Q&A: Saiful didn't tell me it was Anwar
Beh Lih Yi | Sep 5, 08 12:44pm
Dr Mohd Osman Abdul Hamid, the Pusrawi Hospital doctor who first examined Mohd Saiful Bukhari Azlan over a sodomy complaint, denied that he advised the latter to lodge a police report.
MCPX
In an interview with Malaysiakini yesterday, the doctor said contrary to certain media reports, he merely asked Saiful to go to a government hospital.
dr mohamed osman abdul hamid pusrawi hospital saiful bukhari azlan anwar ibrahim sodomy 2He also said that Saiful did not mention the name of the person who allegedly sodomised him.
The 23-year-old former aide of Opposition leader Anwar Ibrahim has accused the 61-year-old politician of sodomising him.
On June 28, Osman had examined Saiful hours before he filed a police report against Anwar after undergoing another examination at Hospital Kuala Lumpur.
Osman’s medical report, which found no evidence of sodomy, was later leaked to the media and the doctor has stood by his findings.
Below is the transcript of the interview:
Malaysiakini: Can you tell us what happened on June 28 when Saiful came to the hospital?
Osman: I can’t say exactly. At first, he saw one lady doctor and then he requested to see a male doctor because (he was) shy, so they sent him to my room.
When you met him, did he complain of being sodomised?
saiful bukhari azlan and anwar ibrahim sodomy 2 pc 150808 05I can’t answer. I saw Saiful (right) in my clinic and I questioned him, examined him - that was it.
Did he mention that he was sodomised by Anwar?
I can’t answer.
Did he mention any names?
No names. I’ll give my evidence in court. I just treated him as any other ordinary patient, I only knew (he was Saiful) after two days.
Did he appear nervous when he met you?
I can’t say.
Could you explain why you stated ‘to rule out sodomy, go to a government hospital’ at the end of the medical report?
That’s a standard procedure because if it is a medical legal case, we have to tell the patient to go to a government hospital. They have a team for specific examination - that is normal procedure.
There are people who interpret the phrase as meaning ‘you can’t confirm there were no signs of sodomy and thus you had to ask him to go to a government hospital to rule out sodomy’.
I am a doctor, I have 30 years experience. I have been seeing all these patients.
Your employer, Pusrawi Hospital, has said that you did not carry out a sodomy-related test. Is this true?
That is their view, I respect their comment. I will give my evidence in court.
Can you confirm it was a sodomy-related examination?
dr mohamed osman abdul hamid pusrawi hospital saiful bukhari azlan anwar ibrahim sodomy 2 interview 040908 08Normally every doctor can check - that is what we call per-rectal examination. Every doctor knows how to do it, that is normal practice, (one doesn’t) need to be a specialist for that examination. That’s it, I used the per-rectal examination.
So you are saying you're qualified to do it? The hospital said you are just a medical officer.
Yes. Every medical doctor can do the test. That is a very basic test.
Generally, how's the test carried out?
We have a look at the anus area, then we put the finger (in to) check whether everything is normal or abnormal, then we’ll put the proctoscope and look whether there is any bleeding, scar or (signs of) abnormality, that is what we call per-rectal examination.
Every doctor must know (this test). You just check (the results of) the examination (and), you may know everything.
In the statutory declaration, you claimed that the police tried to tamper with your witness statement, could you elaborate on this? You said it was the police who inserted Anwar’s name into your statement?
anwar pc permatang pauh 02 260808I don’t understand Bahasa (Malaysia), at that time they didn’t mention Datuk Seri’s (Anwar’s) name (in the witness statement), they just mentioned a VIP.
Did you ever advise Saiful to lodge a police report?
Never, never. I advised him to go to the general hospital or any government hospital.
You said you didn't know that the patient was Saiful - did you not get the patient’s folder with his name before you examined him?
There are so many patients. We (usually) see the patient, their face, (whether they are) male or female, our diagnosis - that’s what we get from the patient.
