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MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial....

TopSage

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Since 2004, people ask govt to consider market test for employers who claim they need to
hire foreigners PAP refused, deny there is a problem. In the mean time, the number of
foreigners at workplace increased. Culturally similar and working in teams, a foreign worker
from a particular country will prefer to work with others from the same place, once one
becomes supervisor, slowly they will phase out Singaporeans by giving poor assessment
or by overloading them. If the Singaporean complains, he will just say the person is
incompetent and incapable. Over time the claim will be cannot find suitable Singaporeans.
Singaporeans react by moving away from certain jobs some of the very good high paying ones
to employment sectors still left with Singaporeans.

When the problem become severe and obvious in 2013, 9 years after people warned of such a
situation. MOM minister tries to do something. That something is somewhat of a half-measure
known as Tripartite Guidelines on Fair Employment Practices.
The advertisement must be open to Singaporeans, comply with the Tripartite Guidelines on Fair Employment Practices, and run for at least 14 calendar days.

Small firms with 25 or fewer employees, and those jobs which pay a fixed monthly salary of S$12,000 and above, will be exempted from the advertising requirement for practical reasons, MOM said

This half-measure will be guaranteed to fail because companies no longer want to hire Singaporeans and Singaporeans have to a certain extent do not want to be hired in jobs now dominated by foreigners. In the 9 years the govt did nothing, foreigners were promoted, groomed for higher positions of project leaders, supervisors, managers etc. It is as ineffective as the govt's previous measure to force companies not to put out adverts for PRs and foreigners only - this simply waste the time of Singaporeans job applicants who apply and just get their resumes thrown in the dustbin.

The continued failure of govt to grasp the problems as the deepen. Earlier when common sense measures could have had an effect, they chose to do nothing. At a time when harsher measures are needed, they choose to implement ineffective approaches. The problem will become unsolvable because of govt incompetence - sector by sector, Singaporeans will pushed out and lose their skills and you become totally dependent on foreigners. Its a vicious cycle.

Every step of the way the PAP govt has been behind the curve, causing the loss of good quality jobs and opportunities for Singaporeans. They fail to understand the human dynamics in play. When start to see data they cannot dney (example is 95% of the foreign staff in a bank came from the same country), they step in with half-measures that employers can easily circumvent allowing the situation to harm the interests of Singaporeans.

They then turn around to say Singaporeans demanding more from the govt do not understand the situation well and the repucussions. We understand fully where the PAP govt policy on this will take us - that is why we see no choice in this late hour other than more drastic measures and curbs to reverse this ever deteriorating situation. 9 years ago, the PAP was warned and 9 years later they are still badly behind the curve...yet they are surpriised they keep losing support and votes. Has there ever been another group of leaders that have been so lost for so long? In a truly democratic country they would have voted out long time ago....yet these elitist leaders who considered themselves the best of the best people for the job don't understand they are on borrowed time and the patience of the people has run out.
 
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enterprise2

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

That's the problem!! They r behind the curve in many things but the local media will publish they r ahead or we r different ... Etc!!
 

Equalisation

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

That's the problem!! They r behind the curve in many things but the local media will publish they r ahead or we r different ... Etc!!

Definitely.

Just look at how they suddenly change their policy few years ago by not giving us back all OUR hard-earned CPF money at age 55 !:mad:

For us ordinary citizens, it is blood and sweat money !:mad:
 

Satyr

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

Why is it foreigners were promoted in the first place ? Singaporeans do not want to accept responsibility and if they do, they are extremely calculative. They do not seem to to understand that seniority and higher pay implies higher dedication to the goals of the company. They are also risk averse , not wanting to try jobs with higher pay but possibility it might not work out. It is natural that once the foreigners become managers they will bring in their own kind. For years Singapore companies have managers who hired only people culturally similar to them. I have observed this all as a Singaporean myself. The whiney tone in this forum is symptomatic of Singaporeans at large. If a foreigner sets up home here and has a family he has to earn as much as a Singaporean. He cannot be cheaper in the long run. Perhaps at entry level they are a little cheaper. The panic stricken mode that the MOM is in now is inconveniencing many companies. Alot of them are moving whatever they can overseas. Once they have this facility to do work anywhere, they will not rarely come back to Singapore.
 
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johnny333

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

I suspect that the PAP is only doing something about this because "some" Sporeans voted in more opposition.

