Top Ten Reasons why Religion Is Bullshit

Other than the Bible's description of this Jesus person, there are no other official accounts of his life. And how is one to believe the Bible, when it says his mama was a virgin when she gave birth to Jesus, and that he rose from the dead after he died? That takes faith. Of which I have none. At least not in this religion.

Cheers!

Frodo said:

You cannot separate the Jesus of history from the so-called Jesus of theology. This is a fake and forced distinction. Jesus never came to free anyone from any political rule, and He never did. It takes more credulity to believe that people would just invent a fictitious character they know to be false and then just go ahead and willingly subject themselves to persecution and cruel executions. For what? A CSB is just that, a CSB. Whatever tall story you have to try to explain Jesus away, it must be supported by facts, not just your insistence that they must be correct because you simply cannot believe the Bible’s account.

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Agoraphobic said:

Other than the Bible's description of this Jesus person, there are no other official accounts of his life. And how is one to believe the Bible, when it says his mama was a virgin when she gave birth to Jesus, and that he rose from the dead after he died? That takes faith. Of which I have none. At least not in this religion.

Cheers!

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LOL! Define “official” accounts? Anyway, to reject the Bible as history simply because it documents the miraculous would make for a lousy historian because he simply dismiss it based on his own worldview beliefs. The Bible is a document(s) of antiquity. It is a historical record of Jesus life, though not in exhaustive detail. It contains historical references and places, which are also verified by other historical facts and documents. If you choose not to believe the events recorded in the Bible, it’s not the problem with the Bible, it’s your beliefs at work. You reject the virgin birth? Why? Simply because that’s what atheists MUST do! But if God exists, why can’t He cause there to be a virgin birth? Again, is anything too hard for God? Your faith is certainly not in God, but in man, and of course, in your own reasoning. Our reasoning faculties are given by God, but we don’t always reason well to good conclusions, especially the atheists.

Official to me simply means authorised, approved by a panel of recognised experts. In the world we live in today, this panel would possibly be organizations like the Smithsonian Institute, National Geographic, or similar organisations.

A virgin birth - to be accepted, takes immense stupidity. Without sexual intercourse, the only other imaginable way for pregnancy to occur is artificial insemination. This does not take super intelligence, this is common knowledge!! So, if Mary was pregnant without sex, could insemination be performed? By who? In that time, the only imaginable way was by a visiting advanced species (some E.T. alien), abducted her, performed the act, then released her after infusing her with the idea that she was pregnated by the Holy Spirit, and carry the Son of God! This is not what the Bible says. So it is debatable then, as to how it happened.

Cheers!

Frodo said:

LOL! Define “official” accounts? Anyway, to reject the Bible as history simply because it documents the miraculous would make for a lousy historian because he simply dismiss it based on his own worldview beliefs. The Bible is a document(s) of antiquity. It is a historical record of Jesus life, though not in exhaustive detail. It contains historical references and places, which are also verified by other historical facts and documents. If you choose not to believe the events recorded in the Bible, it’s not the problem with the Bible, it’s your beliefs at work. You reject the virgin birth? Why? Simply because that’s what atheists MUST do! But if God exists, why can’t He cause there to be a virgin birth? Again, is anything too hard for God? Your faith is certainly not in God, but in man, and of course, in your own reasoning. Our reasoning faculties are given by God, but we don’t always reason well to good conclusions, especially the atheists.

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Agoraphobic said:

Official to me simply means authorised, approved by a panel of recognised experts. In the world we live in today, this panel would possibly be organizations like the Smithsonian Institute, National Geographic, or similar organisations.

A virgin birth - to be accepted, takes immense stupidity. Without sexual intercourse, the only other imaginable way for pregnancy to occur is artificial insemination. This does not take super intelligence, this is common knowledge!! So, if Mary was pregnant without sex, could insemination be performed? By who? In that time, the only imaginable way was by a visiting advanced species (some E.T. alien), abducted her, performed the act, then released her after infusing her with the idea that she was pregnated by the Holy Spirit, and carry the Son of God! This is not what the Bible says. So it is debatable then, as to how it happened.

Cheers!

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You are committing a chronological fallacy here. Surely you are not serious to expect today’s standards to be in place 2000 years or more before, right? If you are serious about such an “official” requirement, you are definitely not as reasonable or logical as you put yourself to be. LOL! The Bible clearly states that Mary was pregnant with child by the power of the Holy Spirit. Again the God who created the universe and brought life into existence, will have absolutely no problem with enabling a virgin birth. But I suppose it gives you immensely great joy to be able to indirectly call your debate opponent immensely stupid. Yeah I get that not very subtle scoff. But you obviously fail to see that you have purposely refused to interact with the correct notion of God, and in addition you again used a naturalistic worldview (which you failed to show to be the right one to begin with) to judge a supernaturalistic worldview. In all aspects you are just stubbornly clinging on to your failed, and false, atheistic worldview. So long as you refuse to interact fairly with your opponent’s view, as I have done with yours, you won’t make much progress in learning about others and maybe you aren’t really interested in a fair debate at all. But then again, perhaps you never wanted to in the first place?

