HSR and RTS Discussion

[freekazoid]

BRT is a smart move....along with road infrastructure improvement...make sense.

RTS...JB simply dont have the density....

 

[eric3417]

Baby steps with BRT. Every bit of Improvement is a positive for Iskandar.
RTS-JB when population in Iskandar hit 3m more feasible.
Bcom a mini KL in 2030?

 

[cybermad]

But MY cars are cheap. Do they need the BRT ? Won't it become a white elephant ?

 

[eric3417]

Depends coz City JAMS and lack of parking.
Might even have ERP in future?
To promote the BRT.

 

[ECboy]

Most important is RTS from JB sentral to Woodlands then 2nd is intra-city transport.

HSR is wow factor project.

 

[snowbird]

But MY cars are cheap. Do they need the BRT ? Won't it become a white elephant ?

YES, NO , YES.

Take a good look at the current Bukit Changar hill which is supposed to be the proposed RTS station (you can have a very good view from the elevated CIQ overhead bridge towards City Square)
On any day, there are thousands of cars parked there, mostly belong to junior officers working in the CIQ (senior officers are allotted parking lots in building) and also another hundreds of cars illegally parked on the roads around the CIQ.
If only they can make this thousands of drivers and their passengers to switch to public transport, then whatever system implemented would be at least 50% successful.

 

[cow138]

Yup agree. More options is always better

 

[ECboy]

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se...to-be-signed-with-singapore-by-mid-2016-najib

Nice, but always talk only.


"Malaysia is expected to sign a memorandum of understanding (MOU) with Singapore by the middle of 2016 for the development of a high-speed rail (HSR) linking both countries, said Prime Minister Najib Razak."

 

[snowbird]

http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/se...to-be-signed-with-singapore-by-mid-2016-najib

Nice, but always talk only.


"Malaysia is expected to sign a memorandum of understanding (MOU) with Singapore by the middle of 2016 for the development of a high-speed rail (HSR) linking both countries, said Prime Minister Najib Razak."

SG and MY are expected to sign the MOU middle of this year but what is a MOU?
It is just a non binding agreement that both sides agree to work on the feasibility study of the project and perhaps come back within a certain time with a proposal where both sides can agree upon to proceed with the project.
Because it involves 2 countries, there will be many details that need to be agreed upon bilaterally so expect another year or two.
Then there will be this "Letter of Intend" sign by both sides to officially launch the commencement by calling tenders for various works.

Just lately, the projected Passenger Flow Volume (PFV) became an issue when it was reported that the PFV can reach to only about 18 million passengers per annum, and that is after 10 years in operation!
This is far too low!
Based on the same travel distance, Shanghai to Nanjing HSR, annual PFV of about 105 million passengers charges RM150 per trip
Taipei to Tainan HSR, annual PFV of 50 million charges RM180 per trip.
So with only 18 million projected passengers, how much will be the HSR fare to break even, don't even talk about making a profit.
Too low, lose money; to high, lose passengers.
Also, is this PFV of 18 million or about 1.5 million per month realistic ?
Are they including the maciks with her chicken, who are going to ditch her regular the bus trip and take the HSR from Batu Pahat to KL?

 

[freekazoid]

Just lately, the projected Passenger Flow Volume (PFV) became an issue when it was reported that the PFV can reach to only about 18 million passengers per annum, and that is after 10 years in operation!
This is far too low!
Based on the same travel distance, Shanghai to Nanjing HSR, annual PFV of about 105 million passengers charges RM150 per trip
Taipei to Tainan HSR, annual PFV of 50 million charges RM180 per trip.
So with only 18 million projected passengers, how much will be the HSR fare to break even, don't even talk about making a profit.
Too low, lose money; to high, lose passengers.
Also, is this PFV of 18 million or about 1.5 million per month realistic ?
Are they including the maciks with her chicken, who are going to ditch her regular the bus trip and take the HSR from Batu Pahat to KL?

Taipei to Tainan 320KM / Taipei population 2.6mil / Tainan population 1.9mil
- Significant lower than KL/SG by 3x

Shanghai to Nanjing 310KM / Shanghai population 14.3mil / Nanjing population 3.6mil
- Higher than KL/SG around 30% max

How does one come up with 18mil annual projection?

