Australia or New Zealand? v.s Singapore

[iamtalkinglah]

Hi brothers!

The internet is full of information on what I am going to ask. But I do prefer to learn from first hand personal experience.

We all know that Auz and NZ offers better working hours and cheaper housing & cars. Their new year's break could be stretch to almost a month! However their tax rate is extremely high for higher income earners.

Question:
1) Will you be financially worse off then if you have stayed in Singapore?
2) If yes, do you in your opinion, think that the quality of life (or what other factors) outweighs the financial lost?

There is this comment "NZ is underpopulated so it lacks critical mass. That's why economically, it can't keep up with other countries like the US and Canada.

Question:
1) Do you agree with this comment? If not, why not?
I have been told that NZ's economy "depends on their cows".
2) What would you say is the common misconception about NZ? I.e. what you were told/read were actually different from what you experienced while living in NZ.

Lastly, do you think you have an equal opportunity to getting bonuses/promotions that an Aussie/Kiwi?

Thanks in advance for your comments!

 

[axe168]

Hi brothers!

Lastly, do you think you have an equal opportunity to getting bonuses/promotions that an Aussie/Kiwi?

Thanks in advance for your comments!

A real life example : AXE started from zero..

Company A (less than 10 staff) : I left within a month - no promotion.

Company B (8,000 strong force) : I got promoted 3 times! I left after 3yrs.

Company C (40 staff) : I got another grade higher + a car. I resigned after 1 yr.

Company D (2,500 staff) : I got $25k more + a car(soon). I am happily working for them

Btw, I do not have bonuses..

 

[Satan]

Answers to your questions:

<<<<We all know that Auz and NZ offers better working hours>>>>

Don't know about NZ but in Oz, it depends. There is a fair number of Aussies who stretch their hours to even 12 hours a day unless you are clerk or a junior level staff where you work just office hours.


<<<< and cheaper housing & cars. >>>>

Yes. But in the case of housing, depends on the area. Good areas will cost you more.


<<<<However their tax rate is extremely high for higher income earners.>>>

Yes and no depending on how you could find smart ways to reduce your tax burden.

Question:
1) Will you be financially worse off then if you have stayed in Singapore?

It depends. Its just like asking how long is a piece of string. If you are an unemployed >40 yrs of age then maybe you could fair better in these countries but if you are like a PAP MPee, or a ministar, no prize for guessing.

<<<<2) If yes, do you in your opinion, think that the quality of life (or what other factors) outweighs the financial lost?>>>>>

Again it depends. Qualoity of life is very subjective. It depnds on what you want at the end of the day.

<<<<There is this comment "NZ is underpopulated so it lacks critical mass. That's why economically, it can't keep up with other countries like the US and Canada.>>>>

Question:
<<<<<1) Do you agree with this comment? If not, why not?
I have been told that NZ's economy "depends on their cows".>>>>

Maybe but then if an individual finds opportunity in NZ why not? Its not that he could have the same opportunity in Canada or USA.Smart people survive in any environment. Only losers will expect the environment, people or the govt to give them freebies.

<<<<2) What would you say is the common misconception about NZ? I.e. what you were told/read were actually different from what you experienced while living in NZ.>>>>

Sorry, can't answer this as I don't have much knowledge of NZ. Shall levae it to some others who could answer this better.

<<<<Lastly, do you think you have an equal opportunity to getting bonuses/promotions that an Aussie/Kiwi?>>>>

Then again depends. Intially, both countries would want a person to have local experieince but down the track, it all depends on you. When I was in Sydney, I was at par with another white woman and man and we 3 of us were managers reporting to a lady who was an Indonesian Chinese.

 

[Leongsam]

We all know that Auz and NZ offers better working hours and cheaper housing & cars. Their new year's break could be stretch to almost a month! However their tax rate is extremely high for higher income earners.

Income tax may be higher for high income earners but the total tax burden is a lot lower in OZ and NZ.

Take NZ for example.

I pay around $250 per car per year in road taxes. I have 2 cars so that's $500. In Singapore, I'd be paying $4000 a year for the same two cars. Delta = $3500.

I pay no COE. I can keep my car for as long as I want. In Singapore, COE would probably cost me at least $4000 per year over 10 years for two cars. Delta = $4000.