I do not know what you mean by chronological fallacy. If this "God" that pregnated Mary via artificial insemination existed then, they would be far superior to us in technology, and being earlier in time does not change that technology at all, it is after all - science. Yes, the bible said, it, But I refute what the Bible says as nonsense. And so is this notion of "God" as all-powerful and can;t do no wrong. If God is like what you say, man would not sin. But we're full of it! If so, then Jesus's coming has not changed anything in our behavious post Roman times. We remain the same barbarians, greedy, cruel and selfish. Maybe Jesus should come again, he's a little overdue isn't he?

Cheers!

Frodo said:

You are committing a chronological fallacy here. Surely you are not serious to expect today’s standards to be in place 2000 years or more before, right? If you are serious about such an “official” requirement, you are definitely not as reasonable or logical as you put yourself to be. LOL! The Bible clearly states that Mary was pregnant with child by the power of the Holy Spirit. Again the God who created the universe and brought life into existence, will have absolutely no problem with enabling a virgin birth. But I suppose it gives you immensely great joy to be able to indirectly call your debate opponent immensely stupid. Yeah I get that not very subtle scoff. But you obviously fail to see that you have purposely refused to interact with the correct notion of God, and in addition you again used a naturalistic worldview (which you failed to show to be the right one to begin with) to judge a supernaturalistic worldview. In all aspects you are just stubbornly clinging on to your failed, and false, atheistic worldview. So long as you refuse to interact fairly with your opponent’s view, as I have done with yours, you won’t make much progress in learning about others and maybe you aren’t really interested in a fair debate at all. But then again, perhaps you never wanted to in the first place?

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Agoraphobic said:

I do not know what you mean by chronological fallacy. If this "God" that pregnated Mary via artificial insemination existed then, they would be far superior to us in technology, and being earlier in time does not change that technology at all, it is after all - science. Yes, the bible said, it, But I refute what the Bible says as nonsense. And so is this notion of "God" as all-powerful and can;t do no wrong. If God is like what you say, man would not sin. But we're full of it! If so, then Jesus's coming has not changed anything in our behavious post Roman times. We remain the same barbarians, greedy, cruel and selfish. Maybe Jesus should come again, he's a little overdue isn't he?

Cheers!

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Which means you should not take a modern day standard and ask why that same standard did not exist in the ancient past. It’s like asking how come no photos of Jesus, or newspaper coverage by journalists. Should have right? Uh….Duh!

The virgin birth was not through artificial insemination. It was a miracle, period. There is nothing scientific about a miracle, since a miracle is a once off event and cannot be repeated or tested via the scientific method. It’s not even a technology issue. You must be talking about the absurd ancient alien nonsense. BTW, people who reject God but believe in ancient aliens don’t even see the inconsistencies within their own beliefs. The reason why people invoke ancient aliens because the evidence for intelligent design is irrefutable. But instead of acknowledging God, they choose to credit it to aliens. But this leaves the question, where did this aliens come from and who made them, if they are even real entities in the first place.

Whoa…hold your horses! Since when have you ever refuted anything in the Bible as nonsense? I have yet to see one refutation from you. What I see was simply you saying you don’t believe it because to you it is fiction, therefore it is nonsense. And that is your definition of refuting? That will only earn you a face palm! Yes, God is all powerful and can do no wrong. Everything God does is by definition good, because God IS good. Goodness and moral perfection is God’s nature. But you fail to see that God and His creation is distinct. Just because God is morally perfect, that does not mean that man is incapable of sin. Man was not created incapable of sin, he was created with free will, and thus man is capable of sin. Yes, we are full of sin, it’s good that you even recognise that in yourself. But knowing you are sinful also means you have to agree that there are moral standards that exposes your sinfulness. And moral laws means there is a moral lawgiver. Yes, Jesus is coming. But you should be grateful that He is gracious to grant humanity more time to repent. If Jesus should come today, you’ll be most upset, and many will regret hardening their hearts against Him while they had the chance to repent and be saved.

So, all that is technologically possible today is because God made it so? Without god, we won't have electronics, won't understand modern medicine? Wah, didn't know God was so powerful! I can see, believers sitting, or kneeling, all the time in Church praying for God to help or provide for them in everything they desire, no need to work, engage brain, just pray hard, hope God listens, and all will be solved. Lucky for us, there are people out there who believe in helping ourselves.

Fiction makes good stories, it gives listeners hope. That something good will happen. Just that in reality, it doesn't always work this way. Somethings do not have happy endings.

People (some) believe in aliens, ETs, UFOs, is because these entities today replace what used to occupy our minds like gremlins, elves, ghosts, which we have grown out of. This stems out from the thought that the universe is so vast, and we know so little of it, that there may be tons of other things we do not know that exist elsewhere in this vastness. Its just our imagination. We create things, just like the idea of God, and religion. if I do come face-to-face with an alien, would like to ask him/her on his world, do they have a smiliar story to Jesus that we have hear on Earth. Whether we share the same hopes and beliefs, that would be interesting.

