"I Rather Be Feared Than Be Loved"

[TracyTan866]

Careful, some elaboration is needed here.

Capable as a politician, not in other aspects. Nation building and other facets need to be attributed to the thousands of workers, architects, engineers, businessmen, civil workers, technicians and labourers who built the country. Not ONE man.

Successful, as claimed by those who idolize him. There are people who see him as a failed human being. It is a matter of choice of view.

Cheers!

Thanks for the elaboration. Noted another description...Failed human being

 

[TracyTan866]

Careful, some elaboration is needed here.

Capable as a politician, not in other aspects. Nation building and other facets need to be attributed to the thousands of workers, architects, engineers, businessmen, civil workers, technicians and labourers who built the country. Not ONE man.

Successful, as claimed by those who idolize him. There are people who see him as a failed human being. It is a matter of choice of view.

Cheers!

People's description of LKY:

1. TracyTan866 - Unwise, Arrogant, Foolish
2. Laksaboy and Tunku- Unscrupulous, Lonely
3. po2wq- Mad, Tyrant
4. Yellowarse and Dr Poh- Political pimp
5. Tun Tan Siew Sin and Yellowarse - Self serving, disruptive and uncooperative
6. William safire and Yellowarse - Little Hitler
7. Agoraphobic- Very capable and Successful
8. Selkirk, British Officials and Laksaboy - Reckless, Power Crazy, Bully, Unreasonable
9. Mahathir and Yellowarse - Big Frog in a small pond, Ambitious, Not satisfied
10. Tunku and Yellowarse - Actor
11. Frenchbriefs - Man ahead of his time
12. Frenchbriefs- Bullshitter, Psycho, Despot
13. Melzp- Power hungry, Bastard, Iron-fisted
14. Laksaboy - Wheelchair bound
15. Agoraphobic- Failed human being

 

[Asterix]

Chapter XVII of "the Prince": Whether it is Better to be Feared or Loved

And here comes in the question whether it is better to be loved rather than feared, or feared rather than loved. It might perhaps be answered that we should wish to be both; but since love and fear can hardly exist together, if we must choose between them, it is far safer to be feared than loved. For of men it may generally be affirmed, that they are thankless, fickle, false, studious to avoid danger, greedy of gain, devoted to you while you are able to confer benefits upon them, and ready, as I said before, while danger is distant, to shed their blood, and sacrifice their property, their lives, and their children for you; but in the hour of need they turn against you. The Prince, therefore, who without otherwise securing himself builds wholly on their professions is undone. For the friendships which we buy with a price, and do not gain by greatness and nobility of character, though they be fairly earned are not made good, but fail us when we have occasion to use them.

Moreover, men are less careful how they offend him who makes himself loved than him who makes himself feared. For love is held by the tie of obligation, which, because men are a sorry breed, is broken on every whisper of private interest; but fear is bound by the apprehension of punishment which never relaxes its grasp.

Nevertheless a Prince should inspire fear in such a fashion that if he do not win love he may escape hate. For a man may very well be feared and yet not hated, and this will be the case so long as he does not meddle with the property or with the women of his citizens and subjects.And if constrained to put any to death, he should do so only when there is manifest cause or reasonable justification. But, above all, he must abstain from the property of others. For men will sooner forget the death of their father than the loss of their patrimony. Moreover, pretexts for confiscation are never to seek, and he who has once begun to live by rapine always finds reasons for taking what is not his; whereas reasons for shedding blood are fewer, and sooner exhausted.

.....................

Returning to the question of being loved or feared, I sum up by saying, that since his being loved depends upon his subjects, while his being feared depends upon himself, a wise Prince should build on what is his own, and not on what rests with others. Only, as I have said, he must do his utmost to escape hatred.