My freehold landed property cost me $400,000. In Singapore, the same property would cost $4,000,000. Delta = $3.6 million and interest rates haven't even been factored in yet.

No CPF in NZ. Everything I earn less taxes is available for me to make my own investments. The average return I get is 6% which I believe is 3% higher than what I would get from forced savings in my CPF account if I earned the same salary in Singapore.

You do the sums. I did my own a few years ago and it turned out I was 32% better off in NZ than I would have been had I stayed on in Sinkieland.

 

[axe168]

Answers to your questions:

<<<<We all know that Auz and NZ offers better working hours>>>>

Don't know about NZ but in Oz, it depends. There is a fair number of Aussies who stretch their hours to even 12 hours a day unless you are clerk or a junior level staff where you work just office hours.

Bro, you should join my organisation. We have strict rules for 8.30am to 5pm.. Employer has to pay overtime, if it exceeded the hours.. change working location also require employer contribute $$$ for transport. This is clearly written in the EBA agreement.. I am under the Association of Professional Engineers, Scientists & Managers, Australia (APESMA) agreement.

 

[iamtalkinglah]

Bro, you should join my organisation. We have strict rules for 8.30am to 5pm.. Employer has to pay overtime, if it exceeded the hours.. change working location also require employer contribute $$$ for transport. This is clearly written in the EBA agreement.. I am under the Association of Professional Engineers, Scientists & Managers, Australia (APESMA) agreement.

Hi! I just went to APESMA website. I think I will have a lot of questions but let me read the website (when I have the time).
Thanks for sharing!!

 

[iamtalkinglah]

Don't know about NZ but in Oz, it depends. There is a fair number of Aussies who stretch their hours to even 12 hours a day unless you are clerk or a junior level staff where you work just office hours.

I think the hours are unavoidable and similar to the hours in Singapore. I have asked an Australian working in the same industry as me. E.g. If you are a professional, you won't be able to escape the long working hours.

 

[axe168]

E.g. If you are a professional, you won't be able to escape the long working hours.

Oh yes, I am a blue collar worker. Thank god, I hv no overtime. Or is it bcos I hv good employer? Work-life balance is so wonderful !

 

[iamtalkinglah]

Oh yes, I am a blue collar worker. Thank god, I hv no overtime. Or is it bcos I hv good employer? Work-life balance is so wonderful !

Oh Mr Axe, there are professionals that work long hours in Oz.
Not to worry, everyone knows you earn 100K+, so don't feel offended.
And I am just giving an example, I am not saying that I am a professional.

 

[kiwibird7]

Hi brothers!

The internet is full of information on what I am going to ask. But I do prefer to learn from first hand personal experience.

We all know that Auz and NZ offers better working hours and cheaper housing & cars. Their new year's break could be stretch to almost a month! However their tax rate is extremely high for higher income earners.

Question:
1) Will you be financially worse off then if you have stayed in Singapore?
2) If yes, do you in your opinion, think that the quality of life (or what other factors) outweighs the financial lost?

There is this comment "NZ is underpopulated so it lacks critical mass. That's why economically, it can't keep up with other countries like the US and Canada.

Question:
1) Do you agree with this comment? If not, why not?
I have been told that NZ's economy "depends on their cows".
2) What would you say is the common misconception about NZ? I.e. what you were told/read were actually different from what you experienced while living in NZ.

Lastly, do you think you have an equal opportunity to getting bonuses/promotions that an Aussie/Kiwi?

Thanks in advance for your comments!

1. One has less debts in NZ than one were to stay in Singapore.
House, Car and Medical Care in Singapore ties one down for life that one CANNOT afford to RETIRE.

2. The quality of life in NZ is many times superior to Singapore, TIME and LEISURE are not available in SINGAPORE. For one thing, one does not need to worry about financial stability for RETIREMENT in NZ.
The voluntary KIWISAVER (CPF), the NZ govt matches $ for $ the contributions of account holders/employers for a certain amount and the interest rates are many times more than the CPF rates. One can quit the scheme at anytime ane the withdrawal age can never be extended or the amount witheld by the govt at the stipulated age of withdrawal unilaterally.
Then there is also the NZ superannuation that guarantees a STATE FUNDED PENSION scheme that pays at least 2/3 of the average wage (revised periodically to match rising incomes) to all NZ citizens/PRs age 65 until death who are resident in NZ for at least 10 yrs prior to retirement.

