LEONGSAM insists he is an English native speaker...

[Leongsam]

If his English is so "powderful", which part of the word "native" does he not understand?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/native+language

<tbody>
[TD="align: right"] Main Entry: [/TD]
[TD="align: left"]native language[SUP][SIZE=-1]1[/SIZE][/SUP][/TD]

[TD="align: right"] Part of Speech: [/TD]
[TD="align: left"] n [/TD]

[TD="align: right"] Definition: [/TD]
[TD="align: left"] the language that a person acquires in earliest childhood ; also, the primary language of a community; also called primary language , mother tongue [/TD]

</tbody>

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/mother+tongue

mother tongue

1.the language first learned by a person; native language.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/native+language

Noun

1.

native language - the language that a person has spoken from earliest childhood

<tbody>
</tbody>

Which part of the explanation don't YOU understand.

 

[dietcoke]

Which part of the explanation don't YOU understand.

but we all understand u are a white-skinned wannabe..

 

[dredd]

Sam, Sam, Sam... I would suggest you don't rely on an internet-based dictionary to justify your definition of an English Native Speaker and get your fat anglophile butt to look for more credible sources of information from a place called a "library". Here are a few suggestions for ref. to start you off:

D. (1990) Language and Species. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Bloomfield, L. (1933) Language. New York: Holt
Chomsky, N. (1965) Aspects of the Theory of Syntax. Cambridge, Mass.: MIT Press.
- (1986) Knowledge of Language: Its Nature, Origin and Use. New York: Praetor.
Elgin, S.H. (1996, June 18) [e-mail to Linguist List 7.941] [Online] Available: http://www.emich.edu/~linguist/issues/html/7-941.html#2
Ellis, J.M. (1993) Language, Thought, and Logic. Evanston, Ill.: Northwestern University Press.
Ferguson, C.A. (1959) "Diglossia." Word 15:325-40.
Fishman, J.A. (1972a) "The Sociology of Language." In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
- (1972b) The Sociology of Language. Rowley: Newbury House.
- (1989) Language and Ethnicity in Minority Sociolinguistic Perspective. Clevedon: Multilingual Matters Ltd.
Gee, S. (1997, June 5) Re: Serbo-Croat. [e-mail to Robin Turner].
Grillo, R.D. (1989) Dominant Languages: language and hierarchy in Britain and France. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
Gumperz, J. (1962) "Types of linguistic communities." Anthropological Linguistics 4(1):28-40
- (1972) "The Speech Community". In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
Hockett, C.F. (1958) A Course in Modern Linguistics. New York: Macmillan.
Hymes, D. (1972a) "Toward Ethnographies of Communication: the analysis of communicative events". In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
- (1972b) "Models of the interaction of language and social life." In John J. Gumperz and D. Hymes (eds.) Directions in Sociolinguistics: ethnography of communication. New York: Holt, Rineheart & Winston.
- (1972c) "On communicative competence". In J.B. Pride & J. Holmes (eds.) Sociolinguistics. London: Penguin.
Kachru, B.B. (1986) The Alchemy of English: the spread, functions and models of non-native Englishes. Oxford: Pergamon Institute of English.
Khubchandani, L.M. (1991) Language, Culture and Nation-Building: challenges of modernisation. New Delhi: Manohar Publications.
Labov, W. (1972) "On the mechanism of linguistic change." In John J. Gumperz and D. Hymes (eds.) Directions in Sociolinguistics: ethnography of communication. New York: Holt, Rineheart & Winston.
Lakoff, G. (1987) Women, Fire and Dangerous Things: What categories reveal about the mind. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Lenneberg, E. (1967) Biological Foundations of Language. New York: John Wiley & Sons.
Le Page, R.B. & Tabouret-Keller, A. (1985) Acts of Identity: Creole-based approaches to language and ethnicity. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
Mead, M. (1980) Sex and Temperament in three Primitive Societies. New York: Morrow Quill Paperbacks
Pennycook, A. (1994) The Cultural Politics of English as an International Language. London: Longman.
Rosch, E. (1973) "Natural Categories". Cognitive Psychology 4: 328-350.
Saussure, F. de (1916). Course in General Linguistics, ed. Charles Bally & Albert Sechehaye, trans. Wade Baskin. New York: McGraw-Hill. 1966.
Saville-Troike, M. (1989) The Ethnography of Communication: an introduction (2nd ed.). Oxford: Blackwell.
Sherzer, J. (1975) "Ethnography of Speaking". Manuscript, University of Texas at Austin.
Wittgenstein, L. Philosophical Investigations. G.E.M. Anscombe & R. Rhees (eds.), trans. G.E.M. Anscombe. 3d ed. New York 1968.

