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MP Material - Lessons learnt

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Like everything in life, there are always lessons to be gleaned. The recent YSL incident is one.

My sense is that people were not surprised with his womanising ways as to his conduct after the affairs came to light. The refusal to front WP CEC to explain his position and his flight as the decision to expel him became apparent. How did this person end up been given the role.

Shortly after GE2006, Yaw dropped a clanger by revealing that he voted for the PAP. It did not matter to him that during the GE rallies, he was asking Singaporeans to vote WP and reject PAP. It did not matter to him that there was something inherently wrong with his argument. I have no doubt that public figures do not reveal their votes as they are secret. But to make ti public showed an individual that had little in terms of acumen.

My sense is that he was chosen for loyalty and for the work that he put in for the party.

I am also aware that the opposition does not have rich pool of good candidates to start with and this may have been a factor. I suppose the best lesson learnt is not the proper assessment of candidates which I am sure they did, but not only working the ground but actively building the pool of capable candidates from the word go.

I am sure the recent climate encourages that.
 

myfoot123

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
If you allow your son to run-road from serving NS during his productive time, but you work the ground you still have high chance to become the next president - scandal or not. TT is the best example on this planet.
 

Thick Face Black Heart

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
The saga highlights just how uneven the playing field still is. If Yaw was in PAP he would have been protected and then quietly removed in 2016.

Unfortunately the predatory MSM and non-stop hounding tactics will only serve to intensify the climate of fear existing in opposition politics. Remove a bad egg with enough viciousness, and soon even the average eggs will find reason to stay away.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
I am actually encouraged by the quality of the opposition candidates that came forward. I understand the PAP was surprised by the turnout. Besides CSM, there was Michelle, Nicole, JJ, GG, Pritam, VW, TT, HP etc. It was quite unexpected frankly and it cut across the age spectrum. I am pretty sure that this trend will continue.

People are looking for change and even if the PAP was benevolent, humble and empathetic, the desire for change and variety would continue to prevail.

PAP is also not the only one facing the threat. With the older ones leaving this world, the traditional appeal of WP may not meet the needs of newer generation. They have already have the blend but they need to project the blend more prominently.

The State Press and the Journalists will I am sure be increasingly isolated if they are not prepared to change. People like Ken Kwek will leave. I am not sure how much of their dignity they are prepared to lose.
 
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Nice-Gook

Alfrescian
Loyal
This thread is a joke.

Every-time,I mention the same about Sylvia Lim.

Scroo comes down blazing with his iron rod hammering it down.

What can one say about the quality of Madam Sylvia Lim as the head of opposition against PAP?

At least Yaw's fault-line is what most man cannot control...the urge to sow his wild oats.

How to explain Sylvia fornicating hypocritical urge to defend PAP against all odds ?

If had a chance to choose between Yaw honest arrogance and Sylvia hypocritical humility. I choose honest arrogance .
 

waterloong

Alfrescian
Loyal
I am actually encouraged by the quality of the opposition candidates that came forward. I understand the PAP was surprised by the turnout. Besides CSM, there was Michelle, Nicole, JJ, GG, Pritam, VW, TT, HP etc. It was quite unexpected frankly and it cut across the age spectrum. I am pretty sure that this trend will continue.

People are looking for change and even if the PAP was benevolent, humble and empathetic, the desire for change and variety would continue to prevail.

PAP is also not the only one facing the threat. With the older ones leaving this world, the traditional appeal of WP may not meet the needs of newer generation. They have already have the blend but they need to project the blend more prominently.

The State Press and the Journalists will I am sure be increasingly isolated if they are not prepared to change. People like Ken Kwek will leave. I am not sure how much of their dignity they are prepared to lose.

Ken Kwek has already left ST , away from the evil clutches of your favourite ST political editor Chua Lee Hong.
 
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Thick Face Black Heart

Alfrescian (InfP)
Generous Asset
To clarify, I don't believe good people will be deterred from coming forth either, and in fact more will show up in 2016.

The PAP is trying its old slate of gimmicks like threats of defamation suits and character assassination including usage of the mass media to intimidate or spread vicious rumours. These are decades old stuff and I think they will work less and less as the desire for change becomes more deeply rooted in the mainstream culture.
 

ThePlen

Alfrescian
Loyal
i think what is holding good people from coming forward is the hardwork. to be in the opp party in sg is a lot of hardwork. they would rather the party establishes its base well first then they join instead of being with the party through thick and thin from scratch
 

Ramseth

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
At least Yaw's fault-line is what most man cannot control...the urge to sow his wild oats.

How to explain Sylvia fornicating hypocritical urge to defend PAP against all odds ?

If had a chance to choose between Yaw honest arrogance and Sylvia hypocritical humility. I choose honest arrogance .