To the doomsday freaks, I like to say this, Jesus already came twice. The first time, during the time of Caesar, the second time, he came to you!

Cheers!

Frodo said:

Which means you should not take a modern day standard and ask why that same standard did not exist in the ancient past. It’s like asking how come no photos of Jesus, or newspaper coverage by journalists. Should have right? Uh….Duh!

The virgin birth was not through artificial insemination. It was a miracle, period. There is nothing scientific about a miracle, since a miracle is a once off event and cannot be repeated or tested via the scientific method. It’s not even a technology issue. You must be talking about the absurd ancient alien nonsense. BTW, people who reject God but believe in ancient aliens don’t even see the inconsistencies within their own beliefs. The reason why people invoke ancient aliens because the evidence for intelligent design is irrefutable. But instead of acknowledging God, they choose to credit it to aliens. But this leaves the question, where did this aliens come from and who made them, if they are even real entities in the first place.

Whoa…hold your horses! Since when have you ever refuted anything in the Bible as nonsense? I have yet to see one refutation from you. What I see was simply you saying you don’t believe it because to you it is fiction, therefore it is nonsense. And that is your definition of refuting? That will only earn you a face palm! Yes, God is all powerful and can do no wrong. Everything God does is by definition good, because God IS good. Goodness and moral perfection is God’s nature. But you fail to see that God and His creation is distinct. Just because God is morally perfect, that does not mean that man is incapable of sin. Man was not created incapable of sin, he was created with free will, and thus man is capable of sin. Yes, we are full of sin, it’s good that you even recognise that in yourself. But knowing you are sinful also means you have to agree that there are moral standards that exposes your sinfulness. And moral laws means there is a moral lawgiver. Yes, Jesus is coming. But you should be grateful that He is gracious to grant humanity more time to repent. If Jesus should come today, you’ll be most upset, and many will regret hardening their hearts against Him while they had the chance to repent and be saved.

Click to expand...

Agoraphobic said:

So, all that is technologically possible today is because God made it so? Without god, we won't have electronics, won't understand modern medicine? Wah, didn't know God was so powerful! I can see, believers sitting, or kneeling, all the time in Church praying for God to help or provide for them in everything they desire, no need to work, engage brain, just pray hard, hope God listens, and all will be solved. Lucky for us, there are people out there who believe in helping ourselves.

Fiction makes good stories, it gives listeners hope. That something good will happen. Just that in reality, it doesn't always work this way. Somethings do not have happy endings.

People (some) believe in aliens, ETs, UFOs, is because these entities today replace what used to occupy our minds like gremlins, elves, ghosts, which we have grown out of. This stems out from the thought that the universe is so vast, and we know so little of it, that there may be tons of other things we do not know that exist elsewhere in this vastness. Its just our imagination. We create things, just like the idea of God, and religion. if I do come face-to-face with an alien, would like to ask him/her on his world, do they have a smiliar story to Jesus that we have hear on Earth. Whether we share the same hopes and beliefs, that would be interesting.

To the doomsday freaks, I like to say this, Jesus already came twice. The first time, during the time of Caesar, the second time, he came to you!

Cheers!

Click to expand...

All that is technological today is possible because God made humans in His image. Intelligent beings that can reason, think, explore. Can an atheist explain why the universe is intelligible? Can an atheist explain why in the entire world, only humans are capable of such achievement? Using evolution to explain is just inventing an ad hoc and just so theory incapable of proof. Yes, there are people praying to God all the time. And you should also be thankful that many of these believers in God are also deeply involved in exploring God’s world. Which is why atheists feel upset each time they are confronted with the fact that modern science was birthed from a Christian worldview. Atheists did not lead the way in the birth of modern science. Yes, not everything have a happy ending. But what does the atheist know about happy or unhappy ending? Is there a “should” in the world of atheism? Nope. Things just are the way they are because…well that’s the way things are! There’s no ultimate reason or teleology for the atheist to look to. What an atheist think is but mere chemistry knocking in his brain. You shouldn’t even trust that. But since you obviously do, that’s because you have stolen from the Christian worldview to make yours work, in spite of the fact that atheism does not work. As for aliens, you are simply exchanging one fiction for another. I don’t suppose you even know the basic problems with the alien theory. Me a doomsday freak? Wow, you really love belittling Christians and scoffing at us! Never mind, Jesus told us that the world will hate us because of Him. I’m cool with that. Jesus said the world loves darkness more than light, because the light exposes the darkness. But you don’t have to continue to live in darkness, you can choose the path to life. And when Jesus comes again to meet us in the air…you’ll be there too. That will be your best day ever.