If you still perceive yourself as an English Native Speaker and am totally convinced others will view you as one, or you are so sure of your "fine" English language skills, try to apply for a job as an English language teacher at any British Council. Let the kind lady interviewer explain to you nicely why you are not qualified because you are not an English Native Speaker.

 

[lianbeng]

lianbeng wonders if leongsam dares to correct the english spoken and/or written by true blue english people from england? most of them dun speak proper english - they speak gibberish!

 

[dredd]

lianbeng wonders if leongsam dares to correct the english spoken and/or written by true blue english people from england? most of them dun speak proper english - they speak gibberish!

He couldn't take up the dare because he will be laughed at: Imagine a "chink" telling an Englishman how to speak proper English. Doing that would be like an Englishman scolding a Chinese for using bad mandarin. He only has the balls to "teach" English to Sinkees here, bitching over the use of "advise" and "advice".

 

[dredd]

but we all understand u are a white-skinned wannabe..

OK, that's a little inaccurate. We must be precise in the usage of English here. It should be: But we all understand u are a white-skinned never-will-be.

 

[lianbeng]

OK, that's a little inaccurate. We must be precise in the usage of English here. It should be: But we all understand u are a white-skinned never-will-be.

lianbeng interrupts, "you lah not u lah!"

 

[dietcoke]

OK, that's a little inaccurate. We must be precise in the usage of English here. It should be: But we all understand u are a white-skinned never-will-be.

Thank you for the correction

 

[Maximilian Chua-Heng]

Wah....This dredd new guy really got substance one lor, can even come up with a bibliographical list!

Welcum to Singsupplies!

Sam, Sam, Sam... I would suggest you don't rely on an internet-based dictionary to justify your definition of an English Native Speaker and get your fat anglophile butt to look for more credible sources of information from a place called a "library". Here are a few suggestions for ref. to start you off:

