CPF Minimum Sum vs CPF Life

[Cestbon]

i think your suggestion is good. But I also think 20% after $2k is also ok

Need to think about company financial burden.
20% after $2k maybe small about but is company have few hundred people that big amount.
What my ideas is to help lower income to have certain amount of money to sustain living and prevent phantom worker( that worker just register in company but never work).
All are paid 20% of 1st $2k salary regardless age. That to reduce phantom worker, if taken out SG worker force will reduce by at least 3% trust me on this.
Company are exploiting the loop hole.

 

[TracyTan866]

Need to think about company financial burden.
20% after $2k maybe small about but is company have few hundred people that big amount.
What my ideas is to help lower income to have certain amount of money to sustain living and prevent phantom worker( that worker just register in company but never work).
All are paid 20% of 1st $2k salary regardless age. That to reduce phantom worker, if taken out SG worker force will reduce by at least 3% trust me on this.
Company are exploiting the loop hole.

Why shd MOM allow phantom workers?

 

[Cestbon]

Why shd MOM allow phantom workers?

MOM dont allow but there is loop hole.
U cannot prevent company from hire older worker. Company willing pay all CPF contribution where old worker CPF % is lower and declare $1k salary. Company just need to pay about $200/month on CPF for older worker and they get worker quota.
There nothing wrong with the law.
Up the CPF contribution to 20% try to narrow the loop hole will deter most company from employ phontom worker.

 

[TracyTan866]

MOM dont allow but there is loop hole.
U cannot prevent company from hire older worker. Company willing pay all CPF contribution where old worker CPF % is lower and declare $1k salary. Company just need to pay about $200/month on CPF for older worker and they get worker quota.
There nothing wrong with the law.
Up the CPF contribution to 20% try to narrow the loop hole will deter most company from employ phontom worker.

Why cant MOM prevent?

 

[Cestbon]

Why cant MOM prevent?

U really sleeping around all these year.
1. How to prevent??? you tell me>> if both employer and employee are happy and no one complaint>> even catch employee just said yes he/she go to work and employer also said yes worker come everyday.
2. If MOM want to close it they should employ me I will narrow the big loop hole now to small hole>> no way can close all the hole.

 

[TracyTan866]

U really sleeping around all these year.
1. How to prevent??? you tell me>> if both employer and employee are happy and no one complaint>> even catch employee just said yes he/she go to work and employer also said yes worker come everyday.
2. If MOM want to close it they should employ me I will narrow the big loop hole now to small hole>> no way can close all the hole.

MOM is the one which is sleeping, not me.

Does MOM concede that it has no way to close this loophole?

 

[Cestbon]

There is no 100% to close any hole for everything or for any rule and regulation. As long there is a way there will always a hole. The only way to close100% of the loop hole is no more employment.
But just a matter to reduce the hole.
MOM also know it for many year. There are always few case phantom worker been catch. Maybe employer dont pay CPF and employee go make report.
The thing in Sg as long as there no complaint there will be no one take action. That the SG gov.
Just see for your self no one complaint on HDB >> there will be no action to built more
No one complaint MRT breakdown>> there no action
SIMPLE summary no complaint>>> no need to work and no action.

 

[TracyTan866]

There is no 100% to close any hole for everything or for any rule and regulation. As long there is a way there will always a hole. The only way to close100% of the loop hole is no more employment.
But just a matter to reduce the hole.
MOM also know it for many year. There are always few case phantom worker been catch. Maybe employer dont pay CPF and employee go make report.
The thing in Sg as long as there no complaint there will be no one take action. That the SG gov.
Just see for your self no one complaint on HDB >> there will be no action to built more
No one complaint MRT breakdown>> there no action
SIMPLE summary no complaint>>> no need to work and no action.

if employers can blatantly get away, MOM is indeed sleeping

 

[Cestbon]

Then you tell me any ideas how to catch??
If both employer and employee word are same??? Meaning both are correct. No prove phantom worker.
Even black and white CPF contribution every month.

 

[TracyTan866]

Then you tell me any ideas how to catch??
If both employer and employee word are same??? Meaning both are correct. No prove phantom worker.
Even black and white CPF contribution every month.

It's not for you nor me to solve this problem. It's MOM's job to solve this problem. It has the govt's support, resources and legislations. MOM cant say it cant solve this issue.

 

[Cestbon]

It's not for you nor me to solve this problem. It's MOM's job to solve this problem. It has the govt's support, resources and legislations. MOM cant say it cant solve this issue.

This is typical Sinkie thinking. Is no my job?? They only complaint but no ideas or solution that will work and economical to do it.
I never complaint anything that if I have no ideas/solution.
All should work together give ideas and solution. No just complaint complaint>>> everyone also can complaint.

 

[TracyTan866]

This is typical Sinkie thinking. Is no my job?? They only complaint but no ideas or solution that will work and economical to do it.
I never complaint anything that if I have no ideas/solution.
All should work together give ideas and solution. No just complaint complaint>>> everyone also can complaint.

do you know the issue enough to come up with a comprehensive solution and do you have the authority to enact legislation to solve the problem or will MOM listen to you?

 

[TracyTan866]

This is typical Sinkie thinking. Is no my job?? They only complaint but no ideas or solution that will work and economical to do it.
I never complaint anything that if I have no ideas/solution.
All should work together give ideas and solution. No just complaint complaint>>> everyone also can complaint.

MOM has an Ag Minister, PS, DS, Directors, DDs, ADs, Staff officers, etc ...they also know the regulations inside out. Why cant they solve a problem and have to listen to you or I? Do you think you can offer a solution that's better than theirs?

