How did 3 doctors come out with the worse political strategy in living memory

Dr Chee Soon Juan, Dr Vincent Wijeysingha and Dr Paul Thambyah, all articulate, all well qualified and had enough experience including speaking at rallies come out with the worse strategy in living memory.

Was it wilful, desperation and completely wrapped up in their old world. Did they think that WP was helmed by an ignoramus and the voters completely blind and deaf laughed at Harbans Singh, MG Guru, Desmond and many like them but they did not dare make such an offer.

CSJ must relak one corner for a while la, he need to spend time in sub bench. dont know why he like to combust like this during erection time, maybe get too excited?

This is called "groupthink". The classic disease that inflicts all parties big and small, right and left, mainstream and alternative.

But that being said, I do believe the two Doctors are each intelligent enough to discern, but wise enough to keep his views from the public air.

scroobal said:

Dr Chee Soon Juan, Dr Vincent Wijeysingha and Dr Paul Thambyah, all articulate, all well qualified and had enough experience including speaking at rallies come out with the worse strategy in living memory.

Was it wilful, desperation and completely wrapped up in their old world. Did they think that WP was helmed by an ignoramus and the voters completely blind and deaf laughed at Harbans Singh, MG Guru, Desmond and many like them but they did not dare make such an offer.

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Astute observations and I believe you reprimand SDP like GMS does for WP so that they will do better. Leegime has more than 20K Singaporean scholars and more than 500 billion USD of funds at their disposable with unfettered control, so how did they come up with some of the worse strategies and policies in living memory? Sorry, I reprimand not because I know they can do better.

Presumably the same way two generations of scholars, doctors, lawyers, generals, admirals and assorted 'elite' cretins have fucked this country up for their own selfish benefit...

Very simple, though they are intelligent, they are out of touch with the real world, just like the PAP.

Dun blame Dr Chee Soon Juan, Dr Vincent Wijeysingha or Dr Paul Thambyah. The SDP is sincerely trying to avoid a 3CF.

Now that a non-cooperative WP has been exposed, let there be a contest between PAP, SDP and another wannabee PAP in WP.

scroobal said:

Dr Chee Soon Juan, Dr Vincent Wijeysingha and Dr Paul Thambyah, all articulate, all well qualified and had enough experience including speaking at rallies come out with the worse strategy in living memory.

Was it wilful, desperation and completely wrapped up in their old world. Did they think that WP was helmed by an ignoramus and the voters completely blind and deaf laughed at Harbans Singh, MG Guru, Desmond and many like them but they did not dare make such an offer.

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Now, things have taken place at a whirlwind rate. This is because the PAP had time to think about the Laurel Ong affair, and plan their moves accordingly. This luxury of time was not afforded to either WP or SDP. For SDP in particular, there is a space of 1 month to start your walkabouts, and to organise a by-election. It is an extremely tight schedule.

I still don't know how much Chee Soon Juan discussed the decision with his colleagues before making it. Recall that the SDP were one of the first to declare that they were not going to contest Hougang. Maybe they got a lot of flak from their own supporters for that. Even if it is true, as they said, that there are arrangements between parties in Malaysia where they send 1 candidate in for elections and the other party takes care of the grassroots, this example is irrelevant because those parties are already part of a formal alliance. SDP and WP is not. Right now they have nothing in common with each other other than being opposition parties.

There was this episode in the 2011 General Elections where Chee Soon Juan was shaking hands with supporters in rallies. He's not supposed to be on stage in a rally, so that was borderline illegal. He was roundly whacked by his teammates. Now Tan Jee Say is gone, and Michelle Lee is gone. Ang Yong Guan is not in the central committee.

Medical doctors do live in a world of their own. They are a protected species, so they don't have to deal with business and politics. Maybe they aren't that bright in this respect, although they have to be politically astute enough to know how to tell a person that he's going to die. But Wijeysingha should know better. Paul Thambyah is a brave guy. He has an academic position, knowing how tightly professors in NUS are muzzled. And I don't know how careful Wijeysingha is. He is bright, articulate and a great speaker. But he was careless enough to put a few things in his long facebook note that left him liable to being sued. There are a lot of charges in that article, and every one of them had to be documented down in case.

This trend of parties imploding looks a little bad. The more visible and capable people in the opposition, when they leave their parties, leave a bad impression and a bad taste in the mouth, like they weren't really in there for the long run, like they were just there to join in the excitement. People like Benjamin Pwee. Nicole Seah keeping a low profile. Tan Jee Say and his antics. Very disappointing to see that the opposition parties are not working as hard as I had hoped. I saw the interview with Wijeysingha and his face was white as a sheet. The SDP are panicking now. They have a decision to make on Tuesday and I hope that it is the right one.

