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finish liao! billions wasted! vaccine not effective against new covid variants!

kaninabuchaojibye

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Emerging evidence suggests new coronavirus variant could be problematic for vaccines
cnn.com
Pharmacist Jason Hyde fills syringes with the Moderna Covid-19 vaccine as first responders wait to receive it at UMass Memorial Hospital in Marlborough, Massachusetts on January 12, 2021. - First Responders started to receive their vaccinations on January 11, as part of the phase one of vaccinations roll out in Massachusetts. (Photo by Joseph Prezioso / AFP) (Photo by JOSEPH PREZIOSO/AFP via Getty Images)
(CNN)As researchers around the world race to see if new coronavirus variants will pose a problem for the vaccines, a second study in two days says a variant from South Africa could possibly do just that.

The variant was first spotted in South Africa in October and has now been found in more than a dozen countries.

In both studies, the work was done in the lab and not in people, so more research is needed to gauge the true threat of the new variant.

In the most recent study, which was small, researchers took antibodies from six people who were hospitalized with Covid-19 before the new variant was discovered. They found to varying degrees, that antibodies for all six of the survivors were unable to fully fight off the virus.

Studies suggest vaccinated people protected from new Covid-19 variants

"I think the evidence is building that these mutations -- and I think other mutations -- will emerge across the globe -- and are emerging already -- that are escaping antibodies from previous infection," Alex Sigal, a virologist at the Africa Health Research Institute and the Max Planck Institute for Infection Biology, told CNN. "It's concerning."

It's unclear whether this means someone would be vulnerable to the new variant if they'd already had Covid-19, or what this might mean for people who've been vaccinated.

Sigal's findings were very similar to those of a study released Tuesday by the National Institute for Communicable Diseases in South Africa.

"When you see two groups independently arriving at same basic answer, that good -- there's more consonance that they are correct," said Jesse Bloom, a virologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center.

A third study, also released Tuesday, showed that mutations in the new variant allowed them to evade some of the immunity induced by vaccination, but it was far from a complete escape.

That study looked at far fewer mutations in the variant than the South African studies examined.

None of the studies were peer reviewed or published in medical journals.
While scientists work out whether these variants are particularly dangerous -- and studies are underway in several labs worldwide -- one thing is clear: Get the vaccine if you can.

Variant might partially evade protection from vaccines or prior infection, early research suggests

"I would for sure get it if I could," Sigal said. "My father-in-law had the opportunity to fly to Israel and get it, and I was shooing him out of the house because you can't get it here in South Africa."

In his research, Sigal found that antibodies from all six study subjects failed to fully fight off the new variant.

"One participant had a fairly good response, but nobody escaped unscathed," he said.

These coronavirus variants are keeping scientists awake at night

The study was posted on the website for KRISP, the Kwazulu-Natal Research Innnovation and Sequencing Platform. The other two studies were posted on a pre-print server.

In the study that had similar findings, blood was drawn from 44 people in South Africa who'd had Covid-19. Nearly all of their cases were confirmed to have occurred prior to September, which is before the variant was spotted in South Africa.

The researchers then looked to see whether their antibodies would fight off the new variant.

For about half of the 44 people, their antibodies were powerless against the new variant. For the other half, the antibody response was weakened, but not totally knocked out.

In the third study, done at Rockefeller University, researchers looked at blood from 20 people who had received either the Moderna or the Pfizer vaccine. Different mutations in the viruses did allow some escape from some types of antibodies, but the volunteers' immune systems threw an army of different types of antibodies at the viruses.

Sign up here to get The Results Are In with Dr. Sanjay Gupta every Tuesday from the CNN Health team.

The Rockefeller study looked at fewer mutations than the two South African studies. It looked at three key mutations on the spikes that sit atop the coronavirus, since that's the part of the virus targeted by the vaccines.

"That's useful, but still not the complete story," said John Moore, a vaccine researcher at Weill Cornell Medicine.

The South African studies, however, used the virus itself, or a model of it, which contained eight spike mutations.

