Dr Allan Ooi’s farewell letter and last word before his death: Questions for SAF

[sage]

During Dr Ooi's time, only President Scholars could elect to study medicine and even so only at NUS, not overseas. However there was an exception, the SAF medicine 'scholarship'. Typical medical students would not give that a 2nd glance when it came with a 12 yr bond. The term "scholarship" is simply misleading. It is false prestige. Just mere sponsorship. Every bright medical student knows and shuns that. If SAF need more regular doctors why can't they compete in the market and pay for them.

 

[myo539]

Being a prisoner in SINgapore, having to serve National Service, looses opportunities & then having to work & serve time in reservist, and looses evern more opportunites, to the ever-growing( at that time) tide of Malaysian FT's.....

My friend, felt SIngapore was a prison, left & never looked back; fortunately he kept a level head & did not die like Dr. Allan Ooi....

I simply don't dig it when thousands and thousands of Singaporeans can endure the rigor of NS and took it as a passage of a young man life and an obligation to defend their own people and country and why this elite cannot.

Is it a case of having too much of a privileged and good life as a young man as he came from a rich family - is it a case of having too much cake and having to eat all of it?

Shouldn't his rich family forsake the expensive scholarship (free university fees, guaranteed jobs, through-train%

 

[myo539]

Being a prisoner in SINgapore, having to serve National Service, looses opportunities & then having to work & serve time in reservist, and looses evern more opportunites, to the ever-growing( at that time) tide of Malaysian FT's.....

My friend, felt SIngapore was a prison, left & never looked back; fortunately he kept a level head & did not die like Dr. Allan Ooi....

I simply don't dig it when thousands and thousands of Singaporeans can endure the rigor NS and took it as an obligation to defend our own people and country and why this elite cannot.

Is it a case of having too much of a privileged and good life as a young man as he came from a rich family - is it a case of having too much cake and having to eat it all of it?

Shouldn't his rich family forsake the expensive scholarship (free university fees, guarantee jobs, through-train to top government jobs, high salary etc) that is so coveted by many poor but talented Singaporeans?

I think the ordinary men-in-the-street can endure more hardship than the privileged ones. Something must be wrong with upbringing rather than the society or country they live in.

The Japanese commit harakiri because of its value system - a code of Samurai honour if not bravery - and not as a way to escape a situation of mundane life.

 

[makapaaa]

The LSA(Med) is a 12 yr bond unfortunately.

6 yrs of medical specialty training (3 yrs BST & 3 yrs AST) mixed in with 6 years of service with the SAF...and any further specialty training (overseas traineeship etc) you undertake will extend your service length...unfortunately most 18 yr olds don't understand what they're getting into when they signed up for it...I know of a MO that's bonded for 18 yrs...

But the thing is, all NUS-trained doctors are bonded to MOH for 5 yrs as well (3 yrs for guys, with the remaining 2 yrs service in NS as MOs)...so really, is there any difference?

While still paid less than FTrash docs who can hardly speak Engrish?

 

[DerekDear]

While still paid less than FTrash docs who can hardly speak Engrish?

How did you arrive at that conclusion - its almost completely baseless

Those idiot china and pinoy doctors are clinical associates - doctors in their own cuntries, but paid even less than a singaporean houseman. Looks like they are hired to cover some form of shortage. They are not given on-call allowance, not given opportunity to specialise.

substantiate your points before trying to mislead others, or you end up sounding like a fcuking idiot who deserves to be paid less than a bangla.

 

[Nice-Gook]

I
Shouldn't his rich family forsake the expensive scholarship (free university fees, guaranteed jobs, through-train%

<style></style>Well that depends on the definition of scholarship.If scholarships like say Nobel prices are awarded for achievements than it should come without strings attached.Nobel price is awarded for what you have already achieved.So an award is a recognition of your achievements.Similarly many scholarships in many countries are awarded for scholars achievements.Why even in Singapore too.Foreigners are indeed awarded bond free scholarships.