When I read the newspapers and saw his name in the newspaper, I didn’t know he was my patient. That afternoon when I started my duty I called my nurse and checked in the computer whether he was my patient.
(Then we confirmed) he came on June 28, only at that time I came to know he was my patient. The TV3 news showed Saiful’s photo (but) when I saw the photo I didn’t know (it was him) because the photo was different (from how he looked).
Were you surprised to read (in the newspapers) that he claimed he was sodomised - something that was totally different from what you found from the medical examination?
(Pauses) I will give the evidence in court.
Who usually keeps the medical record?
I am one of the doctors working there, there are so many patients, (these records) usually goes to the record office. (The medical record was) with me only for a few minutes. After seeing the patient, the nurse will take the patient’s folder and send it back to the counter.
(The folder was) with me just for a few minutes - 10 or 15 minutes - (because) while the patient is inside (the clinic), I have to write on that folder, once I finish, it will be kept by the (hospital’s) record office. We don't do the paperwork, we see the patients.
How many copies of the record will be kept by the hospital?
dr mohamed osman abdul hamid pusrawi hospital saiful bukhari azlan anwar ibrahim sodomy 2 interview 040908 06One folder for one patient.
Why did you decide to come out in public at this juncture?
After taking leave, I feel relieved and I decided to come back to Malaysia, I wanted to clear my name.
Have you spoken to the hospital management?
Not yet.
Do you wish to go back to Pusrawi Hospital after all that has happened?
At the moment, yes. If I have a chance to get another job, I will take the other job (laughs).
Were you under pressure all this while?
I got stressed because of the investigation, I have no experience, there were three times (of being questioned by the police) but the police never (pressured) me.
What about your family, were they under pressure?
My youngest daughter will sit for the UPSR exam next week, (we have been away for) one month. Yes, they were under pressure too.
Was there any harassment from the police or politicians?
No.
Since you have been thrust into the limelight, how can you carry on with your job?
I want my life back.
Watch 18-min video of Dr Osman's exclusive interview
Osman's statutory declaration in full
Beh Lih Yi | Sep 5, 08 12:44pm
Dr Mohd Osman Abdul Hamid, the Pusrawi Hospital doctor who first examined Mohd Saiful Bukhari Azlan over a sodomy complaint, denied that he advised the latter to lodge a police report.
MCPX
In an interview with Malaysiakini yesterday, the doctor said contrary to certain media reports, he merely asked Saiful to go to a government hospital.
dr mohamed osman abdul hamid pusrawi hospital saiful bukhari azlan anwar ibrahim sodomy 2He also said that Saiful did not mention the name of the person who allegedly sodomised him.
The 23-year-old former aide of Opposition leader Anwar Ibrahim has accused the 61-year-old politician of sodomising him.
On June 28, Osman had examined Saiful hours before he filed a police report against Anwar after undergoing another examination at Hospital Kuala Lumpur.
Osman’s medical report, which found no evidence of sodomy, was later leaked to the media and the doctor has stood by his findings.
Below is the transcript of the interview:
Malaysiakini: Can you tell us what happened on June 28 when Saiful came to the hospital?
Osman: I can’t say exactly. At first, he saw one lady doctor and then he requested to see a male doctor because (he was) shy, so they sent him to my room.
When you met him, did he complain of being sodomised?
saiful bukhari azlan and anwar ibrahim sodomy 2 pc 150808 05I can’t answer. I saw Saiful (right) in my clinic and I questioned him, examined him - that was it.
Did he mention that he was sodomised by Anwar?
I can’t answer.
Did he mention any names?
No names. I’ll give my evidence in court. I just treated him as any other ordinary patient, I only knew (he was Saiful) after two days.
Did he appear nervous when he met you?
I can’t say.
Could you explain why you stated ‘to rule out sodomy, go to a government hospital’ at the end of the medical report?
That’s a standard procedure because if it is a medical legal case, we have to tell the patient to go to a government hospital. They have a team for specific examination - that is normal procedure.