It's what man should control and manage, at least for man as public figure, that I'd have to say. Anyway, let the YSL saga pass over. As for Sylvia, what do you mean by "fornicating hypocritical to defend PAP against all odds?" Cite some examples. She has agreed with some PAP policies but not all and certainly not most. You expect her or any WP member to disagree with every PAP policy? Not even YSL would do that. He even voted for PAP. Why your focus on Sylvia?

Ken Kwek has already left ST , away from the evil clutches of your favourite ST political editor Chua Lee Hong.

Last week, I just met the pretty demure lady journalist who was assigned to take over Ken's political desk. Nice, supportive, sensible and understanding lady, but she also has to qualify, what she and her junior colleagues wrote for us or about us may not turn out the same after going through her senior editors.
 

waterloong

Alfrescian
Loyal
It's what man should control and manage, at least for man as public figure, that I'd have to say. Anyway, let the YSL saga pass over. As for Sylvia, what do you mean by "fornicating hypocritical to defend PAP against all odds?" Cite some examples. She has agreed with some PAP policies but not all and certainly not most. You expect her or any WP member to disagree with every PAP policy? Not even YSL would do that. He even voted for PAP. Why your focus on Sylvia?



Last week, I just met the pretty demure lady journalist who was assigned to take over Ken's political desk. Nice, supportive, sensible and understanding lady, but she also has to qualify, what she and her junior colleagues wrote for us or about us may not turn out the same after going through her senior editors.

You have scoops for Tessa / Andrea? What do you meant they wrote about you. I'm not aware you are so significant. Sorry. I'm new here.
 

Nice-Gook

Alfrescian
Loyal
It's what man should control and manage, at least for man as public figure, that I'd have to say. Anyway, let the YSL saga pass over. As for Sylvia, what do you mean by "fornicating hypocritical to defend PAP against all odds?" Cite some examples. She has agreed with some PAP policies but not all and certainly not most. You expect her or any WP member to disagree with every PAP policy? Not even YSL would do that. He even voted for PAP
.I have wrote many a times as below.Only that you ran away from refuting me;once under Scroo instructions...any way for the benefit of other forumers here;-


ME ,....."I certainly hope to be proven wrong about Sylvia....especially now that opposition desperately needs good man and more importantly woman to stand against the might of PAP.

But I still cannot digest the fact that she by her choice alone stood with PAP against JBJ -the very giant who breathed life into WP with his blood,sweat,wealth and sacrificed everything that he held dear for the sake of democracy in Singapore.I am,of course,talking about the International Bar Association's -Rule of Law Symposium held at Suntec City.By her logical extension, did Singaporeans want Mr Chia Thye Poh's three-decade detention? Did Singaporeans want the media to be completely under the thumb of the PAP? Did the people support the manipulation of the electoral process?

Yes bro,that's what Sylvia Lim stood for in front of the world audience.WITH THE PAP FOR THE PAP AGAINST ALL OPPOSITION FIGURES WHO WERE JAILED AND BANKRUPTED.

But instead she got a slap on her face when the same IBAHRI released it's own report later which expressed concern about human rights and the independence of the judiciary in Singapore here--http://www.ibanet.org/Article/Detail.aspx?ArticleUid=0081C460-4B39-4ACB-BB40-8303FCEFDB31

I often wondered how on earth could she sleep so peacefully by defending the bloody path PAP took. Are we talking about the same Sylvia Lim?"



Why your focus on Sylvia?



Isn't it obvious ,if the head stinks;you expect the rest of the bodily function any better?
 
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Ramseth

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
Last week, I just met the pretty demure lady journalist who was assigned to take over Ken's political desk. Nice, supportive, sensible and understanding lady, but she also has to qualify, what she and her junior colleagues wrote for us or about us may not turn out the same after going through her senior editors.

You have scoops for Tessa / Andrea? What do you meant they wrote about you. I'm not aware you are so significant. Sorry. I'm new here.

I didn't say she'd be writing anything about me, I said us, as in WP as a party generally.
 

Ramseth

Alfrescian (Inf)
Asset
WITH THE PAP FOR THE PAP AGAINST ALL OPPOSITION FIGURES WHO WERE JAILED AND BANKRUPTED.

It's not even most or many. It's just a few overstepped the lines of the laws. How to justify the use of the word ALL? When defeated fairly and squarely in the polls, PAP conceded and gave the seats to the opposition fairly and squarely. Even Ling How Doong was left unscathed until he was fairly and squarely defeated. I support some PAP policies too. I support more WP policies. That's why I'm with WP. If you expect a support-all or oppose-all policy, please look for a dictator.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
I agree. The MPS itself has become a huge burden. Interestingly it was something that WP started and the PAP followed to gain ground.
i think what is holding good people from coming forward is the hardwork. to be in the opp party in sg is a lot of hardwork. they would rather the party establishes its base well first then they join instead of being with the party through thick and thin from scratch
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
Without exception, everyone who enters politics find all journalists nice, decent, supportive, intelligent and understanding. I even recall in this forum Locke and Ejay making similar comments and even suggesting that a particular journalist is the exception.