At this point now, SDP is screwed whether it contests or pulls out. The damage will need some time to repair.

tanwahp said:

At this point now, SDP is screwed whether it contests or pulls out. The damage will need some time to repair.

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No, it's not screwed. Suppose we have SDP pull out, WP in it, RP in it, SDA in it, RP and SDA lose their deposits, SDP will walk away looking quite OK.

metalmickey said:

No, it's not screwed. Suppose we have SDP pull out, WP in it, RP in it, SDA in it, RP and SDA lose their deposits, SDP will walk away looking quite OK.

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At this point if SDP pulls out, it will also draw flak. The better timing to withdraw was before the writ.

tanwahp said:

At this point if SDP pulls out, it will also draw flak. The better timing to withdraw was before the writ.

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Yes but compare the flak to - less than 20% in the polls. Maybe even lose deposits.

If SDP pull out and it's still a multi-corner fight, then somebody will lose their deposit, and SDP will say, "well, we did it in the name of opposition unity. We're as good as our word."

If SDP pull out and it's a straight fight, most likely WP is still going to lose. And SDP will say, "well what was the fuss about? Either way WP would not gain that seat. I should have contested and not worried about what people are saying".

If SDP pull out and it's a straight fight, and WP win. SDP will say, "In the name of opposition unity, I embrace you my brother and congratulate you on your victory. You see, SDP did the right thing".

metalmickey said:

Yes but compare the flak to - less than 20% in the polls. Maybe even lose deposits.

If SDP pull out and it's still a multi-corner fight, then somebody will lose their deposit, and SDP will say, "well, we did it in the name of opposition unity. We're as good as our word."

If SDP pull out and it's a straight fight, most likely WP is still going to lose. And SDP will say, "well what was the fuss about? Either way WP would not gain that seat. I should have contested and not worried about what people are saying".

If SDP pull out and it's a straight fight, and WP win. SDP will say, "In the name of opposition unity, I embrace you my brother and congratulate you on your victory. You see, SDP did the right thing".

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I said "SDP is screwed whether it contests or pulls out". I didn't say the extent of screwing in both cases are the same.

I agree with you that pulling out causes less damage.

metalmickey said:

No, it's not screwed. Suppose we have SDP pull out, WP in it, RP in it, SDA in it, RP and SDA lose their deposits, SDP will walk away looking quite OK.

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I think SDP will walk away if RP and SDA are in this PE. Five is a crowd. Also RP and SDA are on good terms with SDP. Wont want to be accused when SDP bagged 20%, and they lose their deposits.

SDP would prefer a straight fight with the papzis. With the wannabees wanting to have a go too, it can get messy.

I am actually looking forward to a 3CF with PAP, SDP and the Wannabee Party in it. The wannabees will be revealed as who they are... wannabees.

methink said:

I think SDP will walk away if RP and SDA are in this PE. Five is a crowd. Also RP and SDA are on good terms with SDP. Wont want to be accused when SDP bagged 20%, and they lose their deposits.

SDP would prefer a straight fight with the papzis. With the wannabees wanting to have a go too, it can get messy.

I am actually looking forward to a 3CF with PAP, SDP and the Wannabee Party in it. The wannabees will be revealed as who they are... wannabees.

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The other aspect of the situation to consider is that the SDP members like methink who are fools. You have to wonder if these contingent of fools are the ones who are putting the pressure on CSJ to put in a 3 corner fight.

As I have analysed elsewhere, it makes sense for a non-WP opposition party to go into the by election to gauge their progress, to gain exposure, to test out their party logistics, to sound out their policies, to discredit the PAP.

It is never OK for party members to criticise other opposition parties, in public or on the internet. Why? Because you are making your leader Chee Soon Juan look like a fool or a liar. It is never OK for SDP to enter the competition on the grounds that it is spoiling WP because that would tell the world that CSJ has been lying all along about opposition unity.

Now you have fools like methink saying on the other thread that it is important to bring down the WP simply because it has been getting more votes.

http://www.sammyboy.com/showthread.php?140517-Wannabee-Party-where-do-you-go-from-here

In other words, he doesn't give a fuck what the electorate thinks. It doesn't matter if more people vote for the WP. You'll just do whatever the fuck you want. Maybe there is no strategy at all. There's just a lot of fools having knee jerk reactions.