Because homo sapiens are the most highly evolved species on earth, that we have developed intelligence. We evolved into what we are because of the need to survive, and also because we did not have the strength, speed, fierceness, fighting ability of other predators, so we had to resort to more brain than brawn. We do not have thick fur to protect ourselves from cold, so we had to use fire - this was what separated us from other "lesser" animals from the start. We huddled together at night, hiding in caves, to shelter from the elements of nature and other animals that could devour us. We looked at the sky at night, wondering what those stars are, and over time, noticed some kind of repetitive cycle(s) in their appearances, correlated them to climate and weather on our planet, pieced this knowledge together and astonomy was born. Now, we are attempting to physically travel to these stars to. Our curious mind has advanced much, since our apeman days. We are seeing more light than darkness, and more so as time advances. The story of Jesus has held us in awe, but I wonder, a hundred years from today, will it still be a story for society to adore? Or will it be set aside like the story of Santa Claus?

Cheers!

Frodo said:

All that is technological today is possible because God made humans in His image. Intelligent beings that can reason, think, explore. Can an atheist explain why the universe is intelligible? Can an atheist explain why in the entire world, only humans are capable of such achievement? Using evolution to explain is just inventing an ad hoc and just so theory incapable of proof. Yes, there are people praying to God all the time. And you should also be thankful that many of these believers in God are also deeply involved in exploring God’s world. Which is why atheists feel upset each time they are confronted with the fact that modern science was birthed from a Christian worldview. Atheists did not lead the way in the birth of modern science. Yes, not everything have a happy ending. But what does the atheist know about happy or unhappy ending? Is there a “should” in the world of atheism? Nope. Things just are the way they are because…well that’s the way things are! There’s no ultimate reason or teleology for the atheist to look to. What an atheist think is but mere chemistry knocking in his brain. You shouldn’t even trust that. But since you obviously do, that’s because you have stolen from the Christian worldview to make yours work, in spite of the fact that atheism does not work. As for aliens, you are simply exchanging one fiction for another. I don’t suppose you even know the basic problems with the alien theory. Me a doomsday freak? Wow, you really love belittling Christians and scoffing at us! Never mind, Jesus told us that the world will hate us because of Him. I’m cool with that. Jesus said the world loves darkness more than light, because the light exposes the darkness. But you don’t have to continue to live in darkness, you can choose the path to life. And when Jesus comes again to meet us in the air…you’ll be there too. That will be your best day ever.

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Agoraphobic said:

Because homo sapiens are the most highly evolved species on earth, that we have developed intelligence. We evolved into what we are because of the need to survive, and also because we did not have the strength, speed, fierceness, fighting ability of other predators, so we had to resort to more brain than brawn. We do not have thick fur to protect ourselves from cold, so we had to use fire - this was what separated us from other "lesser" animals from the start. We huddled together at night, hiding in caves, to shelter from the elements of nature and other animals that could devour us. We looked at the sky at night, wondering what those stars are, and over time, noticed some kind of repetitive cycle(s) in their appearances, correlated them to climate and weather on our planet, pieced this knowledge together and astonomy was born. Now, we are attempting to physically travel to these stars to. Our curious mind has advanced much, since our apeman days. We are seeing more light than darkness, and more so as time advances. The story of Jesus has held us in awe, but I wonder, a hundred years from today, will it still be a story for society to adore? Or will it be set aside like the story of Santa Claus?

Cheers!

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“Because homo sapiens are the most highly evolved species on earth.”

Your first statement above already begs the question, because you are assuming evolution to be true, ignoring the whole debate that challenges evolution as the true origins story of the universe and life on earth. You are likely to be shielding yourself from the considerable evidence and mounting criticism of evolution from very qualified scientists who can easily hold a debate with evolutionists and trump them.

The story of Jesus has held up for more than 2000 years. People in history have tried to wipe Jesus off the face of the earth. But they will die and fade off while Jesus continues to be the Person who divides human history in BC and AD. A hundred years from today, people will still be singing Christmas songs, telling stories of St Nicholas (from which the Santa Claus story probably has its beginnings), and people will still be testifying to the enormous influence of Jesus Christ on human history when they sign their names and date their signatures.

Then tell me, which other organism on this planet is more evolved than our species? We are able to make fire, which other animal is able to do this? I don't think this is an assumption. It is true, from observation, and experience.

Jesus is the most influential individual in history because the Christian nations are dominant since after the Dark Ages. If not, it would have been Mohammed, if the crusades were won by the muslims, or Confucious, if the rice eaters ruled the world. I am not downplaying the accomplishments and impact of Jesus Christ on modern society, but just highlighting the fact on why he has become who he has become. Because of history and the events that happened. It is mankind, and its history. I came to this conclusion not through any brilliant thought, but just by looking around. If Canada was a superpower, Wayne Gretsky would be the greatest bugger on the planet, but since the USA is the dominant superpower, that position is held by Bill Gates/Steve Jobs/Thomas Edison/Henry Ford (some might say Lindsay Lohan!). If Peesai were on the same level as USA, LKY would be the greatest human who ever lived!

Cheers!

Frodo said:

“Because homo sapiens are the most highly evolved species on earth.”

Your first statement above already begs the question, because you are assuming evolution to be true, ignoring the whole debate that challenges evolution as the true origins story of the universe and life on earth. You are likely to be shielding yourself from the considerable evidence and mounting criticism of evolution from very qualified scientists who can easily hold a debate with evolutionists and trump them.

