Raddy was a top goalkeeper in his heyday.

 

[BlueCat]

a very disappointing season for us.
hope a new owner or owners will be in,before the start of the new season else expect another disappointing season again.

 

[allanlee]

Re: Kop could be left in the cold

BREAKING NEWS!

An PRC internet tycoon rumoured to be one of the interested buyers of Liverpool FC is a high ranking member of an Asian gambling syndicate. This syndicate was believed to have raked in bets amounting to over 8 billion euros in 2009 according to Interpol estimates......... (source..... The HK Business Times Daily)


Looks like the triads are moving in. :p

 

[elephanto]

Just finished reading Jamie Carragher's Autobiography 'Carra' from NLB. The paperbaack version is very up to date : published in 2009 must be in the summer after the 08/09 season since in the book, Carra lamented coming in second 4 points behind Man United.

This autobiography beats the Stevie G's one which in turn beats the Michael Owen's one.

Owen's the worst - very bland very whiter than white.

Carra's autobiography is very much like his personality - very candid & opinionated.

At the end, he expressed his ever-present fear of being pushed out of his preferred central defender role, acknowledged that he is too old to play left/right backs (the younger ones like Skyrtel should volunteer for that now.. he wryly remarked), resigned to the fact that his chances of ever winning a EPL Title medal is next to nothing.

Carra would love to be in management, but only in Liverpool simply becos he would never want to uproot himself geographically for his 3 childrens' sake (he wants them to have the Bootle accent).

Enjoyed it. Without people like Stevie G & Carragher, Liverpool FC will have lost its soul.

 

[elephanto]

As at today, the situation in Liverpool is:-

(1) Rafa confirmed not going to Juventus

(2) After talks with Chairman & Managing Director next, Rafa seemed to be staying & declared his stand that as long as he is there, he doesn't intend to sell Stevie G & Fernando Torres (is that a get-out clause?)

(3) Market talk: B.Yossi - wanted by Chelsea to replace Joe Cole, Torres - wanted by both Barca & Chelsea, Mischerano - wanted by Barca

I forsee:-
- more turmoil ahead.
- Yankees to insist on unrealistic selling price
- more rumors of potential buyers - all put-off by Yankee's profiteering asking price
- deadline approaches, banks & creditors pressure ....
- club has to sell star players to service debt & pay off iinterests
- fans protest, demonstrate, boycott etc
- Rafa resign in protest & Torres & Gerrard sold
- Daglish caretaker ....
- mid-table mediocrity in 10/11 season
- year-end or when next loan window period approaches, finally Yankees forced to compromise - yet still exit with good obscene profit
- New Owners Come in at long last to rebuild from the ground up...
- Liverpool is contending again ..... season 2013/2014 !!!!

 

[Alamaking]

Rafa wont go 1, if he go Liverpool will have to pay him 6 million leh, lol

 

[Screwball]

Rafa wont go 1, if he go Liverpool will have to pay him 6 million leh, lol

Saw the newsflash just broadcast on Chelsea TV.
Abramovic is offering 38 million + Joe Cole for Torres.