John Bonifield and Amanda Sealy cotributed to this report
 

Leongsam

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I've been saying the same thing for months!

Social distancing, masks, lockdowns, handwashing.... whatever......... NOTHING is going to stop the virus.

They may slow it down, even halt the spread temporarily but nothing will get rid of the virus permanently. It will just continue to spread the same way influenza has done for hundreds of thousands of years. Man does not control nature and cannot change the laws of physics, chemistry and biology.

The sooner we allow the virus to spread throughout the general population the sooner some degree of immunity will be established and the mortality rate will then drop significantly to the point where it is far less lethal than the flu.

Coronaviruses have been around for a long time. When the existing variants first appeared on the scene I'm sure they caused a surge in deaths amongst the vulnerable too. Over time they became relatively harmless.

99.97% of the population hasn't even be touched by this pandemic based on the official numbers. What is there to worry about? You're more likely to be killed by a car than to die of Covid.
 

knnccb

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I've been saying the same thing for months!

Social distancing, masks, lockdowns, handwashing.... whatever......... NOTHING is going to stop the virus.

They may slow it down, even halt the spread temporarily but nothing will get rid of the virus permanently. It will just continue to spread the same way influenza has done for hundreds of thousands of years. Man does not control nature and cannot change the laws of physics, chemistry and biology.

The sooner we allow the virus to spread throughout the general population the sooner some degree of immunity will be established and the mortality rate will then drop significantly to the point where it is far less lethal than the flu.


shall moi help u to cut n paste this brilliant writeup over to the other mask advocating thread?
 

tanwahtiu

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The day will come where wear masks is ban becos chiko per go round to grope woman boobs and ass. Then wear a cap lagi cannot see hair head full camafloug to do cheeky things...

Victim cannot identify man w mask on. Failed miserably. Human is like that getting gutsy overtime do cheeky things on women grabbing their boobs and arses.
 

tanwahtiu

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3 billions depopulation is targeted. Long process take 20 years...

See u as one of the trees or plants in the jungle, forest, parks or someone backyard plant in yr next life for naughty boy like u porn site owners.


I've been saying the same thing for months!

Social distancing, masks, lockdowns, handwashing.... whatever......... NOTHING is going to stop the virus.

They may slow it down, even halt the spread temporarily but nothing will get rid of the virus permanently. It will just continue to spread the same way influenza has done for hundreds of thousands of years. Man does not control nature and cannot change the laws of physics, chemistry and biology.

The sooner we allow the virus to spread throughout the general population the sooner some degree of immunity will be established and the mortality rate will then drop significantly to the point where it is far less lethal than the flu.

Coronaviruses have been around for a long time. When the existing variants first appeared on the scene I'm sure they caused a surge in deaths amongst the vulnerable too. Over time they became relatively harmless.

99.97% of the population hasn't even be touched by this pandemic based on the official numbers. What is there to worry about? You're more likely to be killed by a car than to die of Covid.
 

Leongsam

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3 billions depopulation is targeted. Long process take 20 years...

See u as one of the trees or plants in the jungle, forest, parks or someone backyard plant in yr next life for naughty boy like u porn site owners.

I wish something does come along to depopulate the planet. It is long overdue. However Covid-19 is not lethal enough by a long shot. It would need to kill at least 20% to 30% of those it infects not 0.2% or less.

It also needs to kill the young not the elderly. Killing the elderly makes no difference because the young are the ones making babies. Kill 3 out of 10 children and the earth's population will take a big hit.

On the other hand killing 3 out of 10 85 year olds does absolutely nothing for mother earth.
 

tanwahtiu

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There is now 1 billion jakleowbee baby boomers to deal with and get rid of them is much easier. They are target first, nevertheless. The remaing 2 billions get rid of bad stocks religious type and India cheats...

As to the younger ones they already hv birth rate problems. Baby boomers only produce 2 to 3 child family not enough for the next generation to over populate the world again.

there will soon be shortage of human forming a couple to make 1 baby.

until polygamy is allowed, women can choose to make babies with the best male available create best gene next population. Get rid of Trump type stupid gene low ses group.