The story of Jesus has held up for more than 2000 years. People in history have tried to wipe Jesus off the face of the earth. But they will die and fade off while Jesus continues to be the Person who divides human history in BC and AD. A hundred years from today, people will still be singing Christmas songs, telling stories of St Nicholas (from which the Santa Claus story probably has its beginnings), and people will still be testifying to the enormous influence of Jesus Christ on human history when they sign their names and date their signatures.

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Agoraphobic said:

Then tell me, which other organism on this planet is more evolved than our species? We are able to make fire, which other animal is able to do this? I don't think this is an assumption. It is true, from observation, and experience.

Jesus is the most influential individual in history because the Christian nations are dominant since after the Dark Ages. If not, it would have been Mohammed, if the crusades were won by the muslims, or Confucious, if the rice eaters ruled the world. I am not downplaying the accomplishments and impact of Jesus Christ on modern society, but just highlighting the fact on why he has become who he has become. Because of history and the events that happened. It is mankind, and its history. I came to this conclusion not through any brilliant thought, but just by looking around. If Canada was a superpower, Wayne Gretsky would be the greatest bugger on the planet, but since the USA is the dominant superpower, that position is held by Bill Gates/Steve Jobs/Thomas Edison/Henry Ford (some might say Lindsay Lohan!). If Peesai were on the same level as USA, LKY would be the greatest human who ever lived!

Cheers!

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The question you should be asking yourself is, “Did we evolve from pond scum?” If yes, where is the evidence, may I ask? Our human experience affirms our superiority over all other creatures and animals. Why? The best answer is because we are created in God’s image, rather than the absurd belief that we were so lucky to have evolved to such a high level, from a so-called single or simple cell, millions and millions of years ago.

Your answer as to why Jesus is so influential is merely a “so what” dismissive answer. The whole reply is moot because it is speculative and explains nothing. It is another ad hoc just so answer. Your what ifs scenarios can never be proven at all, so such what if answers are just fluff to be blown away. You should not just be looking around, but look up and see the providential hand of God who is directing the affairs of human history, and guiding it to the crossroads where the battle of Armageddon will be fought, and the curtain will drop on the stage of human history.

We did not evolved from pond scum. We evolved from some ape-like bipedal hominid, who evolved from some rodent-like mammal, who evolved from some amphibian, who evolved from some fish, who evolved from some invertebrate, which evolved from some pond-scum. It makes a lot more sense than believing we were made from dust, and life was blown into us. And we appeared, male and female, modern homo sapiens, with vocal chords able to understand the written word, and muster advanced mathematics.

Bro, sorry if I hurt your feelings on this character Jesus Christ. I do not disdain or dislike him. I admire the main subject in the story of Jesus of Nazareth. Just that I do not believe it happened as described. Yes, I can admire a fictitious person. I want to think that Jesus is not dead, but he lives on, in us. That we carry on his teachings, it is after all good teachings, and improves us. He is the perfect human being.

Cheers!

Frodo said:

The question you should be asking yourself is, “Did we evolve from pond scum?” If yes, where is the evidence, may I ask? Our human experience affirms our superiority over all other creatures and animals. Why? The best answer is because we are created in God’s image, rather than the absurd belief that we were so lucky to have evolved to such a high level, from a so-called single or simple cell, millions and millions of years ago.

Your answer as to why Jesus is so influential is merely a “so what” dismissive answer. The whole reply is moot because it is speculative and explains nothing. It is another ad hoc just so answer. Your what ifs scenarios can never be proven at all, so such what if answers are just fluff to be blown away. You should not just be looking around, but look up and see the providential hand of God who is directing the affairs of human history, and guiding it to the crossroads where the battle of Armageddon will be fought, and the curtain will drop on the stage of human history.

Click to expand...

Agoraphobic said:

We did not evolved from pond scum. We evolved from some ape-like bipedal hominid, who evolved from some rodent-like mammal, who evolved from some amphibian, who evolved from some fish, who evolved from some invertebrate, which evolved from some pond-scum. It makes a lot more sense than believing we were made from dust, and life was blown into us. And we appeared, male and female, modern homo sapiens, with vocal chords able to understand the written word, and muster advanced mathematics.

Bro, sorry if I hurt your feelings on this character Jesus Christ. I do not disdain or dislike him. I admire the main subject in the story of Jesus of Nazareth. Just that I do not believe it happened as described. Yes, I can admire a fictitious person. I want to think that Jesus is not dead, but he lives on, in us. That we carry on his teachings, it is after all good teachings, and improves us. He is the perfect human being.

Cheers!

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You wrote, “We evolved from some ape-like bipedal hominid, who evolved from some rodent-like mammal, who evolved from some amphibian, who evolved from some fish, who evolved from some invertebrate, which evolved from some pond-scum.”