You don't understand democracy. If you don't agree with the will of the people, the people win. If you have a problem with that, quit politics.

methink said:

Dun blame Dr Chee Soon Juan, Dr Vincent Wijeysingha or Dr Paul Thambyah. The SDP is sincerely trying to avoid a 3CF.

Now that a non-cooperative WP has been exposed, let there be a contest between PAP, SDP and another wannabee PAP in WP.

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If you want to expose someone as non-cooperative, the foremost concern you should have is not to shoot yourself in the foot in the process. WP has never tried to hide the fact it is reticent when it comes to inter-party coopoeration. TOC hard talk forum is OK as everyone was invited and was moderated by a neutral or seemingly neutral entity that was oppo friendly.

In short if you want to make political statements about other oppo parties, be sure that your delivery is right and you don't end up commtting suicide.

metalmickey said:

Yes but compare the flak to - less than 20% in the polls. Maybe even lose deposits.

If SDP pull out and it's still a multi-corner fight, then somebody will lose their deposit, and SDP will say, "well, we did it in the name of opposition unity. We're as good as our word."

If SDP pull out and it's a straight fight, most likely WP is still going to lose. And SDP will say, "well what was the fuss about? Either way WP would not gain that seat. I should have contested and not worried about what people are saying".

If SDP pull out and it's a straight fight, and WP win. SDP will say, "In the name of opposition unity, I embrace you my brother and congratulate you on your victory. You see, SDP did the right thing".

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imho, sdp are screwed. pull out, sdp lose it hard core supporters who dont like wp anyway, but dont pull out, lose the support of the moderate. a friend who help out at sdp told me he wont be going to sdp activities liao. not even if sdp pull out because he shock by the intelligent of the sdp supposingly intellects.

sleaguepunter said:

imho, sdp are screwed. pull out, sdp lose it hard core supporters who dont like wp anyway, but dont pull out, lose the support of the moderate. a friend who help out at sdp told me he wont be going to sdp activities liao. not even if sdp pull out because he shock by the intelligent of the sdp supposingly intellects.

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Yes, but right now still not many people are following SDP's movement because only a few hardcore political watchers like us pay attention before nomination day. Wait until later on, when the election campaign is under way, when every single word that anybody say is listened to, it will be worse.

6 hours after WP unveiled their candidate, SDP has yet to move.

I think SDP is good at policy ideas but may not be as good at political strategy.

As I have indicated in another thread, the SDP's objective is not about meeting the WP. It knew, from years ago and from the 2006 cheng tng incident, that WP under LTK and WP's Princess Megawati Sukarnoputri (Sylvia Lim) would never associate with them. It knew from Desmond's "10 minutes" incident that it would not happen.

The SDP's objective was to bring to the public's attention the unbridled and breathtaking arrogance of the WP that hitherto, had remained somewhat hidden from the public eye but which is well known in cyberspace and amongst netizens.

The WP members, supporters and astroturfers were too clever by half for their own good, mocking CSJ's "lonely" press conference in his little office without knowing what it was all about. I can understand the insecurities of the WP and its fear of being shown up and hence, its members, supporters and astroturfers have temporarily suspended their usual racism postings and "Guess the Race" racial bigotry and are now spending time and effort to mock, criticise and ridicule the SDP into withdrawing.

Once again, this will not happen. The SDP will not withdraw from contesting the PE.

With its unbridled and breathtaking arrogance, Chauvinist Low and WP's Princess Megawati Sukarnoputri, along with their platoon worth of members and astroturfers behaving like they are an army's worth of supporters, have shown themselves to be even worse than the PAP.

The WP has lost the support of the minority Malays and Indians because of its racism and racial chauvinism. It will now start to lose support amongst the ordinary men in the street. Remember, there is always sympathy for the underdogs. And if there is one thing that ordinary people everywhere around the world despise, it is arrogance.

The PAP is hated and held in contempt for its arrogance. And the WP, under the leadership of Chauvinist Low and WP's Princess Megawati Sukarnoputri, to its sheer stupidity has, in the past, emulated the unbridled arrogance of the PAP, is emulating the unbridled arrogance of the PAP and will continue to emulate the unbridled arrogance of the PAP. i.e until its downfall. Pride goes before a fall.

JBJ would never, ever behave with such arrogance and in such a manner as Chauvinist Low and WP's Princess Megawati Sukarnoputri.

Once again, I call on my Malay, Indian and Eurasian brothers and sisters to deliver a lesson in humility to the WP Chinese Chauvinists and its "Guess the Race" racists and racial bigots.