 

[Tekkun]

Personally, I think the HSR would most likely terminate at Nusajaya. That's how I see a MOU which is actually a Heads of Agreement, not a actual binding agreement. From the way things are moving, Najib will push for the HSR with or without Singapore. China has already committed and Malaysia has obligations to see through this contract to be given to China. Najib owe China this one.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

China Railway Plans Regional HQ in Malaysia, Eyes High-Speed Rail
Mon, 03/21/2016 - 8:56am by The Associated Press

China Railway Group Ltd. announced Monday it plans to open a $2 billion regional center in a transport hub in Kuala Lumpur that it hopes will give it an edge over rivals for a coveted contract for a high-speed rail linking the Malaysian capital and Singapore.

CREC, one of China's largest state-owned companies, will build its regional headquarters in Bandar Malaysia, a new 486-acre commercial and residential development in the city center where the proposed high-speed rail terminal will be located on the Malaysia end.

"Our regional center is here, not our competitors'. We find resources together with our local developer in infrastructure...I cannot find (anyone) who can match us," CREC General Manager Cai Zemin told a press conference after a ceremony at the Hilton Hotel that was attended by Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Abdul Razak and a host of Cabinet ministers.

 

[snowbird]

Taipei to Tainan 320KM / Taipei population 2.6mil / Tainan population 1.9mil
- Significant lower than KL/SG by 3x

Shanghai to Nanjing 310KM / Shanghai population 14.3mil / Nanjing population 3.6mil
- Higher than KL/SG around 30% max

How does one come up with 18mil annual projection?

This was reported to be provided by the Minister in the Prime Minister's Department Nancy Shukri that the estimated annual PFV of the HSR is estimated at 18 million.
I also wonder how she got those numbers.
SG population 5.5 mil / KL population 1.8 mil so how they justify 1.5 mil (18 mil /yr) passengers per month for the HSR?

 

[freekazoid]

This was reported to be provided by the Minister in the Prime Minister's Department Nancy Shukri that the estimated annual PFV of the HSR is estimated at 18 million.
I also wonder how she got those numbers.
SG population 5.5 mil / KL population 1.8 mil so how they justify 1.5 mil (18 mil /yr) passengers per month for the HSR?

The way i read the report, some dude made an assumption of 18mil. It doesn't add up at all....this is typical Malaysian politician talk.

Klang Valley population is 7.2mil....ever fast and furious too. That's partly why Singapore have to keep up.

 

[snowbird]

The way i read the report, some dude made an assumption of 18mil. It doesn't add up at all....this is typical Malaysian politician talk.

Klang Valley population is 7.2mil....ever fast and furious too. That's partly why Singapore have to keep up.

Yup, they need some good news to announce to the public, lately too much negative news on the PM.
They will never be able to tell how they arrive at 18 million PFV annually but will just bulldoze thru' with this report.
In MY anything can happen, some people can get a RM2.6 billions donation for nothing in return coming from a super duper rich faceless person.
Just 2 days ago, the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) Chairman (which he admitted) was found secretly deleting some vital information from the report on 1MDB without the knowledge of other committee members.

 

[ECboy]

HSR may begin ops in 2027
http://www.nst.com.my/news/2016/04/141321/hsr-may-begin-ops-2027


High-speed rail project timeline
http://www.nst.com.my/news/2016/04/141328/high-speed-rail-project-timeline

 

[FHBH12]

Upcoming Malaysia-Singapore high-speed rail sparks interest from train makers

Countries - including Japan, South Korea and China - have showcased their works in Malaysia, hoping to get selected to operate the upcoming service.

By Melissa Goh, Malaysia Bureau Chief, Channel NewsAsia
Posted 05 May 2016 18:00 Updated 05 May 2016 19:27

KUALA LUMPUR: Even before a Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) on the high-speed rail (HSR) is signed between Malaysia and Singapore later this year, countries are rushing to showcase their latest trains and technologies to the people who might travel on the super-fast service.

On Thursday (May 5) at an exhibition by Japan Rail in an upmarket mall in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysians young and old were excited to experience a Shinkansen bullet train simulator first hand.

Capable of traveling up to 350 km per hour, Japan is promoting its series E5 train that would significantly reduce travel time between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore to just 90 minutes.

Running since 2011, the E5 has a 100 per cent punctuality and zero fatality record.

"It’s up to Malaysians and Singaporeans (to decide),” said Dr Makio Miyagawa, the Japanese Ambassador to Malaysia. “We do not want to push hard. We hope the two countries will choose the best and safest system so it can be a show model to other Southeast Asian nations and to the whole world."

Beijing also harbours the same ambition. China Railway Group (CREC) is eager to showcase its technology on a global platform using the HSR as a platform. It is touted as the front runner, having invested heavily in Malaysia, from energy to integrated property development.

