Dr Allan Ooi's Obituary - Government's Policy

[laukk]

How the late Dr OOi could slipped out of the country when he is wanted for AWOL ?????? Can ICA throw some light on this ???? ICA always say that security is our concern especially after the mas selamat case which caused the daily massive jams at our borders but how late Dr Ooi able to slip through the network and landed in Australia ?????????

 

[tomasloh]

How the late Dr OOi could slipped out of the country when he is wanted for AWOL ?????? Can ICA throw some light on this ???? ICA always say that security is our concern especially after the mas selamat case which caused the daily massive jams at our borders but how late Dr Ooi able to slip through the network and landed in Australia ?????????

Good question asked.

Maybe members of Elite are treated differently from ordinary people. That is why there is always one law for the Rich and Powerful and one law for the General Public.

 

[apogee]

For the deceased, his act dies with him but his survivors suffers. If he had spared a thought for his survivors, he would not have done it despite the enormous amount of education that was poured in and to nurture him to be a scholar. There are always setbacks in life and it is how you face and handle it. It is understandable that his parents are bearing the brunt of his action.

But society and government has to take a public stand that they cannot celebrate and condone such an action. Imagine if we are in a war and the soldiers in the SAF instead of defending the country chose to commit suicide when they are confronted with the enemies and yet the SAF has to "celebrate" their death in the Obituary section as though they are national heroes.

The crime stays even if he is dead for history will always remember that the crime was committed by him. Decades and centuries later, history will still remember that he has committed a crime and there is no doubt about it. If he has descendents, they have to live with that fact.

I believe you have digress quite a lot from your original post. You had originally asked the rhetoric question, that is,"Why is Mindef Chief of various forces advertising in the Obituary Section of The Straits Times sending their condolences to the late Dr Ooi when he is a wanted criminal for AWOL in the army."

I was merely telling you that the condolences were not sent to the deceased but his parents and siblings. There was accolades or encomium for the deceased in those condolences. SAF did the right thing. We have to take care of the living who are innocent.

I cannot imagine any soldier would rather kill himself than join the battle. With due respect, your illlustration is a bit far fetched.

I do not see in any of the condolences that there is a celebration (?) and condonation of the suicide. It would have been ideal had he been persuaded by the thought that the survivours whol loved him woud suffer by his death and thereby refrain from committing suicide. Sadly, this has not been the case

 

[apogee]

There was accolades or encomium for the deceased in those condolences. SAF did the right thing. We have to take care of the living who are innocent.

Sorry typo error, the sentence should read:
"There was no accolades or encomium for the deceased in those condolences. SAF did the right thing. We have to take care of the living who are innocent."

 

[DerekDear]

Hello, Alex Ooi himself was charged and struck off the register by the Singapore Medical Council in 1991 for having sex with a patient. He subsequently appealed and quashed the conviction, but has been persona non grata since then.

Close friends know that he was guilty but got off on a technicality.

Aiyo... so many powderful doctors in singapore got away with that crap - only the stupid ones kena filmed (who was that?? in kembangan kena filmed having sex with his 25 yo personal assistant)....

Elite means... you get away with a lot of things. Still, Singapore is better than the places around us, where Elite (royal family etc) is really damn tokong, everything also can do...

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Are you trying to be facetious?

the late doc was a elite, he deserves a respectable send off. may he rest in peace.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Makes no difference. The questions still appear to be legitimate and deserve an answer. Also I would like to know who paid for those condolence messages? Mindef i.e. taxpayers $$$ or from private pockets?

This one from Scroobal is also relevant.

"Of all awol cases that resulted in a suicide, how many were provided with obituaries placed in the Press by SAF"

The condolences were sent to the parents and siblings and not to Dr Ooi. Dr Ooi has died. Whatever crime or quasi-crime he is alleged to have committed to have died with him. May he rest in peace.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Conflict and professional misconduct. Same for lawyers.

having sex with a patient wrong meh ?

 

[tomasloh]

I believe you have digress quite a lot from your original post. You had originally asked the rhetoric question, that is,"Why is Mindef Chief of various forces advertising in the Obituary Section of The Straits Times sending their condolences to the late Dr Ooi when he is a wanted criminal for AWOL in the army."

