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CitiGroup Will Still Collaspe Later....Don't Touch Stocks......

ahleebabasingaporethief

Alfrescian
Loyal
There is no such thing as "too big to fall" anymore. I had rather see Lehman rescued than Citi.

If you look at the so called "rescue", $20b in cash and $300b in guarantees is only enough to cover ONE percent of risky Citi's $37trillion rubbish.

The real reason why they "rescue" Citi is to try to bring the share price to above $5 before year's end. If not, all big investors like funds will have to sell as they are not allowed to hold shares below$5 in their portfolios.

Don't be Conned.
:mad:
 
Last edited:

ahleebabasingaporethief

Alfrescian
Loyal
You are right. JP Morgan wants to be the last bank standing but gut feeling is BOA and JP Morgan call die too.

You are right. There have been numerous talk shows on this topic. Citi was unanamous choice amongst penalists to be first followed by BOA.

If you read enough "underground stuff" both Citi and BOA are suppose to be used by the CeeAyeA.

So if that really is the case, now with governments around the world using their conutries' reserves to guarantee deposits, what better way to get at a country's reserves then by letting let's say Citigroup collaspe. All countries that have guaranteed deposits will have to pay from their reserves?

Ficton? Can't figure. Can you?
 

theblackhole

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
i think the whole monetary system will all collapse.it's now impossible to save any bank at all. seek your own salvation.look after yourself and your family.no one is going to bail you out. you finish your business. you die your business.

don't keep on pumping punctured tyres or keep feeding a dead horse.

singaporeans should learn to say NO and look after ourselves...and stop being conned again and again. majulah singapura!!!
 

Leegimeremover

Alfrescian
Loyal
You are right. There have been numerous talk shows on this topic. Citi was unanamous choice amongst penalists to be first followed by BOA.

If you read enough "underground stuff" both Citi and BOA are suppose to be used by the CeeAyeA.

So if that really is the case, now with governments around the world using their conutries' reserves to guarantee deposits, what better way to get at a country's reserves then by letting let's say Citigroup collaspe. All countires that have guaranteed deposits will have to pay from their reserves?

Ficton? Can't figure. Can you?

A very insightful moniker once cautioned LKY from being act smart and play SWF. Now USA play global financial warfare using xixindafa, sucking in all liquidity with dollar imperialism. BTW, Citigroup is said to accept mafia money from Bollywood
 

ahleebabasingaporethief

Alfrescian
Loyal
i think the whole monetary system will all collapse.it's now impossible to save any bank at all. seek your own salvation.look after yourself and your family.no one is going to bail you out. you finish your business. you die your business.

don't keep on pumping punctured tyres or keep feeding a dead horse.

singaporeans should learn to say NO and look after ourselves...and stop being conned again and again. majulah singapura!!!


There could only be strngth in numbers. This is something sadly lacking in Singapore.

Thats why the PAPies can rule this long. If more come out openly to support others, Papies will fail.

Mr. Tan asked for 100,000 signatures. If he gathers 500,000 in the process, the papaies would have shitted in their pants for sure.
 

lifeafter41

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
There is no such thing as "too big to fall" anymore. I had rather see Lehman rescued than Citi.

If you look at the so called "rescue", $20b in cash and $300b in guarantees is only enough to cover ONE percent of risky Citi's $37trillion rubbish.

The real reason why they "rescue" Citi is to try to bring the share price to above $5 before year's end. If not, all big investors like funds will have to sell as they are not allowed to hold shares below$5 in their portfolios.

Don't be Conned.
:mad:

Whether the share price will hold remains to be seen as there is still another month to go before year end closing.

Meanwhile what is this 37trillion loan portfolio?. Understand the toxic asset they are carrying is related to the mortgage asset. It should be more than the 300 billion. In any case, the foreclosure in the US is still on going and it's going to get worse with all the ARM resetting next year.
 

Leegimeremover

Alfrescian
Loyal
Whether the share price will hold remains to be seen as there is still another month to go before year end closing.