D. (1990) Language and Species. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Bloomfield, L. (1933) Language. New York: Holt
Chomsky, N. (1965) Aspects of the Theory of Syntax. Cambridge, Mass.: MIT Press.
- (1986) Knowledge of Language: Its Nature, Origin and Use. New York: Praetor.
Elgin, S.H. (1996, June 18) [e-mail to Linguist List 7.941] [Online] Available: http://www.emich.edu/~linguist/issues/html/7-941.html#2
Ellis, J.M. (1993) Language, Thought, and Logic. Evanston, Ill.: Northwestern University Press.
Ferguson, C.A. (1959) "Diglossia." Word 15:325-40.
Fishman, J.A. (1972a) "The Sociology of Language." In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
- (1972b) The Sociology of Language. Rowley: Newbury House.
- (1989) Language and Ethnicity in Minority Sociolinguistic Perspective. Clevedon: Multilingual Matters Ltd.
Gee, S. (1997, June 5) Re: Serbo-Croat. [e-mail to Robin Turner].
Grillo, R.D. (1989) Dominant Languages: language and hierarchy in Britain and France. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
Gumperz, J. (1962) "Types of linguistic communities." Anthropological Linguistics 4(1):28-40
- (1972) "The Speech Community". In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
Hockett, C.F. (1958) A Course in Modern Linguistics. New York: Macmillan.
Hymes, D. (1972a) "Toward Ethnographies of Communication: the analysis of communicative events". In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
- (1972b) "Models of the interaction of language and social life." In John J. Gumperz and D. Hymes (eds.) Directions in Sociolinguistics: ethnography of communication. New York: Holt, Rineheart & Winston.
- (1972c) "On communicative competence". In J.B. Pride & J. Holmes (eds.) Sociolinguistics. London: Penguin.
Kachru, B.B. (1986) The Alchemy of English: the spread, functions and models of non-native Englishes. Oxford: Pergamon Institute of English.
Khubchandani, L.M. (1991) Language, Culture and Nation-Building: challenges of modernisation. New Delhi: Manohar Publications.
Labov, W. (1972) "On the mechanism of linguistic change." In John J. Gumperz and D. Hymes (eds.) Directions in Sociolinguistics: ethnography of communication. New York: Holt, Rineheart & Winston.
Lakoff, G. (1987) Women, Fire and Dangerous Things: What categories reveal about the mind. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Lenneberg, E. (1967) Biological Foundations of Language. New York: John Wiley & Sons.
Le Page, R.B. & Tabouret-Keller, A. (1985) Acts of Identity: Creole-based approaches to language and ethnicity. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
Mead, M. (1980) Sex and Temperament in three Primitive Societies. New York: Morrow Quill Paperbacks
Pennycook, A. (1994) The Cultural Politics of English as an International Language. London: Longman.
Rosch, E. (1973) "Natural Categories". Cognitive Psychology 4: 328-350.
Saussure, F. de (1916). Course in General Linguistics, ed. Charles Bally & Albert Sechehaye, trans. Wade Baskin. New York: McGraw-Hill. 1966.
Saville-Troike, M. (1989) The Ethnography of Communication: an introduction (2nd ed.). Oxford: Blackwell.
Sherzer, J. (1975) "Ethnography of Speaking". Manuscript, University of Texas at Austin.
Wittgenstein, L. Philosophical Investigations. G.E.M. Anscombe & R. Rhees (eds.), trans. G.E.M. Anscombe. 3d ed. New York 1968.

If you still perceive yourself as an English Native Speaker and am totally convinced others will view you as one, or you are so sure of your "fine" English language skills, try to apply for a job as an English language teacher at any British Council. Let the kind lady interviewer explain to you nicely why you are not qualified because you are not an English Native Speaker.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

It's always a problem when the native english speaker is a non white person a chinese person. Ppl always assume his english just won't be up to scratch. Typical example would be that forvendet assuming his english is better than others simply cos he has white ancestry.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

lianbeng wonders if leongsam dares to correct the english spoken and/or written by true blue english people from england? most of them dun speak proper english - they speak gibberish!

You know the odd thing is when they speak and write poorly they don't get chided that badly compared to when a chinese person is unable to speak or write chinese well.

Notice the differences between these 2. It's like somehow it's acceptable for an english person to not be able to write or speak perfect english but yet a chinese person has to be able to do so for chinese.

Then when an english person speaks a few chinese phrases or writes a few chinese words gets praised to the skies by other chinese who'll be literally kissing his ass. Yet a chinese person that speaks fluent english but doesn't have the proper american or british accent gets laughed at by them.

 

[po2wq]

Sam, Sam, Sam... I would suggest you don't rely on an internet-based dictionary to justify your definition of an English Native Speaker and get your fat anglophile butt to look for more credible sources of information from a place called a "library". Here are a few suggestions for ref. to start you off: ...

... But we all understand u are a white-skinned never-will-be.

u shud oso provide dat hburger a list of soses 4 skin bleaching ...

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Seriously this racial thing created by the whites has really put them in such a huge advantage. They don't even need to speak perfect english and ppl will always assume they write and speak perfect english. Even then just the fact that they have an accent especially british or american already puts them at a huge advantage. A white person with less than perfect knowledge of english but speaks with a brit accent for eg will always be more highly regarded than an asian with better english but without the ang moh accent. Even other white people will treat another white person more respect and not condemn him for speaking poor english.