Late last year, China Railway together with its local joint-venture partner, Iskandar Waterfront Holdings acquired a 60 per cent stake in Bandar Malaysia, which houses the HSR terminus from state-owned 1 Malaysia Development Berhad (1MDB) for RM7.41 billion.

It has also announced a plan to build a US$2 billion commercial complex and moved its regional headquarters to Bandar Malaysia, one of 1MDB’s developments.

"Together with our local developer in infrastructure development, I can not find one who can match with us," said Cai Zemin, the general manager of CREC.

Apart from China and Japan, South Korea is also showing a strong interest in the HSR project. It is showcasing its high-speed rail system KTX, operated by Korea Railroad Corporation (Korail).

The promotional activities have generated a lot of enthusiasm among Malaysians.

“Safety is everything,” said Michael Yip, an engineer. “I hope the government will put government-to-government consideration second. Pricing is not everything; the technical track record is more important."

Both countries leaders are expected to sign the MOU during the annual retreat in Malaysia in September, before the signing of a bilateral agreement early next year.

The HSR is expected to have two different services operating on same gauge, but on a double track system, with a direct service straight into Singapore in just 90 minutes and another service with six stops between Kuala Lumpur, Seremban, Ayer Keroh, Batu Pahat, Muar and Nusajaya with a feeder train into Singapore.

- CNA/ek

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asiapacific/upcoming-malaysia/2759028.html

 

[ECboy]

"Singapore-JB cabbies call for brakes on touts"

http://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/transport/singapore-jb-cabbies-call-for-brakes-on-touts

There's so much demand for crossborder transport services. I was wondering is there such thing as a daily driver to fetch me to Raffles Place from JB Town? If not, then I might go buy a Alphard/Estima and hire a driver to drive me in. Then maybe find 2-3 execs and charge them S$75/return/day. Good idea?

 

[jasonjst]

"Singapore-JB cabbies call for brakes on touts"

http://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/transport/singapore-jb-cabbies-call-for-brakes-on-touts

There's so much demand for crossborder transport services. I was wondering is there such thing as a daily driver to fetch me to Raffles Place from JB Town? If not, then I might go buy a Alphard/Estima and hire a driver to drive me in. Then maybe find 2-3 execs and charge them S$75/return/day. Good idea?

$75/= a day x 30days = $2,250/= per pax . Why don't rent a room in SG instead ?

 

[mpan12]

Many are finding ways and means to save money by living in JB but working in SG while cutting short time of travel. I think there is totally no way out of this simply because we are talking about 2 different countries.

The only way this is possible is this scenario: Do away with the Customs check points. That means you don't need a passport to travel between SG and Johor. Build an MRT system that links from old JB to various parts of Iskandar.

We know the above is totally impossible.

I don't see how HSR or RTS can help boost the prospects of Singaporeans moving over to Johor to live. If you take the RTS, you still need time to travel to Woodlands from your workplace. Then you need to clear Customs. You are also likely to meet with lots of human traffic. So while you avoid the traffic jams at the Causeway, you now meet a new kind of jam -- human jam. Then when you reach JB, you still need transportation to reach your home. All in, this is going to take at least 1.5 hrs.

As for HSR, the price of ticket may not be cheap for the lower income workers to use it for everyday travel. Even if it is feasible for one to pay and use it everyday, the problems as explained above, will still be there. Your traveling time will not be shortened.

 

[Frodo]

Many are finding ways and means to save money by living in JB but working in SG while cutting short time of travel. I think there is totally no way out of this simply because we are talking about 2 different countries.

The only way this is possible is this scenario: Do away with the Customs check points. That means you don't need a passport to travel between SG and Johor. Build an MRT system that links from old JB to various parts of Iskandar.

We know the above is totally impossible.

I don't see how HSR or RTS can help boost the prospects of Singaporeans moving over to Johor to live. If you take the RTS, you still need time to travel to Woodlands from your workplace. Then you need to clear Customs. You are also likely to meet with lots of human traffic. So while you avoid the traffic jams at the Causeway, you now meet a new kind of jam -- human jam. Then when you reach JB, you still need transportation to reach your home. All in, this is going to take at least 1.5 hrs.

As for HSR, the price of ticket may not be cheap for the lower income workers to use it for everyday travel. Even if it is feasible for one to pay and use it everyday, the problems as explained above, will still be there. Your traveling time will not be shortened.

If I am not wrong, many people in Singapore also take more than an hour from their HDB to office each way using public transport. Crossing borders does have its hassles but it's a trade off that just have to be accepted. If cannot accept then should not move over.