Cut off the middle steps…and you are simply saying the same thing, we evolved from pond scum. Now the question is, did we? You believe we did. Is that science or belief? How did pond scum life come about? Surely pond scum life from nonliving matter must be better than God creating man from dust. Yes, we are made intelligent to begin with. It’s an all or nothing feature. Just like the famed bombardier beetle. It couldn’t possibly have evolved part by part. Everything has to be there at the same time. You owe me no apology for your beliefs about Jesus Christ. It’s really a matter between you and Him! All I am saying is what Jesus Himself taught, that the world hates Him. Even if you are indifferent towards Jesus, He said that we are either for Him or against Him. Jesus left no middle ground for you to stand on.

From what I read, I believe we evolved from simpler life-forms. Moelcules of protein massed together, and formed chains of longer molecules - that is how we think life began. To be sure, one would have to be around to witness that, billions of years ago.

With regards to this Jesus dude, it is the character of him that I admire, the physical person did not live as the story went. It is after all, a story. For those who choose to be on his side, more power to you. Hopefully he will protect you guys from Jihadists, your arch-enemy, for their God is with them, and apparently, very strong as well! Good luck to all you religious blokes, may the righteous God win over the evil god (whichever one that is!)

Cheers!

Frodo said:

You wrote, “We evolved from some ape-like bipedal hominid, who evolved from some rodent-like mammal, who evolved from some amphibian, who evolved from some fish, who evolved from some invertebrate, which evolved from some pond-scum.”

Cut off the middle steps…and you are simply saying the same thing, we evolved from pond scum. Now the question is, did we? You believe we did. Is that science or belief? How did pond scum life come about? Surely pond scum life from nonliving matter must be better than God creating man from dust. Yes, we are made intelligent to begin with. It’s an all or nothing feature. Just like the famed bombardier beetle. It couldn’t possibly have evolved part by part. Everything has to be there at the same time. You owe me no apology for your beliefs about Jesus Christ. It’s really a matter between you and Him! All I am saying is what Jesus Himself taught, that the world hates Him. Even if you are indifferent towards Jesus, He said that we are either for Him or against Him. Jesus left no middle ground for you to stand on.

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Agoraphobic said:

From what I read, I believe we evolved from simpler life-forms. Moelcules of protein massed together, and formed chains of longer molecules - that is how we think life began. To be sure, one would have to be around to witness that, billions of years ago.

With regards to this Jesus dude, it is the character of him that I admire, the physical person did not live as the story went. It is after all, a story. For those who choose to be on his side, more power to you. Hopefully he will protect you guys from Jihadists, your arch-enemy, for their God is with them, and apparently, very strong as well! Good luck to all you religious blokes, may the righteous God win over the evil god (whichever one that is!)

Cheers!

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And I stress the word “BELIEVE”. So you see, the question about our origins is very much a matter of belief. But the question that plagues the evolutionists is, where did the molecules come from? How come so lucky these exist, and can come together in the right places to give life, and all this by random chance? Don’t you even suspect that all these fortuitous events coming together smell a little miraculous perhaps? Or you just ignore the elephant in the room? Your evolutionary scenario does not even make any sense and is incoherent and goes against what we know. Systems don’t just cobble together by accident, they are put together by intelligence.

How did you know that Jesus did not exist in the same way the Bible recorded? What’s driving your conclusion? Do you even know that? In case you don’t, it’s again atheism, naturalism, that’s driving your conclusions. It’s nothing to do with reasoning or logic at all. An atheist simply believe there can be no room for God and the supernatural, so anything that even looks supernatural and dismissed with a wave of the hand, no need to think further. Which is why atheists are not really good thinkers. LOL!

You are playing with words. Nothing wrong with that, but I see this is where your strength is. Where did molecules come from? This one I can easily answer - molecules are formed when atoms combine to form stable particles that can exist on its own. I can't answer if you ask me how atoms came about. Unless you can accept that atoms are made up of protons, neutrons, and electrons. And neither can I tell you where these subatomic particles come from, but they are everywhere. To you, its is easy, God made them! Good, your questions can be answered. Easy for Christians to pass exams, the answer to every question will be - because God made it, and that is the way God meant it to be!

So, did Jesus die because God made it so? Or did he die to fulfil the scriptures? Or did he die to save mankind (no he didn't - because mankind still is evil!) Jesus never existed, because it was not possible for a human being (he was after all, God on earth, in the form of a man), to have lived as he did in the story. No feelings of the flesh, no desire for sex, not drawn by temptation, totally forgiving, no man is able to be like this. Only perhaps one without a brain or any device to foster or garner emotion. On this, I say that Jesus could not have been.

Cheers!

Frodo said:

And I stress the word “BELIEVE”. So you see, the question about our origins is very much a matter of belief. But the question that plagues the evolutionists is, where did the molecules come from? How come so lucky these exist, and can come together in the right places to give life, and all this by random chance? Don’t you even suspect that all these fortuitous events coming together smell a little miraculous perhaps? Or you just ignore the elephant in the room? Your evolutionary scenario does not even make any sense and is incoherent and goes against what we know. Systems don’t just cobble together by accident, they are put together by intelligence.