On the other hand chinese ppl only know how to bully their own kind. A chinese person doesn't know how to read or write some chinese words gets insulted and the standards are set super high or made unreasonable. Then they'll praise a non chinese person for even knowing how to speak a few basic mandarin words that even a 4 yr old chinese kid knows how to speak and write.

Even stupider is the use of chop sticks for eg. Who in this day and age whether he's an easterner or a westerner doesn't know how to use chopsticks?

 

[Ramseth]

Language is just a medium of communication. As long as it's understood, it serves its function. There's neither need nor ground to gloat over who's native or who's standard. English is of Germanic base but began as a bastadized mix of Angles-Jutes-Saxons tongues. Angles were the native English. Jutes were from Scandanavia. Saxons were from Germany. The bastadization exponentially multiplied for lack of vocabulary. Most English vocabulary were loanwords, from French, Latin and Greek. It's almost mirror image of Japanese. Japanese is grammatically and structurally Altaic but most of Japanese vocabulary were loanwords from Chinese.

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

Yes english not only has loan words from these european languages but even chinese like kow tow pariah from indian and so on. The main issue here is the definition of one's native tongue. Unfortunately even in today's globalized world race is still very much fixed to culture. I don't think many people would consider a japanese person that grew up in a greek speaking household for eg to have greek as his native language. For english it's more flexible since it's the international language but still by and large even today most ppl wouldn't consider an asian person's native language to be english unless the person in consideration is extremely liberal.

Perhaps it's due to snobbery or just a way to standardize classification.

 

[Ramseth]

Yes english not only has loan words from these european languages but even chinese like kow tow pariah from indian and so on. The main issue here is the definition of one's native tongue. Unfortunately even in today's globalized world race is still very much fixed to culture. I don't think many people would consider a japanese person that grew up in a greek speaking household for eg to have greek as his native language. For english it's more flexible since it's the international language but still by and large even today most ppl wouldn't consider an asian person's native language to be english unless the person in consideration is extremely liberal.

Perhaps it's due to snobbery or just a way to standardize classification.

The name of the language Mandarin was conferred on the Chinese by English speakers. Nobody in local Chinese dialects called the Chinese capital language Mandarin. It means noble language. Chinese of all dialects just call it Beijing dialect or Putonghua (Beijing or general dialect).

 

[Jah_rastafar_I]

The name of the language Mandarin was conferred on the Chinese by English speakers. Nobody in local Chinese dialects called the Chinese capital language Mandarin. It means noble language. Chinese of all dialects just call it Beijing dialect or Putonghua (Beijing or general dialect).

yes that's plain obvious isn't it? I don't know why did you digress from the topic but this is the case for most languages and names of places isn't it? The name of something in english is totally different from the name in its native language. Another example would be bangkok. Most non thais call it bangkok but the thais call it krung thep. Its official name is super long.

The chinese in china called it guo yu too. I don't know why you brought this up.

 

[eatshitndie]

i think he is an expert in english and singlish. his expertise in giving advise to people who want to advice others is legendary.he has a phD on the exclusive use of the words advise and advice. i salute his mastery of his native english. we sinkies with our sicklish and singlishare dead ducks in the world of linguistics. we are dead.dead.dead.....

"advise" should be "advice", and "advice" should be "advise" in your first statement above. the former is a noun and the latter a verb.

 

[Ramseth]

yes that's plain obvious isn't it? I don't know why did you digress from the topic but this is the case for most languages and names of places isn't it? The name of something in english is totally different from the name in its native language. Another example would be bangkok. Most non thais call it bangkok but the thais call it krung thep. Its official name is super long.

The chinese in china called it guo yu too. I don't know why you brought this up.

I brought this up because you brought language snobbery up first. There was a time when the Chinese language was considered to be of noble class without even the Chinese needing to act or sound snobberish.