Highly debatable. But obviously LKY agreed with the arguments that it is better to be feared. if he is still not senile, he probably knows how wrong he is as he is npot feared now and, in many eyes, he has been reduced to nothing

Whilst I prefer to read Machiavelli's Discourses
In which failed diplomat espoused noble causes
The Prince is indeed a gem and one of the few books
Which one must as Bacon says read carefully and digest

As a profit minded but nonetheless ethical Feringi
I confirm that human beings are indeed a wretched lot
For a Prince it indeed is better to be feared than loved
Should a gun be pointed and Prince must choose one

Father who aspires to be feared by his children
Is certainly not what Machiavelli meant to say
Prince must never allow fear to turn into hatred
I hate anyone who withholds my See Pee Elf

Old Fart did not fully comprehend Machiavelli's book
Fear is useful but in real life can be mixed with love
No gun was pointed at him to compel choice of one
And did many things which made Sinkies hate him

 

[frenchbriefs]

if he rather be feared than love then why he surround himself with so many por lumpas and lovers?why he wants so many people to idolise him and adore him?he should not care what people think right and be a solitary hero like batman.the truth is he is a coward and a insecure man.

 

[TracyTan866]

Whilst I prefer to read Machiavelli's Discourses
In which failed diplomat espoused noble causes
The Prince is indeed a gem and one of the few books
Which one must as Bacon says read carefully and digest

As a profit minded but nonetheless ethical Feringi
I confirm that human beings are indeed a wretched lot
For a Prince it indeed is better to be feared than loved
Should a gun be pointed and Prince must choose one

Father who aspires to be feared by his children
Is certainly not what Machiavelli meant to say
Prince must never allow fear to turn into hatred
I hate anyone who withholds my See Pee Elf

Old Fart did not fully comprehend Machiavelli's book
Fear is useful but in real life can be mixed with love
No gun was pointed at him to compel choice of one
And did many things which made Sinkies hate him

Well said. Another apt description - Failed Intellect

 

[TracyTan866]

Well said. Another apt description - Failed Intellect

People's description of LKY:

1. TracyTan866 - Unwise, Arrogant, Foolish
2. Laksaboy and Tunku- Unscrupulous, Lonely
3. po2wq- Mad, Tyrant
4. Yellowarse and Dr Poh- Political pimp
5. Tun Tan Siew Sin and Yellowarse - Self serving, disruptive and uncooperative
6. William safire and Yellowarse - Little Hitler
7. Agoraphobic- Very capable and Successful
8. Selkirk, British Officials and Laksaboy - Reckless, Power Crazy, Bully, Unreasonable
9. Mahathir and Yellowarse - Big Frog in a small pond, Ambitious, Not satisfied
10. Tunku and Yellowarse - Actor
11. Frenchbriefs - Man ahead of his time
12. Frenchbriefs- Bullshitter, Psycho, Despot
13. Melzp- Power hungry, Bastard, Iron-fisted
14. Laksaboy - Wheelchair bound
15. Agoraphobic- Failed human being
16. Asterix - Failed Intellect

 

[TracyTan866]

if he rather be feared than love then why he surround himself with so many por lumpas and lovers?why he wants so many people to idolise him and adore him?he should not care what people think right and be a solitary hero like batman.the truth is he is a coward and a insecure man.

Good question..Appropriate description - Coward and Insecure man

 

[TracyTan866]

Good question..Appropriate description - Coward and Insecure man

People's description of LKY:

1. TracyTan866 - Unwise, Arrogant, Foolish
2. Laksaboy and Tunku- Unscrupulous, Lonely
3. po2wq- Mad, Tyrant
4. Yellowarse and Dr Poh- Political pimp
5. Tun Tan Siew Sin and Yellowarse - Self serving, disruptive and uncooperative
6. William safire and Yellowarse - Little Hitler
7. Agoraphobic- Very capable and Successful
8. Selkirk, British Officials and Laksaboy - Reckless, Power Crazy, Bully, Unreasonable
9. Mahathir and Yellowarse - Big Frog in a small pond, Ambitious, Not satisfied
10. Tunku and Yellowarse - Actor
11. Frenchbriefs - Man ahead of his time
12. Frenchbriefs- Bullshitter, Psycho, Despot
13. Melzp- Power hungry, Bastard, Iron-fisted
14. Laksaboy - Wheelchair bound
15. Agoraphobic- Failed human being
16. Asterix - Failed Intellect
17. Frenchbriefs - Coward and Insecure man

 

[Asterix]

Well said. Another apt description - Failed Intellect

My take: Achieved absolute power (mainly because Sinkies are ball-less, he would have failed miserably even in a similarly small place like Hong Kong) but not lasting legacy = Prince who is all powerful when he is alive and kicking but when dead history will give him a harsh but correct judgement. Old Fart should have read the Prince TOGETHER with the Discourses and adapt to the circumstances which he finds himself in and the aims he wish to achieve (which I think includes lasting legacy). I read both books = Old Fart is not as smart as me But I am still powerless, must be because I am not unscrupulous enough.

