Is the Chee Soon Juan appeal fading? Here comes Vincent Wijeysingha

[CannonFairy]

I know I will have bricks,stones and knives thrown at me for starting this discussion.

I am traditional which is mainly the reason I do not like gays. I find them bitchy whiny, petty,stubborn,inflexible, like women like that. I have to deal with my wife at home who nags at my diet and I hope not to deal with lady-like temperamental gentleman in the public.

I have been reading the postings that Vincent Wijeysingha made on the internet and I have heard some of his speeches.My impression of him that he has fire in his belly,eloqquate and able to connect most of the time. There is no doubt you could sense his hatred for the PAP. He is a social worker who witnessed the poverty in Singapore which embolden the sense of injustice he felt and fueled his disgust for the PAP. Who are the politicians who can speak like him? My yum cha kaki today told me Vincent has some public speaking skills of that old man.I almost spitted out my chinese tea.Too bad he is not Chinese, he also said. But this is a sign that Vincent has attention

My point is Vincent is definitely able to step out of the shadows of Chee Soon Juan and SDP. At the rate of exposure that Vincent is getting and his political charm to persuade, Chee comparatively is irrelevant and he seems like a follower instead of a leader.Chee is unable to connect for the past 20 years or so and not in the future. He has lost the plot.The only thing he can do now is not to be seen as the same league of Kenneth Jeyaretnam.

If there is hope for this country to make the PAP wake up their greedy bloody idea, Vincent is the one to look at. Not Chee.

If the much talked by-election of Punggol East is a proxy battle for the popularity of the political parties or individual party members, Vincent should throw his hat into the ring. PAP is much pretty at a loss.Who can PAP field?The young useless PAP members do not have much "battlefield" or public speaking experience. If pitted against Vincent,PAP will have a very hard time.

Lastly,who is going to attend the PAP rallies for the free nasi lemak?

 

[wwabbit]

I am traditional which is mainly the reason I do not like gays. I find them bitchy whiny, petty,stubborn,inflexible, like women like that. I have to deal with my wife at home who nags at my diet and I hope not to deal with lady-like temperamental gentleman in the public.

...and you call yourself a fairy. Oh the irony...

 

[tualingong]

this gay agenda was why sdp lost the last election.

still haven't learn?

let us hope those nasi lemak wasn't prepared by non PAP SUPPORTERS YOU LAOSAI THEN YOU KNow

 

[eremarf]

I find it a refreshing sign of the times that social workers rather than lawyers gain mileage among the electorate. Maybe it shows a shift in what people envision for Singapore, more loudly than the staged National Conversation reveals.

Re: people saying SDP lost because of the gay agenda - well but they also win votes because of that. If in the future SDP becomes a potential coalition partner, it might just be because they can win women's, gay, and minority votes (WP is a bit too Chinese-oriented perhaps?) (sounds a bit like Obama/Democrats right, after the Republicans painted themselves into a corner with pro-white, pro-Christian campaigning and now face a darkening and secularizing American constituency).

BTW I still have the utmost respect for Dr Chee. My ex-students who slam Dr Chee are always surprised when I show them the side not shown by the media. He really is just the victim of a major smear campaign orchestrated by the PAP and carried out by their media hitmen. He was a great man and still is. He began making the sacrifices in a time when sticking out got you hammered down really bad. He's not so different from Gandhi or Mandela, really.

 

[wikiphile]

We shall see in 2016 or the BE in 2013 if Chee comes out to play

 

[cass888]

BTW I still have the utmost respect for Dr Chee. My ex-students who slam Dr Chee are always surprised when I show them the side not shown by the media. He really is just the victim of a major smear campaign orchestrated by the PAP and carried out by their media hitmen. He was a great man and still is. He began making the sacrifices in a time when sticking out got you hammered down really bad. He's not so different from Gandhi or Mandela, really.

Are you suggesting the loud nailer routine was made up? How? Photoshop?

 

[jw5]

Are you suggesting the loud nailer routine was made up? How? Photoshop?

loud nailer routine? hahahaha, whose routine is that? Palmer's?

 

[jw5]

Hey CannonFairy, hehehe :o

1. Why would u think people would throw bricks, stones, knives for this thread? Perfectly fine for discussion.

2. I have no problem with gays except those who exhibit PDA in front of me, or those who go about clamouring for gay rights. What they do behind closed doors or without making a public issue of it is their business.

3. Vincent is a deep thinker as well as an excellent public speaker. He shows all the qualities that the ordinary singaporean would want in an MP.

4. Last but certainly not least, no free nasi lemak for me. I'll buy my own or I can don't eat nasi lemak.

 

[eremarf]

Are you suggesting the loud nailer routine was made up? How? Photoshop?