But if scholarships are given on the basis that I give you something and in return you must give me back something than its a contractual obligation.Allan falls under this category.If that is so why must the onus be placed on a person morality to accept or not ,Based on his or her family means?If at all a means test is to be done for qualification of scholarship than it squarely falls on the government.

This government restricted the intake of medical students based on their policy.And because of that this government found few qualified doctors wanting to work long years in SAF.One reap what one sow.Allan is a victim of this governments mismanagement.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

There appears to be too much hearsay, half truths, speculation and conjecture in this case. I for one would like to see an independent black and white answer, one that is neither pro nor anti Ooi.

yes whether its a fact or not only some1 in the medical community would be able to answer.!

Life is dynamic and yes we all change in outlook whether at 18, 27, 38, 48 etc. However on this particular issue of Ooi and his SAF scholarship/bond; because present generations Y, Z and beyond appear more precocious and knowledgeable due to reasons which I have already elaborated on coupled by the fact that Oooi comes from a savvy sophisticated background, I do not think being young, stupid and impulsive would make for reasonable excuses in Ooi's case. Ooi had a free choice, more so than others because of his savvy sophiscated background.

as for age, let me ask you, compared to when you were 18, would you say you are mentally and emotionally different now? i know for one that at the age of 18 'independent due diligence' hardly registered in my mind. put another way, i was young an stupid at age 18 and im sure lots of others were too!

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Sorry but it is you who are the confused misconceived one, totally detracting from the relevant issue at hand i.e. Ooi's freedom of choice viz his SAF scholarship.

The criteria of selection for the SAF scholarship has nothing whatsoever to do with the the relevant issue at hand.

But let me address this point in any event. You appear to think that scholarships should be restricted to one's socio economic class which is a logically flawed view. The logical objective criteria for scholarships should be based on a candidate's academic aptitude and ability regardless of the candidate's socio economic background. You are confusing a scholarship with a bursary. Bursaries are restricted based on socio economic means testing and the rationale behind this right, to assist the lower classes in education to get a leg up in society . The rationale behind scholarships however is totally different, it is meant to attract the best and brightest academically regardless of background. So you are misconceived to assert that there is a "morality" issue in the first place. There is no "onus" on the rich to decline vying for scholarships because of the rationale behind scholarships which I mentioned above.

<style></style>You appear confused.Let me rephrase and spell it out.Why qualify Allan for scholarship or similarly rich people.You place the onus on the morality of rich people not to take that choice.I am asking why give that choice to rich people since they have deep pockets.I am simply saying why must PAP give the rich people that choice in the first place.

Why do I ask this ?Simple ! Because by not giving a choice of a scholarship to rich people destroys your argument that because Allan is rich he can blah,blah blah and therefore the onus/choice is entirely his not to accept scholarship.

Let me spell it out once more.Allan and people of his ilk are not disadvantaged because the choice of scholarship is not offered to them.Therefore your argument that . " is he obliged/forced/coerced to accept the scholarship/"free lunch" or does he have a free choice" ...is untenable.

Why give free food to the full fed?

 

[Nice-Gook]

Life is dynamic and yes we all change in outlook ............. Ooi's case. Ooi had a free choice, more so than others because of his savvy sophiscated background.

Go and read this........
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question
Begging the question

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


http://actionskeptics.blogspot.com/2006/09/circular-reasoning.html
Circular logic is a subset of the fallacy known as "begging the question," wherein one posits an argument that assumes its conclusion in its premises. Circular logic is basically an explicit form of begging the question: it is immediately obvious that the conclusion is assumed in the premises. An argument that begs the question implicity is the Ontological Argument for God's existence, first put forward by St. Anselm in the 11th century, after a sort of epiphany on his part. It is, basically:

1. God is the greatest possible being.
2. It is greater to exist than not to exist. <hr width="15%" align="left">
3. God exists.

1. Zombies are the coolest possible beings.
2. It is cooler to exist than not to exist. <hr width="15%" align="left">
3. Zombies exist.

I just did the same thing. I defined zombies as extant creatures (because it's definitely cooler to exist than the other option) and then used that to try to prove that zombies exist in reality. It's just silly. Bobby Henderson even offers an ontological argument for the existence of the FSM in His Noodliness' Gospel.