I was merely telling you that the condolences were not sent to the deceased but his parents and siblings. There was accolades or encomium for the deceased in those condolences. SAF did the right thing. We have to take care of the living who are innocent.

I cannot imagine any soldier would rather kill himself than join the battle. With due respect, your illlustration is a bit far fetched.

I do not see in any of the condolences that there is a celebration (?) and condonation of the suicide. It would have been ideal had he been persuaded by the thought that the survivours whol loved him woud suffer by his death and thereby refrain from committing suicide. Sadly, this has not been the case

I beg to disagree that I did not digress from what I had set out to ask what was the public policy. What I had merely done was to give examples and illustration to drive home my point. It may have been viewed otherwise by you but differences in interpretation of what I had said between you and me is understandable as views between us may differ.

The simple point is that the deceased serviceman had committed 2 criminal offences, that is, AWOL and suicide. Mindef is sending a wrong message to the public. Is Mindef going to publish condolences if assuming another several servicemen follow the same footstep as the late Dr Ooi. If so, aren't they "decorating" such act and condone their action. Public policy may dictate otherwise.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

You assume SAF is truly "enlightened" by this one episode. Me thinks to reach an objective opinion, SAF needs to answer the material questions raised above.

His family and their personal pain and suffering is a totally different issue altogether.

Is the policy of the Singapore Police Force a decent or correct policy? When someone commits suicide, it means that for him the world has come to an end and life is of no meaning. It may not be real to others but it is definitely real to the deceased. I am glad the SAF are more enlightened. The police should revisit their policy.

The people that suffer are the living and not the dead. Here, my heart goes out to the parents and the siblings. They have to live with their loss every day and for a very long time.

The police can keep whatever records they want and for how long they wish. It makes no difference. When a criminal dies, you can no longer prosecute him. His crime is "interred (cremated) with his bones". The police should also revisit this policy, if one exists.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Probably left the country before he was declared AWOL. Same as crooks like lawyer Rasif and the stupid Cortina watch thief.

How the late Dr OOi could slipped out of the country when he is wanted for AWOL ?????? Can ICA throw some light on this ???? ICA always say that security is our concern especially after the mas selamat case which caused the daily massive jams at our borders but how late Dr Ooi able to slip through the network and landed in Australia ?????????

 

[tomasloh]

You assume SAF is truly "enlightened" by this one episode. Me thinks to reach an objective opinion, SAF needs to answer the material questions raised above.

His family and their personal pain and suffering is a totally different issue altogether.

The whole issue was whether SAF did the right thing by publishing condolences in the newspaper for someone who had gone AWOL and committed suicide while still in service.

Porfirio has rightly pointed out that whether his family suffers or not is a totally different issue from what I had asked originally, that is, "[COLOR="_______"]Why is Mindef Chief of various forces advertising in the Obituary Section of The Straits Times sending their condolences to the late Dr Ooi when he is a wanted criminal for AWOL in the army[/COLOR]."

 

[DerekDear]

The whole issue was whether SAF did the right thing by publishing condolences in the newspaper for someone who had gone AWOL and committed suicide while still in service.

Porfirio has rightly pointed out that whether his family suffers or not is a totally different issue from what I had asked originally, that is, "[COLOR="_______"]Why is Mindef Chief of various forces advertising in the Obituary Section of The Straits Times sending their condolences to the late Dr Ooi when he is a wanted criminal for AWOL in the army[/COLOR]."

Eh.... if you are so damned concerned, instead of blind leading the blind here, why donch you email: [email protected]

For all you know, he may give a reply better than his brother Teo Lockpin

 

[apogee]

The whole issue was whether SAF did the right thing by publishing condolences in the newspaper for someone who had gone AWOL and committed suicide while still in service.

Porfirio has rightly pointed out that whether his family suffers or not is a totally different issue from what I had asked originally, that is, "[COLOR="_______"]Why is Mindef Chief of various forces advertising in the Obituary Section of The Straits Times sending their condolences to the late Dr Ooi when he is a wanted criminal for AWOL in the army[/COLOR]."