3. Underpopulated, lack of critical mass, cannot keep up with other countries etc is IRRELEVANT because the natural resources in NZ alone with its low population numbers translates into self-sufficiency that would strongly buffer against the fickle cyclical flows of the global economy that can be devastatingly BRUTAL. There is enough food, water, energy in NZ to live simply, comfortably without worries for her small population why hanker for a population explosion?
People from crowded cities in US, UK etc are emigrating to underpopulated NZ to escape the very places that have 'critical mass'.

4. NZ has strong comparative advantage in their agricultural economy, so no complains there. If it ain't broke why fix it? S'pore on the other hand is still desperately searching for their niche trying to set up HUB after HUB of every nature, now gambling on their IRs to succeed and throwing good money after BAD in overseas investments.

5. The #1 misconception about NZ that S'poreans have about NZ is it is a BORING place with nothing to do. It cannot be further from the truth, Leisure for recreation, time for family life, hobbies/sports and recreation at a fraction of the cost that S'pore has to offer. For one thing, NZ residents don't have to hang around shopping centres on weekends as their sole means of entertainment.

6. Equal opportunities for persons of any ethnicity/Nationality/Gender in NZ. It may not be perfect but I regard NZ as less racist than S'pore. We have Mayors, MPs and top professionals (Law, Medicine, Engineering, Accounting etc) who are of immigrant stock, if not 1st generation than at least 2nd generation.

 

[RelativeV]

Income tax may be higher for high income earners but the total tax burden is a lot lower in OZ and NZ.

Take NZ for example.

I pay around $250 per car per year in road taxes. I have 2 cars so that's $500. In Singapore, I'd be paying $4000 a year for the same two cars. Delta = $3500.

I pay no COE. I can keep my car for as long as I want. In Singapore, COE would probably cost me at least $4000 per year over 10 years for two cars. Delta = $4000.

My freehold landed property cost me $400,000. In Singapore, the same property would cost $4,000,000. Delta = $3.6 million and interest rates haven't even been factored in yet.

No CPF in NZ. Everything I earn less taxes is available for me to make my own investments. The average return I get is 6% which I believe is 3% higher than what I would get from forced savings in my CPF account if I earned the same salary in Singapore.

You do the sums. I did my own a few years ago and it turned out I was 32% better off in NZ than I would have been had I stayed on in Sinkieland.

Hi all

Are we liable to pay any taxes on investment returns (6%) on average that you mentioned. Thank you.

Regards

RelativeV

 

[Leongsam]

Hi all

Are we liable to pay any taxes on investment returns (6%) on average that you mentioned. Thank you.

Regards

RelativeV

Investment returns are taxable. However, exactly how much taxes one has to pay depends upon how the investment entity is structured.

The 6% I quoted is the after tax return.

 

[RelativeV]

Investment returns are taxable. However, exactly how much taxes one has to pay depends upon how the investment entity is structured.

The 6% I quoted is the after tax return.

Thanks very much Sam, I spoke to a NZ consultant recently and i asked him about the taxes that I will be subjected to if i were to invest in their Govt bonds and so forth, seems like he doesn't have a clue about it. Any
brothers out there has any knowledge on this? Again, this particular immigration consultant wanted to charge me a processing fee of more than 10k for the various applications, govt fees etc for a family of 5, is that amount correct? Thank you all......

 

[Leongsam]

Most investment returns are taxed at 33% but the amount can easily be mimimised by structuring the investment as part of a company, foundation or trust. You need a tax accountant for that not an immigration consultant. You don't ask your doctor for advice regarding your dental problems do you?

Don't waste your money with immigration consultants. Just go to the NZ high comm and tell them you want to emigrate to NZ. They'll give you all the necessary forms plus a booklet of instructions regarding how to fill them in. Unless you're illiterate, it'll take you less than an hour.

The only time consuming part is securing the necessary documentation to support your application... eg proof of working experience, police good conduct certificate etc.

Thanks very much Sam, I spoke to a NZ consultant recently and i asked him about the taxes that I will be subjected to if i were to invest in their Govt bonds and so forth, seems like he doesn't have a clue about it. Any
brothers out there has any knowledge on this? Again, this particular immigration consultant wanted to charge me a processing fee of more than 10k for the various applications, govt fees etc for a family of 5, is that amount correct? Thank you all......