Until engineers take over create babies outside the female wombs... having 1 to 2 baby only is enough to get by.

then gahmen take over farm babies once the engineers invented baby outside the female wombs, same goes to farming domestic animals for food the same way....



I wish something does come along to depopulate the planet. It is long overdue. However Covid-19 is not lethal enough by a long shot. It would need to kill at least 20% to 30% of those it infects not 0.2% or less.

It also needs to kill the young not the elderly. Killing the elderly makes no difference because the young are the ones making babies. Kill 3 out of 10 children and the earth's population will take a big hit.

On the other hand killing 3 out of 10 85 year olds does absolutely nothing for mother earth.
 

Xisiqomelir

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Oh hey look, vaccinations don't work on viruses!

@nayr69sg please give us 2 para of pathology and immunology to help our lay understanding of why this is so
 

Leongsam

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Oh hey look, vaccinations don't work on viruses!

@nayr69sg please give us 2 para of pathology and immunology to help our lay understanding of why this is so

Vaccinations work very well on viruses like chickenpox, smallpox, measles, polio etc and bacterial infections eg tetanus and TB.

However they are no so effective when the virus continuously mutates and has multiple strains eg influenza, rhinovirus and coronavirus.
 

myfoot123

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99.97% of the population hasn't even be touched by this pandemic based on the official numbers. What is there to worry about? You're more likely to be killed by a car than to die of Covid.
We are worried that the virus is smarter than human like you. If you don't eradicate it, you are going to face the inevitable of being destroyed by it someday.
 

Leongsam

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We are worried that the virus is smarter than human like you. If you don't eradicate it, you are going to face the inevitable of being destroyed by it someday.

It's not going to be eradicated no matter what you do. Even measles, which is unable to mutate and still be infectious has not been eradicated despite a vaccine being available since 1963.

To think that lockdowns, masks and vaccines can eliminate a virus that mutates rapidly is really farfetched.
 

cocobobo

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Vaccinations work very well on viruses like chickenpox, smallpox, measles, polio etc and bacterial infections eg tetanus and TB.

However they are no so effective when the virus continuously mutates and has multiple strains eg influenza, rhinovirus and coronavirus.
The issue is influenza and rhinovirus have no long term effect but covid19 seems to be different. Cant quantify though whether stories like below from reddit sg represent majority.

So i have this uncle. Mid-forties, jogs almost daily, goes for swims, eats healthy, has never smoked -- a gold star when it comes to health. Then last about mid last year he got diagnosed with covid. It wasn't too bad for him and he recovered in about 2 weeks. But now, about 5-6 months on, he is constantly fatigued. Like a short walk to a nearby market would have him panting. It has seriously affected - diminished rather - his standard of living.

I've also read reports - most recently one from ST - that 3 out 4 covid patients suffer from longterm effects including fatigue, insomnia, memory loss, taste/smell loss.

My point is, we seem to be taking covid less seriously now. I can wager that many Singaporeans are seeing it as no more than some flu, which if you contract, you just wait for it to go away. But covid is much, much scarier than that. It stays with you for who knows how long. And the longterm effects are not the least unpleasant. Do remain cautious and stay safe!
 

myfoot123

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To think that lockdowns, masks and vaccines can eliminate a virus that mutates rapidly is really farfetched.
You cannot stop crime from happening, but you can still lock up the criminal being caught. Same logic of using vaccines to curb pandemic.
 

Leongsam

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The issue is influenza and rhinovirus have no long term effect but covid19 seems to be different. Cant quantify though whether stories like below from reddit sg represent majority.

I caught influenza in 1993 and the effects lasted more than 6 months. It took a year for me to recover to full fitness.