How did you know that Jesus did not exist in the same way the Bible recorded? What’s driving your conclusion? Do you even know that? In case you don’t, it’s again atheism, naturalism, that’s driving your conclusions. It’s nothing to do with reasoning or logic at all. An atheist simply believe there can be no room for God and the supernatural, so anything that even looks supernatural and dismissed with a wave of the hand, no need to think further. Which is why atheists are not really good thinkers. LOL!

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Agoraphobic said:

You are playing with words. Nothing wrong with that, but I see this is where your strength is. Where did molecules come from? This one I can easily answer - molecules are formed when atoms combine to form stable particles that can exist on its own. I can't answer if you ask me how atoms came about. Unless you can accept that atoms are made up of protons, neutrons, and electrons. And neither can I tell you where these subatomic particles come from, but they are everywhere. To you, its is easy, God made them! Good, your questions can be answered. Easy for Christians to pass exams, the answer to every question will be - because God made it, and that is the way God meant it to be!

So, did Jesus die because God made it so? Or did he die to fulfil the scriptures? Or did he die to save mankind (no he didn't - because mankind still is evil!) Jesus never existed, because it was not possible for a human being (he was after all, God on earth, in the form of a man), to have lived as he did in the story. No feelings of the flesh, no desire for sex, not drawn by temptation, totally forgiving, no man is able to be like this. Only perhaps one without a brain or any device to foster or garner emotion. On this, I say that Jesus could not have been.

Cheers!

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I’m not playing with words at all, but I am sure you realise how impossible it is for atheism to explain why anything should even exist at all. What have you explained? Nothing! Telling me that protons and electrons and atoms exist, is telling me nothing about where they come from. You don’t like the answer to be God, because that’s what atheism is all about. It’s not science driving your thinking, it’s simply a belief system that denies God. Yes, God is the Creator. The answer is not difficult to conclude, but it is very difficult for an atheist to accept because it also means the atheist has to acknowledge God and that God will judge him. In the world of atheism there is no sin, no wrong doing, because there is no objective moral standard or values. All morals are man-made and what is accepted by the majority becomes what is right for that society. You want to eat your neighbour? Just move to a society where cannibalism is the way of life. Nothing is absolutely wrong for the atheist, simply because man make all the rules.

Yes, Jesus died because God decreed it so. Jesus came to die for our sins. He was sinless. You cannot imagine that because you are not sinless. But Jesus is God in the flesh. Jesus was 100% human. He was tempted in every way (you obviously never read the Gospels!) but was without sin. Jesus hungered, thirsted for water, wept for His friends etc. Jesus was human like us in every way, but no human was ever like Jesus, sinless and blameless. That’s why only Jesus was qualified to carry the cross and bear the sins of the world. He who knew no sin could die for sinners. If Jesus had sinned, He would have needed a Saviour too. Atheists don’t like it, but there is a God and Jesus is the way to God. But atheists try to avoid the truth by trying to erase Jesus out of history, writing nonsense books (but earning big bucks) that Jesus never existed. But these atheists cannot never come up with the explanation why Christianity exists. It is far more easier to accept what the Bible says than for the atheists to come up with even more miraculous and absurd ad hoc just so answers.

Your questions have been debated and answered by philosophers in the past. You keep calling me an atheist, I have not said I am, but I suppose I can accept being called an atheist, if it satisfies you, I can be. I have not said I do not believe in an intelligent being(s), just that I do not believe the Bible to be what you claim it is. And the almighty God, seeing over us. If we were created, by God, what was his purpose? Why do we have to go through life? Why is life so unequal? If man was created equal before God, why do some blokes have to suffer so much, and others born into luxury? Your God is NOT fair! Why should an unfair God, be considered great?

Man has made laws for the orderly function of society. We (or at least some of us) needs to take charge. Otherwise, if left unattended, society will become lawless, discorderly, and unfunctional. We make laws to protect life and property. Cannibalism is not the way we want (to live). Human flesh is not seen as normal food for consumption. Neither is incest. Only in barbaric and perverted societies do these practices exist. Yes, we make the rules (and in very huge communities, we elect some to do this for the rest of us), because it is our society.

I am not against Christianity, in fact, I am in full favour of anyone choosing Chrisitianity as a religion, BUT, believing it is the WAY and only way to heaven is arrogance, and has cause massive sufferings and injustices to non-Christian peoples whom Christian societies have encroached upon. Witchhunts, persecutions, religious wars, slavery etc. Because of Christian beliefs, and that anyone who didn't believe was evil, a product of the devil, to be burned at the stake. This was all because of belief in a man without sin!!! I know, its not his fault, but the belief was a major contributor.

Cheers!