1. All mammals are carnivores.
2. Lions are mammals. <hr width="15%" align="left">
3. Lions are carnivores.

The argument is valid and the conclusion is true. It is, however, a transparently bad argument. The first premise is not itself true. Many mammals are herbivores or omnivores. That the argument is unsound, however, says nothing about the truth value of its conclusion.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Forumers can decide on "non sequitur", you or me

<style></style>If you believe your speculations has logical basis..Than I cannot convert you.Others would call it circular logic.

 

[Nice-Gook]

You appear to think that scholarships should be restricted to one's socio economic class which is a logically flawed view. The logical objective criteria for scholarships should be based on a candidate's academic aptitude and ability regardless of the candidate's socio economic background.

Read my reply to myq539.Perhaps you should talk less and listen more.:p

Quote:
<table width="100%" border="0" cellpadding="6" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset ;"> Originally Posted by myo539
I
Shouldn't his rich family forsake the expensive scholarship (free university fees, guaranteed jobs, through-train%
</td> </tr> </tbody></table>
<style></style>

Well that depends on the definition of scholarship.If scholarships like say Nobel prices are awarded for achievements than it should come without strings attached.Nobel price is awarded for what you have already achieved.So an award is a recognition of your achievements.Similarly many scholarships in many countries are awarded for scholars achievements.Why even in Singapore too.Foreigners are indeed awarded bond free scholarships.

But if scholarships are given on the basis that I give you something and in return you must give me back something than its a contractual obligation.Allan falls under this category.If that is so why must the onus be placed on a person morality to accept or not ,Based on his or her family means?If at all a means test is to be done for qualification of scholarship than it squarely falls on the government.

This government restricted the intake of medical students based on their policy.And because of that this government found few qualified doctors wanting to work long years in SAF.One reap what one sow.Allan is a victim of this governments mismanagement.
<!-- / message --> <!-- controls -->

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Hope he is doing ok in the real world

Mavis......!

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

It is even better nowadays for bright able students as there are numerous lucrative non government scholarships up for grabs that come with no bonds/strings attached. The choices are quite amazing.

I still cannot understand why some Singaporeans associate scholarship with family hardship. I suspect in the early years, top students tend to be from humble backgrounds while rich kids tended to coast thru life and the local press played up the humble and lowly parents bit. With scholarships now providing doorway to lucrative careers in civil sevice and GLC and giving priority to political office even the rich have decided to join the gravy train.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Again I say look at the case of Singapore's "Mr Lasik" who was also on an SAF medical scholarship and even appears to have got his specialist opthamology qualifications while in the SAF. Ooi could well have taken a leaf from his book.

There is more to this than meets the eye.

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

BS.....

[/FONT]

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

I suggest you go look up "non sequitur" instead

Go and read this........

 

[Porfirio Rubirosa]

Forumers can draw their own conclusions

Read my reply to myq539.Perhaps you should talk less and listen more.

 

[scroobal]

It is even better nowadays for bright able students as there are numerous lucrative non government scholarships up for grabs that come with no bonds/strings attached. The choices are quite amazing.

Yes. very true.

 

[scroobal]

Again I say look at the case of Singapore's "Mr Lasik" who was also on an SAF medical scholarship and even appears to have got his specialist opthamology qualifications while in the SAF. Ooi could well have taken a leaf from his book.

Even Philip Yeo's nemsis managed to wangle some perks before he got too greedy. I know of chaps that asked for the moon and got close to it including atatchements that are more bthan a year in a beautiful city and with a large MNC.

 

[harlow111]

Just think for yourself, use your brain and take responsibility for your actions and choices that you make in your life, do not look towards blaming others and finding easy scapegoats and live in self-denial.

Just to side track, you've described Australian mentality right down to the core.
Australians do not use their brains, are irresponsible and unaccountable for their actions and choices they make, always looking to blame others and finding easy scapegoats when things go wrong, living in self-denial.
Don't believe? Go live there for a few years and observe the locals and culture.