Meanwhile what is this 37trillion loan portfolio?. Understand the toxic asset they are carrying is related to the mortgage asset. It should be more than the 300 billion. In any case, the foreclosure in the US is still on going and it's going to get worse with all the ARM resetting next year.

All other derivatives. If Citi dies, the derivatives get left hanging there, which was the Lehman problem. If no one can do a proper transition, those derivatives become null and void, the world gets fucked.
 

ahleebabasingaporethief

Alfrescian
Loyal
Whether the share price will hold remains to be seen as there is still another month to go before year end closing.

Meanwhile what is this 37trillion loan portfolio?. Understand the toxic asset they are carrying is related to the mortgage asset. It should be more than the 300 billion. In any case, the foreclosure in the US is still on going and it's going to get worse with all the ARM resetting next year.


In the last 2 days, Citi's toxic assets were valued at more than $306b ONLY.

Can you believe this? How can anyone put a finger to a figure at this time?

Nobody knows for sure.

Citi has always been a very secretive bank. If only 30% of their portfoilio is toxic, we are looking at almost $10 trillion. All these scenarios are from expert penalists on talk shows around the world.
 

jbsmith

Alfrescian
Loyal
singaporeans should learn to say NO and look after ourselves...and stop being conned again and again. majulah singapura!!!

Singapore is putting more money into Standard Chartered Bank.

3rd UPDATE: Standard Chartered Plans GBP1.78 Billion Rights Issue
Dow Jones
November 24, 2008: 07:30 AM EST

(Adds comments from group chief executive on capital adequacy, HKMA on note- issuing banks in Hong Kong, and analysts' comments on the plan.)

HONG KONG -(Dow Jones)- Standard Chartered PLC (STAN.LN) said Monday it plans to raise GBP1.78 billion (US$2.66 billion) in a rights issue to strengthen its balance sheet, as the financial crisis continues to take its toll on the world's largest banks.

The U.K. lender said the proceeds from the rights issue won't only boost its capital but also give it flexibility to take advantage of emerging opportunities.

"This rights issue is different from many others that you have seen from other banks. It's not to fill a hole," Group Chief Executive Peter Sands told reporters in a conference call. "2009 is full of challenges for any bank, anywhere in the world. That is why we see merit in having a capital buffer."

The rights issue could also give Singapore's state investment company Temasek Holdings Pte. Ltd., which is underwriting the deal, a rare opportunity to boost its stake in the emerging market-focused lender beyond its current 19% holding.

The U.K. lender said it will issue 470 million new shares, or 30 new shares for every 91 existing shares, at 390 pence each, representing a 48.7% discount to the stock's closing price Friday.

In Hong Kong, the issue price will be HK$45.11 a share. Standard Chartered was down 6.4% in Hong Kong at HK$88.00 before trading was suspended two minutes into Monday's afternoon session.

Standard Chartered said Temasek will take part in the rights issue, both as a shareholder and an underwriter.

On top of the 19% it is entitled to buy as a shareholder, it is also underwriting another 14% of the new shares, allowing it not only to avoid a dilution of its current holding, but to raise it further.

"In theory, it can raise its stake to 22%. But it's only hypothetically. It is still subject to regulatory approval," Sands said in the conference call.

A Temasek official, who declined to be named, confirmed the company's participation, but wouldn't elaborate further.

People familiar with the situation said Temasek is interested in boosting its stake to beyond 20%.

"They would like to boost the stake above 20%. This is the one bank in Asia that they really believe in," said one person.

Temasek last increased its stake in Standard Chartered on Jan. 23, bringing its ownership closer to the 20% foreign ownership limit that the Hong Kong Monetary Authority imposes on bank-note issuers in the city.

A further increase in Temasek's holding may mean Standard Chartered would lose its role as one of Hong Kong's three bank-note issuers.

"Our position is very clear," HKMA Chief Executive Joseph Yam told reporters in Beijing Monday, when asked about the ownership cap. "If the rights issue results in a foreign government owning more than 20% of the lender, then it can't continue to issue notes."

The HKMA restriction was announced in July last year to ensure that none of Hong Kong's bank-note issuers has a "close association with any foreign government or foreign government-controlled entity", which controls a stake of 20% or more.