Even if you’re usually healthy, the flu can knock you off your feet for days -- even weeks.
And it doesn’t always happen, but there's a chance that it could lead to more serious health problems, or "complications," like sinusitis (sinus infections), bronchitis, or pneumonia.
But if you know what the symptoms are and how to take precautions, you can avoid these problems and stay healthy.
What Is the Flu?
It's a very contagious disease caused by the influenza virus. People tend to catch it most often in the fall and winter. It comes on fast and strong, spreading through your upper respiratory tract and sometimes invading your lungs.
What Are the Symptoms?
You may have:

What Are the Most Common Complications?
They include viral or bacterial pneumonia, dehydration, and ear infections and sinus infections, especially in children. The flu can worsen long-term medical conditions, like congestive heart failure, asthma, or diabetes.
You might also have muscle inflammation (myositis), problems with your central nervous system, and heart problems such as heart attacks, inflammation of the organ (myocarditis), and inflammation of the sac around it (pericarditis).
Who’s Most Likely to Have Flu Complications?
  • Adults over 65
  • Children ages 6 months to 4 years
  • Nursing home residents
  • Adults and children with heart or lung disease
  • People with compromised immune systems (including people with HIV/AIDS)
  • Pregnant women

What About Pneumonia?
It can happen when the flu virus enters your lung or when you get a bacterial infection during the course of the illness. Pneumonia can make you quite ill and may send you to the hospital.
It can cause chills, fever, chest pains, and sweating. You might have a cough with green or bloody mucus. You could notice a faster pulse, and your lips or nails might have a bluish tint because of a lack of oxygen. Other symptoms include shortness of breath and sharp pains in your chest when you take a deep breath. Seniors may only notice a pain in the belly.
When you get a bacterial infection with the flu, your symptoms may get better at first. Then they get worse with high fevers, more coughing, and a greenish tinge to what you’re coughing up.
Call your doctor if you have a cough that won’t stop, a bad fever, or if you get shortness of breath or chest pains. The doctor can do tests to find out if you have pneumonia. Antibiotics can treat bacterial pneumonia, but these meds can't treat viral pneumonia.
How Long Does Pneumonia Last?
It can hang around for about 2 weeks, or even longer in young children, elderly adults, and those who have weakened immune systems or ongoing illness like COPD or asthma. Even healthy people may feel tired or weak for a month or more after their lungs clear up.
Is There a Vaccine for Pneumonia?
There are 2 types: pneumococcal polysaccharide vaccine (PPSV23) for adults and the pneumococcal conjugate vaccine (PCV13) for children.
The adult vaccine protects against 23 types of bacteria that commonly cause pneumonia. Doctors suggest that healthy seniors over 65 get both vaccines. The timing and sequence in which you get them will vary depending on what vaccines you’ve already had.

Some experts say adults younger than 55 should get both vaccines to boost their immune system. The pneumonia vaccine isn’t recommended for pregnant women. But it can help people at increased risk for infections, like those with:
Children under age 2 should get four doses of the PCV13 vaccine. Tots between 2 and 4 who didn’t get the pneumonia vaccine series should get a single vaccine. Children 6 to 18 with health problems should get a single dose of PCV13 whether they had shots already or not.
When Should I Call the Doctor?
Call them if you have a high fever and a hard time breathing. Other serious symptoms include:
  • Fever with shaking chills
  • Coughing with blood-tinged mucus from the lungs
  • Trouble breathing
  • Rapid breathing
  • Shortness of breath
  • Chest pains
  • Wheezing
Can I Avoid These Complications?
Many can be managed. But some, depending on how weak your immune system is, can’t be prevented.

If you do get the flu, call your doctor within 48 hours after your symptoms show up. Ask about a flu antiviral drug. If you get them early enough, they can help ease your symptoms and help you get well sooner.
 

Leongsam

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You cannot stop crime from happening, but you can still lock up the criminal being caught. Same logic of using vaccines to curb pandemic.

I'm all for vaccines which are safe and proven. I take my flu shot annually.

However we are not going to eliminate the virus so there is no point locking down or wearing masks. If the Covid vaccines work then the infection can be managed the same way we manage influenza ie a shot annually for the prevailing strains to keep the death toll low. However we are never going to have zero deaths or zero cases. If the deaths are of the same order as influenza deaths there is nothing further that can be done.

So expect around 200,000 covid related deaths every year give or take tens of thousands depending upon how effective the vaccine is and how lethal the prevailing strain is.
 
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