Interestingly, you might just have indeed hit the nail on the head. It might be a photoshop after all.

I tried googling "Chee Soon Juan loudhailer", "Did Chee Soon Juan use a loudhailer", etc. and the only hits were some people claiming the ST did some editing to juxtapose Chee with a loudhailer with Goh (but no credible sources). I tried searching google image - but turned up no visuals of Dr Chee with a loudspeaker in hand.

The truth - is unknown to me. Maybe someone who knows can clarify.

But knowing the media's propensity to smear Dr Chee, it's probably not real that he used a loudhailer to shout and chase after Goh Chok Tong. And the amazing thing is - in citizens' minds - he did! That's the power of our MSM smearing. What else can I say...

 

[cass888]

You are probably too young.

I saw the footage in 1991. The footage was quite clear that Chee Soon Juan's voice was magnified. He uses an excuse that the PAP supporters were chanting too loud. Seems he doesn't have enough supporters then.

Interestingly, you might just have indeed hit the nail on the head. It might be a photoshop after all.

I tried googling "Chee Soon Juan loudhailer", "Did Chee Soon Juan use a loudhailer", etc. and the only hits were some people claiming the ST did some editing to juxtapose Chee with a loudhailer with Goh (but no credible sources). I tried searching google image - but turned up no visuals of Dr Chee with a loudspeaker in hand.

The truth - is unknown to me. Maybe someone who knows can clarify.

But knowing the media's propensity to smear Dr Chee, it's probably not real that he used a loudhailer to shout and chase after Goh Chok Tong. And the amazing thing is - in citizens' minds - he did! That's the power of our MSM smearing. What else can I say...

 

[eremarf]

You are probably too young.

I saw the footage in 1991. The footage was quite clear that Chee Soon Juan's voice was magnified. He uses an excuse that the PAP supporters were chanting too loud. Seems he doesn't have enough supporters then.

You might be right. I was in primary school in 1991. But the incident happened in 2001 leh.
http://sgforums.com/forums/10/topics/414565

Let's see what other forummers can tell us.

But nonetheless, does this incident strongly influence our assessment of what kind of person CSJ is? Especially when you have a lot of other positive film coverage of how CSJ talks and behaves the rest of the time?

 

[metalmickey]

I'm still concerned that Singaporeans are anti-gay but I suppose most people when you ask them will say "I'm not anti-gay, I'm not pro-gay". This is probably good news for gay rights groups because it means that eventually they will really be treated like everybody else, if this isn't already happening.

Vincent Wijeysingha, as you all probably know, is really gay. The PAP did not make that one up. They tried to publicise this fact because they know that Singaporeans are slightly disapproving of gay people.

I don't think the loudhailer incident took place with a loudhailer. He did harangue Goh Chok Tong about a loan made to Indonesia during the financial crisis. I don't fully understand what's there to disapprove about that loan.

If you want to judge people, I think you'd rather judge their achievements rather than their faults. CSJ is no politician, he doesn't know how to reach out to the fellow Singaporean. His profile has risen in the last few years because people now understand the sacrifices he has made on their behalf. His real work is organising a lot of attention from NGOs around the world to put persistent pressure on the Singapore government for their human rights issues. And re-organising the SDP so that it becomes a rising force in local politics, and providing a platform for people like VW and dunno who else to put forth their ideas against the PAP regime. It's not important what he didn't manage to do, what is more important is what he did. I would have though that he was dead and buried by now, but his turnaround is quite amazing. To me he is a bit more of a martyr than a hero but he's still a great guy. SDP won't be about him or VW. It is a party and a party is not about any one person. The younger people will carry on the work that he did.

By the way anybody know what happen to that Ang Yong Guan?

 

[Picardo]

It is enough just to say that to judge and condemn any person based wholly on a deliberately selective, narrow and illusory view of him is not only a gross injustice to him, but also clearly shows unwillingness of the person to rectify his hitherto erroneous view of the person. One can for instance, selectively and idiotically attack a person's way of combing his hair, or the the peculiar way he walks. Or indeed the particular way he chose to put across his message. Doing so would be not only petty, but be focussing on the irrelevant, rather than the substance and thoughts of the person.

One with such a unfair, self-deceptive and rogue view against a person can be rather easily disarmed with the truth itself. For such a person it, would do well and be highly beneficial for him to gain more insight, by making the effort to read the many available writings of Dr Chee Soon Juan.

Then, and only then can any person claim to know Dr Chee Soon Juan as the man he is, and what he stands for. Magnifying little petty matters to destroy a man of noble aspirations, while refusing to see far more serious rogue acts of immorality or impropriety elsewhere is to be grossly dishonest, to say the least.

Let's see what other forummers can tell us.