There are people who interpret the phrase as meaning ‘you can’t confirm there were no signs of sodomy and thus you had to ask him to go to a government hospital to rule out sodomy’.
I am a doctor, I have 30 years experience. I have been seeing all these patients.
Your employer, Pusrawi Hospital, has said that you did not carry out a sodomy-related test. Is this true?
That is their view, I respect their comment. I will give my evidence in court.
Can you confirm it was a sodomy-related examination?
dr mohamed osman abdul hamid pusrawi hospital saiful bukhari azlan anwar ibrahim sodomy 2 interview 040908 08Normally every doctor can check - that is what we call per-rectal examination. Every doctor knows how to do it, that is normal practice, (one doesn’t) need to be a specialist for that examination. That’s it, I used the per-rectal examination.
So you are saying you're qualified to do it? The hospital said you are just a medical officer.
Yes. Every medical doctor can do the test. That is a very basic test.
Generally, how's the test carried out?
We have a look at the anus area, then we put the finger (in to) check whether everything is normal or abnormal, then we’ll put the proctoscope and look whether there is any bleeding, scar or (signs of) abnormality, that is what we call per-rectal examination.
Every doctor must know (this test). You just check (the results of) the examination (and), you may know everything.
In the statutory declaration, you claimed that the police tried to tamper with your witness statement, could you elaborate on this? You said it was the police who inserted Anwar’s name into your statement?
anwar pc permatang pauh 02 260808I don’t understand Bahasa (Malaysia), at that time they didn’t mention Datuk Seri’s (Anwar’s) name (in the witness statement), they just mentioned a VIP.
Did you ever advise Saiful to lodge a police report?
Never, never. I advised him to go to the general hospital or any government hospital.
You said you didn't know that the patient was Saiful - did you not get the patient’s folder with his name before you examined him?
There are so many patients. We (usually) see the patient, their face, (whether they are) male or female, our diagnosis - that’s what we get from the patient.
When I read the newspapers and saw his name in the newspaper, I didn’t know he was my patient. That afternoon when I started my duty I called my nurse and checked in the computer whether he was my patient.
(Then we confirmed) he came on June 28, only at that time I came to know he was my patient. The TV3 news showed Saiful’s photo (but) when I saw the photo I didn’t know (it was him) because the photo was different (from how he looked).
Were you surprised to read (in the newspapers) that he claimed he was sodomised - something that was totally different from what you found from the medical examination?
(Pauses) I will give the evidence in court.
Who usually keeps the medical record?
I am one of the doctors working there, there are so many patients, (these records) usually goes to the record office. (The medical record was) with me only for a few minutes. After seeing the patient, the nurse will take the patient’s folder and send it back to the counter.
(The folder was) with me just for a few minutes - 10 or 15 minutes - (because) while the patient is inside (the clinic), I have to write on that folder, once I finish, it will be kept by the (hospital’s) record office. We don't do the paperwork, we see the patients.
How many copies of the record will be kept by the hospital?
dr mohamed osman abdul hamid pusrawi hospital saiful bukhari azlan anwar ibrahim sodomy 2 interview 040908 06One folder for one patient.
Why did you decide to come out in public at this juncture?
After taking leave, I feel relieved and I decided to come back to Malaysia, I wanted to clear my name.
Have you spoken to the hospital management?
Not yet.
Do you wish to go back to Pusrawi Hospital after all that has happened?
At the moment, yes. If I have a chance to get another job, I will take the other job (laughs).
Were you under pressure all this while?
I got stressed because of the investigation, I have no experience, there were three times (of being questioned by the police) but the police never (pressured) me.
What about your family, were they under pressure?
My youngest daughter will sit for the UPSR exam next week, (we have been away for) one month. Yes, they were under pressure too.
Was there any harassment from the police or politicians?
No.
Since you have been thrust into the limelight, how can you carry on with your job?
I want my life back.
Watch 18-min video of Dr Osman's exclusive interview
Osman's statutory declaration in full