Rights Issue To Boost Capital Adequacy

The other underwriters of Standard Chartered's rights issue are J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. (JPM), UBS AG (UBS), and Goldman Sachs Group Inc. (GS), Standard Chartered said.

The new shares, which are expected to start trading Dec. 23, would increase the lender's total Tier 1 capital adequacy ratio by 1.3 percentage point to 9.8% on a pro-forma basis, the bank said.

Standard Chartered didn't say what its capital adequacy ratio will be after the rights issue. Its total Tier 1 ratio was 8.5% at the end of June.

Investment bank Deutsche Bank AG said the issue is positive in bringing the lender's capital adequacy "more in line" with peers, but Nomura Holdings Inc. said the prospective ratio "doesn't look particularly high to us, given the level other banks are now achieving."

Swiss investment bank Credit Suisse Group reported a Tier 1 ratio of 10.4% by the end of September, while UBS had a ratio of 10.8%.

The new shares will effectively dilute the final dividend to be paid out, as Standard Chartered said it will keep the aggregate amount as it would have done had the rights issue not been implemented.

It said the level of dividends in the future will depend on its expected future earnings, capital requirements and prevailing financial and business conditions.

-By Amy Or and Costas Paris, Dow Jones Newswires; 852-2802-7002; amy.or@ dowjones.com

(Nisha Gopalan and Jeffrey Ng in Hong Kong contributed to this article.)
 

ahleebabasingaporethief

Alfrescian
Loyal
Latest:

'Citigroup Common is Toast'

Christopher Whalen of Institutional Risk Analytics said the deal to save Citigroup [C 5.95 2.18 (+57.82%) ] means that the financial giant's common stock has effectively been written off:

"The government is continuing to pretend they're just like any investor. And they're not."

He said the government will have to break up Citi and sell its pieces.

Whalen expects JPMorgan Chase to face a similar fate in coming months.
 

AWARENESS

Alfrescian
Loyal
Despite the US Govt's massive Citigroup bailout, it is going to be difficult for the global banking system to survive the shock to confidence for very long.
On Oct 11,2008, the Managing Director of the IMF in a wire statement: "Intensifying solvency concerns about a number of the largest US based and European financial institutions have pushed the global financial system to the brink of systemic meltdown."
Implication: So many of the world's largest banks were so close to bankruptcy, the entire global banking system was vulnerable to a massive collapse. And the primary cause : DERIVATIVES.
On June 30, 2008,the US Comptroller of the currency (OCC)reported that US commercial banks held USD182.1 trillion in notional value(face value) derivatives.
And according to the Bank of International Settlements(BIS), which produced a tally six months earlier for the entire world, the global pile-up of derivatives, including institutions in the US, Europe and Asia was USD596 trilion.
Based on OCC mid year data:
Citibank N.A.,the primary banking unit of Citigroup held USD37.1trillion
in derivative bets. Only 1.7% of the bets were under any exchange purview. The balance - 98.3% was direct one-on-one bets with their trading partners outside of any exchange.
Bank of Ameriva(BOA) a slighty bigger player held USD 39.7trillion in derivative bets. 93.4% were traded outside of any exchange.
JP Morgan Chase-the biggest of them all, controlled half of all derivatives in the US banking system, held USD 87.3 trillion in derivative bets. 95 .7% were outside the purview of any exchange.
What it means:
BOA was exposed to a tune of 194.3% of its capital, i.e for every USD 1.00 capital BOA was risking USD 1.94 strictly on the promises made by its betting partners.
At Citibank, the risk was greater USD 2.58 in exposure for every dollar of capital.
JP Morgan Chase was even worse. For every dollar of capital, the bank was risking USD 4.30 on the credit of its betting partners. It also has the largest default exposure.
Going forward if Lehman Brothers derivative bets were "only" USD7.1trillion and causing such financial turmoils, the collapse of Citigroup or any of the other two banking giants would ultimately lead to a shutdown of he global banking system.
IMMINENT COLLAPSE.....ANY BETS?
 
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