Firstly they need to build rapport and need to engage their subject of interest. They can't do that if they display the attributes opposite to what you described. Thats common sense.

Secondly the editor is the one who plays the perennial bad guy and its rather convenient. Why never the journalist?I have no doubt there will be sincere genuine ones who have to finish their scholarship bonds and those that are tied down for one reason or another.

By the way you need to put your hand-up to take on the political beat. Its not national service. Lets me give you one example - former SPH Journalist Sasi, sorry can't remember his full name who is heavily in the arts and culture scene and starting the sub-station. This guy is very intelligent, politically astute etc. you cannot hold a gun to his head and ask him to write a political piece acceptable to the editor. He is not the only one. There are many that never put their hand up and covered other areas.

Ever watch a conversation with LTK or Chiam and Singapore journalist. You can see that they are not talking to the journalists but thru the journalists to their editors. Its a very sombre feeling for a new journalists to realise that they are messangers and have little standing by themselves.

JBJ and CSJ however lacked that ability and ended being confrontational. JBJ also had the habit of passing snide remarks when dealings with civil servants who may or may not support the PAP. Bro, seriously better stick to patrol, this is not your forte.

Last week, I just met the pretty demure lady journalist who was assigned to take over Ken's political desk. Nice, supportive, sensible and understanding lady, but she also has to qualify, what she and her junior colleagues wrote for us or about us may not turn out the same after going through her senior editors.
 
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mesmerised

Alfrescian
Loyal
Our govt processes started off emulating the British. The style of the British politicians subsequently become the standard bearer for most party leaders in Singapore: a few good men with the courage to stand up and speak, have the intellect to appreciate where our society is heading and the imagination to formulate, implement and evaluate public policies. The rest in each party were basically 'choh kar chiew'/sedan bearers of these 'few good men'.

The PAP of today is similarly a party with a few good men. The rest just make up the numbers. The PAP will be able to attract new candidates so long as these 'few good men' hang around.

The WP so far has been able to build some good will and brand recognition amongst the people. LTK, SL and CSM can be the core of the 'few good men' but are yet to raise to the challenge of true party political leaders. They are basically in their first term as an Opposition Party while all these years, WP just had one or two representatives in Parliament.

Somehow I have this feeling that before 2016, there will be a new political arrangement/party developing to oppose the PAP. And many of these will be alot more qualified, smarter and eloquent than the current WP stalwarts. Whether they will all galvanise under the leadership of LTK is a big question. And personally, I have my doubts.
 

scroobal

Alfrescian
Loyal
You remind me one gentleman in NUS, well read, highly respected in his field, very engaging until the subject of his ex-wife comes up. He goes ballistic and you can't stop him. Absolutely consumed by it. You are obssessed with Sylvia. And this has been going on for years. Give it a rest. We need the breather. WP is not for everyone. SDP being in its present position has nothing to do with WP.Frankly WP is too quiet for my liking and I don't think they can carry on in this manner. The salary debate is a sign to them. The current situation is there is a rise in anti-PAP sentiments and it goes to parties that present themselves well. There is a tipping point where these voters require results of some sort. WP have not even come to the stage where Chiam was in his first 2 terms where he was asking difficult questions.
This thread is a joke.Every-time,I mention the same about Sylvia Lim.Scroo comes down blazing with his iron rod hammering it down.What can one say about the quality of Madam Sylvia Lim as the head of opposition against PAP?At least Yaw's fault-line is what most man cannot control...the urge to sow his wild oats.How to explain Sylvia fornicating hypocritical urge to defend PAP against all odds ? If had a chance to choose between Yaw honest arrogance and Sylvia hypocritical humility. I choose honest arrogance .
 

Nice-Gook

Alfrescian
Loyal
It's not even most or many. It's just a few overstepped the lines of the laws. How to justify the use of the word ALL? When defeated fairly and squarely in the polls, PAP conceded and gave the seats to the opposition fairly and squarely. Even Ling How Doong was left unscathed until he was fairly and squarely defeated. I support some PAP policies too. I support more WP policies. That's why I'm with WP. If you expect a support-all or oppose-all policy, please look for a dictator.

Read my lips.

We are talking about Sylvia Lim.

And we are talking about Sylvia Lim defending our judiciary beholden to PAP in the International Bar Association's Human rights, democracy and the rule of law in a symposium held at Suntec in Singapore, in 2007.In 2008 the IBA Human Rights Institute subsequently published a report entitled http://www.ibanet.org/images/downlo...apore-Prosperity_versus_individual_rights.pdfhttp://yoursdp.org/index.php/compon...cises-human-rights-and-judiciary-in-singapore which criticized the judiciary and human rights record in Singapore. A SLAP ON SYLVIA FACE.

In simple words Sylvia Lim by her logical extension supported all these MIW sue sue here and sue sue there of sammyboyforum /Scroobal,Yawning bread and so on.

What are you talking about?
 
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