What is the purpose of a condolence? Is it not to give comfort to the family? The deceased does not need any comfort. I think we need to revisit the law of treating a sucidie or attempted suicide as a crime. No one love to commit suicide. No one commit suicide out of choice. For a person to take his own life, he must really be pushed to the edge.

I agree with you completely that SAF should now come out and state that their policy is to advertise condolences for all soldiers who died. There should be no discrimatination. If they had publish condolences discrimately, then they are wrong. But it does not mean that they should continue to be wrong. They did right by advertising the condonlences in Dr Ooi's case. Let's hope that this is the beginning of the 1st step in the right direction. To me, the SAF should go further and render all help to the breaving family, if this has not already done. Dr Ooi's family may be able to take care of themselves, but there are many who do not.

 

[tomasloh]

Eh.... if you are so damned concerned, instead of blind leading the blind here, why donch you email: [email protected]

For all you know, he may give a reply better than his brother Teo Lockpin

You don't need to email to the minister as they should be aware of it by now as there are more than enough people in cyberspace to feedback to them information concerning the government and what people have to say.

 

[tomasloh]

What is the purpose of a condolence? Is it not to give comfort to the family? The deceased does not need any comfort. I think we need to revisit the law of treating a sucidie or attempted suicide as a crime. No one love to commit suicide. No one commit suicide out of choice. For a person to take his own life, he must really be pushed to the edge.

I agree with you completely that SAF should now come out and state that their policy is to advertise condolences for all soldiers who died. There should be no discrimatination. If they had publish condolences discrimately, then they are wrong. But it does not mean that they should continue to be wrong. They did right by advertising the condonlences in Dr Ooi's case. Let's hope that this is the beginning of the 1st step in the right direction. To me, the SAF should go further and render all help to the breaving family, if this has not already done. Dr Ooi's family may be able to take care of themselves, but there are many who do not.

I have said from the outset what is the public policy of the government in cases of this nature where a serviceman commits suicide. Should the government advertise in the Obituary for these servicemen.

I am strongly against it but I know you beg to differ. That is all right. There must be a public stand on such an issue and once a decision is made on such policy then we have to live by it whether we like it or not until some time when those policy are being overturned.

I am arguing that we cannot condone such an act done by the late Dr Ooi albeit that the advertisement was meant for the parents and siblings of the deceased. It remains a fact that the subject matter (that is, the deceased) is a cause for concern as he had AWOL and committed suicide.

I understand that you had felt emotional about the issue from the way you presented your case but take a step back and look at it from a purely public perspective and what the general public would have perceived if someone had told them that a serviceman had gone AWOL and committed suicide and yet given recognition by the Chief of Forces in the Obituary and see what their initial reaction is.

Ask those that have served in the army and you see what they have to say about it. We have not heard of cases where Mindef puts up an Obituary for serviceman who had gone AWOL and comitted suicide. Cite me a case where they had.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Calling Col Darius, calling Col Darius

I It remains a fact that the subject matter (that is, the deceased) is a cause for concern as he had AWOL and committed suicide.

take a step back and look at it from a purely public perspective and what the general public would have perceived if someone had told them that a serviceman had gone AWOL and committed suicide and yet given recognition by the Chief of Forces in the Obituary and see what their initial reaction is.

Ask those that have served in the army and you see what they have to say about it. We have not heard of cases where Mindef puts up an Obituary for serviceman who had gone AWOL and comitted suicide. Cite me a case where they had.

 

[SAMURAISAN]

Eh... Dr

This is called "cover your own backside"... :oIo: Common tactic by small fries. Costs a few bucks to put a condolence notice, cheap cheap.

Actually no need to cover whole backside.....just protect the asshole by leaving one's finger inside so no one can creep up behind you to take advantage.

Thus CYA has become more efficient with PYA (plug your asshole).

But as usual, fucking SAF behind time.

 

[DerekDear]

You don't need to email to the minister as they should be aware of it by now as there are more than enough people in cyberspace to feedback to them information concerning the government and what people have to say.

Are you kidding? Such feedback never reaches them.... you think the ka kia dare to speak up....

:p

 

[tomasloh]

Are you kidding? Such feedback never reaches them.... you think the ka kia dare to speak up.... :p

There is a difference between being aware and chose to be ignorant when aware of it. Perhaps both eyes and ears are closed for that matter.