Just imagine how much harder the PAP would work for Sporeans if they only had 49% of the vote. :wink:
 

rushifa666

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

none of this justifies voting against your interests. the rich are a minority in any country. the poor will always be hit the hardest. their jobs will be the first to be taken away. and yet look at how the idiots vote. i dont mind them getting their just rewards. the problem is they are pulling the country down
 

winnipegjets

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

If those idiots in MOM have any love for the country, they would have done everything possible to look after the interests of sinkees. But these civil servants don't give a damn.
 

Nik1971

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

Sage, what's your take on blumont ?
 

SgParent

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

i'd like to think the white scums deliberately allowed cheapskate employers to exploit workers, local or foreign, by depressing salary so that singapore could continue to compete based on white scums' low tech low pay economy strategy.

the result of more and more cheaperest foreigners are just coincident.... the fact that we have insufficient infrastructure, housing, etc, etc suggests that the white scums never really plan/expect for the ever increasing foreigner population
 

makapaaa

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

In the 9 years the govt did nothing, foreigners were promoted, groomed for higher positions of project leaders, supervisors, managers etc.

=>

60% Empty Head: No problem lah as long as my HDB flat value appreciates. *hee*hee*

40%: How does this help your children who need to buy their own flats eventually?

60% Empty Head: Ya hor...*scratch head*

40%: So, do you still want more of the same come 2016 GE? Do you want to vote for change?!

*cling clang*

60%: Oops! What noise is that?

40%: Your balls droppped lah!

60%: Mai kar lee gong liao! You make me look like a fool! *chey*
 
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I_Hate_Pappies

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Asset
Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

In the 9 years the govt did nothing, foreigners were promoted, groomed for higher positions of project leaders, supervisors, managers etc.

=>

60% Empty Head: No problem lah as long as my HDB flat value appreciates. *hee*hee*

40%: How does this help your children who need to buy their own flats eventually?

60% Empty Head: Ya hor...*scratch head*

40%: So, do you still want more of the same come 2016 GE? Do you want to vote for change?!

*cling clang*

60%: Oops! What noise is that?

40%: Your balls droppped lah!

60%: Mai kar lee gong liao! You make me look like a fool! *chey*

makapaaa making a joke? Rare........ :biggrin:
 

kezgtree

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

I suspect that the PAP is only doing something about this because "some" Sporeans voted in more opposition.

Just imagine how much harder the PAP would work for Sporeans if they only had 49% of the vote. :wink:


.....what about< 49%...I'm just wondering???the ground sentiment have not been favorable to MIW lately if u have read into a lot of local forums
 

johnny333

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

.....what about< 49%...I'm just wondering???the ground sentiment have not been favorable to MIW lately if u have read into a lot of local forums


When was the last time you heard anyone saying anything positive of LHL:confused:
LHL doesn't have much support from Sporeans. The real power is still with the old fart.
I think true change will only take place when he ups the lorry. His death will also start the infighting within the party.
 

rushifa666

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

why do you think the old guard were removed one by one? Anyone heard of the famous slap he gave dhanabalan. Is that true? if so he has even more enemies that we thought
 

DuYunQi

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Asset
Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

I would say sage posted some rather lob-sided view on what the situation has become.

Not all SG ppl are risk-averse.. they are risk-unaware.. because the pappies have inculcated such into almost every generation till this date.

Their plans were to make all SG ppl FOLLOW a "certain path".. and if one "strayed" from the path they set before you.. that one would be cast as a non-believer.. an outcast.. an anomaly.. something weird and to be scrutinized by all.

Look at how the political scene was "managed". If you were not supporting of pappies in like 20 years back.. you run the risk of being seen as someone who was "rocking the boat".

But.. as time went on.. pappies changed tunes... again and again.. what was once the "path".. is now "wiped clean".. and they seem to have this "new approach" every so often... making me feel that technology should be looking to them for ideas on how to make ppl chase the innovations.

When cheap labour was the "calling".. and when ppl spotted some uneasy changes that resulted from this influx.. what did pappies do? NOTHING!!

Until.. at the GE 2011.. when their average.. and more importantly, a GRC was taken from them.. that they began to try to find out what went wrong.

Simple to all, but much complicated to them.. foreign workers cannot vote.. unless they are citizens... so.. having mre of them DOES NOTHING for their voting averages.. which is why I suspect they pulled out the white paper.. so "tell all" that they are bringing in "new citizens".. these lot.. since they are citizens.. CAN VOTE.. but maybe.. and I am guessing here.. maybe the new citizens who have already arrived in SG.. also face the same thing as the local born and raised SG ppl.. for they too have to compete with "cheap foreign talent"

But guess what? I'm thinking alot of them can actually go back to their birth countries.. and DITCH the SG citizenship that was "handed to them".