Frodo said:

I’m not playing with words at all, but I am sure you realise how impossible it is for atheism to explain why anything should even exist at all. What have you explained? Nothing! Telling me that protons and electrons and atoms exist, is telling me nothing about where they come from. You don’t like the answer to be God, because that’s what atheism is all about. It’s not science driving your thinking, it’s simply a belief system that denies God. Yes, God is the Creator. The answer is not difficult to conclude, but it is very difficult for an atheist to accept because it also means the atheist has to acknowledge God and that God will judge him. In the world of atheism there is no sin, no wrong doing, because there is no objective moral standard or values. All morals are man-made and what is accepted by the majority becomes what is right for that society. You want to eat your neighbour? Just move to a society where cannibalism is the way of life. Nothing is absolutely wrong for the atheist, simply because man make all the rules. You might want to give credit to your good God for making our societies abide by these rules, but even in primitive tribal societies, these practices are tabooed. So righteousness stems from our inner beings, not necessarily from God.
Yes, Jesus died because God decreed it so. Jesus came to die for our sins. He was sinless. You cannot imagine that because you are not sinless. But Jesus is God in the flesh. Jesus was 100% human. He was tempted in every way (you obviously never read the Gospels!) but was without sin. Jesus hungered, thirsted for water, wept for His friends etc. Jesus was human like us in every way, but no human was ever like Jesus, sinless and blameless. That’s why only Jesus was qualified to carry the cross and bear the sins of the world. He who knew no sin could die for sinners. If Jesus had sinned, He would have needed a Saviour too. Atheists don’t like it, but there is a God and Jesus is the way to God. But atheists try to avoid the truth by trying to erase Jesus out of history, writing nonsense books (but earning big bucks) that Jesus never existed. But these atheists cannot never come up with the explanation why Christianity exists. It is far more easier to accept what the Bible says than for the atheists to come up with even more miraculous and absurd ad hoc just so answers.

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Agoraphobic said:

Your questions have been debated and answered by philosophers in the past. You keep calling me an atheist, I have not said I am, but I suppose I can accept being called an atheist, if it satisfies you, I can be. I have not said I do not believe in an intelligent being(s), just that I do not believe the Bible to be what you claim it is. And the almighty God, seeing over us. If we were created, by God, what was his purpose? Why do we have to go through life? Why is life so unequal? If man was created equal before God, why do some blokes have to suffer so much, and others born into luxury? Your God is NOT fair! Why should an unfair God, be considered great?

Man has made laws for the orderly function of society. We (or at least some of us) needs to take charge. Otherwise, if left unattended, society will become lawless, discorderly, and unfunctional. We make laws to protect life and property. Cannibalism is not the way we want (to live). Human flesh is not seen as normal food for consumption. Neither is incest. Only in barbaric and perverted societies do these practices exist. Yes, we make the rules (and in very huge communities, we elect some to do this for the rest of us), because it is our society.

I am not against Christianity, in fact, I am in full favour of anyone choosing Chrisitianity as a religion, BUT, believing it is the WAY and only way to heaven is arrogance, and has cause massive sufferings and injustices to non-Christian peoples whom Christian societies have encroached upon. Witchhunts, persecutions, religious wars, slavery etc. Because of Christian beliefs, and that anyone who didn't believe was evil, a product of the devil, to be burned at the stake. This was all because of belief in a man without sin!!! I know, its not his fault, but the belief was a major contributor.

Cheers!

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Why are you shifting the issue to the philosophers and hiding behind them? What are YOUR answers to these questions? So long as you deny that there is a Creator God, it is certainly not wrong to be labelled an atheist. No shame in that, except that with this label comes a whole system of belief that cannot withstand scrutiny, especially from a theist. LOL! The question you need to ask yourself is, what is the cause of the universe? Who created the universe? Why do you insist that it cannot be God? Because it is too close for comfort? You have many questions about life being unfair and suffering. Yet are you willing to listen to the answers the Bible provide? It seems that you want the Christian to answer your questions but yet you have no wish to accept the answers.

The rules we make for orderly living are all sprung from the fact that we are moral beings. So you still need to answer the question, why are we moral beings who can judge and discern right from wrong? Where does the concept of moral right and wrong come from? If we are really evolved apes, then why shouldn’t the law of the jungle prevail? You can have incest if you wish, or eat your own child. Why not live like animals then? Can an atheist really say that is wrong? On what basis? See how hopeless atheism is in providing a framework of beliefs that can stand up to scrutiny?

Let me ask you, is truth arrogant? If the house is on fire and I tell you there is only one exit, you will call me arrogant for saying that? Sorry, the irony here is that it would be you who is arrogant to think that no one can ever know that there is only one way out. Truth by definition is objective and exclusive. You have to align yourself with it, not make it bend to you. In fact, what you should do is to ask “is that true? Why? How do you know that?” and seek to find out instead of launching a personal attack at the person by calling him arrogant! That is an irrelevant and inappropriate response to say the least. Again if you want to fault Christianity, first make sure you got the teachings right. You want to fault Christianity with slavery? Fine, first prove that the Jesus teaches we should enslave one another, or that we should go on witch hunts and kill witches. Better still, show that Jesus Himself practised that! Jesus called us to follow Him, and obey Him. So when you want to charge Christians with wrongdoing, first establish whether the actions were in accordance with what Jesus taught. That’s just being fair and objective, isn’t it? Or you throw fairness and objectivity out of the window when it comes to arguing against Christianity?