 

[blur sotong]

Is it better for a Singaporean to remain on the Minimum Sum scheme rather than opt for CPF Life? If she takes $200 from her monthly payout and buy a life insurance plan that matures in 20years, she will probably have enough money even if she has a long life after 85years. Has anyone done the maths?

Sister Tracy,

No need to do the maths.

Whatever maths you do will be immaterial so long as you have Hole Jink & gang there. :(

CPF Minimum Sum is guaranteed by the government i.e. you get to withdraw all your minimum sum until the money runs out i.e. until you outlived the period of withdrawal.

CPF Life is a con job. In CPF Life, there will no payment if the fund is broke.

See the link below - check out Establishment of Lifelong Income Fund, Para 27N, (7) - Notwithstanding anything in this Part or the relevant regulations, the Board shall not make any payment under this Part unless the Lifelong Income Fund is solvent.

http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/aol/sear...-3ee0d7f21100" Status:inforce;rec=0#pr27N-he-.

Establishment of Lifelong Income Fund
27N.—
(1) The Board shall establish and maintain a fund to be known as the Lifelong Income Fund, into which shall be paid all premiums collected under section 27L, and out of which shall be met all payments to be made by the Board under this Part (including any costs and expenses incurred by the Board in establishing and maintaining the Scheme).

(2) The Lifelong Income Fund shall be controlled and administered by the Board.

(3) The moneys in the Lifelong Income Fund may be invested by the Board in accordance with the standard investment power of statutory bodies as defined in section 33A of the Interpretation Act (Cap. 1).

(4) Where a member is not entitled to any amount paid to him, or into his account in the Fund, under or purportedly under section 27K(6) or 27L(5), the Board may recover that amount —
(a)from any money standing to his credit in the Fund; or
(b)on his death, notwithstanding section 24(3A), from —
(i)his estate;
(ii)the moneys payable out of the Fund on his death; or
(iii)any person to whom any moneys referred to in sub-paragraph (ii) have been paid.

(5) Subsection (4) is without prejudice to any other right of action which the Board may have under any written law or rule of law.

(6) Any money recovered by the Board under subsection (4) shall be refunded to the Lifelong Income Fund.

(7) Notwithstanding anything in this Part or the relevant regulations, the Board shall not make any payment under this Part unless the Lifelong Income Fund is solvent.

 

[TracyTan866]

Sister Tracy,

No need to do the maths.

Whatever maths you do will be immaterial so long as you have Hole Jink & gang there.

CPF Minimum Sum is guaranteed by the government i.e. you get to withdraw all your minimum sum until the money runs out i.e. until you outlived the period of withdrawal.

CPF Life is a con job. In CPF Life, there will no payment if the fund is broke.

See the link below - check out Establishment of Lifelong Income Fund, Para 27N, (7) - Notwithstanding anything in this Part or the relevant regulations, the Board shall not make any payment under this Part unless the Lifelong Income Fund is solvent.

http://statutes.agc.gov.sg/aol/sear...-3ee0d7f21100" Status:inforce;rec=0#pr27N-he-.

thanks...so if you have a choice to opt, wld you remain on Minimum Sum?

 

[blur sotong]

Sister Tracy,

Guess you are aware that once you turned 55, CPF will deduct the annuity premium upfront on that day.

There are alot of Singaporeans who decided to leave Singapore and stayed elsewhere, remained there as PR.

If a chap decided to take up citizenship of that country and renouce his SG citizenship just after he turned 55, say 55 years and 1 week, he should be able to ask for close to full refund of the premium paid (less some admin fees)right?

Yes, that chap will get a refund. The question is how much will be refunded to that chap. $1? :*:

I asked CPF Board on this and they were non commital. No commitment as to how much refund that chap will get.

How to do the maths like that?

No wonder some folks equate CPF to Con People Fund.

 

[blur sotong]

thanks...so if you have a choice to opt, wld you remain on Minimum Sum?

Sister Tracy,

I am over 55 and have withdrawn all that I could withdraw. :p

If I am under 55, I will choose the Minimum Sum Scheme - which is guaranteed.

1 cent less also they cannot CHEAT.

 

[TracyTan866]

Sister Tracy,

Guess you are aware that once you turned 55, CPF will deduct the annuity premium upfront on that day.

There are alot of Singaporeans who decided to leave Singapore and stayed elsewhere, remained there as PR.

If a chap decided to take up citizenship of that country and renouce his SG citizenship just after he turned 55, say 55 years and 1 week, he should be able to ask for close to full refund of the premium paid (less some admin fees)right?

Yes, that chap will get a refund. The question is how much will be refunded to that chap. $1? :*:

I asked CPF Board on this and they were non commital. No commitment as to how much refund that chap will get.

How to do the maths like that?

No wonder some folks equate CPF to Con People Fund.

thank you for the elaboration. looks like CPF is all out to confuse singaporeans

 

[TracyTan866]

Sister Tracy,

I am over 55 and have withdrawn all that I could withdraw. :p

If I am under 55, I will choose the Minimum Sum Scheme - which is guaranteed.

1 cent less also they cannot.

excellent advice. I too believe the CPF Life is a big rip off.

i think those who have a choice shd opt to reject CPF Life

 

[blur sotong]

excellent advice. I too believe the CPF Life is a big rip off.

i think those who have a choice shd opt to reject CPF Life

Sister Tracy,

Can up me for that "excellent advice"? :p

Thank you!