It is no secret that ppl like to mix with the same group.. for familiarity.. for simple communication, same cultural origins. It's so much easier if you speak Singlish with another SG person.. then to try to talk to a foreigner.. why does MNCs bring in their own ppl to fill upper and even middle management roles in other countries?

But.. the FACT still remains.. that the numbers of foreigners have gotten out of control.. be it cos of cheaper wages.. or because of a foreign middle management hiring more of the same kind. It's just too many now.. and the social backlash is hitting hard at pappies.

With nowhere to turn.. I guess pappies had to kowtow a little.. and try to do SOMETHING.. or be seen as the lousy-good-for-nothing ministry that has expensive public servants but does nothing for SG ppl.

Still.. I feel it is too little.. and far far too late.. as the numbers now are really staggering.. and these measures are but a slight tap on the wrist for employers who might still continue with their wilful ways.
 

Hans168

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

That's the problem!! They r behind the curve in many things but the local media will publish they r ahead or we r different ... Etc!!

Invert or rotate the curve n behind becomes ahead//////////////////
 

bryanlim1972

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

you are talking about a small segment of society. the few problematic singaporeans you encounter does not mean all are like that.

foreigners were brought in to appease business owners. with high rents, the businesses needed cheap labour to survive.

now the working class is getting its act together to vote against the business owners.

Why is it foreigners were promoted in the first place ? Singaporeans do not want to accept responsibility and if they do, they are extremely calculative. They do not seem to to understand that seniority and higher pay implies higher dedication to the goals of the company. They are also risk averse , not wanting to try jobs with higher pay but possibility it might not work out. It is natural that once the foreigners become managers they will bring in their own kind. For years Singapore companies have managers who hired only people culturally similar to them. I have observed this all as a Singaporean myself. The whiney tone in this forum is symptomatic of Singaporeans at large. If a foreigner sets up home here and has a family he has to earn as much as a Singaporean. He cannot be cheaper in the long run. Perhaps at entry level they are a little cheaper. The panic stricken mode that the MOM is in now is inconveniencing many companies. Alot of them are moving whatever they can overseas. Once they have this facility to do work anywhere, they will not rarely come back to Singapore.
 
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cunnosieur

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

The advertisement must be open to Singaporeans, comply with the Tripartite Guidelines on Fair Employment Practices, and run for at least 14 calendar days.

Small firms with 25 or fewer employees, and those jobs which pay a fixed monthly salary of S$12,000 and above, will be exempted from the advertising requirement for practical reasons, MOM said

BIG LOOP HOLE ALL OF YOU DIDNT SPOT....

1) How many jobs are there that pays $12k above in current market?

2) $11,999 can siam MOM requirements to place ad with WDA.

3) Also, what about ads for jobs below $12k?

The database should be for all FT jobs, regardless of pay, starting from for Q1, EP1 and EP2 passes.

This is clearly a useless wayang measure. They can bring in another 1 mllion FTs with jobs paying at $11,999 and below.

Also, what's the hurry to increase the population blindly?
With the current global economic slowdown, we can cut down on the lists of 3rd world sources unis (eg: India, Myanmar and China, say top 20 only). However, say, Chinese and Indians from accredited US, UK and Australia can still be considered. Usually, these people are the better ones and well-off in their own countries and the better "talents".
 
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Poomer

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Re: MOM trying to fix problems but already far behind the curve due to yrs of denial.

BIG LOOP HOLE ALL OF YOU DIDNT SPOT....

1) How many jobs are there that pays $12k above in current market?

2) $11,999 can siam MOM requirements to place ad with WDA.

3) Also, what about ads for jobs below $12k?

The database should be for all FT jobs, regardless of pay, starting from for Q1, EP1 and EP2 passes.

This is clearly a useless wayang measure. They can bring in another 1 mllion FTs with jobs paying at $11,999 and below.

Also, what's the hurry to increase the population blindly?
With the current global economic slowdown, we can cut down on the lists of 3rd world sources unis (eg: India, Myanmar and China, say top 20 only). However, say, Chinese and Indians from accredited US, UK and Australia can still be considered. Usually, these people are the better ones and well-off in their own countries and the better "talents".

Wayang measure agreed, 2 weeks advertising period is like a cooling in period for buying a house. But I think they mean EP jobs paying less than $12k must advertise for Singaporeans, not more than $12k. I agree with the reasoning as the $12k FT is likely worth his wages as he offers companies something that locals cannot, that is usually an angmoh with a good network, yes let's face it racial discrimination still exists even at the highest levels. Most angmoh CEOs will not take their asian counterparts seriously, preference is to deal with another white man.
 
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