But nonetheless, does this incident strongly influence our assessment of what kind of person CSJ is? Especially when you have a lot of other positive film coverage of how CSJ talks and behaves the rest of the time?

 

[tanwahp]

One with such a unfair, self-deceptive and rogue view against a person can be rather easily disarmed with the truth itself. For such a person it, would do well and be highly beneficial for him to gain more insight, by making the effort to read the many available writings of Dr Chee Soon Juan.

I agree that one should not throw stones at people who are doing something for the country. That being said, I am faced with the possibility of voting among 3 candidates from PAP, WP and SDP. If I throw out PAP, I have to make a decision between WP and SDP. My emphasis is on consistent (but not unchanging) party direction.

Right now I remain suspicious about a few things. Wonder if any of Chee's supporters can explain any of it.

1. He has stopped any actions that will land him in court. Does this mean he recognize that his strategy was wrong and he had intentionally sought to land himself in court.

2. He once said the opposition can never replace the govt by elections. Lately he not only discharged himself from bankruptcy and said he wants to contest elections, he stopped such talk.

3. He talks the most about opposition unity, but his actions are either superficial or incongruent.

 

[captainxerox]

I'm still concerned that Singaporeans are anti-gay but I suppose most people when you ask them will say "I'm not anti-gay, I'm not pro-gay". This is probably good news for gay rights groups because it means that eventually they will really be treated like everybody else, if this isn't already happening.

gays should just suck it up. the more they assert, the more irritated people are. now is already live and let live. if they keep their private lives private, like people who have affairs, or ppl who have fetish, so what.

By the way anybody know what happen to that Ang Yong Guan?

from his performance in the last ge, he is a sdp liability and they dropped him.

 

[giggity_shit]

I find it a refreshing sign of the times that social workers rather than lawyers gain mileage among the electorate. Maybe it shows a shift in what people envision for Singapore, more loudly than the staged National Conversation reveals.

Re: people saying SDP lost because of the gay agenda - well but they also win votes because of that. If in the future SDP becomes a potential coalition partner, it might just be because they can win women's, gay, and minority votes (WP is a bit too Chinese-oriented perhaps?) (sounds a bit like Obama/Democrats right, after the Republicans painted themselves into a corner with pro-white, pro-Christian campaigning and now face a darkening and secularizing American constituency).

BTW I still have the utmost respect for Dr Chee. My ex-students who slam Dr Chee are always surprised when I show them the side not shown by the media. He really is just the victim of a major smear campaign orchestrated by the PAP and carried out by their media hitmen. He was a great man and still is. He began making the sacrifices in a time when sticking out got you hammered down really bad. He's not so different from Gandhi or Mandela, really.

Chee is not electable because people think he will do anything as long as it discredits the PAP. Anything...

 

[Picardo]

I feel he is simply tired of it all.

Just give the man a break. He's not such a bad person as everyone thinks and has been thinking he is. In spite of all his and his whole team's tireless efforts in the past, it has been proven, I believe to his satisfaction, that 'swine can never appreciate the goodness of pearls', in it's truest sense. He is ahead of his time.

Rather than mulling and speculating over opposition parties and personalities, it is better if you will spend your nerve energy pondering about and 'relishing', if you are inclined to do so, the unique characteristic of the voters. Ultimately, it is more about the voters than anything else. Here, they are truly a unique product of the past.

I agree that one should not throw stones at peoergy ponderingple who are doing something for the country. That being said, I am faced with the possibility of voting among 3 candidates from PAP, WP and SDP. If I throw out PAP, I have to make a decision between WP and SDP. My emphasis is on consistent (but not unchanging) party direction.

Right now I remain suspicious about a few things. Wonder if any of Chee's supporters can explain any of it.

1. He has stopped any actions that will land him in court. Does this mean he recognize that his strategy was wrong and he had intentionally sought to land himself in court.

2. He once said the opposition can never replace the govt by elections. Lately he not only discharged himself from bankruptcy and said he wants to contest elections, he stopped such talk.

3. He talks the most about opposition unity, but his actions are either superficial or incongruent.

 

[waterloong]

Vincent Wijeysingha publicly threw his temper against a known PAP member in a tertiary institution.

 

[cass888]

When? Where? How? Why?

Vincent Wijeysingha publicly threw his temper against a known PAP member in a tertiary institution.

 

[tanwahp]

Just give the man a break. He's not such a bad person as everyone thinks and has been thinking he is. In spite of all his and his whole team's tireless efforts in the past, it has been proven, I believe to his satisfaction, that 'swine can never appreciate the goodness of pearls', in it's truest sense. He is ahead of his time.

It's fine if he wants a break, but if he wants to win my vote, then he can't take a break. If not I will give my vote to someone who is not taking breaks.

I still need to make a choice if my candidates are all pearls and not bad persons.