 

[TracyTan866]

My take: Achieved absolute power (mainly because Sinkies are ball-less, he would have failed miserably even in a similarly small place like Hong Kong) but not lasting legacy = Prince who is all powerful when he is alive and kicking but when dead history will give him a harsh but correct judgement. Old Fart should have read the Prince TOGETHER with the Discourses and adapt to the circumstances which he finds himself in and the aims he wish to achieve (which I think includes lasting legacy). I read both books = Old Fart is not as smart as me But I am still powerless, must be because I am not unscrupulous enough.

Well said. I agree with you that LKY is not that smart.

 

[aurvandil]

As a single drop of water fills a bucket, so do small deeds of evil; as a single drop of water fills a bucket, so do small deeds of good.
~Buddha

Yes, no one fears LKY now. As LKY ruled based on fear, he is totally irrelevant now

 

[TracyTan866]

As a single drop of water fills a bucket, so do small deeds of evil; as a single drop of water fills a bucket, so do small deeds of good.
~Buddha

so do you think LKY fills the bucket with evil deeds or good deeds?

 

[aurvandil]

If the bucket is filled with good deeds, that will be genuine sadness over the passing of a good man.
If the bucket is filled with evil deeds, there will be great joy that an evil man has died.

Do you see great sadness or great joy?

so do you think LKY fills the bucket with evil deeds or good deeds?

 

[TracyTan866]

If the bucket is filled with good deeds, that will be genuine sadness over the passing of a good man.
If the bucket is filled with evil deeds, there will be great joy that an evil man has died.

Do you see great sadness or great joy?

I foresee genuine great joy when LKY dies.

How about you? Do you foresee Singaporeans genuinely rejoicing? or do you think Singaporeans will be sad?

 

[syed putra]

Given the chance, I thought all chinaman behave like this.

 

[TracyTan866]

Given the chance, I thought all chinaman behave like this.

If you truly think so, I feel sorry for you

 

[frenchbriefs]

If the bucket is filled with good deeds, that will be genuine sadness over the passing of a good man.
If the bucket is filled with evil deeds, there will be great joy that an evil man has died.

Do you see great sadness or great joy?

If u read the Machiavelli prince....u would know that man are fickle minded and superficial greedy of gain and devoted to you only

 

[aurvandil]

I think his passing will be similar to that of King Henry VIII. The following is an account of the funeral:

http://www.speroforum.com/a/KKFTBFR...e-death-and-burial-of-Henry-VIII#.VE3o2BZc-xU

It was over two weeks after his death before the great procession of Henry's body left Whitehall and Westminster towards Windsor. Not many people came out to pay their respects, and those who did so either greeted the coffin out of fear or a false sense of loyalty. Most of the mourners were paid to be there - they included Henry VIII's domestic staff, the boys who worked in his kitchens and the women who washed his laundry. Decked in specially made black outfits, these servants of the king walked with his body all the way to Windsor.

I foresee genuine great joy when LKY dies.

How about you? Do you foresee Singaporeans genuinely rejoicing? or do you think Singaporeans will be sad?

 

[TracyTan866]

If u read the Machiavelli prince....u would know that man are fickle minded and superficial greedy of gain and devoted to you only

do you think LKY is fickle minded and greedy?

 

[TracyTan866]

I think his passing will be similar to that of King Henry VIII. The following is an account of the funeral:

http://www.speroforum.com/a/KKFTBFR...e-death-and-burial-of-Henry-VIII#.VE3o2BZc-xU

I tend to agree with you. PA will send its "volunteers" and other GLCS eg NTUC, SLF, etc will send their staff. I wont be surprised if these "mourners" will be paid handsomely