 

[RelativeV]

Most investment returns are taxed at 33% but the amount can easily be mimimised by structuring the investment as part of a company, foundation or trust. You need a tax accountant for that not an immigration consultant. You don't ask your doctor for advice regarding your dental problems do you?

Don't waste your money with immigration consultants. Just go to the NZ high comm and tell them you want to emigrate to NZ. They'll give you all the necessary forms plus a booklet of instructions regarding how to fill them in. Unless you're illiterate, it'll take you less than an hour.

The only time consuming part is securing the necessary documentation to support your application... eg proof of working experience, police good conduct certificate etc.

Hahaha...ok Mr Sam....got it....thank you....!

 

[Leongsam]

Hahaha...ok Mr Sam....got it....thank you....!

You can save yourself a trip by going to http://www.immigration.govt.nz/

All the necessary forms can be downloaded.

 

[RelativeV]

You can save yourself a trip by going to http://www.immigration.govt.nz/

All the necessary forms can be downloaded.

Yes, thank you Sam....will do just that.....

 

[boundThunter]

It is a very dangerous country too. Horror details revealed :

Liberty no more...

 

[Leongsam]

It is a very dangerous country too. Horror details revealed :
Liberty no more...

Cut the crap. There are crime stories that feature every single country on earth including "safe" Sinkiepoor.

There is a time and place for such articles but it's not appropriate in this thread. Put your horror stories in the "International News" section.

 

[iamtalkinglah]

1. One has less debts in NZ than one were to stay in Singapore.
House, Car and Medical Care in Singapore ties one down for life that one CANNOT afford to RETIRE.

2. The quality of life in NZ is many times superior to Singapore, TIME and LEISURE are not available in SINGAPORE. For one thing, one does not need to worry about financial stability for RETIREMENT in NZ.
The voluntary KIWISAVER (CPF), the NZ govt matches $ for $ the contributions of account holders/employers for a certain amount and the interest rates are many times more than the CPF rates. One can quit the scheme at anytime ane the withdrawal age can never be extended or the amount witheld by the govt at the stipulated age of withdrawal unilaterally.
Then there is also the NZ superannuation that guarantees a STATE FUNDED PENSION scheme that pays at least 2/3 of the average wage (revised periodically to match rising incomes) to all NZ citizens/PRs age 65 until death who are resident in NZ for at least 10 yrs prior to retirement.

3. Underpopulated, lack of critical mass, cannot keep up with other countries etc is IRRELEVANT because the natural resources in NZ alone with its low population numbers translates into self-sufficiency that would strongly buffer against the fickle cyclical flows of the global economy that can be devastatingly BRUTAL. There is enough food, water, energy in NZ to live simply, comfortably without worries for her small population why hanker for a population explosion?
People from crowded cities in US, UK etc are emigrating to underpopulated NZ to escape the very places that have 'critical mass'.

4. NZ has strong comparative advantage in their agricultural economy, so no complains there. If it ain't broke why fix it? S'pore on the other hand is still desperately searching for their niche trying to set up HUB after HUB of every nature, now gambling on their IRs to succeed and throwing good money after BAD in overseas investments.

5. The #1 misconception about NZ that S'poreans have about NZ is it is a BORING place with nothing to do. It cannot be further from the truth, Leisure for recreation, time for family life, hobbies/sports and recreation at a fraction of the cost that S'pore has to offer. For one thing, NZ residents don't have to hang around shopping centres on weekends as their sole means of entertainment.

6. Equal opportunities for persons of any ethnicity/Nationality/Gender in NZ. It may not be perfect but I regard NZ as less racist than S'pore. We have Mayors, MPs and top professionals (Law, Medicine, Engineering, Accounting etc) who are of immigrant stock, if not 1st generation than at least 2nd generation.

Thanks for your information, I feel more confident abt NZ now!
May I ask you why did you choose NZ over Oz? Have you ever considered Oz?

Also, I understand that if you want to speed up your PR application in Oz, you need to hire an immigration consultant who will help follow up with the Oz gov't. E.g. the PR approval could be obtained within 9 months. Is this the same thing in NZ?

One last question: If you are are an Oz PR, does it offers any advantage when applying for NZ PR? I do know that if you are an NZ citizen, you are automatically granted Oz PR/easier to get Oz PR.

Thanks so much!