 

[hokkienpeng]

Sam, Sam, Sam... I would suggest you don't rely on an internet-based dictionary to justify your definition of an English Native Speaker and get your fat anglophile butt to look for more credible sources of information from a place called a "library". Here are a few suggestions for ref. to start you off:

D. (1990) Language and Species. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Bloomfield, L. (1933) Language. New York: Holt
Chomsky, N. (1965) Aspects of the Theory of Syntax. Cambridge, Mass.: MIT Press.
- (1986) Knowledge of Language: Its Nature, Origin and Use. New York: Praetor.
Elgin, S.H. (1996, June 18) [e-mail to Linguist List 7.941] [Online] Available: http://www.emich.edu/~linguist/issues/html/7-941.html#2
Ellis, J.M. (1993) Language, Thought, and Logic. Evanston, Ill.: Northwestern University Press.
Ferguson, C.A. (1959) "Diglossia." Word 15:325-40.
Fishman, J.A. (1972a) "The Sociology of Language." In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
- (1972b) The Sociology of Language. Rowley: Newbury House.
- (1989) Language and Ethnicity in Minority Sociolinguistic Perspective. Clevedon: Multilingual Matters Ltd.
Gee, S. (1997, June 5) Re: Serbo-Croat. [e-mail to Robin Turner].
Grillo, R.D. (1989) Dominant Languages: language and hierarchy in Britain and France. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
Gumperz, J. (1962) "Types of linguistic communities." Anthropological Linguistics 4(1):28-40
- (1972) "The Speech Community". In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
Hockett, C.F. (1958) A Course in Modern Linguistics. New York: Macmillan.
Hymes, D. (1972a) "Toward Ethnographies of Communication: the analysis of communicative events". In Pier Paulo Giglioli (ed.) Language and Social Context. Harmondsworth: Penguin.
- (1972b) "Models of the interaction of language and social life." In John J. Gumperz and D. Hymes (eds.) Directions in Sociolinguistics: ethnography of communication. New York: Holt, Rineheart & Winston.
- (1972c) "On communicative competence". In J.B. Pride & J. Holmes (eds.) Sociolinguistics. London: Penguin.
Kachru, B.B. (1986) The Alchemy of English: the spread, functions and models of non-native Englishes. Oxford: Pergamon Institute of English.
Khubchandani, L.M. (1991) Language, Culture and Nation-Building: challenges of modernisation. New Delhi: Manohar Publications.
Labov, W. (1972) "On the mechanism of linguistic change." In John J. Gumperz and D. Hymes (eds.) Directions in Sociolinguistics: ethnography of communication. New York: Holt, Rineheart & Winston.
Lakoff, G. (1987) Women, Fire and Dangerous Things: What categories reveal about the mind. Chicago: University of Chicago Press.
Lenneberg, E. (1967) Biological Foundations of Language. New York: John Wiley & Sons.
Le Page, R.B. & Tabouret-Keller, A. (1985) Acts of Identity: Creole-based approaches to language and ethnicity. Cambridge: Cambridge University Press.
Mead, M. (1980) Sex and Temperament in three Primitive Societies. New York: Morrow Quill Paperbacks
Pennycook, A. (1994) The Cultural Politics of English as an International Language. London: Longman.
Rosch, E. (1973) "Natural Categories". Cognitive Psychology 4: 328-350.
Saussure, F. de (1916). Course in General Linguistics, ed. Charles Bally & Albert Sechehaye, trans. Wade Baskin. New York: McGraw-Hill. 1966.
Saville-Troike, M. (1989) The Ethnography of Communication: an introduction (2nd ed.). Oxford: Blackwell.
Sherzer, J. (1975) "Ethnography of Speaking". Manuscript, University of Texas at Austin.
Wittgenstein, L. Philosophical Investigations. G.E.M. Anscombe & R. Rhees (eds.), trans. G.E.M. Anscombe. 3d ed. New York 1968.

You sure you read any of these? Seems to be a cut-and-paste job:

http://neptune.spaceports.com/~words/native.html